We Loaned on a Stolen House

We Loaned on a Stolen House

Lender · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

Local wholesaler gets a response from some bandit signs. A homeowner is willing to sell his vacant hoarder house and adjacent lot in a nice area in Los Angeles. Sale price for both properties is something over $500k (I’m not exactly sure). He pays cash, which is unusual for a wholesaler but completely legit, and he closes appropriately thru title and escrow and also obtains an owner’s title policy.

Some weeks later, the wholesaler contacts our borrower, a local and very experienced house flipper, who agrees to buy both properties for $610k. House will take about $75k to fix and end up with an $875k ARV. Not a barn-burner, but the lot next door will be sold quickly for $100k to make this a great deal.

Our borrower’s transaction is handled through the same independent escrow and title company that handled the wholesaler’s purchase. Our borrower gets an owner’s title policy and we obtain lenders title insurance in the amount of $685k. We fund and close like any other normal boring loan.

Two days later, our borrower is standing in the property planning the rehab. A gentleman walks in and asks who he is. He says he’s the new owner. The gentleman says he’s the owner and never sold the property. Uh, oh.

The escrow company calls the notary who witnessed signing the grant deed for the original sale to the wholesaler. At first, she doesn’t return the call but calls back a few days later claiming she lost her notary book or it was stolen. More uh, oh.

Everyone files a title claim and a police report, including us. Title opens an investigation.

I understand the wholesaler, who we never met, sent all his profits to the title company. He’s even. As a result of the great long-term relationship we have with our borrower, we loaned him 100%, so he’s out almost nothing as well, but has been paying for fire and hazard insurance since he closed. We’re out over $600k but with either a legit 1st position lien or a credible title claim. I’m not worried.

I called our lawyer asking if we need to hire him. With almost no info from me, he virtually repeats what happened and what will come. He advises us to sit tight and let title “do their thing.” No need to hire him unless someone files a lawsuit or title denies our claim. He tells me this could take two months or two years to resolve. Aren’t I thrilled.

Title does a four-month investigation, interviewing everyone and their brother. It appears the police (I think?) were able to search bank records and determined the “real” owner never received any money and was telling the truth -- he never sold the property. The grant deed was indeed forged, though we don’t know by whom and I don’t know the involvement of the notary.

It also appears the escrow company, which is an independent escrow (not associated with a title co.), did not require the seller to present himself with proper ID to sign a notarized grant deed. They accepted everything by mail – and obviously from a scammer. You’d think this would violate a title company rule???

We just received a check from title for our principal and interest. We were also owed points but title claimed they were not part of the “indebtedness.” Our lawyer said we could argue but it would take a while and the outcome wasn’t certain. Per his recommendation, we require the value of our lenders title policy must be at least 125% of the loan value. Frankly, we would have been happy just getting our principal back so we’re happier than a pig in you know what. The system worked for us.

This problem it seems occurred because escrow either didn’t follow proper processes or because they didn’t have any. Bottom line is don’t even think about buying or lending on a property without proper title insurance. Make sure your policy will cover all your potential losses.

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Chris MasonPro Member
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Lender · CA · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 10k+ votes
6y

My wife and I put a title insurance claim in the very first time we purchased a house. I've never done a transaction wherein the buyer did not get title insurance, excluding scenarios such as the following paragraph. 

I also strongly encourage title insurance for quitclaim scenarios. Not long ago, we had a refinance wherein the free/clear property was QC'd to our borrower from several family members years and years prior. To get lender's title insurance and close the $600k cash out refi (this ALSO would have been required to SELL the property, but as a loan originator I do not work with sellers -- only buyers, and owners who are refinancing), the borrower had to chase down every single person on that QC and get them to sign additional paperwork. If one of those various persons had a falling out with our borrower in the meantime, they could have stopped the refinance from going through (or attempted to extort money, etc). This is a new thing in California, in response to things like what happened in OP.

Yes, some will object that title insurance is like mafia protection money. They point out that health insurance plans pay out $95 or $97 in claims for every $100 in insurance premiums collected, but title insurance only pays out less than $20 by that same metric, leading to an unusually large profit margin. I do not disagree. Great, we're all in agreement, it's the mafia. Conclusion remains unchanged: pay the mafia or your legs will get broken. It's a simple as that. 

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  • Real Estate Broker · Portland, OR · Member since 2019 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    Lesson learned.  Get a PTR, review the title report and verify any exception and that all parties are as represented on title.  Close at a legitimate title company with an escrow officer to record your lien against the property.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    6y
    I could not agree more  Notary stamps are the weak link.. the case i had back in the 80s was about 15 million of forged reconveyances and new loan docs.. perp  stole his secretary's notary stamp.  this is the guy who ended up in THE BIG Q

    I went to get a Notary in Canada once and of course Notary there is like an attorney .. its a big deal in all other countries and for foreign buyers as you know to go to consulate cost a bunch of money..

    |good luck with your app !!!

  • Investor · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2019 · 112 posts · 47 votes
    6y

    Wow, thanks for sharing. 

  • Specialist · Winter Springs, FL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 747 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Samantha Rye:

    In Ontario, we have a Land Titles Registry which is administered and guaranteed by the provincial government. You can basically look up the property in the registry and be secure that the listed owner is the owner. I gather this is not the case is most US states? I'm just beginning to investigate buying property in the States and I couldn't figure out what the point of escrow was, but if that's the case, it makes way more sense. 

    While I've never done title claims in Canada I have done them in US states that have a Torrens system of land registry and believe that even then the property can be the subject of a forged deed in which case the damaged party recovers from the state rather than a title insurer.  Some time ago in a claim I handled, a forged deed was accepted by the Registrar of Deeds and the Grantee received a Certificate of Title (CT) and also a title policy issued on the company I worked for.   When the former owner became aware of the forgery he filed suit to set the sale aside naming my insured as a defendant.  When I researched the law related to Torrens land I found the state statute provided each CT is a brand new root of title and therefore concluded the insured had good title and the former owner had to recover from the state recovery fund.  I also found a US Supreme Court decision (Eliason v. Wilborn 281 U.S. 457 (1930)) that held that when you buy land under a Torrens system you live and die by it's rules.  In an abstract state I believe one can never be a bona fide purchaser under a forged deed so an owner will always remain the owner.  (S)he may have to bring an action to set the forged deed aside but cannot be divested of title as can happen in a Torrens state.

  • Rental Property Investor · Woodbridge, VA · Member since 2017 · 12 posts · 37 votes
    6y

    We need more good guys like you to conquer the growing population of bad guys! Notaries have more respect from me now.  Thanks David!

  • Member since 2020 · 17 posts · 4 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @David M.:

    @Juan Pardo

    ... if the deal falls apart after inspection, why bother having paid for the Title search.  ...When you deal with National banks (e.g. Chase, Wells Fargo, ...) they order the appraisal immediately.  I've had a few unhappy clients who wonder why they paid $500 for an appraisal when they killed the deal during inspections...

    I know this was kinda long.  Make any sense? 

    Hell yes.  I'd be really pissed to learn firsthand and not have paid "the mafia" for protection.  This has been duly noted in my things to know notebook!   Get a title policy upfront.  Then pay for the above quoted services only after inspection is acceptable.  

  • Member since 2020 · 17 posts · 4 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Phil Hallman:

    So the "Seller"  had a bank account to get the wire in proceeds, Banks have "know your customer" rules...Did straw "seller"  set up a false bank account as well?

    I wish to hear too.  Really, some bonehead can say he is a seller, and get money wired to him yet not even the title insurer has the big guns to go trace the bastard down?  No way!  It's that easy to forge and steal and get away?   My jaw is dropped...

  • Member since 2020 · 201 posts · 118 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Robert Shreffler:
    Originally posted by @Phil Hallman:

    So the "Seller"  had a bank account to get the wire in proceeds, Banks have "know your customer" rules...Did straw "seller"  set up a false bank account as well?

    I wish to hear too.  Really, some bonehead can say he is a seller, and get money wired to him yet not even the title insurer has the big guns to go trace the bastard down?  No way!  It's that easy to forge and steal and get away?   My jaw is dropped...

    And this happen in the US, the world's first economy. I am in awe too..

  • Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2019 · 127 posts · 63 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Jeff S.:

    Not a mistake, @Rachel S.  I suppose I should have written “… or more.” That’s how we did our underwriting. Adjacent lot is very buildable, but truly a postage stamp.

    Where in LA and what sq footage is the lot? I live in a relatively inexpensive area of LA and 2500 sq ft lots are pretty common. Those lots go for way more than 100k. Low to mid 500's if they have a 700-800 sq ft house on them.

  • Lender · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    "There are no buildable lots in the Los Angeles area that are worth so little..."

    Not true.

    You can absolutely buy buildable lots in Los Angeles for less than $100k, @Rachel S.. You need to quit looking for acreage in Beverly Hills.  🤣  Ha.

    Property is located in Mt. Washington. Not a bad area. Here are comps for the adjacent lot (click on the image to expand it):

    I waited to add to my post because I wanted to get a recent update from title and also for the first time, I spoke to the escrow company.

    The homeowner who showed up in the property and confronted our borrower was the real owner and never sold his house. When escrow found out about the issue, they immediately called the notary who stamped the grant deed. She responded to escrow that she hadn’t been a notary for about year, after either losing her notary log book or it was stolen (not clear). When the police investigator interviewed her some time later, she said she was still a notary, but had no knowledge of this grant deed. Apparently, it was not listed in her log book. One of these has to be a lie so this obviously stinks to high heavens.

    The scammer who originally called the wholesaler has not been identified, that I’m aware, and I don’t know if the police know who he is. They clearly know the notary, so you’d think they could lean on her to determine who she’s working with? Perhaps I’ve been watching too much CSI?

    The wholesaler never met the (fake) seller but received all his contact info from him over the phone and by email. So did escrow, who emailed a filled-out grant deed to the him. He had it notarized and mailed it back to them. This was the fatal flaw in the deal. Escrow relied that the notarization was legit. I can’t say I blame them. We mail notarized documents to escrow companies we’ve never met all the time. The system assumes all notaries are honest.

    Considering that almost everything in a real estate transaction is a matter of public record, these scams appear to be amazingly easy to pull off. So long as escrow and title companies allow anonymity, we can expect this nonsense to continue. And, don’t get me started on lending, where borrowers are continually duped by online strangers they willingly meet on the web with no real verification. That’s another topic.

    @Rachel S.

  • Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2019 · 127 posts · 63 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by :

    "There are no buildable lots in the Los Angeles area that are worth so little..."

    Not true.

    You can absolutely buy buildable lots in Los Angeles for less than $100k, @Rachel S.. You need to quit looking for acreage in Beverly Hills.  🤣  Ha.

    Property is located in Mt. Washington. Not a bad area. Here are comps for the adjacent lot (click on the image to expand it).

    I waited to add to my post because I wanted to get a recent update from title and also for the first time, I spoke to the escrow company.

    The homeowner who showed up in the property and confronted our borrower was the real owner and never sold his house. When escrow found out about the issue, they immediately called the notary who stamped the grant deed. She responded to escrow that she hadn’t been a notary for about year, after either losing her notary log book or it was stolen (not clear). When the police investigator interviewed her some time later, she said she was still a notary, but had no knowledge of this grant deed. Apparently, it was not listed in her log book. One of these has to be a lie so this obviously stinks to high heavens.

    The scammer who originally called the wholesaler has not been identified, that I’m aware, and I don’t know if the police know who he is. They clearly know the notary, so you’d think they could lean on her to determine who she’s working with? Perhaps I’ve been watching too much CSI?

    The wholesaler never met the (fake) seller but received all his contact info from him over the phone and by email. So did escrow, who emailed a filled-out grant deed to the him. He had it notarized and mailed it back to them. This was the fatal flaw in the deal. Escrow relied that the notarization was legit. I can’t say I blame them. We mail notarized documents to escrow companies we’ve never met all the time. The system assumes all notaries are honest.

    Considering that almost everything in a real estate transaction is a matter of public record, these scams appear to be amazingly easy to pull off. So long as escrow and title companies allow anonymity, we can expect this nonsense to continue. And, don’t get me started on lending, where borrowers are continually duped by online strangers they willingly meet on the web with no real verification. That’s another topic. 

    Not looking in Beverly Hills. I live in San Pedro. It's definitely not a fancy area. You still can't get a buildable lot for 100k. Those lots you list surprise me. Makes me wonder if the lot is really buildable or if the city would make you jump through so many hoops that it wouldn't be worth it.

  • Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago Suburbs, IL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 594 votes
    6y

    @Jeff S. So...does anything punitive at all happen to the notary?? She obviously had two different stories. Is she still allowed to be a notary? Still allowed to be anything else licensed that she would like to be as well, like a real estate broker?

  • Robert ChuangPro Member
    Realtor · Arcadia, CA · Member since 2014 · 145 posts · 46 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Rachel S.:
    Originally posted by :

    "There are no buildable lots in the Los Angeles area that are worth so little..."

    Not true.

    You can absolutely buy buildable lots in Los Angeles for less than $100k, @Rachel S.. You need to quit looking for acreage in Beverly Hills.  🤣  Ha.

    Property is located in Mt. Washington. Not a bad area. Here are comps for the adjacent lot (click on the image to expand it).

    I waited to add to my post because I wanted to get a recent update from title and also for the first time, I spoke to the escrow company.

    The homeowner who showed up in the property and confronted our borrower was the real owner and never sold his house. When escrow found out about the issue, they immediately called the notary who stamped the grant deed. She responded to escrow that she hadn’t been a notary for about year, after either losing her notary log book or it was stolen (not clear). When the police investigator interviewed her some time later, she said she was still a notary, but had no knowledge of this grant deed. Apparently, it was not listed in her log book. One of these has to be a lie so this obviously stinks to high heavens.

    The scammer who originally called the wholesaler has not been identified, that I’m aware, and I don’t know if the police know who he is. They clearly know the notary, so you’d think they could lean on her to determine who she’s working with? Perhaps I’ve been watching too much CSI?

    The wholesaler never met the (fake) seller but received all his contact info from him over the phone and by email. So did escrow, who emailed a filled-out grant deed to the him. He had it notarized and mailed it back to them. This was the fatal flaw in the deal. Escrow relied that the notarization was legit. I can’t say I blame them. We mail notarized documents to escrow companies we’ve never met all the time. The system assumes all notaries are honest.

    Considering that almost everything in a real estate transaction is a matter of public record, these scams appear to be amazingly easy to pull off. So long as escrow and title companies allow anonymity, we can expect this nonsense to continue. And, don’t get me started on lending, where borrowers are continually duped by online strangers they willingly meet on the web with no real verification. That’s another topic. 

    Not looking in Beverly Hills. I live in San Pedro. It's definitely not a fancy area. You still can't get a buildable lot for 100k. Those lots you list surprise me. Makes me wonder if the lot is really buildable or if the city would make you jump through so many hoops that it wouldn't be worth it.

    I have 5 lots total on hillside. 3 down slopes and 2 up slopes. Prices were 201k, 165k, 220k and 175k (4 lots merge lot tie into 2). The lowest sell price would be about $1.4mm minimum to $4mm. So I think those numbers are very doable to find a profitable project.

  • Stephanie MedellinBusiness Member
    Mortgage Broker · CA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 642 votes
    5y

    @Jeff S.  I know this is an old thread, but did anyone try to trace where the money for the fraudulent purchase went?  It had to go to a bank account somewhere?

    Stephanie Medellin, Loan Factory58 Reviews
  • Lender · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    5y

    “Follow the money,” is the obvious approach here, @Stephanie Medellin, and something I asked about over and over. I never got a good answer, but the bottom line was clear; this was too small and too common a crime for anyone to spend resources on. You’d think the title company would care since they were the end losers.

    The title investigator, an attorney, indicated they are not able to trace money through private bank accounts, indicating only law enforcement can do that. She never said it, but I imagine if there were a few more zeros at the end of their loss, they could have marshaled more help. On the other hand, with no obligation to keep me informed, perhaps they did.

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