Pace Morby Gator Method Course Review

[Jonathan Abrado]

Hi BP community,

I recently saw a Pace Morby ad for something he calls the gator method. I wanted to see if anyone here has joined his mentorship program or for this specific course, and receive some honest feedback. Google is weird sometimes. 

Appreciate y'all!

-Jon

[Don Konipol]

Everything is good, wonderful, well worth the money, an investment in your future, member of a tribe, the networking alone is worth the money, yada, yada, yada.  Until the posting “booster” is asked how many deals he’s closed from all this mentoring.  That’s when it becomes dead silence.

[Christian Kyle]

I watched the webinar yesterday and mysteriously they're still having the same chat issues that the assistant wasn't able to fix.  Still must be using the same recording.  He also talked about how the program has been closed down for around a year I think?  And you saw this in May.  Perhaps the program is great, but this doesn't add any credibility.

[Chris Barrett]

This seems to be the opposite of the point of EMD... if the transaction is broken by the buyer, the seller can keep the EMD. 

[Elmer Bonilla]

@Violet Cobb so have you made any deals yet?

Did anyone ever answer the question whether they’ve made deals using this guru’s method?

[Don Konipol]

Why do all these “guru” methods seem to rely on naive, uneducated, or desperate sellers?  I mean if a seller has any real estate knowledge at all isn’t he going to realize that earnest money that is returnable to the buyer for any reason at all at any time isn’t really earnest money?  And never being “at risk” is it even sufficient to legally bind a seller?  And won’t parties involved see red flags waived by all this “out of space” subterfuge?  

Also, I’ve noticed that the unknowledgeable persons who are most likely to be suckered into spending time and money on these “programs” all have a basic gullibility that leads to them making comments that have remained remarkably consistent over the last 40years.  They somehow think that for $197, or $1970, or $19700, they’ve somehow acquired some methodology, strategy, knowledge or “the secret sauce” that will ensure their investing or business success, and that the experienced, knowledgeable, and successful real estate investors who point out the obvious faults “just don’t get it”.  

Once someone has paid, what to them is a good deal of money, and invested a good deal of time, and become emotionally involved with a particular mentor and his program, they’ll fight like hell to defend it.  It’s as if pointing out any negatives about the guru, or his system, is a personal attack on themselves.  In 6 months they will be licking their wounds having given up on the system, now being that much further (by the amount spent, amount lost investing, wasted time, and emotional devastation) behind in realizing their goals and dreams 

[Frank Straughter]

Quote from @Chris Barrett:

This seems to be the opposite of the point of EMD... if the transaction is broken by the buyer, the seller can keep the EMD. 

Not broken, cancelled. Allow me to clarify.......most states (at least the ones I am familiar with) have ways of cancelling the transaction without losing EMD.

1.) Within the inspection or due dilligence period you can cancelled the contract without losing the EMD. The inspection period is also negotiable. For example, some states the standard inspection period is 14 days, but you can request longer or shorter in the offer letter and if the seller agrees and signs, its binding. I have done this my self for a few properties I made offers on earlier this year.

2.) Contract contingency. Another property I was looking at I placed a financing contingency in the contract that allow me to pull out if I could not get financing within a specified time. Which I didn't for this particular property. The sellers were not happy about it, but I got my EMD back because I did not break the contract, I cancelled it per the contract they agreed to.

There are other ways you could also cancel the contract without losing your EMD, but those are two that I have done personally and can speak too.

[Chris Barrett]

Yes, and if the buyer isn't able to close due to reasons other than allowable in the OTP you will lose your EMD and they'll owe you money that they apparently couldn't pay in the first place...

[Frank Straughter]

Quote from @Chris Barrett:

Yes, and if the buyer isn't able to close due to reasons other than allowable in the OTP you will lose your EMD and they'll owe you money that they apparently couldn't pay in the first place...

As the person bringing the EMD you are essentially Joint Venturing on the contract and as such you have the right to cancel the contract just as much as the wholesaler. This is all explained in the training. The information that is put out there is just to get people interested in taking the training. Its not complete and it causes confusion for people trying to figure it out but there are other items involved.

[Chris Barrett]

You have no security in that type of loan however, if the deal falls through and the loanee loses the EMD you have to go to them to get money from them that they probably don't have.

[Frank Straughter]

Quote from @Chris Barrett:

You have no security in that type of loan however, if the deal falls through and the loanee loses the EMD you have to go to them to get money from them that they probably don't have.

If you mean security backed by collateral, you are correct. However, some security comes in the form of having joint control of the transaction. As I mentioned above you are JVing on the deal when you bring in the EMD. So if you sense the deal is not going to go through within the diligence period you can cancel the contract. There are several people in the group that have run into that issue but rather than cancel the deal they brought in the buyer and took a bigger cut of the deal in the form of a "Finders Fee".

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the points you are trying to make are the following:

Could you lose your EMD money?
Yes

Is the EMD backed by collateral?
No

If you lose your EMD money could you get it back?
Probably not

As you already know, there are no guarantee's with investing which includes lending.

***NOTE*** I am not trying to talk anyone into doing EMD lending. I just saw a questions that looked like it hadn't been answered so I thought I would try and be helpful and answer it. This might sound rude (it isn't meant to be), but it makes no difference to me whether someone decides to do it or not. I just wanted to share my knowledge on the subject and help clear up any confusion.

[Chris Barrett]

Thank you for the comprehensive reply Frank!

[Ryan Miller]

Do you typically ask for a percentage of the deal or cash in return for the "bridge loan"?

[Juda Swann]

How do I sign up for the Gator community?

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Frank Straughter:

Quote from @Chris Barrett:

You have no security in that type of loan however, if the deal falls through and the loanee loses the EMD you have to go to them to get money from them that they probably don't have.

If you mean security backed by collateral, you are correct. However, some security comes in the form of having joint control of the transaction. As I mentioned above you are JVing on the deal when you bring in the EMD. So if you sense the deal is not going to go through within the diligence period you can cancel the contract. There are several people in the group that have run into that issue but rather than cancel the deal they brought in the buyer and took a bigger cut of the deal in the form of a "Finders Fee".

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the points you are trying to make are the following:

Could you lose your EMD money?
Yes

Is the EMD backed by collateral?
No

If you lose your EMD money could you get it back?
Probably not

As you already know, there are no guarantee's with investing which includes lending.

***NOTE*** I am not trying to talk anyone into doing EMD lending. I just saw a questions that looked like it hadn't been answered so I thought I would try and be helpful and answer it. This might sound rude (it isn't meant to be), but it makes no difference to me whether someone decides to do it or not. I just wanted to share my knowledge on the subject and help clear up any confusion.

We have a Direction to Pay as part of our EMD lenders agreement. This goes to the title or escrow agent and along with a HUD or settlement statement documenting the fees paid out clearly states and is agreed to by all parties that the EMD funds are loaned and must be repaid at closing from the assignment fee owed to the wholesaler or from the sellers funds.

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Don Konipol:

Why do all these “guru” methods seem to rely on naive, uneducated, or desperate sellers?  I mean if a seller has any real estate knowledge at all isn’t he going to realize that earnest money that is returnable to the buyer for any reason at all at any time isn’t really earnest money?  And never being “at risk” is it even sufficient to legally bind a seller?  And won’t parties involved see red flags waived by all this “out of space” subterfuge?  

Also, I’ve noticed that the unknowledgeable persons who are most likely to be suckered into spending time and money on these “programs” all have a basic gullibility that leads to them making comments that have remained remarkably consistent over the last 40years.  They somehow think that for $197, or $1970, or $19700, they’ve somehow acquired some methodology, strategy, knowledge or “the secret sauce” that will ensure their investing or business success, and that the experienced, knowledgeable, and successful real estate investors who point out the obvious faults “just don’t get it”.  

Once someone has paid, what to them is a good deal of money, and invested a good deal of time, and become emotionally involved with a particular mentor and his program, they’ll fight like hell to defend it.  It’s as if pointing out any negatives about the guru, or his system, is a personal attack on themselves.  In 6 months they will be licking their wounds having given up on the system, now being that much further (by the amount spent, amount lost investing, wasted time, and emotional devastation) behind in realizing their goals and dreams 

 Yep. Guru's prey on these types. It's why there are so many crypto scams and rug pulls going on now. 

[Jatin Singh]

Hi guys, just wanted to reiterate the same message since I recently was shown this course. The marketing strategy Pace uses is still the same. He states that there is something wrong with the chat and creates a sense of urgency and tells the viewers that the last time he did Gator was 8-9 months ago and that he won't be doing it again for another 8-9 months, but from the information I gathered on here, it seems that he was doing these sessions every month or second month. This is all a psychological game to just get the user to cave in and think later. He puts this big timer up to make them think that there are only 30 minutes to act and that spots will fill up. He's doing another session again this following Saturday. I read through the entire 5 pages here and I am very thankful for all of the feedback everyone has given. This seems like nothing but a scam. So relieved I did my due diligence and came here!

[Account Closed]

Quote from @Jatin Singh:

Hi guys, just wanted to reiterate the same message since I recently was shown this course. The marketing strategy Pace uses is still the same. He states that there is something wrong with the chat and creates a sense of urgency and tells the viewers that the last time he did Gator was 8-9 months ago and that he won't be doing it again for another 8-9 months, but from the information I gathered on here, it seems that he was doing these sessions every month or second month. This is all a psychological game to just get the user to cave in and think later. He puts this big timer up to make them think that there are only 30 minutes to act and that spots will fill up. He's doing another session again this following Saturday. I read through the entire 5 pages here and I am very thankful for all of the feedback everyone has given. This seems like nothing but a scam. So relieved I did my due diligence and came here!

Gator lending is simply "transaction funding" and doing "2nd mortgages". There are a lot of dangers in lending money. That is why the Pro's don't go over 70% CLTV - cumulative loan to value (all money lent against a property.) So, if a property has a value of $100,000 - and the first mortgage is $75,000 - no one will do a 2nd loan. If the mortgage is $65,000 *some* lenders will lend an additional $5,000. The problem comes in when Pace Morby says he buys properties for full price and then uses someone from the "gator community" to provide $50,000 for closing, rehab and cash in his pocket, that means they are his "piggy bank". And he is way over leveraged. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/o/overleveraged.asp If there is any hick up at all, the lender loses their money. Not a position anybody wants to be in, but he apparently doesn't disclose that.

There are ways to do this much more safely, but of course, you need proper training and to be told what to avoid.

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Account Closed:

Quote from @Jatin Singh:

Hi guys, just wanted to reiterate the same message since I recently was shown this course. The marketing strategy Pace uses is still the same. He states that there is something wrong with the chat and creates a sense of urgency and tells the viewers that the last time he did Gator was 8-9 months ago and that he won't be doing it again for another 8-9 months, but from the information I gathered on here, it seems that he was doing these sessions every month or second month. This is all a psychological game to just get the user to cave in and think later. He puts this big timer up to make them think that there are only 30 minutes to act and that spots will fill up. He's doing another session again this following Saturday. I read through the entire 5 pages here and I am very thankful for all of the feedback everyone has given. This seems like nothing but a scam. So relieved I did my due diligence and came here!

Gator lending is simply "transaction funding" and doing "2nd mortgages". There are a lot of dangers in lending money. That is why the Pro's don't go over 70% CLTV - cumulative loan to value (all money lent against a property.) So, if a property has a value of $100,000 - and the first mortgage is $75,000 - no one will do a 2nd loan. If the mortgage is $65,000 *some* lenders will lend an additional $5,000. The problem comes in when Pace Morby says he buys properties for full price and then uses someone from the "gator community" to provide $50,000 for closing, rehab and cash in his pocket, that means they are his "piggy bank". And he is way over leveraged. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/o/overleveraged.asp If there is any hick up at all, the lender loses their money. Not a position anybody wants to be in, but he apparently doesn't disclose that.

There are ways to do this much more safely, but of course, you need proper training and to be told what to avoid.

It is predatory. Very mob loan shark like. 

[Charles Beltran]

Quote from @Brandon Foster:

I see it here for $79. He talked about doing Gator 2.0 where you just refer someone to their website/team/lender and you split the profits 50/50. So you don't need to use your own money. This makes a lot of sense to just do it on the side as a referral and not risk any of your own capital it sounds like.

https://tscourses.com/courses/...

 How is this different from the $3k offering?

[Charles Beltran]

Quote from @Brandon Foster:

I see it here for $79. He talked about doing Gator 2.0 where you just refer someone to their website/team/lender and you split the profits 50/50. So you don't need to use your own money. This makes a lot of sense to just do it on the side as a referral and not risk any of your own capital it sounds like.

https://tscourses.com/courses/...

 George G/Community Support at ManifestU on 11/14/2023 stated that the link is a scam and that is being worked on for "copyright issues."

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Charles Beltran:

Quote from @Brandon Foster:

I see it here for $79. He talked about doing Gator 2.0 where you just refer someone to their website/team/lender and you split the profits 50/50. So you don't need to use your own money. This makes a lot of sense to just do it on the side as a referral and not risk any of your own capital it sounds like.

https://tscourses.com/courses/...

 George G/Community Support at ManifestU on 11/14/2023 stated that the link is a scam and that is being worked on for "copyright issues."

 There are a number of people who are glomming off of Pace. He brought it on himself too. 

[Michael Fish]

Hello,

Just stopping by to comment. I sat through the "live" webinar and commented four times where Mr. Morby had made statements earlier that he then proceeded to contradict himself with, such as contact with wholesalers, requirements in finding deals, requirements and criteria for new investors--who do not have real estate or wholesaling experience--in finding their own deals, etc.  
Around the 1h04m mark in the webinar my comments were deleted and there was a message from admin that if I wanted any questions answered I had to email a tech support address.  I closed out the webinar after reading that clownish response; I will not be emailing my four questions to a tech support address. 
YMMV.

[Rob B.]

Interesting!  Thanks for sharing.

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Michael Fish:

Hello,

Just stopping by to comment. I sat through the "live" webinar and commented four times where Mr. Morby had made statements earlier that he then proceeded to contradict himself with, such as contact with wholesalers, requirements in finding deals, requirements and criteria for new investors--who do not have real estate or wholesaling experience--in finding their own deals, etc.  
Around the 1h04m mark in the webinar my comments were deleted and there was a message from admin that if I wanted any questions answered I had to email a tech support address.  I closed out the webinar after reading that clownish response; I will not be emailing my four questions to a tech support address. 
YMMV.

 Yep. He does not believe in honesty and transparency. Looks like he learned from people like Madoff and Bankman-Fried. Same type of scumbag!

[Robert Short]

This is my concern as well. I attended the presentation but it ended without explaining that. I'm sure Pace is smarter than me when it comes to real estate, but I don't have $5000 worth of trust in his ethics. That's a massive barrier to entry when you're just getting started. That's a high price tag for someone who claims that he will also help you find your first few deals. That just doesn't add up for me.

Quote from @Anthony Stephens:

It sounds interesting but my concern is that this would be an unsecured loan to someone who may not be in a good financial position. I assume that if the wholesale deal falls through the earnest money is lost and the "Gator" lender would have to seek the money from the wholesaler who did not have the funding to begin with.

Am I misunderstanding?

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Robert Short:

This is my concern as well. I attended the presentation but it ended without explaining that. I'm sure Pace is smarter than me when it comes to real estate, but I don't have $5000 worth of trust in his ethics. That's a massive barrier to entry when you're just getting started. That's a high price tag for someone who claims that he will also help you find your first few deals. That just doesn't add up for me.

Quote from @Anthony Stephens:

It sounds interesting but my concern is that this would be an unsecured loan to someone who may not be in a good financial position. I assume that if the wholesale deal falls through the earnest money is lost and the "Gator" lender would have to seek the money from the wholesaler who did not have the funding to begin with.

Am I misunderstanding?

 Their concern is more than valid. Plus gators ae bragging about getting 200% plus returns.