What are the "secrets" and "strategies"?
Sharad M.Pro Member
Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votesWhat are the "secrets" and "strategies"?
Most Popular Reply
Secret #1: study hard
Secret #2: take action
Secret #3: don't give money to anyone who claims there are other secrets
62 Replies
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes12y
Bryan just implied there are secrets, he offers coaching.
Understand that some slight spin or technique applied is not really a secret worth paying for as we can get into aspects of presentations, salesmanship, responses to objections and other unique areas that are unique to ones personality, area and market. Such "secrets" may not be reproducible by others.
Implying there are marketable secrets IMO is false and deceptive advertising, we covered what secrets there are.
One area of coaching or mentoring where I do see value is in construction and rehabbing. No, this is not an endorsement of Bryan's services. But, there tons of techniques, tricks and approaches in rehabbing, not really secrets, that can be reproduced by others, save you time and money. An example, removing carpeting from a large room, first cut the carpet at 6 to 8 foot lengths along the longest stretch from wall to wall, then remove each small piece rolling it up in easily managed sizes for disposal. That can save you some time, has less effort and makes it a one man job. What is that really worth, not much, most will figure it out, it's common practice too, if it's being trashed. But there are hundreds of things you can do to make work more efficient and efficiency reduces costs.
Heck, if you go to a bar with a bunch of construction workers and buy a few beers, you'll get their tricks and the how to's. Sometimes it's good to have friends in low places, LOL. :)
I haven't been doing RE as long as some of the other members. This is my 4th year, so may be in some years I will have some secret. But as of today, I can't think of one thing I do that is secret in my business and which hasn't already been discussed on BP.
Over the years, I have developed some sophisticated spreadsheets that I use to manage my business, but those are not secrets.
What has helped me do deals is:
1) Timing
2) Networking
3) Reliable team
Sharad - some good and accurate posts here. I don't know Than Merrill however I do know many of the people who've claimed real estate success but went down in flames. Here is the secret:
Most people never follow through and give up!
I had this very conversation at lunch yesterday with a well-known trainer. Statistics are probably 80-90%+ of people don't apply what they learn. I've been on both sides of this equation for close to 40 years!
Add to this the challenge of managing people's expectations and you have a recipe for only a handful of really successful real estate investors. This is human nature. It's not unique to real estate. Substitute dieting, gym, etc. if you don't belive me, get the BP people to survey members and see what percentage of posters here have even done a single deal!
This is also the problem that brings down trainers. If you sell education to people who get excited by a TV show or some mass media, and have your top students testify as to their success, thereby proving the material works, you're going to have a lot of people who never take the shrink wrapper off the course or leave the couch but are unhappy with the (lack of) results of the training.
Don't let BPers tell you otherwise; there are secrets in real estate investing! If I were you, however, I'd hold off spending much money on training until you find that the tools you have are insufficient for the job you are tying to do. That's when specialty tools are good investments - when you know that you're going to use them.
Imagine that...a wrench for every nut.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes12y
Surprised we got through the fist page without the coaches, mentors and gurus, but here they come!
Secrets, BS, they won't tell you a secret until you pay for it, then you can find out it's been done before or that the knowledge is already out there.
Common sense tells you that if someone has to rely on marketing secrets the content of what they have can't stand on its own as being the product, if it wasn't the illusion of being special it wouldn't be worth much, let alone more.
I'll review the prospectus of the Harvard Law School and see if they sell the higher value of their education being based on the "secrets" in law, I know it's not cheap but I doubt they make such claims. You pay more for basically the same education and pay more for the prestige of the degree based on the schools reputation, contacts with peers and staff, it sure isn't based on their sports programs (LOL).
I'll leave the topic now and let the folklore be told, here they come! :)
- Residential Real Estate Agent · Cookeville, TN · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 948 votes12y
Regardless of coaching or not-coaching or whatever: The truth of the matter is that the real estate market is not an efficient market. And I'm thankful for that. It gives us investors opportunities to make money if we know how to find and take advantage of those inefficiencies. It may be a matter of terminology, but some may refer to some of those inefficiencies as "secrets" and methods to take advantage of them as "strategies". And some of those secrets and strategies may be more or less "secret" than others. For me, I have learned some things (secrets if you will) that I take advantage of (strategies if you will), and I am confident that these same things have been a major part of my success as an investor. Will I just blab all of this out there to everyone on BP and the world? No way. Are they unique to my particular market? Well, yes in some ways, but no in other ways. What I have learned could very well be reproduced over much of the USofA. I've looked into it and researched it. Is my "secret" something that is already well known? No, I've never heard ANY other person (guru, coach, investor, or whatever) mention it at all as it relates to REI. I did a keyword search here on BP and the only mention of it that I found was my own. I did a Google search, and there are a few mentions of this inefficiency in the RE market, but I did not find a single blog, article, guru sales pitch or anything else that even came close to advocating a strategy to take advantage of this inefficiency. I really have no need to justify this to Bill or anyone else, and I really have no desire to "teach" this strategy, because I'm having too much fun utilizing it myself. But suffice it to say, there are "secrets" that some people know and utilize to make money in this biz. And there's nothing wrong with that. I'm sure that Coca Cola won't be sharing their secret formula any time soon either.
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes12y
Any type of business you are in it's all about MARKETING. The companies you see with a profitable balance sheet typically have a very good marketing campaign.
What I have learned after decades is there are no secrets only information I haven't learned yet.
Many people want to be lazy and make money so they buy into these types of "easily change your life" programs. Everyday I get up with the mentality that I know nothing so that it opens my mind to absorb the most information possible to increase my knowledge and competency.
People BUY into the DREAM but they do not realize that the dream is nothing more than actionable steps and a continual process of where they want to go in life.
Nike had one of the best slogans out there "Just do it ! " I would rather taste failure from trying than fear from never taking the first step.
Well said, Joel Owens. If it's new to me, it's 'new.' If you know something that I don't, it may not be a big secret but it may be difficult or next to impossible to discover in the timeframe that I want or need the information or that tool. I may be willing to pay your price or not.
I'm free to try and discover it on my own, IF I know the right question(s) to ask.
- 12yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Agreed RE is such a big field NO one knows it all or even close to it.
And as we gain experience we learn new things. A lot of what we learn is by doing it.. Trial and Error. Making boo boo's learning from those boo boo's.
The reality is what most investors gravitate to when they are starting out is what is most visible in their daily lives and that's basically flipping houses ERGO HGTV and all the off shoot celebrity flipper shows and people, then those guys get a name and morph into the the Seminar bizz. Its just a business of selling information and willing buyer and willing seller comes to play..
And unless one was handed an already operating profitable RE business we ALL started as newbies never have done a deal,, little or no cash, and somehow figured out how to succeed..
Those with backgrounds in finance and Marketing and construction. Have a distinct advantage over those with no fundamental RE knowledge. This is why for me I think a good suggestion to those starting out is get a RE license that will at least teach you the terminology and laws of the land.. And most RE companies give those course's for free or nominal costs ( in the hopes you will work for them when you pass the test.)
For me personally I had good background in Sales and Marketing, but I hired the accounting, and construction I have just learned by trial and error and or hired people that new that field. But when your starting out which is like we are stating 90% of the audience here they have to be all things. So that is where a seminar or paid mentorship could be a benefit to some... Not all but to some. and especially those that can afford it.
AS for little secrets my favorite that I learned was standing in the basement of this lovely bricker in Detroit the rehabber was working and they were painting the copper pipes grey.. I asked why are you doing that.. Response.. When the thieves come in at night looking for copper they see these grey pipes and think its Galvanized and they don't have value and they don't steal them... Nice little touch and a trade secret Eh.
- Real Estate Agent · Milwaukee County, WI · Member since 2009 · 3k+ posts · 525 votes12y
Nice tip Jay
Thanks
" thieves come in at night looking for copper they
see these grey pipes and think its Galvanized
and they don't have value and they don't steal them "
- Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 31k+ posts · 20k+ votes12y
Originally posted by @Ramon Jenkins:
Nice tip Jay
Thanks
" thieves come in at night looking for copper they
see these grey pipes and think its Galvanized
and they don't have value and they don't steal them "
I go Pex
- Flint, MI · Member since 2013 · 106 posts · 38 votes12y
Use of the word "secret" is so widely used and abused in the information marketing industry because it works. I used to work in the timeshare industry, marketing assets that have no value except that which the sales can create for it. Information is equally worthless, especially when much of it is untrue
Most successful investors I have spoken to say the key to success in real estate is good relationships with the right people. And a key to good relationships is aligning interests. What frustrates me and probably most others on BP who are not in the information industry about information marketers may be the inherent hypocrisy that is evident when a teacher's financial interests are not at all aligned with their students' financial interests but they teach about an industry that only really works when we align our interests. They're essentially saying, "do as I say, not as I do."
The net is we need to be very careful when choosing teachers, whether they be professional or even spiritual teachers. They can very easily do more harm than good. They can also do a lot of good when we choose wisely...
- Real Estate Professional · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2010 · 609 posts · 163 votes12y
I really like what @Joel Owens said. However, perhaps some have no money for marketing. But It is still so possible to start in this business. I have a friend I have known over 30 years who has gone from job to job. Very smart but job to job. A month ago he called and asked me to come over to help him with something. When I got there he wanted to show off his brand new Rich Dad Poor Dad software he was going to use to get rich in RE investing. I sat him down and told him to read the marketing threads in BP for 2 hours a day until he read everything or he had actually mailed letters or something. I told him to think of and write down every reason a person might want to sell and then separate the ways that might have motivation linked to them. I told him to knock on doors of potential motivated sellers from the list he made ie foreclosure or what ever. Then I told him to knock on more doors and talk to more people. Then I told him to get his RE license while doing all of this. I even told him one of my "secrets" to find deals as long as he promised to stay out of my county :). My "secret" takes a few hours a week but does produce deals. Just closed on one doing this Friday and had it sold on Friday for a real nice spread. I told my friend I will help him every step of the way but he has to do what I told him first. Most people want the easy way; I hope he takes the hard way.
As for my "secret", I'm not going to tell. But if one will make the list I spoke of and look for something that everyone and their dog is not going after and knock on doors, one will find a deal. I havn't done this but I bet if one picked the correct neighborhood and knocked on every door and asked the right questions, one could find a deal within a few months. Once one has the money, more efficient ways of marketing can be done.
- Real Estate Professional · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2010 · 609 posts · 163 votes12y
Originally posted by @Scott McMahan:
Most successful investors I have spoken to say the key to success in real estate is good relationships with the right people. And a key to good relationships is aligning interests.
100% true at least in my case. Good relationships have enabled me to have instant buyers when I need them and the type of projects I like to rehab when I need one.
- Investor/Realtor · Hoover, AL · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 459 votes12y
@Andy Luick ..."left wallet at home"..I like this one!!...In my market you can buy properties for under 30K, so it never made sense to pay for a "guru"..my first 3 rehabs were my classroom!!..I'm still learning!!!Each project brings it's own challenges or not...
1..Action, action, action
2. network with local investors
3. Read, BP, good books
4. Enjoy the journey..
- Flipper / Rehabber / Real Estate Investor · Toronto, Ontario · Member since 2012 · 392 posts · 77 votes12y
Hey, what's wrong with gurus? I wouldn't be where I am today without mine!
Of course, I guess my confidence was a little shaken when he declared the company bankrupt and fired his staff... :(
Everyone on this forum's got it right - there's no secret: keep learning, keep networking, build your relationships/teams and most importantly do something productive for your business/investing every day. Amazing things happen when you keep pushing!
- Real Estate Investor · atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 456 posts · 237 votes12y
Relationships and learning & networking on a site like BP will do far more for anyone than anything else....besides actually doing the rehabs and work. @Rolanda Eldridge - good stuff...and you will continue to learn by doing. I've been at it for 26 years now and continue to learn something new every single day. It's keeps it fun..Some like you are in markets where a decent $30k property can still be found and rented....that's awesome! There are little towns in upstate NY where you can do the same and get $800 a month rents...there are headaches with those as well but the returns make it worthwhile!
The secrets if there are any - are working smart, learning to earn and networking. Beyond, treat the people in your circle well and have fun while avoiding too much leverage. I looked at a multi-fam this weekend that never made any sense and I might be able to turn it around for the owner with shared housing...just not sure I want the headache. Happy Investing!
Originally posted by @Bill Gulley:
An interesting guru education thought: There were two girls who attended a private college. School admissions told them they could get high paying jobs with a degree in a specialty from the school. The girls got the degree but no jobs were to be found. They sued the school for deceptive trade practices and are "winning" it appears. Their attorney is now in the process of seeking a class action suit against the school and the Arkansas AG is looking into the case as well for fraud. Case began last July.
Then, it stands to reason that promising riches from an education about certain things isn't as risk free as we thought! :)
this is the reason why so many uncredited and private schools have been popping up all over the country. ABC or one of those had an investigative report that all schools make that claim and get people to sign up. schools know that most adults will quit after a semester or two. it's a big scam but it's a big business, i guess.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes12y
I found this issue during my due diligence as the director asked if I would teach for them. We were talking about BP and RE in a small group as I usually do, yes, I talk about you all, LOL, and the online classes came up. He offered a pretty sweat deal actually without much of my direct involvement along with providing an accredited business degree and state RE education approval.
Problem is I found this marketing issue, and most all here know I can't be had doing such things. I'd be using my name under their banner. They would be marketing the business school.
I do know that they have a decent course in medical fields and that students are placed in jobs here. But due to the matter being unresolved and the serious nature of the claims I'll pass.
I do have an opening at Missouri State University of sorts, I was advised to present the course outline and present it. That would be a huge amount of brain damage and basically handing the school a lot of detailed information. The real upside would be support and it being accredited.
IMO, if a course isn't accredited by a state or national education board it's not really an educational endeavor. That is not to say that education can't be obtained by qualified instructors in a corporate or association setting. The American Banker's Association is an educational entity, the National Association of Realtors has courses, American Appraisal Institute is another. All have industry and educational accreditation aspects.
Gurus aren't accredited by anyone except themselves. I'm not going there. :)
- Investor · Fort Smith, AR · Member since 2013 · 150 posts · 32 votes12y
I went to a weekend seminar. I think it cost about $200. It introduced me to ideas that I have now discovered are common place, but were new to me at the time. The best thing I actually got out of it was the networking with similar thinkers. I keep contact with a few of them and it was one of them that introduced me to BP. I cant say that Id recommend it to anyone else, but I actually did get my money out of it by being proactive at the event.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes12y
Something we aren't likely to find out is the extent of BP's impact on the guru market. I really only have three reasons to be here; 1, I enjoy talking about RE, 2. I want to educate and encourage ethical dealing leading others making a great living, 3. Put those who prey on the public with unethical dealings or promoting illegal and bad information out of business, to get the scammers out of the industry.
3. Won't likely happen as they pop up like weeds. There will always be crooks. There will always be those wanting an easy buck off others with little effort. There will also be an endless supply of people wanting to make money in RE with the least amount of effort, who believe if they just get the secret of some strategy that's all they need to be in the RE business.
If you can attend some seminar on RE and meet other folks there, for the price of a night out with a dinner and a movie, then by all means, go have fun! Just have the common sense to know what is said may not be true and their goal is to get in your pocket, not to make you rich, but them. :)
- Residential Real Estate Agent · Cookeville, TN · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 948 votes12y
@Bill Gulley - Since you paint with such a broad brush, I assume that you have personally met and come to know the personal motivations of every coach, mentor, and guru on the face of the planet.
- Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes12y
Originally posted by @Bryan L.:
@Bill Gulley - Since you paint with such a broad brush, I assume that you have personally met and come to know the personal motivations of every coach, mentor, and guru on the face of the planet.No, I've just read the things they've said on here and other sites. If I had met them, I'd probably use a spray gun. :)
Funny, I got a random call at 11pm last night from a guy across the country who was about ready to sign up for Fortune Builder's $25K coaching program. By the time the conversation was done, he had decided (on his own) to spend $2000 working 1:1 with a local coach instead.
I saved him $23,000 and he'll probably get better instruction from the local investor/coach...I feel I've done my good deed for the week... :-)
- Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes12y
Thanks Sharad for asking this question.
Back in 2003 when I started investing in real estate, there was no BP. So, I had to learn from the gurus. I bought a $20 book and a $60 course on cassette tapes (I know...I am old) from a guru . I made $10K on my first deal so...are the "secrets" worth it? The answer is YES.
Now that there's BP and a lot of information can be researched and found online...do you still need the gurus? Not so much. The supposedly "secrets" are out in the open and can be acquired at a much cheaper price than the thousands or tens of thousands of dollars that these gurus charge.
I like @J Scott 's approach of listening to the free seminars or webinars to learn some little new twists to an old strategy or get some new ideas. I do the exact same thing. I am humble enough to realize I don't know everything but I am skeptical that the gurus know something that can not be found at a much cheaper price. I benefited from a guru idea recently. Implemented it in my business and I am getting 2 new properties a month because of it.
Listen to the gurus for ideas but don't buy their overpriced courses. Research the rest of it here on BP and some books about the topic. The "secrets" are not really secrets anymore. Or at least, they don't cost as much as the gurus want us to believe.
I agree that @J Scott has a good approach about attending free seminars to pick up some good ideas. I have not tried it, but I think I might start doing that too.
Honestly, in my market up until this point, I have been able to buy plenty of deals from MLS with some non-MLS deals that I really haven't had a need to come up with some creative ideas. Recently, the market has been getting more competitive and I am looking at some other methods (none "secrets") to acquire more properties.
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.