Realtor Bait & Switch ?

Member since 2019 · 34 posts · 22 votes

I made an offer today on a property that’s been sitting for some time now. The seller’s realtor made a counter offer and I accepted.

My realtor was about to send the contract with the amended price that I agreed to which is the seller’s asking counter offer.

Just a few hours into it the seller’s realtor texted my realtor saying there’s another offer coming in tomorrow.

REALLY?! Isn’t this a huge co-incidence that someone is making another offer tomorrow after a few hours of me accepting their counter offer? Smells fishy to me. I’m tempted to pull out my offer and say they can have it ! What would you guys do? This is my 1st flip.

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Russell BrazilBusiness Member

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Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes

Too many amateurs giving you bad advice.

How does waiting til they look at the other offer hurt you other than the possibility of you losing the deal? Pulling your offer does the same thing. Why would you shoot yourself in the foot?

Therea no coincidence here. This is how real estate works. Offer comes in, listing agent sends mass email to every one that looked at the property, 2nd or 3rd offer comes in. Standard operating procedure. I just had a property listed, week 7 on the market I get an offer, and I was able to turn that into 4 offers in s 24 hour period.

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Justin Caputo
Real Estate Broker · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2016 · 70 posts · 15 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera
what is the issue with that? If you’re under contract, you should be fine.
0 Reply
Al Pat
Rental Property Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2016 · 325 posts · 253 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera Always put in your offer with a sign by or expiration date. That puts pressure on them to accept In timely manner. Often time they play this game to have you raise your offer. Remember to fall in love with the numbers not so much in love of the property, love the property after you purchase it.
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Ola Dantis
Multifamily Syndicator · Houston, TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera This happens sometimes. The Seller wants the highest and best, so does the Realtor.
Now, all you have to do wait and when they come back begging you drop the price to your original office.
Try not to be too vested in ONE deal.
Deals are like buses there is always another coming behind!
0 Reply
Alex G.
Eastern Mass & Central Maine · Member since 2009 · 252 posts · 135 votes
7y
Do not rescind the offer. Stand your ground.
0 Reply
Michael Masters
Rental Property Investor · Westport, CT · Member since 2017 · 176 posts · 183 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera
I have a different approach on offers. I always put a time limit on the offer as others have mentioned. However, in addition I tell my agent if the seller comes back saying they want more time for other offers then tell them my offer after time expires will be lowered a small amount. In your case, an 82,000 offer today will become an 81,000 offer tomorrow.
This will give the seller second thoughts about shopping my offer. Also, if they shop it and fail then my offer is clearly above market so it should be lowered.
I never tell the seller my approach up front as it may offend, only if they come back with “awaiting better offers”.
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Todd Rasmussen
Rental Property Investor · Clarksville, TN · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
7y
Originally posted by @Engelbert Devera:
@Brian Haskell they received the paperwork with their asking counter price but have NOT signed the contract. So technically I don’t have a deal until they sign it correct?

Correct. Technically, you made an offer that they did not respond to and then you made a second higher offer that they have not responded to. In the future, if someone counters verbally have them send it officially. If you had actually accepted a counter, you'd be under contract and be able to purchase the property. Agree with what's been said previously about not pulling your offer for spite. You never know what the other offer is.

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Joel Fine
Rental Property Investor · Leander, TX · Member since 2018 · 183 posts · 264 votes
7y
It's just business. If you are comfortable with your offer, let it stand and wait to see what the sellers come back with. Either they'll agree to your offer, or they'll tell you there's a new offer on the table, and you'll likely have to match or beat it. At that point you can decide what to do.
Imagine you were in the sellers' position. Wouldn't you do the same thing?
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Henry Lazerow
Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
7y
"Doesn’t matter if an offer is coming in tomorrow. If they made a written counter offer and you accepted, the deal is done. If nothing was in writing, then no deal was offered or accepted."

Not true at all. At least in Chicago seller can sign an offer and an hour later have attorney email "I declare contract null and void" and go with a new higher offer. Nothing is permanent until attorney review closes.

This is why it's good to have a well known realtor. It tends to be the no name realtors that play games like this. People who have rapport and know each other tend to be a lot more upfront.
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Acram Richani
Rancho Santa margarita, Ca. · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 0 votes
7y
@Henry Lazerow
I always recommend to put a deadline to be accepted in all your offers and counter offers. That way you brush out the players and keep them honest. At this point you need to stay patient and ride it out .
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Acram Richani
Rancho Santa margarita, Ca. · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 0 votes
7y
@Acram Richani
Also when your realtor got the counter over the phone he should have asked the sellers realtor to send it in writing . Then you would have had them locked.
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Engelbert Devera
OP
Member since 2019 · 34 posts · 22 votes
7y
Thank you all for your comments I lost the deal seller’s realtor said they took another offer I’m OK with that will learn from this...onto the next.
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Omar Diaz
Fort Polk, LA · Member since 2019 · 29 posts · 14 votes
7y
@Tricia Ewing
Could not have said it any better!
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Joe SplitrockPro Member
Moderator
Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
7y
In this situation, there was not a counter offer. There was an offer and a verbal discussion about a counter offer. The seller never gave a counter offer, they asked for the buyer to resubmit a revised offer. The realtor probably did that intentionally as to not lock the seller into anything.
The alternate way this could have gone down is request a counter offer in writing. In that case, the seller could not have considered any other offers.
I get annoyed when realtors will not send a written counter and instead ask you to resubmit an new offer. I just say put it in writing back to me or nothing will happen. That is my personal strategy, but I get why the listing agent wants to keep options open.
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Boris GrinbergBusiness Member
Lender · Paramus, NJ · Member since 2016 · 118 posts · 33 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera It was no mistake on your part. Realtors play this game all the time. You can try to get things in writing but you may struggle.
We bought multiple properties and think that we are sophisticated player but it happens to us all the time (especially for attractively priced deals) even though we know the game.
I read a lot of sophisticated responses on this thread and some good ideas. Practically speaking - if you have an unscrupulous realtor, which seems like you are dealing with one, all bets are off. They will use your offer and will beat the drums that demand is strong.
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Joe Bertolino
Investor · El Dorado Hills, CA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera
No need to be emotional. Your offer is what it is. They take it or not.
It is really odd but there are times when a house has been on a long time and suddenly gets a lot of interest because of price decreases or the competing inventory has been absorbed and this house “was a 2 at 10pm and a 10 at 2am.”
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Dustin P.
Realtor · Tempe, AZ · Member since 2017 · 541 posts · 442 votes
7y
@Russell Brazil Made a great point in that the listing agent is doing their job to get the seller the best price. You have to make your realtor work you just as hard on the buyer's side

If I was the buyer's agent I would have pried and figured out where that other offer was coming in at and obtained as much information as possible. You'd be surprised how much info listing agents will give up (Not all of them, but a lot of them). Maybe if you came up to 83k would 3k in earnest money and a shorter inspection period with a 4 hour response time you would have got it, who knows? Typically I'm very aggressive with offers, especially on earnest money and response time
I just got a deal under contract this week from doing something similar. The deal price dropped from 180k to 142k. I went and walked the house within 30 minutes of it hitting the hot sheet and had the offer to them within the hour, 125k. Over the course of the next day they had a bunch of other offers all between the 120k and 132k mark and I called the agent and said where do I need to be to get this done? Highest offer they said was 132k. We came up to 132.5k (Still worked there), shortened inspection period to 48 hours and upped earnest money to $5k, and put a 2 hour response time on it. Offer was accepted. Found a couple things to renegotiate on and ended up at 130k.
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David Michael
Developer · Closter, NJ · Member since 2016 · 392 posts · 109 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera
I'm not sure Outside New Jersey but the contract is biting when both parties signed. One sided signing doesn't mean anything... At least here in NJ
They could also be fishy for a higher offer from you.
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Jordan Mummau
Real Estate Agent · Hershey, PA · Member since 2019 · 66 posts · 54 votes
7y
I can’t tell you how many offers I’ve made, even on properties that have been on the market forever. 99.9% of the time the selling agent will ALWAYS say there’s another offer coming or at a minimum another interested party. It’s not always untrue either, as a selling agent they’re going to go back to every other single person that showed the least bit of interest and let them know it’s their last shot to get in. Sometimes this does result in a competitive offer. However, in most cases, it never materializes or the competitive offer doesn’t have as good of terms. If you make an offer and it’s truly your highest and best, put your head in the sand! Stay emotionless through the process and you’ll make better business decisions!
1 Reply
Eric Thomson
Real Estate Broker · Conroe, TX · Member since 2012 · 165 posts · 46 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera As a Realtor I learned pretty quickly to stop giving any verbal acceptance of offers because of this sort of situation (which happens more than you’d think). I would not pull your offer, that makes no sense. That’s cutting off your nose to spite your face. This is a business, don’t let your emotions get the best of you (easier said than done). I’d suggest finalizing your signed, accepted counter offer and submit it. If they were lying then you’ll get the property for the price you agreed. If they weren’t lying, well you’re no worse off than if you pull you offer.
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Joshua Tessier
Rental Property Investor · Manchester, NH · Member since 2019 · 186 posts · 156 votes
7y
Originally posted by @Engelbert Devera:
@J Tessier I agree 100%. Can you contact the seller directly even if they already have a realtor? I think they have to use their realtor since they have a contract for their listing.

A realtor is selling a product and charging a rate for there service. So let’s say the seller agrees to pay a buyer and seller commission typically. They sign a contract saying I’ll list with you for X amount of time and get paid X percentage to bring you a offer. You may have also signed an agreement with a broker saying if I purchase a property you’ll get x percentage as well. So be careful you maybe on the hook too. If you have the sellers info certainly contact them directly. If it’s been for sale for a long time the contract may be close to expiring. If you can explain to them your willing to purchase the property with no agents that means 5% that’s not going to realtors and instead coming off the purchase price. So if you use a realtor and pay $100,000 for the house the seller pockets $95,000. If I’m able to get to the seller directly and I offer $95,000 the seller gets the whole $95,000 which is the same amount they got before except you save $5,000. Since there’s no one between you and the seller communicating is easier and smoother in my mind. Realtor will hate you but your wallet won’t!
1 Reply
Monique O.
Rental Property Investor · Visalia, CA · Member since 2019 · 44 posts · 20 votes
7y
For me....It is easy to get caught up in the emotion of it all. I always try to operate in the world of facts (Not saying it is easy!). But if you want the house, I would ride it out and see what happens before you make a decision based on circumstantial evidence, thoughts and feelings. Let it play out and if there is another offer and you do not want to make another counter offer then move on to the next deal.
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Chad Boyers
Real Estate Agent · Toledo, OH · Member since 2019 · 88 posts · 38 votes
7y
@J Tessier just remember that a listing agent only has a fiduciary duty to his/her client, not to you as the buyer. You may or may not get better/more info or a better deal, it is not guaranteed. Same as going directly through the listing agent because they'll lower their listing fees to get you a better price. That's not a guarantee either.
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Chad Boyers
Real Estate Agent · Toledo, OH · Member since 2019 · 88 posts · 38 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera
I think you have likely received some accurate as well as some inaccurate information. Every situation is different, as are State laws. Here are a few items that I'm thinking:
1) You may have had a legally binding agreement in place, depending on your state. Here in Ohio, verbal agreements are legally binding. That being said, good luck proving it in court. If verbal agreements are not considered legally binding, you simply have an offer that wasn't accepted.
2) Depending on your state, there may be an attorney review period. This is what I call a "get it of jail free" card. It essentially allows the other party to cancel the agreement for basically any reason.
3) Going forward, make sure you get any counter offers in writing.
4) It sounds like there was another bona fide offer from another buyer. This tells me that it wasn't just the listing agent give you a line. Don't assume that there isn't another offer that comes in. Also, don't overreact if another offer does come.
5) Going forward, a couple of things to consider: (1) using an escalation clause in competitive offer situations. (2) If there are other offers involved, insist on getting a copy of the last page of the other offer(s) (minus private details) so that you have verification that they actually existed.
Best of luck to you!
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Fasil Khan
Real Estate Agent · Elmwood Park, NJ · Member since 2015 · 151 posts · 36 votes
7y
@engelbert I would wait it out, also know your numbers even if you went to 90k would it make sense then wait it out if it only makes sense at the 82k then see what they say if they want you to go higher then walk away. My assumption is that it's a competitive market see what happens the make a logically and numbers decision not emotional decision. Hope it works in your favor and great job finding deal
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Terry Ellis
Specialist · Omaha · Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 5 votes
7y
@Engelbert Devera I would walk away. I had a guy do that to me. This house had been sitting for a year. I offered a price, and the next day “somebody else” was making a higher priced offer. No counter from the seller. Walk away and never use that realtor.
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