Quit My Job and Plan to Wholesale

537 Replies

Originally posted by @Dave G. :

Maybe I'm off on this, but I believe it is the responsibility of every BP contributor to read all the posts prior to theirs in attempt to not be redundant to previous posts as well as to provide value-added input.

However, I am not about to go read 395 posts. Even if I was a bored, retired person with absolutely no life, I would not read 395 posts before adding my 2 cents.

So here goes, and apologies for my laziness.

I am always baffled why someone new to real estate decides they want to be a wholesaler. Admittedly, I have not done any wholesaling, as I am a long-time buy/hold investor. But to me, being a good, valid wholesaler seems like it would be one of the most challenging jobs in real estate investment. It does not at all seem like a job that a newbie could quickly be successful at. I would think an effective wholesaler needs to have a more comprehensive skillset than almost all other types of real estate investors. They need to have superior communication & negotiation skills. They need to know not just the traditional transaction process, but multiple alternative transaction/deal structures. They must know precise market values and precise rehab costs. There's a lot of stuff going on here, and it seems to me like its the last path someone new to real estate should take.

Lastly, I have looked at wholesaler deals. I am very skeptical until I am provided enough substantiation to gain confidence and engage. On what basis would I have any confidence in the deals someone brand new to real estate brings me? I know the short answer would be the numbers, but experience and reputation apply strongly here.

Not trying to dissuade anyone from doing this. But realize that here's one investor's view of someone new to real estate going into wholesaling as well as considerations on doing business with such a person.

But yes, I do think every single wholesaler feels crazy and overwhelmed before they start closing deals. At least, that's the impression I'm getting. I have some knowledge, as I had be trying to crack into REI for almost a year now, so I'm not a complete "newb" just haven't done a deal yet. Will I sound like a buffoon to an experienced investor, I hope not a total one, but probably a little... I'm open about my status. I'm also willing to work HARD for anyone willing to work with me. Relationships are key. I'm in a steep learning curve right now and it's kicking my butt. I'll figure out what works and what doesn't and I'll come out on top in the end. Baltimore is crazy swamped with investors, I'm confident I'll come across a solid person I can help out if they help me out soon enough. I have a few small connections but nothing solid yet - getting close though - so so so close. I'm closing my first deal before this month is over. That's a fact! Well, it will be any way. If I had no other responsibilities I would have already closed my first deal but I do have other responsibilities right now so MY "normal" timeline is extended a bit.

Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs :
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom. JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals.. But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps.

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

Originally posted by @Matt K. :
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom.   JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but  I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals..  But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I  would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps. 

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

 Turns out that many live there and sleep under their desks at least in the early years.. when you are employed and all your food and basic needs are free. many just never left  .. when I was in one of the restaurants the whole famdamily was there dinning.. :)  Its UBER cool really though. and to think I was raised 5 miles away and look what has happened.  but you cant get into the building with the players.

Originally posted by @Matt K. :
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom.   JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but  I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals..  But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I  would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps. 

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

That's crazy! I had no idea. I wonder if it's still considered one of the top companies to work for. I mean, I assume so. Looking back, every job I left (voluntarily) was due to being overworked, under-appreciated, and essentially not being able to utilize my skill set appropriately or to it's fullest. 

My job I just left, I could have easily stayed had the work been different. Had it been more like my 1st or 2nd year there. The money was more than sufficient for the lifestyle I had created/wanted - I was even paid much less my first year. I worked my butt off and got a $10K raise after my first year. However, when that work became something different (not due to promotion, just simply the work was "different"), I became really unhappy. I then really analyzed what I was bringing home for that work and I said, I can not do this anymore right now. I need something else. I need to help others in a different way. Actually help them. I did not go to school and work my butt off to get to a job where I basically wanted to cry in a bathroom everyday. That was not for me. So many people are miserable working in the school system I just left. The conditions really... I mean... I could just go on and on. The average person could not hang and would not settle for what these people do every school day. They shouldn't "hang" or "settle" for it either but while they do, nothing will change, so hang and settle they must. It's just shame, really. And so many of the kids suffer as a result - that system is so broken. 

Some districts have it right but most are failing miserably. And don't even get me started on "Common Core." That is bogus! I was looking at a diary I had from when I was in 4th grade compared to what my son, now in 4th-grade, writes. I'm like... what... the... f...? The quality is just worlds apart. He's always hated writing though, so I'm sure that has something to do with it. Though, I look at the state and district averages for his testing from last year, he's literally only JUST below it those averages. *smh*

Originally posted by @Melanie Hartmann :
Originally posted by @Matt K.:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom.   JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but  I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals..  But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I  would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps. 

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

That's crazy! I had no idea. I wonder if it's still considered one of the top companies to work for. I mean, I assume so. Looking back, every job I left (voluntarily) was due to being overworked, under-appreciated, and essentially not being able to utilize my skill set appropriately or to it's fullest. 

My job I just left, I could have easily stayed had the work been different. Had it been more like my 1st or 2nd year there. The money was more than sufficient for the lifestyle I had created/wanted - I was even paid much less my first year. I worked my butt off and got a $10K raise after my first year. However, when that work became something different (not due to promotion, just simply the work was "different"), I became really unhappy. I then really analyzed what I was bringing home for that work and I said, I can not do this anymore right now. I need something else. I need to help others in a different way. Actually help them. I did not go to school and work my butt off to get to a job where I basically wanted to cry in a bathroom everyday. That was not for me. So many people are miserable working in the school system I just left. The conditions really... I mean... I could just go on and on. The average person could not hang and would not settle for what these people do every school day. They shouldn't "hang" or "settle" for it either but while they do, nothing will change, so hang and settle they must. It's just shame, really. And so many of the kids suffer as a result - that system is so broken. 

Some districts have it right but most are failing miserably. And don't even get me started on "Common Core." That is bogus! I was looking at a diary I had from when I was in 4th grade compared to what my son, now in 4th-grade, writes. I'm like... what... the... f...? The quality is just worlds apart. He's always hated writing though, so I'm sure that has something to do with it. Though, I look at the state and district averages for his testing from last year, he's literally only JUST below it those averages. *smh*

Tech companies in general have really nice perks, but typically demand crazy hours. One big problem for Google is that you pack a ton of top performers into the same team.... and some have an identity crisis or get burnt out (because they are now average, no longer a top performer). It also is blessing/curse to have the name recognition they do... having it on your resume can really help out.

You also have to remember the cost of living in this area (bay area ca) is outrageous... so a 150k yr salary for fresh college grad starting out might sound amazing... until you realize you're paying 1500 for a room and lose about 40% to taxes. Oh and to buy a house, you're talking millions... or hours commuting in stop/go traffic.

Originally posted by @Matt K. :
Originally posted by @Melanie Hartmann:
Originally posted by @Matt K.:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom.   JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but  I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals..  But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I  would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps. 

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

That's crazy! I had no idea. I wonder if it's still considered one of the top companies to work for. I mean, I assume so. Looking back, every job I left (voluntarily) was due to being overworked, under-appreciated, and essentially not being able to utilize my skill set appropriately or to it's fullest. 

My job I just left, I could have easily stayed had the work been different. Had it been more like my 1st or 2nd year there. The money was more than sufficient for the lifestyle I had created/wanted - I was even paid much less my first year. I worked my butt off and got a $10K raise after my first year. However, when that work became something different (not due to promotion, just simply the work was "different"), I became really unhappy. I then really analyzed what I was bringing home for that work and I said, I can not do this anymore right now. I need something else. I need to help others in a different way. Actually help them. I did not go to school and work my butt off to get to a job where I basically wanted to cry in a bathroom everyday. That was not for me. So many people are miserable working in the school system I just left. The conditions really... I mean... I could just go on and on. The average person could not hang and would not settle for what these people do every school day. They shouldn't "hang" or "settle" for it either but while they do, nothing will change, so hang and settle they must. It's just shame, really. And so many of the kids suffer as a result - that system is so broken. 

Some districts have it right but most are failing miserably. And don't even get me started on "Common Core." That is bogus! I was looking at a diary I had from when I was in 4th grade compared to what my son, now in 4th-grade, writes. I'm like... what... the... f...? The quality is just worlds apart. He's always hated writing though, so I'm sure that has something to do with it. Though, I look at the state and district averages for his testing from last year, he's literally only JUST below it those averages. *smh*

Tech companies in general have really nice perks, but typically demand crazy hours. One big problem for Google is that you pack a ton of top performers into the same team.... and some have an identity crisis or get burnt out (because they are now average, no longer a top performer). It also is blessing/curse to have the name recognition they do... having it on your resume can really help out.

You also have to remember the cost of living in this area (bay area ca) is outrageous... so a 150k yr salary for fresh college grad starting out might sound amazing... until you realize you're paying 1500 for a room and lose about 40% to taxes. Oh and to buy a house, you're talking millions... or hours commuting in stop/go traffic.

True story Matt! My mom only was making about $20ishK a year while I was growing up, so yes, even with inflation, my old salary that I managed obtain at $70K was worlds above. And so have been my children's lives when compared to my own. Much like you said though, it's nice enough on paper but the reality is you are seeing only a bit of that. For me it was about $35-$38K that I was actually bringing home each year. So we live below our means and can do things a lot of people with that salary cannot as a result - such as not work 5 jobs and save a lot of money. However, that does come with drawbacks. I've sworn from the time I bought this house that we would move before my son started middle school. The elementary is ok enough but that middle school is a mess. Two more years before it's expiry time, haha

Anyway Grant Cardone speculates that your salary needs to be $360K a year in order to save adequately, invest adequately, have an adequate buffer for emergencies, have fun, and truly not be concerned with money/how much things costs. Knowing that I can live on well under that is good but it's also gotten a bit old having to do it since day one of life when so many people are out their killing it...

@Melanie Hartmann I wish you the best of luck. Before you start spending on marketing, I strongly suggest you consider getting a real estate license. Wholesaling is a lot harder than being a RE agent IMO. In most markets, wholesaling is ridiculously hard. I'm not saying it's impossible, but you will need a very solid plan and a good amount of capital to invest on marketing.

If you have a good chunk of capital saved up, I'd go and look for a fix and flip project for yourself. Familiarize yourself with the market before you start spending big on marketing. I learned that the hard way. I hope you do well, best of luck!

Originally posted by @Melanie Hartmann :
Originally posted by @Matt K.:
Originally posted by @Melanie Hartmann:
Originally posted by @Matt K.:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Tom Gimer:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

Don't worry, not dealing with SEO won't affect your business at all. SEO is a lead generation tool. For people who have enough deals to analyze already... no need.

 That is very very VERRRY wrong!

The flaw here is thinking that (your) SEO only has to do with you and nothing and noone else.

If you have competitors no matter what your business is, not doing SEO will cost you. SEO is not just to get on top of google search results. SEO gives the (false) illusion of credibility.

When you do a search for something you automatically assume the first organic result IS actually a trusty site .."why else are they on top of Google". This is NOT the correct assumption but it is a fact that people think that.

Not doing SEO while your competitor does will get you out of business eventually, because the leads that you are getting now without SEO will sooner than later ONLY see your competitor, on top of google with "thus" more credibility.

I do not mean offense to the following but statements like you have made makes it clear you absolutely do not understand  SEO and the reasons/benefits importance for SEO.

It is dangerous saying stuff like that in the open and I hope no one takes that advise seriously because it will be the end of them!

How are you getting your leads btw? You pay for them I assume.. DMM, PPC Ads?

You having enough leads so you do not need SEO...  well.. if those leads stop coming in because your competitor ramped up their SEO... what then?

Take a look at my competitors traffic:

Before I came along they were fine. Since I came along their organic traffic pretty much stopped dead! Now they have to do paid marketing to get leads. Yet I am still more credible than they are and people chose me. Now they cant keep their marketing budget.. and as you can see  at "september" they are now desperately trying to do organic SEO because it looks they cant afford spending the money.

So what do I do?

I look at every city they invest in and take their market away from thm. I will completely destroy them till they go bankrupt. It is brutal out there but that is the way it goes. If you are the top dog, eventually someone will overtake you. You have to be sure you are the ONLY dog out there!

Lucky for all of you, your competitors have not yet figured this out... in CT however.. they are poop out of luck because I do not play around!

Thanks Tom.   JErryl I only ask because when my website launchs I do want someone to see it. .. but  I have never had one and I do over 40 million a year in real estate so I guess you can say I create my own deals..  But when I do launch my new website its purpose from my end is simply I guess more of a brag piece more than anything.. we have built some pretty cool housing tracks and some super neato Period homes in Charleston and moderns in Portland that I  would like to showcase.. and other land developments we are doing and have an interest in.. that look great from google maps I love google maps. 

I think though I can get google to play.. they invited me down and I made a presentation at their campus  LOL.. so I have some pretty good connections there.. 

Anyway I get it now .. and if I was a Realtor or a PHO realtor ( ie wholesaler) I would sure want this to drive leads over paying 10k a month for direct mail.. 

 I see. Tom my apologies. I assumed you were replying in general. If you do 40M a year, dude, I want my 1M for being your friend! You think my friendship is free?

Pffft!

When you are ready to launge give me the URL. I can help you with some SEO Magic!

wait.. Google invited you to their campus?

WTH man. SO unfair!

 40 million gross sales not NET.. so you will have to wait for your 1 mil..  YUP fully guided tour eat there its a culture unto its own that's for sure.. lots of super sharp kids walking around there with their dogs and playing Volleyball :)

 I did some research once on google and the like for a class....  Basically the short version is that money only goes so far, but it's benefits outside of money that gets you top talent. Side benefit of that is the more you provide your employees the less they have to leave campus... so the more time they can spend working!

And that's why google has everything from oil change to doctor office on its campus... 

That's crazy! I had no idea. I wonder if it's still considered one of the top companies to work for. I mean, I assume so. Looking back, every job I left (voluntarily) was due to being overworked, under-appreciated, and essentially not being able to utilize my skill set appropriately or to it's fullest. 

My job I just left, I could have easily stayed had the work been different. Had it been more like my 1st or 2nd year there. The money was more than sufficient for the lifestyle I had created/wanted - I was even paid much less my first year. I worked my butt off and got a $10K raise after my first year. However, when that work became something different (not due to promotion, just simply the work was "different"), I became really unhappy. I then really analyzed what I was bringing home for that work and I said, I can not do this anymore right now. I need something else. I need to help others in a different way. Actually help them. I did not go to school and work my butt off to get to a job where I basically wanted to cry in a bathroom everyday. That was not for me. So many people are miserable working in the school system I just left. The conditions really... I mean... I could just go on and on. The average person could not hang and would not settle for what these people do every school day. They shouldn't "hang" or "settle" for it either but while they do, nothing will change, so hang and settle they must. It's just shame, really. And so many of the kids suffer as a result - that system is so broken. 

Some districts have it right but most are failing miserably. And don't even get me started on "Common Core." That is bogus! I was looking at a diary I had from when I was in 4th grade compared to what my son, now in 4th-grade, writes. I'm like... what... the... f...? The quality is just worlds apart. He's always hated writing though, so I'm sure that has something to do with it. Though, I look at the state and district averages for his testing from last year, he's literally only JUST below it those averages. *smh*

Tech companies in general have really nice perks, but typically demand crazy hours. One big problem for Google is that you pack a ton of top performers into the same team.... and some have an identity crisis or get burnt out (because they are now average, no longer a top performer). It also is blessing/curse to have the name recognition they do... having it on your resume can really help out.

You also have to remember the cost of living in this area (bay area ca) is outrageous... so a 150k yr salary for fresh college grad starting out might sound amazing... until you realize you're paying 1500 for a room and lose about 40% to taxes. Oh and to buy a house, you're talking millions... or hours commuting in stop/go traffic.

 True story Matt! My mom only was making about $20ishK a year while I was growing up, so yes, even with inflation, my old salary that I managed obtain at $70K was worlds above. And so have been my children's lives when compared to my own. Much like you said though, it's nice enough on paper but the reality is you are seeing only a bit of that. For me it was about $35-$38K that I was actually bringing home each year. So we live below our means and can do things a lot of people with that salary cannot as a result - such as not work 5 jobs and save a lot of money. However, that does come with drawbacks. I've sworn from the time I bought this house that we would move before my son started middle school. The elementary is ok enough but that middle school is a mess. Two more years before it's expiry time, haha

Anyway Grant Cardone speculates that your salary needs to be $360K a year in order to save adequately, invest adequately, have an adequate buffer for emergencies, have fun, and truly not be concerned with money/how much things costs. Knowing that I can live on well under that is good but it's also gotten a bit old having to do it since day one of life when so many people are out their killing it...

How’s the wholesaling going Melanie?

Typically wealthy starts at doubke the middle salary for the area.  Grant cardone gives some good advice but most of it isn’t really that great.

360k puts you in too 10 percent in most parts of the county.  70k isn’t rich but it’s solidly middle class.  You may not feel that’s the case if you’re a sole income household.

My personal opinion is “rich” starts at around 200k household income and up.  If I achieve that number I will be 6X the average income for where I likely end up eventually (meaning where I live)

@Matt K. Please elaborate. I have savings, working on my credit as well. Should I buy and hold? Why do some make wholesaling sound like a last resort? There are some that say get started there then, buy/flip, and rehab. Thoughts please
Originally posted by @Mia Paschall :
@Matt K. Please elaborate. I have savings, working on my credit as well. Should I buy and hold? Why do some make wholesaling sound like a last resort? There are some that say get started there then, buy/flip, and rehab. Thoughts please

 a majority of the same skill sets used to be a successful wholesaler allow you to be successful in other avenues. Wholesale is tuff because you need someone to sell you their house so far under market you can add on your fees and still have profit left in the deal for the next person. Not everyone is going to be excited about that sale and likely have little other choice otherwise they wouldn't sell it to you, they'd sell it at market price...

Buy and Hold is a slow game, you're not going to get rich/replace income over night nor will you really be able to scale up quickly. It's good way to introduce yourself and build a track record and find out what works/doesn't work for you.... Once a portfolio is built up either sell it or keep going then you could self manage and leave a day job... but it really doesn't take that much work to manage the right property.

Flips, def more money to be made. But again, depending on your area you need to find what works. In some popular areas people who don't know what they are doing bid up prices and there's almost no profit... Plus it's a skill to be able to manage a contractors performance and pay out, not everyone has it. BUT, if you can manage that and find the right deal... you're going to make more than the wholesaler did (most of the time).

Realtors, again overlapping skill set. But instead of finding the lowest prices to sale so someone else can still make money you're looking at getting market values. Plenty of bad realtors, plenty of good... plus look on commercial side good way to make a lot of money if you're cut out for it.

Plenty of bad wholesalers out there get junk properties, no clue on the rehab costs, no clue on the comps (ARV), and rely on people just looking at the marketing material (read that as bad numbers) vs doing their own due diligence. That's why so many get a bad rap, but the good ones... they don't advertise because they have established buyers already so they don't need to.

Of course as is life... always to exceptions to every rule.

I haven't read through all 400+ replies, but I have a question. If @Melanie Hartmann had posted all the same details originally but said "realtor" instead of "wholesaler", would she be getting the same amount of negative responses? Just curious.

Melanie, I think it's awesome that you're doing this.

Originally posted by @Caleb Heimsoth :
Typically wealthy starts at doubke the middle salary for the area.  Grant cardone gives some good advice but most of it isn’t really that great.

360k puts you in too 10 percent in most parts of the county.  70k isn’t rich but it’s solidly middle class.  You may not feel that’s the case if you’re a sole income household.

My personal opinion is “rich” starts at around 200k household income and up.  If I achieve that number I will be 6X the average income for where I likely end up eventually (meaning where I live)

Exactly! Haha, yes, I agree - nor is it practical for most. 

Honestly, I wouldn't have been so eager to leave my job had it been more tolerable. When I left living with my mother, she was still only making around mid $30Kish. So, in comparison, having a $70K salary was like swimming in a pool of money for me every day, haha. What's funny though, is I received a lot of government assistance when I was making 20-30Kish during grad school days. Things actually were much tighter when I first started my career at $53K as all the assistance went away and we were almost worse off overall than we had been when I was making much less. However, given the $70K pay I mad it to, and what I had put into getting to that point, it was not what I wanted for myself. It just wasn't worth my mental or physical health anymore, particularly my mental health.

As for the wholesaling - no closed deals yet but working em everyday. Have had several discussions, made a few offers, and realized I have mostly stumbled upon non-motivated sellers thus far. My marketing is new (undeveloped) so at this point it's a numbers game - so I gotta get my numbers up and eventually one will turn into a deal

Originally posted by @Tyron White :
@Melanie Hartmann Hey if you're going all in just make sure you take massive action and keep in mind your only 1 deal away from your life being changed. Good luck!

 Thank you Tyron! That's what I tell myself every day, all day. :)

Originally posted by @Jeremy Baxter :

I haven't read through all 400+ replies, but I have a question. If @MelanieHartmann had posted all the same details originally but said "realtor" instead of "wholesaler", would she be getting the same amount of negative responses? Just curious.

Melanie, I think it's awesome that you're doing this.

As many, probably not, but there's still going to be negative. It's risky to leave a well paying job to start something you've never done before. Many people (myself included) would say take the route where once your part time job (wholesale/realtor/flipper/investor/whatever) starts to suffer because of your primary job then make the switch. But there is value of self satisfaction that doesn't have a number attached to it and for her she places a high value on it that may not translate to "smart" move but it's her life to live. Think about it from a numbers view and leave emotion out of it, she was making 70k yr working 10 mos out of the year. She was getting retirement, benefits, and paid time off (even if she didn't place value on them, they were there). In fact, she was making enough to save up a years worth of savings....  again meaning that she had a excess of money coming in each month. That from a numbers only point of view isn't a bad gig and something most people would think twice walking away from to start w/ a blank slate.


She now has "unlimited" income potential, but has to earn each one of those dollars. She has no PTO, no retirement, no employer match etc. She is now her own boss for better or worse. Note that most wholesalers going to make a few grand per deal... and take down a few deals per mo... The good ones are going to be part of teams, power by numbers.


Just because I say all this or others say something similar doesn't mean she can't, won't, or unable to be successful... it's that she's going to have to have bit of luck and lot of determination to make a go of it. The fact that she's posted to this thread time and time again shows she's at least motivated and she's already got a website etc....

But back to the wholesaler part... they get a bad rap because they are seen as the used car salesman of the RE world... looking to make a buck off someone else and pass a problem down the line. Not always the case nor always the intention, but it's not realistic that someone with no experience can accurately price out a rehab or comps. You don't know what you don't know...

Originally posted by @Mia Paschall :
@Matt K. Please elaborate. I have savings, working on my credit as well. Should I buy and hold? Why do some make wholesaling sound like a last resort? There are some that say get started there then, buy/flip, and rehab. Thoughts please

Here's a snapshot of my REI journey thus far. I've been wanting to own rentals for YEARS. I lived in really bad apartments my entire childhood and all the way until age 18 and some more again until I was 19/20. So naturally, once I left "home" I had NOOOOO interest in living in an apartment and bought a house right away. I worked and worked and worked and finally finished grad school and got to a point where I could save a lot of my monthly income.

I kept saving for a few years until I had enough for a downpayment. I was planning on getting my RE license too but some things got in the way of that - a new baby, lack of time/energy to study/attend classes. The multi-unit market has really blown up in my area. I wanted at least a duplex - which 3 years ago my savings would have MOOOOORE than covered but no more. Kept on looking for one though. 

Found a property that was an interesting one that I've wondered about most of my life - it was going up for auction. It's never been sold since it was built. Anyway, I was going to flip it but it sold for way more than it should have. I put a few offers in and got some other properties under contract but they all were duds for various reasons, so no rental properties for me. 

My family has encountered a lot of changes in the past year or so (aside from my leaving my W-2 job) and priorities changed as well. So, at this point, since I had more than a years worth of take home pay still saved up and the thought of going back to my job was literally making me ill. Taking several more years to build up enough, just to clear $500 a month on a rental. No and no and no. 

My long-term goal was to "retire" in about 10 years and live off of the "passive" income of my rentals. Then eventually upgrade to an apartment complex. 

I just couldn't wait that long anymore. I began to research wholesaling, liked what I learned, and decided to go for it. And here I am chatting with you lovely people - trying not to pull all of my hair out. I haven't worked this hard in years - feels good. Though, I need to get back to taking care of myself too otherwise I won't be able to maintain this pace for much longer.

Originally posted by @Jeremy Baxter :

I haven't read through all 400+ replies, but I have a question. If @Melanie Hartmann had posted all the same details originally but said "realtor" instead of "wholesaler", would she be getting the same amount of negative responses? Just curious.

Melanie, I think it's awesome that you're doing this.

Never thought about that but Jeremy, given that so many have asked why I didn't choose to become a realtor or told me that's what I should have done instead I would have initially said no. Though in actuality, I believe I would still have gotten the same amount of negative responses. Change and uncertainty is scary - so why leave something "solid" for something "liquid" that could easily slip through your fingers?

Now I can't be sure, but it seems like only one person who actually was a wholesaler told me it didn't work for them and they had to do something else and just cautioned me. Everyone else it seems who questioned it haven't done it. I've had many more people who have said they did the same or similar and it's working out for them... so... yea, I'm going to keep doing it until it's impossible for me to do it anymore.

Man, being a realtor - that's also not for me. At all. I would get my license but not be a realtor. I don't care to go into the reasons as they really don't matter to anyone but me. Haha, but being a realtor to me is almost as bad as being a teacher. I will wholesale instead of being a realtor and was a school psychologist instead of a teacher. Yup, that's me. :) 

Originally posted by @Matt K. :
Originally posted by @Jeremy Baxter:

I haven't read through all 400+ replies, but I have a question. If @MelanieHartmann had posted all the same details originally but said "realtor" instead of "wholesaler", would she be getting the same amount of negative responses? Just curious.

Melanie, I think it's awesome that you're doing this.

As many, probably not, but there's still going to be negative. It's risky to leave a well paying job to start something you've never done before. Many people (myself included) would say take the route where once your part time job (wholesale/realtor/flipper/investor/whatever) starts to suffer because of your primary job then make the switch. But there is value of self satisfaction that doesn't have a number attached to it and for her she places a high value on it that may not translate to "smart" move but it's her life to live. Think about it from a numbers view and leave emotion out of it, she was making 70k yr working 10 mos out of the year. She was getting retirement, benefits, and paid time off (even if she didn't place value on them, they were there). In fact, she was making enough to save up a years worth of savings....  again meaning that she had a excess of money coming in each month. That from a numbers only point of view isn't a bad gig and something most people would think twice walking away from to start w/ a blank slate.


She now has "unlimited" income potential, but has to earn each one of those dollars. She has no PTO, no retirement, no employer match etc. She is now her own boss for better or worse. Note that most wholesalers going to make a few grand per deal... and take down a few deals per mo... The good ones are going to be part of teams, power by numbers.


Just because I say all this or others say something similar doesn't mean she can't, won't, or unable to be successful... it's that she's going to have to have bit of luck and lot of determination to make a go of it. The fact that she's posted to this thread time and time again shows she's at least motivated and she's already got a website etc....

But back to the wholesaler part... they get a bad rap because they are seen as the used car salesman of the RE world... looking to make a buck off someone else and pass a problem down the line. Not always the case nor always the intention, but it's not realistic that someone with no experience can accurately price out a rehab or comps. You don't know what you don't know...

I've been working/in contact with a few wholesalers and yea, with certain ones, I definitely have already seen why wholesalers get a bad rap... wow... just, wow... I'm not ever drinking that kool-aid!

Originally posted by @Account Closed :

Whats her WHY?   and whats this driving for $s,   stickers.

I dont get what kids schooling has to do with successful wholesaling.

People get way toooooo caught up in podcast speaek n think it will make them financially free in 5 years.

1.  You need a team.

2.  You need a WHY.

1. =True

2. =True

Without good 1s and 2s, NOTHING in life will be fruitful or fulfilling. That's just facts!

Originally posted by @Melanie Hartmann :
Originally posted by @Jeremy Baxter:

I haven't read through all 400+ replies, but I have a question. If @Melanie Hartmann had posted all the same details originally but said "realtor" instead of "wholesaler", would she be getting the same amount of negative responses? Just curious.

Melanie, I think it's awesome that you're doing this.

Never thought about that but Jeremy, given that so many have asked why I didn't choose to become a realtor or told me that's what I should have done instead I would have initially said no. Though in actuality, I believe I would still have gotten the same amount of negative responses. Change and uncertainty is scary - so why leave something "solid" for something "liquid" that could easily slip through your fingers?

Now I can't be sure, but it seems like only one person who actually was a wholesaler told me it didn't work for them and they had to do something else and just cautioned me. Everyone else it seems who questioned it haven't done it. I've had many more people who have said they did the same or similar and it's working out for them... so... yea, I'm going to keep doing it until it's impossible for me to do it anymore.

Man, being a realtor - that's also not for me. At all. I would get my license but not be a realtor. I don't care to go into the reasons as they really don't matter to anyone but me. Haha, but being a realtor to me is almost as bad as being a teacher. I will wholesale instead of being a realtor and was a school psychologist instead of a teacher. Yup, that's me. :) 

 out of curiosity what is it that is so different about being a realtor vs wholesaler for you?

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