PMs vs. Landlords: What’s the one thing the other side always gets wrong?

Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes

New property manager here — trying to learn from the best before I make expensive mistakes. I want to hear from both PMs and landlords because I think that dual perspective is something a lot of people miss early on.

**Questions for experienced property managers:**

1. What's the #1 thing that separates PMs who retain clients long-term from those who constantly churn?

2. How did you handle your first really difficult tenant situation before you had experience to draw from?

3. What software, systems, or daily habits made the biggest difference in your first year?

4. How did you price your services starting out — and would you do it differently now?

**Questions for landlords (this is the part I really need help with):**

1. What actually made you decide to hire a property manager instead of self-managing? Was it a specific breaking point?

2. When you were evaluating PMs, what gave you confidence in someone who didn't have a massive portfolio yet?

3. What are the green flags — the things a PM does or says that make you think "yes, I can trust this person with my property"?

4. On the flip side, what are the instant red flags that make you walk away?

5. After you've hired someone, what keeps you loyal to them long-term? Is it communication, fewer headaches, financial reporting, all of the above?

I ask because I think a lot of new PMs focus on the operational side — leases, maintenance, tenant screening — but maybe underestimate how much the landlord relationship and trust-building is really the foundation of the whole business.

Would love a current take on this. Happy to share what I'm learning along the way too — and I'll report back once I've been at this longer!

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Richard F.

Honolulu, HI · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes

4mo

With nearly 30 years, at various times between 125 and 850 units, a couple hundred Clients, (some of which followed me from one company to the next over a couple decades) placing an estimated 1000 plus Tenants, reviewing over 3000 credit apps, and performing several thousand non-intrusive, visual, inspections, here are my responses/suggestions:

1) Telling the truth, and as soon as practical. Clients and Tenants alike do not want to hear bad or unwanted news of any type, but it is better than sugarcoating and causing a misunderstanding or ignoring an issue until someone else "notices". #2 would be know the laws, know your contracts, be consistent, and always be fair to BOTH parties. #3 Document, document, document. Lots of photos and documentation help all situations.

2) I was Mr. Nice Guy starting out. A Tenant was late on rent, and asked me to "stop by" so we could talk. I did so, and he was looking very forlorn, painful, tired, etc. as he explained he had an emergency surgery, even showing me a large bandaged area on his side/abdomen. Of course I was willing to give him time, knowing that his wife had to stay home to take care of their multiple kids. The following weekend, on a Sunday, I happened to be in the area and decided to stop in to see how they were getting on. To my surprise, when I pulled in their driveway, the Tenant was in the middle of a quite competitive game of volleyball. I got out of my car, walked over and just told him to be out by the following weekend, which, thankfully, he managed to do. That taught me the value of saying "NO". No exceptions, no extensions, no you cannot do that. The Customer (Client or Tenant) is NOT always right in this business.

3) Developing solid systems for each major process; applying the principals of Quality Management and Continuous Improvement.

4) I was a PM working for other Brokers and did not price services initially, but you have to evaluate how much time will be spent by entire staff for each door. This will vary, much as "deals" vary, depending on age and condition as well as the effectiveness of screening both new and inherited Tenants; and in the effectiveness of communicating policies, procedures, rules, responsibilities, and accountability to Tenants and Clients alike. In later years, I did make recommendations to my Broker regarding several items which they did adopt: They had been absorbing the local GET tax, rather than passing through to Client; the management contract did not have provision for additional charges for major projects such as fire restorations, total renos, or Court time. A percentage amount was established, along with parameters of when and how that would be invoked; lastly, rather than a quick "Yes, just sign here" when someone approached for Management, we started requiring an on site visit of representative units and copies of current agreements (if any). During the site visit, but away from any Tenants, we would point out issues that we would either require immediate repair/updates, or approval of a schedule of repairs over a year or less before we would accept management. Some LL's are just tighter than two coats of paint, which is fine, but the PM gets all the blame and heat from the Tenants and, up to a point, Code Enforcement, so it requires much more time, and therefore a higher management fee.

As an aside, having a sharp, competent, in-house maintenance staff absolutely can benefit all parties if you do not get greedy with your charges. I worked for two companies that offered these services. We billed and charged based on 15 minute increments, and with different rates ( established at a minimal upcharge from actual cost for each individual) based on the type of work- plumbing, electrical, general carpentry, cleaning/hauling, groundskeeping, painting. We also, eventually, at my recommendation, built a shop and storeroom that a local vendor kept stocked based on our requirements. We were able to build our own cabinets and perform many routine repairs. We farmed out roofing, carpet installation, and some of the larger reno projects (largely due to higher risk of injury), but performed everything else. The key was quality people and a solid set of processes for common maintenance issues. As with the base management fee, the maintenance charges grew significantly with more doors.

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Richard F.
Honolulu, HI · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
4mo
With nearly 30 years, at various times between 125 and 850 units, a couple hundred Clients, (some of which followed me from one company to the next over a couple decades) placing an estimated 1000 plus Tenants, reviewing over 3000 credit apps, and performing several thousand non-intrusive, visual, inspections, here are my responses/suggestions:
1) Telling the truth, and as soon as practical. Clients and Tenants alike do not want to hear bad or unwanted news of any type, but it is better than sugarcoating and causing a misunderstanding or ignoring an issue until someone else "notices". #2 would be know the laws, know your contracts, be consistent, and always be fair to BOTH parties. #3 Document, document, document. Lots of photos and documentation help all situations.

2) I was Mr. Nice Guy starting out. A Tenant was late on rent, and asked me to "stop by" so we could talk. I did so, and he was looking very forlorn, painful, tired, etc. as he explained he had an emergency surgery, even showing me a large bandaged area on his side/abdomen. Of course I was willing to give him time, knowing that his wife had to stay home to take care of their multiple kids. The following weekend, on a Sunday, I happened to be in the area and decided to stop in to see how they were getting on. To my surprise, when I pulled in their driveway, the Tenant was in the middle of a quite competitive game of volleyball. I got out of my car, walked over and just told him to be out by the following weekend, which, thankfully, he managed to do. That taught me the value of saying "NO". No exceptions, no extensions, no you cannot do that. The Customer (Client or Tenant) is NOT always right in this business.
3) Developing solid systems for each major process; applying the principals of Quality Management and Continuous Improvement.
4) I was a PM working for other Brokers and did not price services initially, but you have to evaluate how much time will be spent by entire staff for each door. This will vary, much as "deals" vary, depending on age and condition as well as the effectiveness of screening both new and inherited Tenants; and in the effectiveness of communicating policies, procedures, rules, responsibilities, and accountability to Tenants and Clients alike. In later years, I did make recommendations to my Broker regarding several items which they did adopt: They had been absorbing the local GET tax, rather than passing through to Client; the management contract did not have provision for additional charges for major projects such as fire restorations, total renos, or Court time. A percentage amount was established, along with parameters of when and how that would be invoked; lastly, rather than a quick "Yes, just sign here" when someone approached for Management, we started requiring an on site visit of representative units and copies of current agreements (if any). During the site visit, but away from any Tenants, we would point out issues that we would either require immediate repair/updates, or approval of a schedule of repairs over a year or less before we would accept management. Some LL's are just tighter than two coats of paint, which is fine, but the PM gets all the blame and heat from the Tenants and, up to a point, Code Enforcement, so it requires much more time, and therefore a higher management fee.
As an aside, having a sharp, competent, in-house maintenance staff absolutely can benefit all parties if you do not get greedy with your charges. I worked for two companies that offered these services. We billed and charged based on 15 minute increments, and with different rates ( established at a minimal upcharge from actual cost for each individual) based on the type of work- plumbing, electrical, general carpentry, cleaning/hauling, groundskeeping, painting. We also, eventually, at my recommendation, built a shop and storeroom that a local vendor kept stocked based on our requirements. We were able to build our own cabinets and perform many routine repairs. We farmed out roofing, carpet installation, and some of the larger reno projects (largely due to higher risk of injury), but performed everything else. The key was quality people and a solid set of processes for common maintenance issues. As with the base management fee, the maintenance charges grew significantly with more doors.
3 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Richard F.:
  
  With nearly 30 years, at various times between 125 and 850 units, a couple hundred Clients, (some of which followed me from one company to the next over a couple decades) placing an estimated 1000 plus Tenants, reviewing over 3000 credit apps, and performing several thousand non-intrusive, visual, inspections, here are my responses/suggestions:
  1) Telling the truth, and as soon as practical. Clients and Tenants alike do not want to hear bad or unwanted news of any type, but it is better than sugarcoating and causing a misunderstanding or ignoring an issue until someone else "notices". #2 would be know the laws, know your contracts, be consistent, and always be fair to BOTH parties. #3 Document, document, document. Lots of photos and documentation help all situations.
  
  2) I was Mr. Nice Guy starting out. A Tenant was late on rent, and asked me to "stop by" so we could talk. I did so, and he was looking very forlorn, painful, tired, etc. as he explained he had an emergency surgery, even showing me a large bandaged area on his side/abdomen. Of course I was willing to give him time, knowing that his wife had to stay home to take care of their multiple kids. The following weekend, on a Sunday, I happened to be in the area and decided to stop in to see how they were getting on. To my surprise, when I pulled in their driveway, the Tenant was in the middle of a quite competitive game of volleyball. I got out of my car, walked over and just told him to be out by the following weekend, which, thankfully, he managed to do. That taught me the value of saying "NO". No exceptions, no extensions, no you cannot do that. The Customer (Client or Tenant) is NOT always right in this business.
  3) Developing solid systems for each major process; applying the principals of Quality Management and Continuous Improvement.
  4) I was a PM working for other Brokers and did not price services initially, but you have to evaluate how much time will be spent by entire staff for each door. This will vary, much as "deals" vary, depending on age and condition as well as the effectiveness of screening both new and inherited Tenants; and in the effectiveness of communicating policies, procedures, rules, responsibilities, and accountability to Tenants and Clients alike. In later years, I did make recommendations to my Broker regarding several items which they did adopt: They had been absorbing the local GET tax, rather than passing through to Client; the management contract did not have provision for additional charges for major projects such as fire restorations, total renos, or Court time. A percentage amount was established, along with parameters of when and how that would be invoked; lastly, rather than a quick "Yes, just sign here" when someone approached for Management, we started requiring an on site visit of representative units and copies of current agreements (if any). During the site visit, but away from any Tenants, we would point out issues that we would either require immediate repair/updates, or approval of a schedule of repairs over a year or less before we would accept management. Some LL's are just tighter than two coats of paint, which is fine, but the PM gets all the blame and heat from the Tenants and, up to a point, Code Enforcement, so it requires much more time, and therefore a higher management fee.
  As an aside, having a sharp, competent, in-house maintenance staff absolutely can benefit all parties if you do not get greedy with your charges. I worked for two companies that offered these services. We billed and charged based on 15 minute increments, and with different rates ( established at a minimal upcharge from actual cost for each individual) based on the type of work- plumbing, electrical, general carpentry, cleaning/hauling, groundskeeping, painting. We also, eventually, at my recommendation, built a shop and storeroom that a local vendor kept stocked based on our requirements. We were able to build our own cabinets and perform many routine repairs. We farmed out roofing, carpet installation, and some of the larger reno projects (largely due to higher risk of injury), but performed everything else. The key was quality people and a solid set of processes for common maintenance issues. As with the base management fee, the maintenance charges grew significantly with more doors.
  
  Richard, thank you so much for taking the time to share such an in-depth response. Having 30 years of experience weigh in is exactly why I posted this.
  Your story about the 'volleyball tenant' is a perfect (and hilarious) example of why 'Mr. Nice Guy' doesn't scale. It’s a great reminder that being fair to both parties often means having the backbone to say 'no' when the lease is being ignored.
  I also really appreciate your point about telling the truth as soon as practical. In a business built on trust, sugarcoating bad news seems like a fast way to lose a client's confidence.
  Quick follow-up on your point about in-house maintenance: When you were first starting out and didn't have the volume for a full shop/staff, did you find it better to use a few dedicated 'go-to' vendors, or did you try to keep it all third-party until you hit a certain door count?
  Thanks again for the wisdom!
  0 Reply
- Richard F.
  Honolulu, HI · Member since 2008 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  Quote from @Richard F.:
  
  With nearly 30 years, at various times between 125 and 850 units, a couple hundred Clients, (some of which followed me from one company to the next over a couple decades) placing an estimated 1000 plus Tenants, reviewing over 3000 credit apps, and performing several thousand non-intrusive, visual, inspections, here are my responses/suggestions:
  1) Telling the truth, and as soon as practical. Clients and Tenants alike do not want to hear bad or unwanted news of any type, but it is better than sugarcoating and causing a misunderstanding or ignoring an issue until someone else "notices". #2 would be know the laws, know your contracts, be consistent, and always be fair to BOTH parties. #3 Document, document, document. Lots of photos and documentation help all situations.
  
  2) I was Mr. Nice Guy starting out. A Tenant was late on rent, and asked me to "stop by" so we could talk. I did so, and he was looking very forlorn, painful, tired, etc. as he explained he had an emergency surgery, even showing me a large bandaged area on his side/abdomen. Of course I was willing to give him time, knowing that his wife had to stay home to take care of their multiple kids. The following weekend, on a Sunday, I happened to be in the area and decided to stop in to see how they were getting on. To my surprise, when I pulled in their driveway, the Tenant was in the middle of a quite competitive game of volleyball. I got out of my car, walked over and just told him to be out by the following weekend, which, thankfully, he managed to do. That taught me the value of saying "NO". No exceptions, no extensions, no you cannot do that. The Customer (Client or Tenant) is NOT always right in this business.
  3) Developing solid systems for each major process; applying the principals of Quality Management and Continuous Improvement.
  4) I was a PM working for other Brokers and did not price services initially, but you have to evaluate how much time will be spent by entire staff for each door. This will vary, much as "deals" vary, depending on age and condition as well as the effectiveness of screening both new and inherited Tenants; and in the effectiveness of communicating policies, procedures, rules, responsibilities, and accountability to Tenants and Clients alike. In later years, I did make recommendations to my Broker regarding several items which they did adopt: They had been absorbing the local GET tax, rather than passing through to Client; the management contract did not have provision for additional charges for major projects such as fire restorations, total renos, or Court time. A percentage amount was established, along with parameters of when and how that would be invoked; lastly, rather than a quick "Yes, just sign here" when someone approached for Management, we started requiring an on site visit of representative units and copies of current agreements (if any). During the site visit, but away from any Tenants, we would point out issues that we would either require immediate repair/updates, or approval of a schedule of repairs over a year or less before we would accept management. Some LL's are just tighter than two coats of paint, which is fine, but the PM gets all the blame and heat from the Tenants and, up to a point, Code Enforcement, so it requires much more time, and therefore a higher management fee.
  As an aside, having a sharp, competent, in-house maintenance staff absolutely can benefit all parties if you do not get greedy with your charges. I worked for two companies that offered these services. We billed and charged based on 15 minute increments, and with different rates ( established at a minimal upcharge from actual cost for each individual) based on the type of work- plumbing, electrical, general carpentry, cleaning/hauling, groundskeeping, painting. We also, eventually, at my recommendation, built a shop and storeroom that a local vendor kept stocked based on our requirements. We were able to build our own cabinets and perform many routine repairs. We farmed out roofing, carpet installation, and some of the larger reno projects (largely due to higher risk of injury), but performed everything else. The key was quality people and a solid set of processes for common maintenance issues. As with the base management fee, the maintenance charges grew significantly with more doors.
  
  Richard, thank you so much for taking the time to share such an in-depth response. Having 30 years of experience weigh in is exactly why I posted this.
  Your story about the 'volleyball tenant' is a perfect (and hilarious) example of why 'Mr. Nice Guy' doesn't scale. It’s a great reminder that being fair to both parties often means having the backbone to say 'no' when the lease is being ignored.
  I also really appreciate your point about telling the truth as soon as practical. In a business built on trust, sugarcoating bad news seems like a fast way to lose a client's confidence.
  Quick follow-up on your point about in-house maintenance: When you were first starting out and didn't have the volume for a full shop/staff, did you find it better to use a few dedicated 'go-to' vendors, or did you try to keep it all third-party until you hit a certain door count?
  Thanks again for the wisdom!
  
  When working for smaller companies without in-house maintenance, we would develop two or three vendors for the usual frequent needs. Initially all you can do is try them out and see what kind of work they do, how much they charge, how they act, and, in time, whether or not they stand behind their work...licensed or not. Of course as licensed RE agents, we have to follow local law and only use licensed contractors for work over $1500 (at that time). Licenses are meaningless in terms of any implied guarantee of "quality" work, you need to observe their work processes AND results, as well as pay attention to the long term performance of each type of repair. Some might LOOK great, but start falling apart in a year or two because they did not follow proper prep and repair procedures.
  
  We always allowed our Client owners the choice of using our recommended and proven contractors, or whoever they wanted to use. If their preference is unlicensed (for jobs requiring it), we would be hands off on the process...providing the Owner the Tenant contact info; having the Owner pay their contractor directly and without going through our accounting process at all. If they wanted estimates, for routine "service calls" we would always have vendors call from site with a verbal, and we would clear that with owner. For larger jobs, we would obtain a written proposal from whichever of our preferred vendors was available the soonest for a specific job, and whatever other vendors the owner requested. Owner would need to approve, sign, and provide full funds for the accepted contract, which we would hold in our Trust account and pay out according to terms agreed, holding final 10% for our approval AND the Owner approval either by site visit or photo series.
  1 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Richard F.:
  
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  Quote from @Richard F.:
  
  With nearly 30 years, at various times between 125 and 850 units, a couple hundred Clients, (some of which followed me from one company to the next over a couple decades) placing an estimated 1000 plus Tenants, reviewing over 3000 credit apps, and performing several thousand non-intrusive, visual, inspections, here are my responses/suggestions:
  1) Telling the truth, and as soon as practical. Clients and Tenants alike do not want to hear bad or unwanted news of any type, but it is better than sugarcoating and causing a misunderstanding or ignoring an issue until someone else "notices". #2 would be know the laws, know your contracts, be consistent, and always be fair to BOTH parties. #3 Document, document, document. Lots of photos and documentation help all situations.
  
  2) I was Mr. Nice Guy starting out. A Tenant was late on rent, and asked me to "stop by" so we could talk. I did so, and he was looking very forlorn, painful, tired, etc. as he explained he had an emergency surgery, even showing me a large bandaged area on his side/abdomen. Of course I was willing to give him time, knowing that his wife had to stay home to take care of their multiple kids. The following weekend, on a Sunday, I happened to be in the area and decided to stop in to see how they were getting on. To my surprise, when I pulled in their driveway, the Tenant was in the middle of a quite competitive game of volleyball. I got out of my car, walked over and just told him to be out by the following weekend, which, thankfully, he managed to do. That taught me the value of saying "NO". No exceptions, no extensions, no you cannot do that. The Customer (Client or Tenant) is NOT always right in this business.
  3) Developing solid systems for each major process; applying the principals of Quality Management and Continuous Improvement.
  4) I was a PM working for other Brokers and did not price services initially, but you have to evaluate how much time will be spent by entire staff for each door. This will vary, much as "deals" vary, depending on age and condition as well as the effectiveness of screening both new and inherited Tenants; and in the effectiveness of communicating policies, procedures, rules, responsibilities, and accountability to Tenants and Clients alike. In later years, I did make recommendations to my Broker regarding several items which they did adopt: They had been absorbing the local GET tax, rather than passing through to Client; the management contract did not have provision for additional charges for major projects such as fire restorations, total renos, or Court time. A percentage amount was established, along with parameters of when and how that would be invoked; lastly, rather than a quick "Yes, just sign here" when someone approached for Management, we started requiring an on site visit of representative units and copies of current agreements (if any). During the site visit, but away from any Tenants, we would point out issues that we would either require immediate repair/updates, or approval of a schedule of repairs over a year or less before we would accept management. Some LL's are just tighter than two coats of paint, which is fine, but the PM gets all the blame and heat from the Tenants and, up to a point, Code Enforcement, so it requires much more time, and therefore a higher management fee.
  As an aside, having a sharp, competent, in-house maintenance staff absolutely can benefit all parties if you do not get greedy with your charges. I worked for two companies that offered these services. We billed and charged based on 15 minute increments, and with different rates ( established at a minimal upcharge from actual cost for each individual) based on the type of work- plumbing, electrical, general carpentry, cleaning/hauling, groundskeeping, painting. We also, eventually, at my recommendation, built a shop and storeroom that a local vendor kept stocked based on our requirements. We were able to build our own cabinets and perform many routine repairs. We farmed out roofing, carpet installation, and some of the larger reno projects (largely due to higher risk of injury), but performed everything else. The key was quality people and a solid set of processes for common maintenance issues. As with the base management fee, the maintenance charges grew significantly with more doors.
  
  Richard, thank you so much for taking the time to share such an in-depth response. Having 30 years of experience weigh in is exactly why I posted this.
  Your story about the 'volleyball tenant' is a perfect (and hilarious) example of why 'Mr. Nice Guy' doesn't scale. It’s a great reminder that being fair to both parties often means having the backbone to say 'no' when the lease is being ignored.
  I also really appreciate your point about telling the truth as soon as practical. In a business built on trust, sugarcoating bad news seems like a fast way to lose a client's confidence.
  Quick follow-up on your point about in-house maintenance: When you were first starting out and didn't have the volume for a full shop/staff, did you find it better to use a few dedicated 'go-to' vendors, or did you try to keep it all third-party until you hit a certain door count?
  Thanks again for the wisdom!
  
  When working for smaller companies without in-house maintenance, we would develop two or three vendors for the usual frequent needs. Initially all you can do is try them out and see what kind of work they do, how much they charge, how they act, and, in time, whether or not they stand behind their work...licensed or not. Of course as licensed RE agents, we have to follow local law and only use licensed contractors for work over $1500 (at that time). Licenses are meaningless in terms of any implied guarantee of "quality" work, you need to observe their work processes AND results, as well as pay attention to the long term performance of each type of repair. Some might LOOK great, but start falling apart in a year or two because they did not follow proper prep and repair procedures.
  
  We always allowed our Client owners the choice of using our recommended and proven contractors, or whoever they wanted to use. If their preference is unlicensed (for jobs requiring it), we would be hands off on the process...providing the Owner the Tenant contact info; having the Owner pay their contractor directly and without going through our accounting process at all. If they wanted estimates, for routine "service calls" we would always have vendors call from site with a verbal, and we would clear that with owner. For larger jobs, we would obtain a written proposal from whichever of our preferred vendors was available the soonest for a specific job, and whatever other vendors the owner requested. Owner would need to approve, sign, and provide full funds for the accepted contract, which we would hold in our Trust account and pay out according to terms agreed, holding final 10% for our approval AND the Owner approval either by site visit or photo series.
  I really appreciate the deep dive into vendor management. The 'hands-off' approach for owner-preferred unlicensed contractors is a brilliant way to protect my license while maintaining flexibility.
  I’m also adopting your 10% 'final approval' rule immediately, it’s a simple, professional way to ensure quality and owner satisfaction before the funds are released.
  Thanks again for sharing 30 years of wisdom; this is exactly the kind of insight I was hoping for!
  1 Reply
Drew SygitBusiness Member
Property Manager · Royal Oak, MI · Member since 2012 · 12k+ posts · 9k+ votes
4mo
Quote from @Alex Eberle:

New property manager here — trying to learn from the best before I make expensive mistakes. I want to hear from both PMs and landlords because I think that dual perspective is something a lot of people miss early on.

**Questions for experienced property managers:**

1. What's the #1 thing that separates PMs who retain clients long-term from those who constantly churn?

2. How did you handle your first really difficult tenant situation before you had experience to draw from?

3. What software, systems, or daily habits made the biggest difference in your first year?

4. How did you price your services starting out — and would you do it differently now?

**Questions for landlords (this is the part I really need help with):**

1. What actually made you decide to hire a property manager instead of self-managing? Was it a specific breaking point?

2. When you were evaluating PMs, what gave you confidence in someone who didn't have a massive portfolio yet?

3. What are the green flags — the things a PM does or says that make you think "yes, I can trust this person with my property"?

4. On the flip side, what are the instant red flags that make you walk away?

5. After you've hired someone, what keeps you loyal to them long-term? Is it communication, fewer headaches, financial reporting, all of the above?

I ask because I think a lot of new PMs focus on the operational side — leases, maintenance, tenant screening — but maybe underestimate how much the landlord relationship and trust-building is really the foundation of the whole business.

Would love a current take on this. Happy to share what I'm learning along the way too — and I'll report back once I've been at this longer!

1) Meeting or exceeding expectations.
- NOT easy to do because many owners do NOT know what they want and/or change it when "life happens".
Proactive & clear communication
You can't be everything to everybody, so don't take every owner prospect.
Always be improving.
2) Leaned on those with more experience in a REIA group I joined. You can do now online here on BP😋
3) Create systems & processes for EVERYTHING!
- The more you document what you standardize, the easier it is to train new hires.
- Do the worst thing first each day. It takes a load off your mind, so your day only gets better.
4) Your competition knows more than you do. So, follow their pricing lead.
[email protected]248-209-6824
Logical Property Management4.9450 Reviews
Website View Page
1 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Drew Sygit:
  
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  New property manager here — trying to learn from the best before I make expensive mistakes. I want to hear from both PMs and landlords because I think that dual perspective is something a lot of people miss early on.
  
  **Questions for experienced property managers:**
  
  1. What's the #1 thing that separates PMs who retain clients long-term from those who constantly churn?
  
  2. How did you handle your first really difficult tenant situation before you had experience to draw from?
  
  3. What software, systems, or daily habits made the biggest difference in your first year?
  
  4. How did you price your services starting out — and would you do it differently now?
  
  **Questions for landlords (this is the part I really need help with):**
  
  1. What actually made you decide to hire a property manager instead of self-managing? Was it a specific breaking point?
  
  2. When you were evaluating PMs, what gave you confidence in someone who didn't have a massive portfolio yet?
  
  3. What are the green flags — the things a PM does or says that make you think "yes, I can trust this person with my property"?
  
  4. On the flip side, what are the instant red flags that make you walk away?
  
  5. After you've hired someone, what keeps you loyal to them long-term? Is it communication, fewer headaches, financial reporting, all of the above?
  
  I ask because I think a lot of new PMs focus on the operational side — leases, maintenance, tenant screening — but maybe underestimate how much the landlord relationship and trust-building is really the foundation of the whole business.
  
  Would love a current take on this. Happy to share what I'm learning along the way too — and I'll report back once I've been at this longer!
  
  1) Meeting or exceeding expectations.
  - NOT easy to do because many owners do NOT know what they want and/or change it when "life happens".
  Proactive & clear communication
  You can't be everything to everybody, so don't take every owner prospect.
  Always be improving.
  2) Leaned on those with more experience in a REIA group I joined. You can do now online here on BP😋
  3) Create systems & processes for EVERYTHING!
  - The more you document what you standardize, the easier it is to train new hires.
  - Do the worst thing first each day. It takes a load off your mind, so your day only gets better.
  4) Your competition knows more than you do. So, follow their pricing lead.
  Drew, thanks for weighing in!
  I really resonate with your advice to 'do the worst thing first each day.' In a business that can feel like a never-ending list of fires to put out, that mindset seems essential for staying sane in year one.
  Your point about not taking every owner prospect is also something I’ve heard whispered but rarely stated so clearly. Is there a specific red flag a property owner shows during an initial intake call that tells you immediately they’ll be one of those clients who is impossible to please?
  I'll definitely be checking out a local REIA group based on your suggestion. Appreciate the guidance!
  0 Reply
- Drew SygitBusiness Member
  Property Manager · Royal Oak, MI · Member since 2012 · 12k+ posts · 9k+ votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  Quote from @Drew Sygit:
  
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  New property manager here — trying to learn from the best before I make expensive mistakes. I want to hear from both PMs and landlords because I think that dual perspective is something a lot of people miss early on.
  
  **Questions for experienced property managers:**
  
  1. What's the #1 thing that separates PMs who retain clients long-term from those who constantly churn?
  
  2. How did you handle your first really difficult tenant situation before you had experience to draw from?
  
  3. What software, systems, or daily habits made the biggest difference in your first year?
  
  4. How did you price your services starting out — and would you do it differently now?
  
  **Questions for landlords (this is the part I really need help with):**
  
  1. What actually made you decide to hire a property manager instead of self-managing? Was it a specific breaking point?
  
  2. When you were evaluating PMs, what gave you confidence in someone who didn't have a massive portfolio yet?
  
  3. What are the green flags — the things a PM does or says that make you think "yes, I can trust this person with my property"?
  
  4. On the flip side, what are the instant red flags that make you walk away?
  
  5. After you've hired someone, what keeps you loyal to them long-term? Is it communication, fewer headaches, financial reporting, all of the above?
  
  I ask because I think a lot of new PMs focus on the operational side — leases, maintenance, tenant screening — but maybe underestimate how much the landlord relationship and trust-building is really the foundation of the whole business.
  
  Would love a current take on this. Happy to share what I'm learning along the way too — and I'll report back once I've been at this longer!
  
  1) Meeting or exceeding expectations.
  - NOT easy to do because many owners do NOT know what they want and/or change it when "life happens".
  Proactive & clear communication
  You can't be everything to everybody, so don't take every owner prospect.
  Always be improving.
  2) Leaned on those with more experience in a REIA group I joined. You can do now online here on BP😋
  3) Create systems & processes for EVERYTHING!
  - The more you document what you standardize, the easier it is to train new hires.
  - Do the worst thing first each day. It takes a load off your mind, so your day only gets better.
  4) Your competition knows more than you do. So, follow their pricing lead.
  Drew, thanks for weighing in!
  I really resonate with your advice to 'do the worst thing first each day.' In a business that can feel like a never-ending list of fires to put out, that mindset seems essential for staying sane in year one.
  Your point about not taking every owner prospect is also something I’ve heard whispered but rarely stated so clearly. Is there a specific red flag a property owner shows during an initial intake call that tells you immediately they’ll be one of those clients who is impossible to please?
  I'll definitely be checking out a local REIA group based on your suggestion. Appreciate the guidance!
  Owner Red Flags
  1) Want to expose you to liability issues
  -- won't get property insurance or add you to it
  -- expect you to violate Fair Housing to screen applicants
  -- ask you to circumvent legal eviction process
  2) Don't respect work day & weekend boundaries
  - once had an owner prospect tell me he expected me to answer my cell at 11pm on a Sunday night if he called. I told him that's exactly why I do NOT give out my cell - so, we ended the conversation.
  
  3) Expect you to be their personal assistant
  - constantly asking questions that they can read on your website or find on their Owner Statement. This is acceptable for the first 90 days and occasionally after, but NOT every day/week/month.
  
  It's not just clients that are impossible to please.
  What about ugly situations?
  Properties that you don't have experience with or that are just odd and will be time-sucks?
  Do an analysis:
  1) Figure out how much per hour your time is worth
  2) Pick one of your properties under management and figure out the income per month from management fees.
  3) Do the math, how many hours/month can you reasonably spend on that one property/owner?
  Do NOT let a property/owner CONSISTENTLY exceed those hours each month - else you'll go broke and the owner will just churn & burn you!
  [email protected]248-209-6824
  Logical Property Management4.9450 Reviews
  Website View Page
  1 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Drew Sygit:
  
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  Quote from @Drew Sygit:
  
  Quote from @Alex Eberle:
  
  New property manager here — trying to learn from the best before I make expensive mistakes. I want to hear from both PMs and landlords because I think that dual perspective is something a lot of people miss early on.
  
  **Questions for experienced property managers:**
  
  1. What's the #1 thing that separates PMs who retain clients long-term from those who constantly churn?
  
  2. How did you handle your first really difficult tenant situation before you had experience to draw from?
  
  3. What software, systems, or daily habits made the biggest difference in your first year?
  
  4. How did you price your services starting out — and would you do it differently now?
  
  **Questions for landlords (this is the part I really need help with):**
  
  1. What actually made you decide to hire a property manager instead of self-managing? Was it a specific breaking point?
  
  2. When you were evaluating PMs, what gave you confidence in someone who didn't have a massive portfolio yet?
  
  3. What are the green flags — the things a PM does or says that make you think "yes, I can trust this person with my property"?
  
  4. On the flip side, what are the instant red flags that make you walk away?
  
  5. After you've hired someone, what keeps you loyal to them long-term? Is it communication, fewer headaches, financial reporting, all of the above?
  
  I ask because I think a lot of new PMs focus on the operational side — leases, maintenance, tenant screening — but maybe underestimate how much the landlord relationship and trust-building is really the foundation of the whole business.
  
  Would love a current take on this. Happy to share what I'm learning along the way too — and I'll report back once I've been at this longer!
  
  1) Meeting or exceeding expectations.
  - NOT easy to do because many owners do NOT know what they want and/or change it when "life happens".
  Proactive & clear communication
  You can't be everything to everybody, so don't take every owner prospect.
  Always be improving.
  2) Leaned on those with more experience in a REIA group I joined. You can do now online here on BP😋
  3) Create systems & processes for EVERYTHING!
  - The more you document what you standardize, the easier it is to train new hires.
  - Do the worst thing first each day. It takes a load off your mind, so your day only gets better.
  4) Your competition knows more than you do. So, follow their pricing lead.
  Drew, thanks for weighing in!
  I really resonate with your advice to 'do the worst thing first each day.' In a business that can feel like a never-ending list of fires to put out, that mindset seems essential for staying sane in year one.
  Your point about not taking every owner prospect is also something I’ve heard whispered but rarely stated so clearly. Is there a specific red flag a property owner shows during an initial intake call that tells you immediately they’ll be one of those clients who is impossible to please?
  I'll definitely be checking out a local REIA group based on your suggestion. Appreciate the guidance!
  Owner Red Flags
  1) Want to expose you to liability issues
  -- won't get property insurance or add you to it
  -- expect you to violate Fair Housing to screen applicants
  -- ask you to circumvent legal eviction process
  2) Don't respect work day & weekend boundaries
  - once had an owner prospect tell me he expected me to answer my cell at 11pm on a Sunday night if he called. I told him that's exactly why I do NOT give out my cell - so, we ended the conversation.
  
  3) Expect you to be their personal assistant
  - constantly asking questions that they can read on your website or find on their Owner Statement. This is acceptable for the first 90 days and occasionally after, but NOT every day/week/month.
  
  It's not just clients that are impossible to please.
  What about ugly situations?
  Properties that you don't have experience with or that are just odd and will be time-sucks?
  Do an analysis:
  1) Figure out how much per hour your time is worth
  2) Pick one of your properties under management and figure out the income per month from management fees.
  3) Do the math, how many hours/month can you reasonably spend on that one property/owner?
  Do NOT let a property/owner CONSISTENTLY exceed those hours each month - else you'll go broke and the owner will just churn & burn you!
  
  Drew, this is a great framework. Your point about owner red flags is going into my intake process immediately, protecting my time and license is priority #1.
  I especially like the math-based approach to ROI on my own capacity. Thinking of a client in terms of actual hourly cost rather than just a door count is exactly the perspective I need to stay profitable while scaling!
  
  0 Reply
Mike Dymski
Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
4mo
Success depends on having good people (whether self or third party management). Systems and other stuff are table stakes.
1 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Mike Dymski:
  
  Success depends on having good people (whether self or third party management). Systems and other stuff are table stakes.
  Mike, you're spot on. Systems are just table stakes, they don't mean much if the people running them lack integrity or common sense.
  1 Reply
Nate Sullivan
Investor · Memphis, TN · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 11 votes
4mo
Coming from the landlord side of this. 14 doors in Memphis, self-manage all of them. I tried PMs early on and it lasted less than a year.
The one thing PMs get wrong about landlords is assuming we don't notice when you stop communicating. Every PM I talked to said the same things during the pitch - proactive updates, detailed reports, we treat your property like our own. Then three months in I'm chasing them for basic information. A tenant missed rent and I found out two weeks later by accident. That was the end for me.
The owners you call "difficult" are usually the ones who actually track their numbers. I know what my turns cost and what I spend on maintenance per unit per year. When I ask why a turn took 6 weeks instead of 2, that's not me being difficult. I'm doing the math on what that vacancy cost me and it's real money.
If you want to keep landlords like me as clients the answer is pretty simple. Pick up the phone before I have to. Bad news on time is fine. Silence is what kills the relationship.
1 Reply
- Alex Eberle
  OP
  Property Manager · Granite Bay CA · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 5 votes
  4mo
  Quote from @Nate Sullivan:
  
  Coming from the landlord side of this. 14 doors in Memphis, self-manage all of them. I tried PMs early on and it lasted less than a year.
  The one thing PMs get wrong about landlords is assuming we don't notice when you stop communicating. Every PM I talked to said the same things during the pitch - proactive updates, detailed reports, we treat your property like our own. Then three months in I'm chasing them for basic information. A tenant missed rent and I found out two weeks later by accident. That was the end for me.
  The owners you call "difficult" are usually the ones who actually track their numbers. I know what my turns cost and what I spend on maintenance per unit per year. When I ask why a turn took 6 weeks instead of 2, that's not me being difficult. I'm doing the math on what that vacancy cost me and it's real money.
  If you want to keep landlords like me as clients the answer is pretty simple. Pick up the phone before I have to. Bad news on time is fine. Silence is what kills the relationship.
  
  Nate, I really appreciate your view from the landlord side. You hit on something crucial: silence isn't just a lack of communication; to an owner, it sounds like negligence.
  It's easy for a PM to get buried in the day to day fires and forget that while a $500 repair is routine for a PM , it's a line item on your P&L that affects your ROI. Your point about the difficult owner actually being the one who tracks their numbers is a great mindset shift for me.
  
  1 Reply
Nate Sullivan
Investor · Memphis, TN · Member since 2026 · 12 posts · 11 votes
4mo
Yeah that's exactly it. And honestly the fact that you're asking this question before you have 50 owners means you're already ahead. Most PMs don't figure out the communication piece until they've lost a few good clients over it.
0 Reply

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