SCAM...beware inexperienced investors!

SCAM...beware inexperienced investors!

Investor · Peabody, MA · Member since 2015 · 114 posts · 107 votes

Not that we are super experienced but if we hadn't taken classes this is something we may have fallen for. 

Recently we found a house for sale by owner on Zillow. We contacted the seller and received a text back that it was still available for the price of $50k..he just wanted to sell it to pay off his mortgage. We looked up the history of the home and they had purchased the property in 1999 for $200k so it was possible they only owed 50k and just wanted to get rid of it. 

The guy's story was that he and his wife had already moved to Virginia and needed to sell the home. They were currently renting it out we should do a drive by and make sure we were really interested before he puts out his tenants. Fair enough. So we drove by and were very interested, the the place looked great so we wanted to get it under contract to show were were serious and we would do our due dilligence after we secured the property and back out if there were any huge issues. 

I wrote up a contract including a $100 deposit and sent it to him to sign at the email he provided. The email was the first and last name of the deed holder at yahoo.com. The fact that we couldn't seem to get this guy on the phone was a bit of a red flag but we hadn't put any money down or locked ourselves into anything so we'd proceed with caution. He also had a phone number from Nevada which was odd but in doing research I found that the couple who owned the house got married in Vegas so there was a small Nevada connection. 

We waited for the contract to come back signed. Instead he asked when we could provide $1000 check so that he could hold the house for us. We explained that we wouldn't send him money directly because we had no proof this was legit and asked for his lawyer's contact information which he provided. We would put the money in an escrow account and he'd get it when we closed. He said okay but still didn't send the signed contract. A couple hours later he asked about the deposit again like we had never had the previous conversation. Some people are slow so we explained again about the lawyers, escrow, blah, blah. 

Still no contract so we were pretty sure something was up (as we were suspicious of the whole time) so we called the number he gave us for his lawyer and no one answered. He then called us and could barely speak english and the connection was terrible. We knew then 100% that it was a scam but decided to mess with him anyway. We asked him for a copy of his drivers license. He sent some picture of a Texas driver's license with the name Chris Osborne, a picture of an older fellow and a birthdate of 1975. He called us a few more times and we told him we knew it was a scam and we were going to report him. He got angry and eventually text'd "Mugu!". We googled it and found this was a Nigerian term for "you fool". So he called himself out.

I called the real deed holders to warn them that someone was trying to sell their home and they were thankful we called. We never sent the money and never would have but there are probably many out there who wouldn't know any better and may have sent whatever amount he asked for that they would never see again.

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Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2015 · 10 posts · 6 votes
11y

It's amazing how slack some people really think everyone else is, especially if you went so far as to let him know how much you really knew what you were doing in regards to the actual transaction...   Yet he continued to attempt to lead you astray...    I'm quite new, and it's unfortunate in my quest to learn, it's situations like this which make me hesitant.   I know however, I can't let situations like this stop me or I'll never make my first deal.  Wow! But the fact that I did buy my own primary home keeps me motivated in realizing that I can do this.

Thank-you for sharing,

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  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    11y

    good story and feedback.. any thing and everything happens with FSBO's :)

    Curious when you saw it for 50k and it sold for 200k ..

    what did you think the current market value was? 

    did you think it was a 100k home 150k home or 200k home.. if it was one of these that would be a red flag on its face for sure.

  • Investor · Peabody, MA · Member since 2015 · 114 posts · 107 votes
    11y

    I found all of the info on public records. The current market value is $350k. The current owners bought it for a smoking deal even at 200k

  • Dana WhickerPro Member
    Investor · Fernandina Beach, FL · Member since 2014 · 557 posts · 374 votes
    11y

    Very similar thing happened to a friend of mine.  The scammer had a very good, believable story similar to your scammers'.  The difference was this scammer asked my buddy to Western Union a $500 deposit.  That's when the red flag went up.  

    We contacted the real owners of the property and let them know what was up.

  • Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2015 · 10 posts · 6 votes
    11y

    It's amazing how slack some people really think everyone else is, especially if you went so far as to let him know how much you really knew what you were doing in regards to the actual transaction...   Yet he continued to attempt to lead you astray...    I'm quite new, and it's unfortunate in my quest to learn, it's situations like this which make me hesitant.   I know however, I can't let situations like this stop me or I'll never make my first deal.  Wow! But the fact that I did buy my own primary home keeps me motivated in realizing that I can do this.

    Thank-you for sharing,

  • Landlord · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2014 · 51 posts · 22 votes
    11y

    if ypu ever look for a place to stay im San Francisco avoid craigslist at all cost. 90% seem to be scams, its that bad. 

    Always the "out of state" will send you (item) after you deposit (amount) scam. 

  • Investor · Greensboro, NC · Member since 2015 · 10 posts · 3 votes
    11y

    Thanks for posting.  As a newbie investor IM scare to mess with any property with out the help of a realtor.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    11y

    @Erica Nagle

      LOL  so you probably think you hit the mother load 50k for a 350k houses  that cracks me up.  

    there is so much of this stuff going on in all sectors of RE... especially those offering loans and capital.. 2 e mails and they are willing to invest 1 million with you..  just need to send 5k to a bond company in Thailand  ...

    For fun I followed up on one in Bahrain  and the number actually worked and it was some middle east dude,  I wanted to see what kind of yarn he would spin. could tell by talking to him he was anything but a high rolling financier of with off shore investments.

    but I suspect with the way some wholesalers work you will run into this as well.. although doubt they will be selling homes and leaving that much meat on the bone !!

  • Professional · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2012 · 12k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    11y

    Thank you for this warning.

  • Investor · Peabody, MA · Member since 2015 · 114 posts · 107 votes
    11y

    @Jay Hinrichs

    Yes we thought maybe, just maybe we'd struck gold but always knew it was likely we did not. 

    For those of you that are scared because of situations like this. Really don't be. Just make sure you always involve a lawyer (or title company) and ask yourself "am I doing something that could put myself financially at a risk that would hurt me?" If we had sent the guy $100 and it turned out to be a scam then that's not a huge deal. But when you start talking thousands make sure you're always protected. Do that and you'll be just fine :)

  • Investor · Peabody, MA · Member since 2015 · 114 posts · 107 votes
    11y

    @Dana Whicker

    Yeah the phrase 'Western Union' was also used in this scam. We told them they were in luck because we had one right next door! They replied 'oh good...you go now and send me money!'

    Is there anyway to do anything about this? We didn't know if it could be reported to someone or some agency that was in a position to actually follow up. I don't know the number to the CIA and I'm pretty they'd laugh at a $1000 scam attempt.

  • Investor · Overland Park, KS · Member since 2015 · 5 posts · 0 votes
    11y

    A great share. Thanks.

    Another lesson to know your seller/buyer.

  • Richmond, VA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 18 votes
    11y

    Thanks for the heads-up! As the old adage goes, If it looks too good to be true, it probably is.

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    11y

    @Erica Nagle

      your states attorney general would be a place to file a complaint.  This is Fraud

  • Real Estate Broker · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2014 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    11y

    We had a seller ask if we could give him 5k upfront because he was really in a bind.... absolutely not... 

    You should never give a seller money directly. It either goes through the title co, or Real Estate Attorney depending on your state.

  • Real Estate Broker · Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH · Member since 2013 · 31k+ posts · 20k+ votes
    11y

    Great share.

    Very informative to new investors.

    Always a good practice to Insist that closing go through an established title company.

  • Real Estate Investor · Lansdowne, PA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 656 votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Erica Nagle:

    Not that we are super experienced but if we hadn't taken classes this is something we may have fallen for. 

    Recently we found a house for sale by owner on Zillow. We contacted the seller and received a text back that it was still available for the price of $50k..he just wanted to sell it to pay off his mortgage. We looked up the history of the home and they had purchased the property in 1999 for $200k so it was possible they only owed 50k and just wanted to get rid of it. 

    The guy's story was that he and his wife had already moved to Virginia and needed to sell the home. They were currently renting it out we should do a drive by and make sure we were really interested before he puts out his tenants. Fair enough. So we drove by and were very interested, the the place looked great so we wanted to get it under contract to show were were serious and we would do our due dilligence after we secured the property and back out if there were any huge issues. 

    I wrote up a contract including a $100 deposit and sent it to him to sign at the email he provided. The email was the first and last name of the deed holder at yahoo.com. The fact that we couldn't seem to get this guy on the phone was a bit of a red flag but we hadn't put any money down or locked ourselves into anything so we'd proceed with caution. He also had a phone number from Nevada which was odd but in doing research I found that the couple who owned the house got married in Vegas so there was a small Nevada connection. 

    We waited for the contract to come back signed. Instead he asked when we could provide $1000 check so that he could hold the house for us. We explained that we wouldn't send him money directly because we had no proof this was legit and asked for his lawyer's contact information which he provided. We would put the money in an escrow account and he'd get it when we closed. He said okay but still didn't send the signed contract. A couple hours later he asked about the deposit again like we had never had the previous conversation. Some people are slow so we explained again about the lawyers, escrow, blah, blah. 

    Still no contract so we were pretty sure something was up (as we were suspicious of the whole time) so we called the number he gave us for his lawyer and no one answered. He then called us and could barely speak english and the connection was terrible. We knew then 100% that it was a scam but decided to mess with him anyway. We asked him for a copy of his drivers license. He sent some picture of a Texas driver's license with the name Chris Osborne, a picture of an older fellow and a birthdate of 1975. He called us a few more times and we told him we knew it was a scam and we were going to report him. He got angry and eventually text'd "Mugu!". We googled it and found this was a Nigerian term for "you fool". So he called himself out.

    I called the real deed holders to warn them that someone was trying to sell their home and they were thankful we called. We never sent the money and never would have but there are probably many out there who wouldn't know any better and may have sent whatever amount he asked for that they would never see again.

    Good thing you spotted the scam sooner then later. Often people figure it out after they've spent thousands. 

    A way to catch them quick is to simply request to see the inside of the property. They will come up with some b.s. story as to why they aren't able to show it(ever). Whether its they've recently been robbed or whatever foolishness they think one would believe. However, even out of state sellers will have a realtor, relative or schedule a few weeks in advance for them to come and show the place themselves, if they genuinely are looking to sell that house. Also the fact that you weren't able to speak to them on the phone was a RED ALERT as well.  Great thread. 

    Kudos,

    Mary

  • Investor · Dallas, TX · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    11y

    I ran into a similar scam last summer here in Dallas. Great story around the whole thing. They were missionaries...yeah right. $450k house, available for $250k with owner financing. I immediately smelled something fishy. A simple Google and the property was listed on MLS at $475k. I emailed the seller back and called them on it. No response, and the email account was immediately shut down. Buyer beware in all circumstances.

  • Investor · Plano, TX · Member since 2015 · 74 posts · 22 votes
    11y

    Lots of scammers out there.  Often they succeed, in fact I know a guy that spent his entire life savings on a string of Nigerian scams, and he is still convinced they are about to cash in big time.  It is sad.

    Now if you want to have a giggle and waste a bunch of time, but it is worth it, read a couple of these counter scammer posts at 419 Eater historic letters.

    A couple of my favorites are the Painted Breast and Carving for cash they are masterpieces of scamming scammers. 

  • Niles, IL · Member since 2015 · 27 posts · 2 votes
    11y

    Thank you all for the heads up. Really appreciate the BP family.

    Francis M.

    Newbie

  • Investor · Catonsville, MD · Member since 2013 · 65 posts · 17 votes
    11y

    This article was an eye opener; I am just getting back into the real estate (game) excuse my pun.  I am glad I read your article before I fell for this Tom Foolery.  Keep the articles coming.

  • Investor · Newport News, VA · Member since 2014 · 43 posts · 20 votes
    11y

    Man some people are sheisty. Thanks for sharing.

  • Investor · DFW, TX · Member since 2013 · 319 posts · 101 votes
    11y

    Thanks for the heads up!

    Not REI related but I recently ran into a scammer on Yahoo Auctions (yes, such a thing exists - big in japan lol). I'm sure there are similar ones going on at eBay etc

    It was fishy from the start, they contacted me offering to buy outside of the auction system and gave their email. The address didn't correspond to the name they were using, shipping address in Malaysia, etc. I googled one of the misspelled phrases in the email, and found a bunch of JP blog posts about the scam. (The email was a template sent to a bunch of people - good way to spot / confirm by googling)

    What I couldn't figure out is, what was the catch? They were asking for bank account details to wire in the money. I'm sure I never would have seen a dime come in, but it's not like giving them an account number allows them to pull out money remotely. Perhaps just a 'wholesaler' of stolen bank account details for a further "value add" scammer up the chain?

    Caveat emptor

    D

  • Toronto, Ontario · Member since 2014 · 615 posts · 172 votes
    11y

    Thanks for sharing!

  • Investor · Boise, ID · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 51 votes
    11y

    That's Crazy!

  • Investor · San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 64 posts · 26 votes
    11y

    @Mike Jury

    Oh boy...I just spent the last 2 hours reading the church of the painted breast story.. laughing my @$$ off..HAH!!! I've got to share this site with my wife.

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