Fund & Grow Case Study

99 Replies

Over the past few months I've become aware of Fund & Grow as a financing option (I heard about it on the Clayton Morris podcast), and I was really intrigued by it.  

Their promise: You give us $3K up front, we'll give you access to up to $250K of unsecured business credit at 0% that doesn't impact your personal credit in any way.  You can even get cash off these credit lines to use to pay a down payment on a house (effectively giving you 100% financing on a deal).

Sounds too good to be true, right?

I figured I could turn to these forums to debunk these myths, but while there were a number of posts of people asking questions about them, I didn't find a whole lot of really concrete answers.  A few folks had gone through with it, but either 1) they didn't have great credit to start with, so they spent a lot of time repairing their credit first, or 2) they found other hard money financing methods along the way and didn't finish out the year's worth of work to get the full amount.

I was very inspired by some case studies about Morris Invest (thank you Tyler Jahnke et. all) to just go ahead and go through with this, and then write regular updates for you all so we can learn, together, once and for all, whether this method works!

My background/why I'm interested in this product: I'm a newbie investor looking to augment my nest egg so as to be able to either put in all-cash offers on properties, or be able to BRRR with 100% financing so as to repeat more often.

My stats:

  • 800 credit score
  • 110K in available personal credit lines already
  • ~1% of existing credit line utilization

The timeline:

Early January 2018: After hearing about Fund & Grow on Clayton Morris' podcast, I decided to give them an initial call.  I ask them questions about how well I'd fare under their program, why their credit wouldn't show up on my personal statement, etc.  I spoke to Cathy in their sales department; she was very helpful and assured me that I'd do very well, and was looking at receiving in the "upper end" of their $50K-$250K of promised credit in the first year.  Interestingly, she also said that if at the end of the first year I chose to re-up with them and give them another $3K, they could get me another year of 0% financing.  I asked about being able to cash out the cards to make a down payment on a house; she assured me they had a strategy to do that without a fee!  I was intrigued, but didn't make a decision right away.

January 26:  After attending a real estate meetup in my area where someone who was very successful told me to get as much credit as I could while I didn't "need it" and use it to buy houses, I decided to call them again and ask some final questions.  I again spoke to Cathy; I asked her how I could possibly get business credit when I didn't yet have a business, and that business wouldn't have any income for quite some time even once I created it.  Without giving away their strategy on this forum, she basically told me they had a method to "backdate" a business entity.  I asked her about whether a lender would be concerned when I went to do a cash-out refinancing that I had all this credit card debt; she responded that this debt wouldn't appear on my personal credit report because it was business credit.  I finally asked her about their money-back guarantee in case all of this didn't pan out; she told me I could get my money back for any reason (I believe) within 60 days.  

I decided to pull the trigger.  I decided to pay half now, half in 30 days so I could get a quick sense of how things were going.  It was $3500 with a $500 discount from Clayton Morris's ad, so this was ~$1875 with taxes per payment.  

The first step was filling out paperwork so they could run my credit.  Then I booked an appointment with a credit specialist for this coming Thursday, Feb 1, to officially kick off the process!

I'll update everyone again after my meeting on Thursday, and I'll post regular updates here as credit comes in and as I try to get cash off the cards!

I have also started the same program. My situation is a bit different. I only have 14k in personal credit. I was at 80% utilization, credit score of approximately 715. I had 10k cash which wasn't enough to get a deal going in my area. I contacted them. They said if I'd use 6.5k to pay down existing credit to below 50% and then use the other 3.5k for their fee that they could get me between 40k and 60k in the "first round". If it's ok with you Doug I will also post on this thread to see how our results vary considering our different starting points. My plan is to refi once I get enough renovations done to get a conventional loan. The house will definitely have the equity when I'm done.

I’ve participated in this program and I have mixed reviews. I was able to access credit lines totaling approximately $80,000, and that is principal only for 12 to 18 months depending upon the card. That is the good news.

The bad news is that this whole “doesn’t affect your credit” advertisement is completely misleading. First, fund and grow does not help you alleviate the negative affects on your credit. They ask you to pay a second business that helps you remove these inquiries off your credit report. Find and grow will supply guidance on how to remove these inquiries so that you do not need to use the second business (Kaydem Credit Help), but the process isn’t very easy at all. Worst of all, I chose to go with the business that helps remove these inquiries and they have been unable to remove these from my credit report for the last four months. I am in my “third round” of this second business trying to help me remove these inquiries off my credit report, so I do not have a finality to this issue. My credit was definitely affected from the additional lines of credit to this date.

Another negative aspect is that the “access to cash” is completely misleading as well. They speak of credit card companies that send you balance transfer checks or cash checks that are as good as cash, but none of the four businesses that I got my credit cards through offered that. They also offer an opportunity to buy gold and then sell it back a few days later in hopes that the value of gold did not go down. There are fees associated with purchasing and selling precious metals and this took me over a week and a half and I actually lost $500 on this. The gentleman I spoke with at fund and grow said that he would do more research for me on how I could get access to cash, But is troubling that they advertise access to cash as if it were extremely easy. I have great credit and very stable, relatively high income, so there should be no reason I should be affected like this.

Overall I give the entire process, thus far, a B-

I’m having mix reviews also, I’m going into my second round now. First one I was able to get $45k. I was able to get the inquires off my report myself. My score was a 740 when I started with them, now going in my second round it’s a 760+ Depend on which report. 

Gold money thing I have not taken cash off as of yet. And yes they did tell me I can get cash from checks on the credit cards. ZERO of the companies do that anymore! So I was really p’d off that. 

But then look on the bright side I payed someone to get me $45,000 in credit cards when it could’ve took me longer to research and do it myself. 

All in all, I would say it’s a B- also, from the lack of communication on my second round rep, my first guy was GREAT!! Now this girl I have isn’t so great at telling me what’s going on. 

@Maurice Colbert How long did it take you to get verified at GoldMoney?  I'm going thru that process now and so far it's been over two weeks.  

I have a similar situation also with changing reps.....my first guy, Leonard, did a fantastic job.  Now I have someone else, not so great.

The communication can be a tad better but I am glad we hired them.  We are nearing the end of our 1st round and the wife and I should easily hit the 100k mark. Send me a private message if you need more details.

This case study is intriguing.

For those of you who have hit 45k, 60, 80, 100k, etc.

What are you planning to do with it? Also are you talking cash advance here? % of those credit limits deposited into your checking so that you can buy a home all cash, do BRRRR, get long term financing and pay back the credit card?

Back in my cc days, I had about $130k of available credit but not with an outfit or paying $3k for the privilege.

To convert my lines to cash, I used the free balance transfer option online.

The name and acct number I transferred to was my business name and bank acct. Worked like a charm and no cash advance fees. 

But then I stopped playing with snakes. My introductory offers of 0% started turning into penalty pricing up to 29.9% through no fault of my own.  Watch the fine print! Been consumer debt free for 5 years and will never go back.  Use these things with caution, y'all.

So you are are essentially paying them $3,000 to give you a list of credit card providers that will offer 0% promotional rates?

After the year is up, you pay them another $3,000 to give you another list of places?

Seems like it would be tough to get all of the lines off your credit report so I could see how this would be an issue.  What does the third party do to remove the inquiries?  They more or less just keep asking if they would help you out by removing it since the account is closed?  I don't see a good way to get the lines removed or a good reason for them to be removed.

@Chris Pomerleau Was the $80k the first round funding?  How bad was the effects of this on your credit?  Could you tell us what is was prior and post the process?  If this is business lines of credit, why does it effect your credit?  Thanks in advance.

$80k for first round.  The second round, I'm informed, isn't until 6 months later, which for me is in 2 months.

They are business lines of credit in that they are under a business, so you personal access to credit is not affected; however, the credit pull for each inquiry to open the credit card DOES affect your credit.  With 4 card (inquiries) it reduced my credit score by about 25 points.   

Fund and Grow's sister company Kaydem Credit Help, although I think they are owned and operated by the same company (because of my frustration, I have no proof), has still not removed these inquiries from my credit report, so my credit score is still at least 25 points less than it should be.

This post has been removed.

I’m considering using this to start doing some flips. I used a similar company to do my first flip and wound up breaking about even after fees( I split the flip with another person and a company for a 1/3rd share of the profits). The first one wasn’t very successful because of some city permitting issues causing the flip to go long. I made about 7,000 after all was said and done which was the fee to use the mentoring company and the credit card funding total. I know this is kind of playing with fire, but my credit score is now over 700 and I have about 40K in liquid credit with no debt. I’m considering using fund and grow to get a higher amount of funds to do a solo deal with the mentor company and make 2/3rds of the profit split typically 30-50,000 a flip in my market.

Originally posted by @Doug Kenney :

Over the past few months I've become aware of Fund & Grow as a financing option (I heard about it on the Clayton Morris podcast), and I was really intrigued by it.  

Their promise: You give us $3K up front, we'll give you access to up to $250K of unsecured business credit at 0% that doesn't impact your personal credit in any way.  You can even get cash off these credit lines to use to pay a down payment on a house (effectively giving you 100% financing on a deal).

Sounds too good to be true, right?

I figured I could turn to these forums to debunk these myths, but while there were a number of posts of people asking questions about them, I didn't find a whole lot of really concrete answers.  A few folks had gone through with it, but either 1) they didn't have great credit to start with, so they spent a lot of time repairing their credit first, or 2) they found other hard money financing methods along the way and didn't finish out the year's worth of work to get the full amount.

I was very inspired by some case studies about Morris Invest (thank you Tyler Jahnke et. all) to just go ahead and go through with this, and then write regular updates for you all so we can learn, together, once and for all, whether this method works!

My background/why I'm interested in this product: I'm a newbie investor looking to augment my nest egg so as to be able to either put in all-cash offers on properties, or be able to BRRR with 100% financing so as to repeat more often.

My stats:

  • 800 credit score
  • 110K in available personal credit lines already
  • ~1% of existing credit line utilization

The timeline:

Early January 2018: After hearing about Fund & Grow on Clayton Morris' podcast, I decided to give them an initial call.  I ask them questions about how well I'd fare under their program, why their credit wouldn't show up on my personal statement, etc.  I spoke to Cathy in their sales department; she was very helpful and assured me that I'd do very well, and was looking at receiving in the "upper end" of their $50K-$250K of promised credit in the first year.  Interestingly, she also said that if at the end of the first year I chose to re-up with them and give them another $3K, they could get me another year of 0% financing.  I asked about being able to cash out the cards to make a down payment on a house; she assured me they had a strategy to do that without a fee!  I was intrigued, but didn't make a decision right away.

January 26:  After attending a real estate meetup in my area where someone who was very successful told me to get as much credit as I could while I didn't "need it" and use it to buy houses, I decided to call them again and ask some final questions.  I again spoke to Cathy; I asked her how I could possibly get business credit when I didn't yet have a business, and that business wouldn't have any income for quite some time even once I created it.  Without giving away their strategy on this forum, she basically told me they had a method to "backdate" a business entity.  I asked her about whether a lender would be concerned when I went to do a cash-out refinancing that I had all this credit card debt; she responded that this debt wouldn't appear on my personal credit report because it was business credit.  I finally asked her about their money-back guarantee in case all of this didn't pan out; she told me I could get my money back for any reason (I believe) within 60 days.  

I decided to pull the trigger.  I decided to pay half now, half in 30 days so I could get a quick sense of how things were going.  It was $3500 with a $500 discount from Clayton Morris's ad, so this was ~$1875 with taxes per payment.  

The first step was filling out paperwork so they could run my credit.  Then I booked an appointment with a credit specialist for this coming Thursday, Feb 1, to officially kick off the process!

I'll update everyone again after my meeting on Thursday, and I'll post regular updates here as credit comes in and as I try to get cash off the cards!

You never updated the thread, how much did you get on the first round etc?

Originally posted by @Drew Cameron :

I’m considering using this to start doing some flips. I used a similar company to do my first flip and wound up breaking about even after fees( I split the flip with another person and a company for a 1/3rd share of the profits). The first one wasn’t very successful because of some city permitting issues causing the flip to go long. I made about 7,000 after all was said and done which was the fee to use the mentoring company and the credit card funding total. I know this is kind of playing with fire, but my credit score is now over 700 and I have about 40K in liquid credit with no debt. I’m considering using fund and grow to get a higher amount of funds to do a solo deal with the mentor company and make 2/3rds of the profit split typically 30-50,000 a flip in my market.

Your plan is actually good. Risky but looks worth it

How much money did you have to put up to make $7k did you get cash off the cards or you charged the card?

@Donny Aldo I converted the cards to cash with 0% intro cash advance  fees. The company I used charged a 10% fee for the credit cards (they marketed it as business lines of credit). I was able to receive 40,000  less a 4,000 sur charge taken upfront by the company. I had $36,000 liquid and used about $3,000 to pay the mentor company I use locally. The flip total cost was roughly $51,000 that I split with another member of the mentor company. My out of pocket cost was about $25,500. So when  I say  I broke even I actually came out ahead, because the flip paid my fee for the company and now any flips I partner with them on will be all profit. Another side benefit was some of the cards had cash bonuses and other perks. I also learned a lot about the process and  overcoming obstacles.  If I use fund and grow to obtain around 60,000 or so that should be enough to do a flip solo and  profit roughly $20,000  and  learn more. I'm also trying to find  some  wholesale deals to raise  capital the old fashioned way, but  so far I haven't  had any luck yet.    

@Maurice Colbert , I appreciate all your insight so far. I've been speaking with Marty Banks from Fund and Grow this week for about 90 minutes in total. He has been very helpful. I have 2 questions for anyone who has gone through it before, how do you exactly take lets say 50K from a credit card to purchase a 50K rental property? Also is it worth is to pay the company to take the inquiries off your record, is it straightforward or super hard if you do it yourself? Thanks again I'm excited to get into the game of real estate! 


Sheldon did you sign up yet?
Im looking for somebody to sign up with so we can go half on it.

$3500 in half is way better on the pockets.

fund and grow looks pretty good to be honest.


Originally posted by @Sheldon Morgan :

@Maurice Colbert , I appreciate all your insight so far. I've been speaking with Marty Banks from Fund and Grow this week for about 90 minutes in total. He has been very helpful. I have 2 questions for anyone who has gone through it before, how do you exactly take lets say 50K from a credit card to purchase a 50K rental property? Also is it worth is to pay the company to take the inquiries off your record, is it straightforward or super hard if you do it yourself? Thanks again I'm excited to get into the game of real estate! 

@Ronald Lenor or to anyone who is going through the process!

If you don't mind could you answer a couple of questions for me:

Since its been 2 months since your post where you said you received up to 100k of lines of credit, can you tell me how long it took to receive the CCs and the cash from the cards also were you able to get at least 80 percent of cash from them?

How much did the CC company charge to get the cash from the cards?

How long between the rounds.?

How did this affect your credit score?

Did fund and grow help you get the inquiries removed from your credit history? and if so how much did it cost you?

Have you done the "sell gold" method? and if so how did it work out?

Are you still satisfied in how the service is working?

Thanks in advance,

Originally posted by @Donny Aldo :

Sheldon did you sign up yet?
Im looking for somebody to sign up with so we can go half on it.

$3500 in half is way better on the pockets.

fund and grow looks pretty good to be honest.

Originally posted by @Sheldon Morgan:

@Maurice Colbert , I appreciate all your insight so far. I've been speaking with Marty Banks from Fund and Grow this week for about 90 minutes in total. He has been very helpful. I have 2 questions for anyone who has gone through it before, how do you exactly take lets say 50K from a credit card to purchase a 50K rental property? Also is it worth is to pay the company to take the inquiries off your record, is it straightforward or super hard if you do it yourself? Thanks again I'm excited to get into the game of real estate! 

 No I have not, I am still asking around and researching how it works. 

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