Here's my situation:
I'm closing on a three family house in Massachusetts for December 4th. Currently the first and third floors have tenants, the second floor is vacant. Both current sets of tenants have lived in the building for a few years and are tenants at will. I would like to live on the first floor (where tenants currently live).
This is my first home and it will be owner occupied, the current owner refuses to tell the tenants to leave.
I am thinking that when I close on December 4th, I tell the current tenants on the first floor that they have a 30 day notice to vacate the unit so that I may live there. I also, in tandem, move temporarily into the second floor unit for the month until they are gone.
My question is are there any legal ramifications that I can face for just giving them notice the day I have ownership of the property? Their current lease (signed in 2007) says that they are month to month and they need a 30 day notice to leave. Am I missing anything?
The tenants in question are a family of 5, living in a 2 bedroom space.
I'm happy to provide any other info that I am missing...
Go and introduce yourself to the tenants , be nice . Tell them you will be doing some remodeling for the new tenants once you buy the place . You are changing the house to a halfway house for violent felons on parole and helping them start a new life in a new area . You would like them to stay on as tenants to help defray some of the costs involved . Have a buddy with you introduce him as a contractor , tell him you want to measure for bars on the windows and a 8 ft chain link fence around the yard while you are talking to the tenants .
You wont have to evict , they will be gone before settlement .
Dan, first of all congrats on the new home. Second I am not an attorney so what I say is not legally binding :-).
Now to answer your question, you will be within your right to give them notice on day 1 and expect them to move out 30 days later.
However, MA is a very renter friendly state and if they do not leave it may take you 6-12 months in court to get rid of them. Also once you give them notice they may stop paying you and you may never recoup those funds, so make sure you have the reserves for that.
depending on what county you are in I may know a constable to help evict them if they do not leave after a court order.
Don't mean to scare you but want you to know the all the facts even the scary ones.
All the best,
Rob
Based off of what @Rob Morris said, I do also want to state that I know no one can give me legal advice!! But just making sure I'm doing everything by the book on my end.
What @Rob Morris said is right, it can take many months to get tenants out if they don't want to leave in MA. Also it will be hard to get them out in the winter months. I would suggest talking to them to feel them out to see how much they like living there maybe they would move to the 2nd floor.
Mike
If you want them out I would give notice when you buy. Not sure you can force the current owner to give notice but I would be clear in your request to him and let him know you will be insisting on a move to the first floor for yourself and you will be improving the second floor (if you have already decided that is what you will do.). I noted you mentioned the number of people living on the first floor vs number of bedrooms. In all communication with the current landlord and the tenants stay away from any reference to family size. I think in MA owner occupied 3 families aren't exempt from fair housing laws related to this protected group. And believe me you don't have to intend to discriminate for it to be perceived and get out of hand.
What others have said is true. Massachusetts is renter-friendly in the extreme. A professional tenant can string you along for many months, while not paying rent or utilities.
I would play a little hardball with the seller and as a condition of the sale, require that the first floor be delivered vacant.
You might consider reimbursing the first floor tenant for some of their moving expenses if they take the 2nd floor unit. Your last ditch effort should be 'cash for keys". Just know that if it ends up in court, it will be ugly and expensive and "discrimination" is an all too easy weapon for the tenant to use to beat you into a lifeless, bloody pulp.
Presumably, he's somewhat motivated to sell. If that's true, you have a bit of an upper hand. I recommend that you play it to your advantage.
You might try asking in casual conversation why he's selling. If you can determine that, you might gain some leverage in negotiations, especially if he's under a time constraint or financial pressure.
Go and introduce yourself to the tenants , be nice . Tell them you will be doing some remodeling for the new tenants once you buy the place . You are changing the house to a halfway house for violent felons on parole and helping them start a new life in a new area . You would like them to stay on as tenants to help defray some of the costs involved . Have a buddy with you introduce him as a contractor , tell him you want to measure for bars on the windows and a 8 ft chain link fence around the yard while you are talking to the tenants .
You wont have to evict , they will be gone before settlement .
You can not tell them on December 4 to leave and expect them to be out December 31. They must have at least the a full rental period to leave. If you notify them on December 4 they would have until the end of January to leave. If they do not leave by the end of January, then you can start an eviction. It may take at least a couple of months to evict. Since it is not for non-payment you may be able to ask for use and occupancy during the eviction (or if you accept rent say that it is for use and occupancy only). You may want to find a local attorney who does evictions to help walk you through the first one if necessary.
I hope you reviewed all leases and other papers with the Seller. Did he take a security deposit or last months rent? That all needs to be accounted for at closing. You can bet the tenants will say they gave a security deposit or last months rent or both. You may want to have the Seller refund that money at closing (with receipts) so it does not come back and bite you or you may want to be sure it is transfered to you. Its sounds like you are already along in the process and it may be too late to make the a condition of purchase that the apartments be empty. Can you renegotiate the purchase price?
If the second floor is also a two bedroom, you may not be able to offer that to them in exchange for the first floor as it sounds like it may be an issue of overcrowding.
You did not mention the third floor. What are you going to do with those tenants? If you are OK with them staying, I would also give them notice that you are ending their tenancy BUT offer them a new one AFTER they complete an application (so you have all their info), agree to your new rent and sign a lease. In any event you need to give them notice where to send the rent and who to contact etc.
feel free to ask me any questions directly by email
Dan, first of all congrats on the new home. Second I am not an attorney so what I say is not legally binding :-).
Now to answer your question, you will be within your right to give them notice on day 1 and expect them to move out 30 days later.
This information is wrong. Giving 30 days notice requires giving them a full rental period to vacate. If you give notice on December 4th, as an example, the tenants have until Jan 31st to vacate since you missed the deadline to have them out before the end of December as that notice will have to have been given by November 30th.
@Dan Smithconsidering this is your first investment property and you are unfamiliar with MA Landlord/Tenant law it would be wise to consult an attorney to help with the eviction. It's actually a very straight forward process but there is a process that must be followed. Do you know if the tenants have security deposits? Has the current landlord followed the correct procedures with respect to handling the deposits? Find out if he has statements of conditions from the tenants if he is in fact holding deposits. What about last month's rent? Be sure that at prior to closing you receive estoppel certificates from all tenants stating whether or not they paid a security deposit or last month rent, if they are current on their rent, what their rent is, if they own any appliances, if the landlord has any outstanding maintenance/repair issues that he has been notified of but have not been addressed. Have the landlord and tenants sign so everyone is in agreement (and be sure he addresses all outstanding repair/maintenance issues.
Be sure if any deposits are being held that you receive a separate check for that amount at closing including the amount of interest that should have been paid all along so you can deposit that in a new account. Don't allow it to be included on the HUD.
If you haven't yet done it, read up on the security deposit requirements for MA. You don't want to hold a deposit and handle it incorrectly.
Good luck Dan.
@Rob Beland my attorney told me a full rental period is the amount of time they pay for (AKA 30 or 31 days) so as long as you give 31 days notice and they pay their rent monthly you are fine. But if they pay 6 months in advance as their normal tenant at will practice then you need to give 6 months notice.
http://www.mass.gov/ocabr/docs/tenantsrights.pdf
"A Tenant at Will is one who occupies a rented apartment without a lease, but pays rent periodically (typically monthly). The agreement for the Tenancy at Will may be either written or verbal. Either the landlord or you may terminate this arrangement at any time by giving written notice of 30 days or one full rental period in advance, whichever is longer. No reason is required to terminate a Tenancy at Will. If your landlord wants to raise your rent, s/he must send you a proper legal notice terminating your tenancy, and then make you an offer to remain in the apartment for the increased rent."
"A Tenancy at Will may be written or oral. Either you or your tenant may terminate this agreement at any time for a specific reason or for no reason by giving 30 days written notice or notice which covers a full rental period, whichever is longer. Termination of a Tenancy at Will for nonpayment requires only a 14 day notice to quit (M.G.L. c.186, § 12)."
http://www.mass.gov/ocabr/docs/landlordrights.pdf
@Rob Morristhe only scenario where your statement, or that of your attorney as the case may be, is true would be if the tenancy runs from the 5th to the 5th every month so notice given on the fourth of December would be valid. I'd say it's a safe assumption that this tenant's rent is due on the 1st of the month so notice must be given before the 1st of the month for it to go into effect for that rental period.
From the state's website...
Tenancy at will. A tenancy-at-will can be either oral or written. Either the landlord or the tenant can terminate a month-to-month tenancy-at-will by giving a written thirty (30) days (minimum) notice to quit that must expire at the end of a rental period. Special attention must be paid to February, which has less than 30 days. Therefore, if the notice to quit is served too late in January, it cannot operate to terminate the tenancy as of March 1.
The key is that the notice must expire at the end of a rental period. If the rental period begins on the first of December and the thirty day notice expires on the 3rd of January since it was served on the 4th of December, it's not a valid notice period and the tenant will have to be reserved.
How about path of least resistance - move into the second floor? No upfront hassle!
Depending on your (and the first floor tenants') timeline, you could end up on the first floor eventually anyway...
Second @Rob Beland, get estoppels from the existing tenants.
Aside - long time lurker, this thread made me register :)
Wow! Thanks for all this help guys! I'm a little worried that this could turn into a headache, but I guess that's just a risk you have to take. The current owner won't kick them out for me, we've had that conversation...
My plan would be to move into the 2nd floor on December 4th, give them their notice that day or the next day and allow them to stay through Jan 31. That seems to be the best, most law-abiding way to do things.
Big Thank you's to @Rob Beland and @Rob Morris for some clarification and some help on this matter!
I'm curious, why are you kicking out long term paying tenants?
Can you not offer them the second floor apartment instead?
The law here in CO is the same as what @Rob Beland is describing. "30 days notice" means "at least 30 days notice before the next time rent is due. Giving notice on the 5th (assuming rent is due on the 1st) is not 30 days before the first of the next month, so the notice applies to the month after that.
I too will STRONGLY recommend finding a landlord/tenant attorney right now. Have them start by reviewing the lease you plan to use. That will cost you a few hundred dollars. Its money well spent, and money you signed up to spend when you bought this place. Now your a client, and have an attorney you can ask specific questions of.
try the cash for keys - offer them $2k-$3k (again, talk to your attorney 1st). with it being December and 5 people living in there, if they have kids, they will want to move out in between the xmas break I would imagine. it still will be tough as they have to find a place to live and, of course, the PITA in moving.
Hi @Dan Smith
Congratulations on your purchase!
My only advice is make sure you are thinking with your investor mind instead of your consumer mind.
(Questions to think about)
1) With 2/3 already rented property how much are you saving by not redoing an apartment and looking for renters during a hard to find renter period (holidays)?
2) Do they keep the place nicer than the rest which is why you want the first floor (Hang onto that tenant you will miss them)?
3) Are they really just a mess and getting rid of them is best for all?
4) For a temporary time frame while investing... is the second floor that bad? If you don't want it what are the odds you will be able to rent it to someone else? Someone you would actually want living in it?
Only you will actually know these answers and there is plenty we don't know but make sure you are thinking as the investor!
try the cash for keys - offer them $2k-$3k (again, talk to your attorney 1st). with it being December and 5 people living in there, if they have kids, they will want to move out in between the xmas break I would imagine. it still will be tough as they have to find a place to live and, of course, the PITA in moving.
$3,000 for cash for keys??? What kind of advice is that??? You have no knowledge of local landlord/tenant laws. Why would you suggest that?
A property owner that will not vacate the units or even give notice to terminate tenancy is a possible discount situation. It often indicates tenant landlord issues as well. Do not close on that property without signed estoppel letters so you know actual rents and deposits paid. Often times the owner is not be willing to help you get estoppels. If you are not able to procure estoppel letters, then don't close on the property without renegotiating the price.
Big question is why wont he get them out ? Are they paying ? make sure he doesnt sign a lease prior to settlement . Personally if you want them out ,have it done before settlement .
If this is not already the deal of a lifetime, I'd doggedly work a discount into the price of the cost of a possible six month eviction . Not unforseeable in Massachusetts esp. winter time.
VERY renter friendly . I've done it knocked $7k off pre agreed price
. Or I'd try and work the eviction into the deal = empty building upon closing
Good luck
If this is not already the deal of a lifetime, I'd doggedly work a discount into the price of the cost of a possible six month eviction . Not unforseeable in Massachusetts esp. winter time.
VERY renter friendly . I've done it knocked $7k off pre agreed price
. Or I'd try and work the eviction into the deal = empty building upon closing
Good luck
I'm all about the discount when the owner can't or won't vacate the property. You typically cannot sell an occupied property with month to month tenants and expect the buyer to take on the tenants for the same price as a vacant property. There are some high end and super active rental markets where this is not an issue, but I don't think the OP's property is in such an area.
I'd not try to get the owner to vacate the units. He's selling them occupied for a reason. It's all about renegotiating the price and terms IMO.
Here's my situation:
I'm closing on a three family house in Massachusetts for December 4th. Currently the first and third floors have tenants, the second floor is vacant. Both current sets of tenants have lived in the building for a few years and are tenants at will. I would like to live on the first floor (where tenants currently live).
This is my first home and it will be owner occupied, the current owner refuses to tell the tenants to leave.
I am thinking that when I close on December 4th, I tell the current tenants on the first floor that they have a 30 day notice to vacate the unit so that I may live there. I also, in tandem, move temporarily into the second floor unit for the month until they are gone.
My question is are there any legal ramifications that I can face for just giving them notice the day I have ownership of the property? Their current lease (signed in 2007) says that they are month to month and they need a 30 day notice to leave. Am I missing anything?
The tenants in question are a family of 5, living in a 2 bedroom space.
I'm happy to provide any other info that I am missing...
Hi Dan:
Here in California, any tenant who has been renting a property for more than one year must be given 60 days' notice, regardless of what their lease says, so don't get tricked into thinking you can only give them 30 days and then finding you have to start over again with a 60 day notice. Laws vary from one state to another so check out the Civil Code in your state before you do anything. Best of luck with the new property!