Prospective Tenant contacted Landlord's FB friends w/o telling me

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Prospective Tenant contacted Landlord's FB friends w/o telling me

Lora H.
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2011 · 53 posts · 8 votes

Hi BPers!  This is a new one for me and I'd love some feedback.  I just moved and am trying to rent out my previous home which will give me my 2nd rental.  I have been vetting out a joint applicant couple.  I educated them that I have an application for them to fill out, I run a background/credit check via smartMove and I require 3 references from each of them, former/current Landlords preferred.  They provided me everything I have asked for, including their signed permission for me to contact their Landlords and ask anything about their rental history with them.

Last night I got a call from a friend of mine telling me that one of the applicants contacted her via Facebook asking my friend if she could tell her anything about me and her rental experience with me.  First of all, my friend has never rented from me nor do we have any idea why the applicant would make that assumption.  Secondly, my applicant never asked for any references from me or told me she was going to contact my friends.  I find this very weird and I'm a bit jaded about her doing this.  If she would have asked me I would have gladly given her names of tenants of mine, after getting their permission to contact.  I'm also disappointed because they communicated to me they appreciated my transparency about everything and yet, they couldn't give me the same respect.  I don't have anything to hide but I am protective of my friends' contact info just as they are of mine. 

How would you feel if a prospective tenant did this to you?  Would you still rent to them? 

I am planning to speak with her today.  I will be diplomatic about it and ask her why she did that, how many of my friends did she contact, etc.  But I also will tell her how I feel about it as well.  If she would like to speak to any of my other tenants that she should ask first.  Thoughts?  What would you do in this situation or has this ever happened to you?  Thanks!

1Reply
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Anthony R.
Property Manager · Lakewood, OH · Member since 2015 · 250 posts · 258 votes
10y

When it comes to the internet, you are the only person to blame for what is on it. ESPECIALLY when it comes to social media. 

##Hops on soapbox## 

As a professional software engineer by day (and a former police officer), I know, as you should by now, how facebook makes it money. They data-mine what you give them and they sell it to other companies. Furthermore, other companies will scrape google results for facebook information that you volunteer. No one should be providing information to these sites. Don't put your real name on there. Don't put your income, job, college, location etc on there. IF YOU DO, and you make it publically visible, be prepared to get grilled over it. Police use it to convict you. Criminals use it to steal your identity. Criminals use it to figure out your routine so they can rob your house. Companies use it to weed you out of potential candidates. Most relevantly though, anyone can use it for whatever they'd like, legal or not.

##Hops off soapbox##

To avoid this issue in the future set your facebook privacy up. You can make it so people can't find you unless they're a friend of a friend. Secondly, use a fake name on there. This is pretty common these days. I usually pick one out of a book that I like and use it. My friends get a kick out of quoting the characters and I don't have to worry about my company firing me for controversial opinions. 

Finally, send that prospective tenant a gift basket for enlightening you. Then tell them that it was also super creepy and to find some place else to live. 

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  • Michaela G.
    Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y

    There are 2 ways to look at it, but I think I'd be able to get past it, because it shows that they're careful and conscientious and that they're not desperate to just move anywhere. 

    There are a lot of scams going around and they have to worry about getting taken. These days tenants need to really do their own due diligence or potentially get in trouble. 

    Is it good that they contacted your friends behind your back? No. But on the other hand, if they had asked you up front, you might have just told them where to go. So, maybe it was one of those 'ask for forgiveness , instead of permission situations.' Maybe they asked another landlord ahead of time and he then turned them down, as it's not very common to do that. 

    I think I would contact them, let them know that I didn't really like to be surprised like this, but that I understood why they did it and move on. 

    That's just me.

    4Reply
  • Dana Dunford
    San Francisco, CA · Member since 2016 · 238 posts · 204 votes
    10y

    @Michaela G.- I agree and like your viewpoint on it.

    @Lora H.- Here is my opinion, leaning towards being transparent about the entire situation:

    • I would mention it to them and ask if they want tenant references. See how they react.
    • Then, I would ask them who / how many people were contacted. You should be honest and mention that you don't want them spamming your friends. It's not ok to do that ...

    I completely understand contacting prior tenants to confirm you are a legitimate property owner. However, it's a bit out of the ordinary for them to correlate your Facebook friends with past renters (not great logic). You should be very honest that it's not ok to spam your friends, but leave that part until they answer the second question.

    0Reply
  • Andreas W.
    Durham, NC · Member since 2013 · 502 posts · 215 votes
    10y

    I think that this is a risk you are taking with social media. By using Facebook you signed your right of privacy away for all information you put out in that platform. You are not the customer, you are the product. Your info is free to use by anybody who sees fit, not only by Zuckerberg who sells your data to the highest bidder. Of course, it goes both ways. You can use Facebook to inquire about your applicants. 

    3Reply
  • Robert Melcher
    Residential Real Estate Broker · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2016 · 506 posts · 311 votes
    10y

    I do not link to residents in Facebook, LinkedIn, or any social forum like meetup.

    Check your privacy settings.  Your links are too easy to exploit.

    Lastly, it's an imposition in your friends and it implies you may be stalked or your friends may be the recipients of complaints if you don't (in their opinion) "act right".

    I would consider this a major breach of protocol.

    1Reply
  • Lora H.
    OP
    Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2011 · 53 posts · 8 votes
    10y

    I did look at my FB settings and it's all marked as "Friends" only. 

    0Reply
  • Gail K.
    Augusta, GA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    It seems like a rather strange way to check out a landlord but on the other hand, many, many landlords check out applicants via their facebook site.  They don't contact their friends but rather read what applicants write about their lifestyle (and sometimes what they write about previous landlords!); can learn interesting things (for example, someone who claims they don't drink posting pictures of themselves snockered at different parties, someone who claims they don't smoke posting pictures of themselves with tobacco...or other products....they are smoking).

    1Reply
  • Jeff B.
    Buy & Hold Owner · Redlands, CA · Member since 2015 · 5k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    10y

    Interesting;  We sermonize using tenant screening and yet you object to  tenants screening you?

    What's fair for the goose is good for the gander :0

    My problem with it is the lack of credibility associated with the social media, and thus I never use it for screening.

    Guess we might conclude that "what goes around comes around" and we need to be sure WE have clean underwear.

    3Reply
  • Dana WhickerPro Member
    Investor · Fernandina Beach, FL · Member since 2014 · 557 posts · 374 votes
    10y

    I don't know what the facebook is but I don't mind prospective tenants asking around about me. They're not going to find anything interesting. They will find that if they pay me what they agree to pay they'll get a nice place to live in in return.

    0Reply
  • Matthew Paul
    Severna Park, MD · Member since 2013 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    10y

    I think it was a great idea for them to check you out .  Facebook , linkedin all are out there in the open . A lot of courthouses  have their info on line .  You can check out a tenant to see if they have a record , BUT they can do the same to you . All is fair 

    0Reply
  • Sylvia B.
    Rental Property Investor · Douglas County, MO · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    I think contacting your FB friends was going a bit too far, but look at it from the tenant's point of view. We landlords have all of their information - driver's license & social security numbers, income details, where they have lived, etc. AND we have a key to their home! Yes, we are trusting very valuable assets to their care, but they have to trust us too.

    I actually like it when a potential tenant tells me that they have talked to other tenants about us, because we have a good reputation. Also, I'm in a small town, and you just have to get used to everyone knowing everything about you. [Sometimes I think everyone else knows what I'm doing before I do!]

    1Reply
  • Anthony R.
    Property Manager · Lakewood, OH · Member since 2015 · 250 posts · 258 votes
    10y

    When it comes to the internet, you are the only person to blame for what is on it. ESPECIALLY when it comes to social media. 

    ##Hops on soapbox## 

    As a professional software engineer by day (and a former police officer), I know, as you should by now, how facebook makes it money. They data-mine what you give them and they sell it to other companies. Furthermore, other companies will scrape google results for facebook information that you volunteer. No one should be providing information to these sites. Don't put your real name on there. Don't put your income, job, college, location etc on there. IF YOU DO, and you make it publically visible, be prepared to get grilled over it. Police use it to convict you. Criminals use it to steal your identity. Criminals use it to figure out your routine so they can rob your house. Companies use it to weed you out of potential candidates. Most relevantly though, anyone can use it for whatever they'd like, legal or not.

    ##Hops off soapbox##

    To avoid this issue in the future set your facebook privacy up. You can make it so people can't find you unless they're a friend of a friend. Secondly, use a fake name on there. This is pretty common these days. I usually pick one out of a book that I like and use it. My friends get a kick out of quoting the characters and I don't have to worry about my company firing me for controversial opinions. 

    Finally, send that prospective tenant a gift basket for enlightening you. Then tell them that it was also super creepy and to find some place else to live. 

    7Reply
  • Frank Dimino
    Rental Property Investor · Rochester, NY · Member since 2014 · 55 posts · 21 votes
    10y

    This is akin to them looking at other properties to see if they are in better shape, a better area, or less rent. Who's my landlord is also part of the property they may rent.

    I would point out that I asked for permission ( signoff ) to check your back ground etc, I expect the same courtesy back. Let them know that it's not that you did it but that you should have said something first.

    0Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
    10y

    @Lora H.you should be thankful that they alerted you to security setting issue on your Facebook account. There is no way for them to view your friends or anything about you for that matter if your security settings were set properly. 

    -Fix your settings so that your friends are private.

    -Delete your home town and current town out of your profile because both are used to find you.

    -Use a different e-mail address for business than for personal, because you can be found with your e-mail address on facebook.

    -Turn off your profile picture so it is not public viewable or better yet change your profile picture to your dog or stuffed animal or the beach. Anything but your face.

    Don't tell tenants your home address. Don't have them mail rent to your home. Avoid giving out your last name when you are first meeting tenants. If you have a business card put Lora H. with your company name on it. You need to take better steps to protect yourself. Do you want to know why?

    My friends gave out there home address to a tenant. Everything was fine for a year, then some psycho boyfriend moves in with their tenant. Tenant starts paying rent late. They ask tenant to leave. Tenants boyfriend starts verbally threatening and driving by their home. 

    Please be more careful!

    0Reply
  • Lora H.
    OP
    Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2011 · 53 posts · 8 votes
    10y

    @Frank Dimino, agreed!  They signed a written authorization giving me (and their current/former Landlords) permission to ask and answer questions concerning their rental history.  I would expect the same courtesy.  Of course, FB is a great way to look people up to learn more about their lifestyles, etc.  I don't have anything to hide and I have appreciated their due diligence thus far.  I don't care if they would like to talk with my former or current tenants or a personal reference but they should have asked first.  

    Thanks everyone for your feedback, thoughts and feelings on the subject.  I think we're all on the same page.  I'm a firm believer in Karma . . . what comes around. . . . 

    0Reply
  • Sandra S.
    Tucson, AZ · Member since 2016 · 14 posts · 1 vote
    10y

    I think you should expect this in 2016, honestly. Social media is so prevalent and pervasive in society now that you shouldn't be surprised or offended by someone simply attempting to safeguard their own interest. Every (smart) job seeker uses social media to "background check" before signing on with a new employer, without signing an agreement alerting the employer they will be doing so. Same situation really.

    Further, if a prospective tenant were to only speak with references you provided, that's hardly going to alleviate any concerns they have since one would expect you would only provide favorable references.

    I don't understand your karma comment...is that in reference to the prospective tenants? If so, yikes! If I read that comment as a prospective tenant I would run.

    0Reply
  • Lesley Resnick
    Real Estate Agent · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    Social media is everywhere and there is no escaping. As Mark Zuckerberg says, "privacy is dead, get over it."  However, there is a degree of character and constraint one should exercise.  There are a  lot of people who do not necessarily follow this  The play out their lives on FB and try to drag others into it.  Without more information they seem like they type that will put everything out there.  I have no problem with them checking me out, but theses people scream DRAMA and possibly more.  I ask my tenants to pay the rent on time and not destroy the place.  In exchange, I provide a good value for a safe and comfortable place to live.    

    0Reply
  • Leland Barrow
    Investor · San Marcos, TX · Member since 2015 · 272 posts · 360 votes
    10y

    I think that if the tenant uses bad judgement in small situations they will use bad judgement in big situations. Having a prospective tenant take liberties with your personal life seems to me like bad judgement. You are not looking to rent...they are; they are not the landlord...you are. So if they become unhappy about a situation and send out messages to your friends and family would that be ok? This is how the relationship works, I ask you for references to check your rental background. I let you know all of the expectations upfront. You as the prospective tenant can ask me for references as a landlord and let me know all of your expectations upfront. Follow your instincts if it seems like a bad situation then it will be a bad situation. There is nothing worse than saying "I should have seen the warning signs".

    1Reply
  • Jared KempPro Member
    Contractor · Titusville, FL · Member since 2015 · 14 posts · 3 votes
    10y

    Personally, I would pass them up and move to the next prospect.  What's next?  Will they send a message complaining to your mother that you haven't repaired their fridge in a timely manner?

    1Reply
  • James DeRoest
    Investor · Century, FL · Member since 2015 · 950 posts · 603 votes
    10y

    >How would you feel if a prospective tenant did this to you? Would you still rent to them?

     Haha, rent to them, that's funny. Hell no.

    There's something just too creepy about a stranger contacting your friends on Facebook.

    0Reply
  • Anthony R.
    Property Manager · Lakewood, OH · Member since 2015 · 250 posts · 258 votes
    10y

    I think what everyone is attempting to say, but is having trouble putting there finger on is this. There is a perceived "personal space" or "boundary" that our culture expects to have when dividing professional life and personal life. Social networks have blurred this line. For most people it's not hard to distinguish where the line is, because they have the ability to project how their actions would make them feel. However, as clearly illustrated by this prospective tenant, they're obviously people that aren't capable of drawing this line so clearly.

    I believe that if you were to rent to this tenant that this mentality would fully manifest. You would have tenants that don't respect your personal space in your building. They wouldn't respect your personal time if you were obviously doing something family related and didn't want to be bothered. Most importantly though, I don't believe they would respect your things.

    1Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
    10y

    @Leland Barrowand @Jared Kempare correct. This person will not think for a moment about using Facebook to complain about you to your friends or even tagging you in a post. Imagine the the water heater stops working and they post a picture on Facebook of water all over the floor tagging you saying, better come fix this. 

    Privacy is not a matter of having something to hide. It is acknowledging that people can be unstable mentally and may use technology to harm you (not necessarily physically). 

    I hope it all works out.

    1Reply
  • J. MartinPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Oakland, CA · Member since 2011 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    10y

    @Lora H.,

    WHENEVER I ASK MYSELF IF I SHOULD REALLY ACCEPT A TENANT, I TRULY ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER DEEP DOWN. Kinda like the Lamborghini.. If you need to ask how much it costs, you can't afford it. Get it..? How many tenants have you had so far..?

    I THINK THE HUGE DIFFERENTIATION SOME PEOPLE ARE MISSING HERE is the difference between:

    a) Tenant looking at your publicly available profiles on social media.
    b) Tenant CONTACTING your friends to ask questions about you.

    The former may be expected and prudent on their part - and you gave up the info.
    The latter is them creeping into your life and not respecting personal boundaries of the landlord (by contacting your friends - not by looking at your page.)

    MY ISSUE HERE: ENTITLEMENT & Personal Boundaries

    The tenant feels ENTITLED to creep into your personal life and personal contacts without permission. The feel ENTITLED to information about you without you providing it or authorizing it. And they went behind your back to look out for themselves to get what the felt ENTITLED to - without adequately considering the impact to you. What if that FB friend doesn't know you own property and flips out because you told their cousin you don't have anything available?

    I think they will also feel ENTITLED later to do what they feel is necessary to satisfy themselves, without much regard for how it may impact you or your business or your personal boundaries.

    If the tenant has a problem with your landlording style later, would you be surprised if they told some of your FB friends, or posted something on your FB page?

    I wouldn't be that surprised given the circumstances. If they want to know what your friends think of your landlording, they'll be sure to want to let your friends know how much it sucks later, if that's how they feel!

    I don't need timid tenants, but I also don't like tenants who feel ENTITLED to fulfill their needs at my expense. I don't know if you are really hurting for tenants, but there is no shortage in my area, and if I'm asking myself if I should really take them - I already know the answer!!! @Leland Barrowhit the nail on the head!

    I'm with Leland, @Robert Melcher, @Anthony R., @Frank Dimino, @Jared Kemp, @James DeRoest, @Anthony Russell - you guys have it right. If the tenants don't respect your personal space/boundaries, and are over-reaching their bounds and stepping not just into your life, but disturbing your friends - before they even become a tenants - is that how you want to start this tenancy? How many tenants have you had in the past?

    4Reply
  • Kimberly H.
    Residential Real Estate Broker · Chicago Suburbs, IL · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 594 votes
    10y

    That they called your friends is odd. One thing to look you up on FB. Quite another for them to call your friends and ask about you. If they don't get that their judgement is off. I agree with @J. Martin

    1Reply
  • Derek Daun
    Investor · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2012 · 289 posts · 151 votes
    10y

    They crossed a personal boundary. It would not have been acceptable for you to have randomly contacted their facebook friends.

    Also, regardless of what you think your social media settings are, they only sure way to check is to view your profile as an outsider. Most web browsers have a privacy mode. (Chrome for example has incognito mode.) Google your name and facebook. Checkout what you can see on your profile as an outsider.

    1Reply
  • Jacob Sampson
    Investor · Topeka, KS · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    Doesn't bother me.  Maybe odd but...ehhh.  They have probably had a bad experience with landlords in the past and don't want to have another.  Full disclosure, the gene that allows me to get flustered never matured. 

    0Reply
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