New Investor Looking Out of State

San Diego, California
New Member Introductions
7moFollow

New Investor Looking Out of State

Jeffrey B.
New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes

Hi BP family,

I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

16Reply
596 views

Most Popular Reply

Nicholas L.Pro Member
Flipper/Rehabber · Pittsburgh · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
7mo

@Jeffrey B.

hello. just to be candid, OOS BRRRR for your first deal is an extremely high risk strategy. and as @Sam McCormack correctly noted, everyone wants a light cosmetic BRRRR - and so those deals are few and far between.

unless you're going to be flying to Ohio every month to manage your project i'd try to stay closer to home.  no one is going to be the QB of your project for you.

hope this helps

5Reply
See this reply in the discussion

54 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Jason WrayPro Member
    Banker · Nationwide · Member since 2020 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo

    Jeffrey,

    My advice based on the last 3 years would be to lean towards Ohio or Indiana due to the price points and stronger rents. You have a much higher ARV potential in both IN & OH if buying the TLC properties on the outskirts of higher priced homes on the outermost radius of the current gentrification areas.

    Keep in mind as of December there are some newer programs that require Less money down on investment properties like 10% for Single, Condo or Townhomes and 15% down for 2-4 Units. That can help spread out 20% into multiple properties versus only one to increase immediate rents and ARV/Equity.

    Feel free to reach out if you have any questions just closed on a Duplex in Dayton and one in Indianapolis. I know a few great agent's and GC if needed to help build your Network.

    [email protected]727-637-4289
    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Jason Wray:

      Jeffrey,

      My advice based on the last 3 years would be to lean towards Ohio or Indiana due to the price points and stronger rents. You have a much higher ARV potential in both IN & OH if buying the TLC properties on the outskirts of higher priced homes on the outermost radius of the current gentrification areas.

      Keep in mind as of December there are some newer programs that require Less money down on investment properties like 10% for Single, Condo or Townhomes and 15% down for 2-4 Units. That can help spread out 20% into multiple properties versus only one to increase immediate rents and ARV/Equity.

      Feel free to reach out if you have any questions just closed on a Duplex in Dayton and one in Indianapolis. I know a few great agent's and GC if needed to help build your Network.

      PM sent.
      0Reply
  • Arman AhmedPro Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus Cleveland Dayton, OH · Member since 2024 · 2k+ posts · 908 votes
    7mo

    @Jeffrey B.

    For an out-of-state BRRRR, the biggest risk isn't the market, it's execution, so I'd focus less on chasing a "perfect" deal and more on clean neighborhoods, conservative rehab numbers, and having boots on the ground before you buy. Both markets you mentioned can work, but one leans more toward affordability and rent ratios while the other gives you deeper tenant demand and easier exits. Either way, lining up a solid PM, a contractor you trust, and realistic ARVs will matter more than squeezing every dollar out of the deal. Build the team first, then buy, and the rest gets a lot easier.

    [email protected]614-418-6081
    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Arman Ahmed:

      @Jeffrey B.

      For an out-of-state BRRRR, the biggest risk isn't the market, it's execution, so I'd focus less on chasing a "perfect" deal and more on clean neighborhoods, conservative rehab numbers, and having boots on the ground before you buy. Both markets you mentioned can work, but one leans more toward affordability and rent ratios while the other gives you deeper tenant demand and easier exits. Either way, lining up a solid PM, a contractor you trust, and realistic ARVs will matter more than squeezing every dollar out of the deal. Build the team first, then buy, and the rest gets a lot easier.


       That's exactly what I had in mind to minimize risk!  I don't need the cash flow now, but would rather focus on a good property for the appreciation in 10+ years.

      0Reply
  • Jackelyn Lee
    Property Manager · Toledo, OH · Member since 2021 · 58 posts · 92 votes
    7mo

    Toledo investor here.


    First off, I like how realistic your plan is. A lot of first-time BRRRR buyers come in with "perfect deal" expectations, and you're already thinking like someone who wants to stay in the game long-term.

    With a $200k–$250k all-in budget, you can absolutely make a BRRRR work in markets like Toledo, and in my opinion the bigger factor isn't which Midwest city you pick, it's who you have around you when you buy and renovate.

    A few general things I’d keep front and center as an out-of-state investor:

    • Neighborhoods are block-by-block. Online research gets you close, but it won’t replace someone local who can sanity-check streets, tenant profile, and rent reality.
    • Cosmetic rehabs are the sweet spot, but you need tight scopes. Paint and flooring can turn into plumbing, roof, and electrical fast if the inspection and walkthrough aren’t thorough.
    • Numbers need to be conservative. Underwrite your rents, vacancy, and repairs like you’re trying to prove the deal won’t work. If it still pencils, you’re in a good spot.
    • Systems beat opinions. The right agent, contractor, and property manager are what keep the deal from drifting, especially when you’re not local.

    If you’re serious about Ohio, I’d focus less on “Toledo vs Columbus” as a headline and more on: what rent range you want, what tenant base you’re targeting, and how hands-on you want to be. Both markets can work. One just tends to be easier to get into, and the other tends to be more competitive price-wise.

    If you want to connect with boots-on-the-ground in Toledo, I’m happy to point you in the right direction and share a couple things I’d look for (and avoid) when buying your first deal from out of state.

    2Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Jackelyn Lee:

      Toledo investor here.


      First off, I like how realistic your plan is. A lot of first-time BRRRR buyers come in with "perfect deal" expectations, and you're already thinking like someone who wants to stay in the game long-term.

      With a $200k–$250k all-in budget, you can absolutely make a BRRRR work in markets like Toledo, and in my opinion the bigger factor isn't which Midwest city you pick, it's who you have around you when you buy and renovate.

      A few general things I’d keep front and center as an out-of-state investor:

      • Neighborhoods are block-by-block. Online research gets you close, but it won’t replace someone local who can sanity-check streets, tenant profile, and rent reality.
      • Cosmetic rehabs are the sweet spot, but you need tight scopes. Paint and flooring can turn into plumbing, roof, and electrical fast if the inspection and walkthrough aren’t thorough.
      • Numbers need to be conservative. Underwrite your rents, vacancy, and repairs like you’re trying to prove the deal won’t work. If it still pencils, you’re in a good spot.
      • Systems beat opinions. The right agent, contractor, and property manager are what keep the deal from drifting, especially when you’re not local.

      If you’re serious about Ohio, I’d focus less on “Toledo vs Columbus” as a headline and more on: what rent range you want, what tenant base you’re targeting, and how hands-on you want to be. Both markets can work. One just tends to be easier to get into, and the other tends to be more competitive price-wise.

      If you want to connect with boots-on-the-ground in Toledo, I’m happy to point you in the right direction and share a couple things I’d look for (and avoid) when buying your first deal from out of state.


       Great points and noted!  I would love to connect.  I will send you a PM.

      0Reply
  • Kerlous TadresBusiness Member
    Realtor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2023 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo
    Welcome to BP! Columbus is a solid choice for a first BRRRR if you stay in good B-class areas and keep rehabs light. I’m active in Columbus and happy to share local insights or connect if you want boots-on-the-ground help.
    [email protected]614-490-1163
    Kerlous Tadres | Reafco Real Estate539 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    2Reply
  • Sam McCormackBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Cincinnati, OH/NKY · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 833 votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


    I do not recommend a BRRRR OOS as your first property. Buy and hold OOS or BRRRR in state are the 2 better options. Or best case, buy and hold in state to build confidence. And by in state, try to have it within a few hours of you so you can drive to it occasionally. Also, I hate to bring this news, but light to cosmetic rehab BRRRR unfortunately does not exist to your everyday investor anymore, unless you are planning to put a ton of time into finding the right seller

    [email protected]859-443-4952
    Sam McCormack Realtor
    View Page
    2Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Sam McCormack:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


      I do not recommend a BRRRR OOS as your first property. Buy and hold OOS or BRRRR in state are the 2 better options. Or best case, buy and hold in state to build confidence. And by in state, try to have it within a few hours of you so you can drive to it occasionally. Also, I hate to bring this news, but light to cosmetic rehab BRRRR unfortunately does not exist to your everyday investor anymore, unless you are planning to put a ton of time into finding the right seller


       Sam,

      Thanks for your reply.  I would love to buy in my local market, but houses in the Class C neighborhoods are 800k and the rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense, even if I had the funds to purchase here.  Believe me, I'm not crazy about going out of state, but I don't see many other options.  I already own a house with a 2.875% rate and have a family, so house hacking is out of the question.

      0Reply
    • Sam McCormackBusiness Member
      Real Estate Agent · Cincinnati, OH/NKY · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 833 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:
      Quote from @Sam McCormack:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


      I do not recommend a BRRRR OOS as your first property. Buy and hold OOS or BRRRR in state are the 2 better options. Or best case, buy and hold in state to build confidence. And by in state, try to have it within a few hours of you so you can drive to it occasionally. Also, I hate to bring this news, but light to cosmetic rehab BRRRR unfortunately does not exist to your everyday investor anymore, unless you are planning to put a ton of time into finding the right seller


       Sam,

      Thanks for your reply.  I would love to buy in my local market, but houses in the Class C neighborhoods are 800k and the rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense, even if I had the funds to purchase here.  Believe me, I'm not crazy about going out of state, but I don't see many other options.  I already own a house with a 2.875% rate and have a family, so house hacking is out of the question.


      I appreciate the response! If you want to go OOS, by all means, I have many investors who do that, most of my clients are out of state, or country. I just want to make sure you know, a "light to cosmetic rehab" isn't going to get you anywhere. Be more flexible with what you want. If numbers make sense with a property that needs $75,000 of work, well that's about as good as it gets, because I don't often see numbers work at all for BRRRR's, unless the seller is looking to offload. But at that point, 50 other people are writing offers with you and some of those people are in state, or contractors themselves so they are able to save 50% on their rehab. You mentioned "unicorn", and I agree with it, it's impossible

      [email protected]859-443-4952
      Sam McCormack Realtor
      View Page
      1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Sam McCormack:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:
      Quote from @Sam McCormack:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


      I do not recommend a BRRRR OOS as your first property. Buy and hold OOS or BRRRR in state are the 2 better options. Or best case, buy and hold in state to build confidence. And by in state, try to have it within a few hours of you so you can drive to it occasionally. Also, I hate to bring this news, but light to cosmetic rehab BRRRR unfortunately does not exist to your everyday investor anymore, unless you are planning to put a ton of time into finding the right seller


       Sam,

      Thanks for your reply.  I would love to buy in my local market, but houses in the Class C neighborhoods are 800k and the rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense, even if I had the funds to purchase here.  Believe me, I'm not crazy about going out of state, but I don't see many other options.  I already own a house with a 2.875% rate and have a family, so house hacking is out of the question.


      I appreciate the response! If you want to go OOS, by all means, I have many investors who do that, most of my clients are out of state, or country. I just want to make sure you know, a "light to cosmetic rehab" isn't going to get you anywhere. Be more flexible with what you want. If numbers make sense with a property that needs $75,000 of work, well that's about as good as it gets, because I don't often see numbers work at all for BRRRR's, unless the seller is looking to offload. But at that point, 50 other people are writing offers with you and some of those people are in state, or contractors themselves so they are able to save 50% on their rehab. You mentioned "unicorn", and I agree with it, it's impossible


       I appreciate the honest and candid response.  An off-market buy and hold will probably be a better route, being out of state.

      2Reply
  • Nicholas L.Pro Member
    Flipper/Rehabber · Pittsburgh · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    7mo

    @Jeffrey B.

    hello. just to be candid, OOS BRRRR for your first deal is an extremely high risk strategy. and as @Sam McCormack correctly noted, everyone wants a light cosmetic BRRRR - and so those deals are few and far between.

    unless you're going to be flying to Ohio every month to manage your project i'd try to stay closer to home.  no one is going to be the QB of your project for you.

    hope this helps

    5Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Nicholas L.:

      @Jeffrey B.

      hello. just to be candid, OOS BRRRR for your first deal is an extremely high risk strategy. and as @Sam McCormack correctly noted, everyone wants a light cosmetic BRRRR - and so those deals are few and far between.

      unless you're going to be flying to Ohio every month to manage your project i'd try to stay closer to home.  no one is going to be the QB of your project for you.

      hope this helps


       I've read and listened to a few podcasts of successful out-of-state investors.  I believe it can be done with the right team.

      Believe you me, ideally I would love to invest locally, but as I told Sam, homes in the Class C neighborhood are 800K here and even if I had the money to invest the rent-to-price ratios do not make sense

      I'm not going to rush into anything and I'm underwriting the properties very conservatively.  It's either I sit on the sidelines or start taking action now and start making connections.

      If things don't feel right or if a deal feels forced, I'm not going to move forward.  I have a strong W2 job and don't need this income to retire but looking to diversify and build a retirement portfolio to increase my family's lifestyle in 10-15 years.

      0Reply
  • Remington LymanBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


    Welcome to the REI world. I have been buying in Columbus, Ohio, since 2017. I would be happy to chat with you about my experiences

    [email protected]614-541-8475Podcast Guest on Show My Job Laid Me Off, So I Replaced My Salary with Rentals
    Reafco512 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
  • Anthony L Amos Jr
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus | Toledo · Member since 2019 · 607 posts · 768 votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

    Hey Jeffrey, welcome to the BP family!

    Toledo is a very good affordable market to start in; however, being out of state has its risks. Before you make an offer, I would recommend coming here with a map and markers in hand.

    Filter out areas from your online research based on neighborhood income vs. rents, school ratings, property taxes, recent street view scanning, and positive remarks from other investors—then come out and confirm. Give yourself at least 3 days to check out the area, walk properties, and shake hands with realtors, contractors, property managers, title companies, and maybe even a local landlord-tenant lawyer. That'll increase your confidence in what you're investing in at the very minimum.

    If you would like to discuss my experience investing in Columbus and Toledo, don't hesitate to reach out!
    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Anthony L Amos Jr:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

      Hey Jeffrey, welcome to the BP family!

      Toledo is a very good affordable market to start in; however, being out of state has its risks. Before you make an offer, I would recommend coming here with a map and markers in hand.

      Filter out areas from your online research based on neighborhood income vs. rents, school ratings, property taxes, recent street view scanning, and positive remarks from other investors—then come out and confirm. Give yourself at least 3 days to check out the area, walk properties, and shake hands with realtors, contractors, property managers, title companies, and maybe even a local landlord-tenant lawyer. That'll increase your confidence in what you're investing in at the very minimum.

      If you would like to discuss my experience investing in Columbus and Toledo, don't hesitate to reach out!

       Great tips!  I do plan on coming out and meeting a few people if my initial connections seem solid and the market looks good from a far.

      0Reply
  • Alfath AhmedBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


    Columbus is going to be the best market to invest in for BRRRR/value add deals. I own 28 rental units that i acquired primarily using the BRRRR strategy.

    I would look to connect with a good investor agent that can connect you with good contractors, hard-money lenders/DSCR lenders, and property managers that can lease and manage for you.

    Your agent should be getting you off-market deals. Buy them at 75% ARV rule. They can also help guide you in building a Scope of Work to get a clear/better indicator of your rehab costs.

    I have a map I built that I can share with you that highlights the best areas to invest. PM me and I'll share it with you. 

    [email protected]614-802-5698
    ReafCo | Ahmed Group 55 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
  • Mario Benavidez
    Property Manager · Cleveland · Member since 2025 · 52 posts · 28 votes
    7mo

    Welcome to the Ohio market! Since you’re weighing Columbus vs. Toledo, you should definitely give Cleveland a look. It’s a great 'middle ground' where you can still find those Class B cosmetic rehabs within your $200k–$250k budget, often with better cash flow than Columbus.

    My name is Mario and I work with a local property management team here and would be happy to help. 

    1Reply
  • Jeffrey B.
    OP
    New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
    7mo
    Wow! Thanks BP family for all the feedback. I’ll connect with y’all when I’m able.
    0Reply
  • Drago Stanimirovic
    New to Real Estate · Miami, FL · Member since 2024 · 1k+ posts · 441 votes
    7mo

    Jeffrey, love your approach, you're not chasing a perfect deal, you're building long-term equity the right way. If you treat your BRRRR like a business from day one, with tight scopes, draw schedules, and capital timing, you'll outperform most first-timers.

    Columbus has scale, Toledo has margin, either works if your systems and team are dialed in. The best BRRRRs aren’t found, they’re engineered.

    Happy to dive deeper anytime.

    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Drago Stanimirovic:

      Jeffrey, love your approach, you're not chasing a perfect deal, you're building long-term equity the right way. If you treat your BRRRR like a business from day one, with tight scopes, draw schedules, and capital timing, you'll outperform most first-timers.

      Columbus has scale, Toledo has margin, either works if your systems and team are dialed in. The best BRRRRs aren’t found, they’re engineered.

      Happy to dive deeper anytime.


       Thanks Drago,

      I will have to learn what "tight scopes, draw schedules, and capital timing" are. I'm so green to business.

      0Reply
  • Zeke ListonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

    Hi Jeffrey, welcome to the Columbus market! I’ve been investing in Columbus since 2019, and Columbus is definitely more competitive than Toledo, but the growth and stability have worked well for me long term. 
    [email protected]614-665-5793
    Forge Real Estate Advisors535 Reviews
    View Page
    1Reply
  • Jimmy LieuBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2019 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

    Welcome to BP, Jeffrey, and you’re not crazy at all for hunting a clean BRRRR in today’s market, you just have to be very market-specific and realistic on rehab scope. Between Toledo and Columbus, your read is pretty accurate, Toledo can pencil better on pure rent-to-price, but Columbus wins big on long-term fundamentals and exit strength, which really matters when you’re BRRRRing and refinancing. Columbus has massive population and job growth right now with companies like Intel, Amazon, Google, Honda, Microsoft, LG, and others pouring billions into the area, and that demand supports both rents and appreciation. Even though prices are higher than Toledo, you can still find light cosmetic or light value-add deals in solid Class B pockets around $120k–180k that hit or get very close to the 1% rule once stabilized, especially if you buy right. A huge number of out-of-state investors are having success here because Ohio is very landlord friendly and Columbus offers a rare combo of cash flow plus strong appreciation potential. With your $200k–250k all-in budget, Columbus gives you a better chance to refi cleanly, sleep at night, and still see long-term upside. Happy to connect and answer any questions you have!
    [email protected]614-300-7535
    Jimmy Lieu, Red 1 Realty4.9120 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Jimmy Lieu:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

      Welcome to BP, Jeffrey, and you’re not crazy at all for hunting a clean BRRRR in today’s market, you just have to be very market-specific and realistic on rehab scope. Between Toledo and Columbus, your read is pretty accurate, Toledo can pencil better on pure rent-to-price, but Columbus wins big on long-term fundamentals and exit strength, which really matters when you’re BRRRRing and refinancing. Columbus has massive population and job growth right now with companies like Intel, Amazon, Google, Honda, Microsoft, LG, and others pouring billions into the area, and that demand supports both rents and appreciation. Even though prices are higher than Toledo, you can still find light cosmetic or light value-add deals in solid Class B pockets around $120k–180k that hit or get very close to the 1% rule once stabilized, especially if you buy right. A huge number of out-of-state investors are having success here because Ohio is very landlord friendly and Columbus offers a rare combo of cash flow plus strong appreciation potential. With your $200k–250k all-in budget, Columbus gives you a better chance to refi cleanly, sleep at night, and still see long-term upside. Happy to connect and answer any questions you have!

       Hi Jimmy,

      That sounds great!  I work in technology and I'm pretty familiar with those companies, but not where they are physically.  Would love to connect.

      0Reply
  • Nicholas L.Pro Member
    Flipper/Rehabber · Pittsburgh · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    7mo

    @Jeffrey B.

    totally fair.  and note that i didn't say don't start with OOS, i said don't start with OOS BRRRR. i'm trying to BRRRR locally, and it's exceptionally difficult. if you are going to really invest in a market and build a team, that's great.

    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Nicholas L.:

      @Jeffrey B.

      totally fair.  and note that i didn't say don't start with OOS, i said don't start with OOS BRRRR. i'm trying to BRRRR locally, and it's exceptionally difficult. if you are going to really invest in a market and build a team, that's great.


       Nicholas,

      Thanks for the clarification. I read that wrong from both you and Sam. Agreed not crazy about BRRRR OOS on my first deal, but I'm not sure about any other strategies to get my money out of the first property in today's market. I can save my nickles (since pennies are no longer made :)), for another downpayment, but that will take a few more years and I don't have time for a side hustle with my W2 and family. Good luck on your local BRRRR.

      0Reply
  • Drew SygitBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Royal Oak, MI · Member since 2012 · 12k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.


    You’re ALWAYS better off investing locally, where it’s easier to:

    • Learn the market
    • Network to find deals
    • Network to find contractors
    • Be more hands-on
    • Driveby property to keep tabs on it
    • Network to find a decent Property Management Company (PMC)

    Next best location is somewhere else you lived, where you have an existing network of family & friends to help you as accomplish the above list as needed.

    If you invest OOS, your biggest challenge won't be finding properties to meet your goals on paper, it’ll be successfully outsourcing all of the above.

    The biggest mistake we see OOS investors making in our market, over and over again, is not fully understanding Neighborhood/Property/Tenant Classes and how they impact your probability of success!

    They all run their ROI numbers assuming Class A results – when buying Class B, C & even D rentals.

    Then they’re shocked when their performance expectations aren't met😞

    If you choose to invest OOS, and have little to no landlord experience, we highly recommend targeting Class B Neighborhoods/Properties/Tenants. If you target Class C, you better be prepared emotionally & financially for plenty of challenges.

    You can find Class B properties in the Midwest to BRRRR, but it will take more digging and YOU will need to understand how to analyze & identify them - because a lot of agents, wholesalers, PMCs, etc. will try to sell you Class C or D misrepresented as Class B:

    • Many of them don't know/care what Class the properties are, so they're incompetent.
    • Others know exactly what they are doing, so should be labeled as crooks!
      EITHER WAY YOU LOSE!

    Why is Property Class so important for investors to understand and apply in their investing strategies?

    Because the Property Class dictates the Class of the tenant pool that the property will attract.

    The Tenant Class greatly impacts rental income stability and property maintenance/damage by tenants.

    Both Property Class and Tenant Class will affect what type of contractors, handymen and property management companies you should target and be willing to deal with a property.

    The Property Class will also impact the maintenance & renovations you do to, “Maintain to the Neighborhood”.

    Why is that important?

    Well, if you buy & renovate a property in Class D area to Class A standards, what Tenant Class will actually rent it?

    Or, if you put several Class D tenants in a Class A four-plex, what do you think will happen to the property?

    So, if you fail to apply the correct assumptions to a property, your expectations won’t be met, and it may even be a financial disaster.

    We use the following to rank Property Classes, in order of importance:

    • Property Tenant Pool: closely linked to location, but not always.
    • Property Location: closely linked to tenant pool, but not always.
    • Property Condition & Amenities: it’s important to, “Maintain to the Neighborhood.”

    Key metrics for each Property Class:

    Class A Properties:
    Tenant Pool: Majority of FICO scores 680+, no convictions/evictions in last 7 years.
    Tenant Default: 0-5% probability of eviction or early lease termination.
    Section 8: Class A rents are too high and won’t be approved.
    Vacancies: 5-10%, depending on market conditions.
    Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, 3-5 years for positive cashflow, but you get highest relative rent & value appreciation.

    Class B Properties:
    Tenant Pool: Majority of FICO scores 620-680, some blemishes, no convictions/evictions in last 5 years.
    Tenant Default    : 5-10% probability of eviction or early lease termination.
    Vacancies    : 10-15%, depending on market conditions.
    Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, 1-3 years for positive cashflow, balanced amounts of relative rent & value appreciation.
    Section 8: Class B rents are usually too high for the Section 8 program.

    Class C Properties:
    Tenant Pool: Majority of FICO scores 560-620, many blemishes, but should have no convictions/evictions in last 3 years. Verifying recent 2-years of rental history very important! Same for 2-years of job/income stability.
    Tenant Default: 10-20% probability of eviction or early lease termination.
    Section 8: Class C rents usually meet program requirements, proper screening still recommended.
    Vacancies: 10-20%, depending on market conditions and tenant screening.
    Cashflow vs Appreciation: Should cashflow immediately, at the lower end of relative rent & value appreciation.

    Class D Properties:
    Tenant Pool: Majority of FICO scores under 560, little to no good tradelines, lots of collections & chargeoffs, but should have no convictions/evictions in last 12 months. Verifying last 2-years of rental history and income/employment extremely important to find the “best of the worst”.
    Tenant Default: 20-30% probability of eviction or early lease termination.
    Section 8: Class D rents meet program requirements, often challenges to pass Section 8 inspection.
    Vacancies: 20%+, depending on market conditions and tenant screening.
    Cashflow vs Appreciation: Typically, all cashflow with little, maybe even negative, relative rent & value appreciation.

    Where did we get our FICO credit score information from?

    Check out this chart:

    FICO Score

    Pct of Population

    Default Probability

    800 or more

    13.00%

    1.00%

    750-799

    27.00%

    1.00%

    700-749

    18.00%

    4.40%

    650-699

    15.00%

    8.90%

    600-649

    12.00%

    15.80%

    550-599

    8.00%

    22.50%

    500-549

    5.00%

    28.40%

    Less than 499

    2.00%

    41.00%

    Source: Fair Isaac Company

    Make sure you understand the Class of properties you are looking at and the corresponding results to expect.

    Metro Detroit has 132 cities, the City of Detroit 183 Neighborhoods, which we’re analyzing and classifying. Check out the map on our website where we’ve made this all easy to follow.

    We can also share numerous examples of properties & portfolios we’ve assisted investors with!

    DM us if you’d like to discuss this logical approach in greater detail!

    Horror Stories from those that did NOT Understand What they were Buying:

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/48/topics/1137397-baltimore-a-path-to-never-ending-pain

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/432/topics/1231840-sell-at-a-loss-or-rent-at-a-loss

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/311/topics/840134-memphis-turnkey-tenant-turnover-costs

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/963/topics/1195280-experience-of-oos-investing-in-cleveland-after-15-years
    [email protected]248-209-6824
    Logical Property Management4.9451 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
  • Ken M.
    Investor · Get yourself trained before doing something inadvisable. · Member since 2024 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo
    Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

    Hi BP family,

    I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

    My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

    Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

    At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

    Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

    Your comment "I’ve never been to Ohio" and yet you are considering investing there? Have you thought about distance, snow, ice and broken pipes? Interesting. Have you thought about the hassles that out of state investing include and do you want to add miles and time zones to the equation ? My California investors opted to go "local" and invest in Phoenix. For good reason.

    Columbus is a nice place and all, I've been there a couple of times, but traveling to deal with owning a rental  . . . well, that's a lot of work.

    San Diego to Columbus 2,200 miles and 3 time zones
    San Diego to Las Vegas    332 miles and 1 time zone
    San Diego to Phoenix      355 miles and 1 time zone

    Well, if travel is your "thing", I 'd suggest investing where you can easily get to and travel to visit fun places like Hawaii or Orlando. Being a landlord is a business.   

    2Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Ken M.:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

      Your comment "I’ve never been to Ohio" and yet you are considering investing there? Have you thought about distance, snow, ice and broken pipes? Interesting. Have you thought about the hassles that out of state investing include and do you want to add miles and time zones to the equation ? My California investors opted to go "local" and invest in Phoenix. For good reason.

      Columbus is a nice place and all, I've been there a couple of times, but traveling to deal with owning a rental  . . . well, that's a lot of work.

      San Diego to Columbus 2,200 miles and 3 time zones
      San Diego to Las Vegas    332 miles and 1 time zone
      San Diego to Phoenix      355 miles and 1 time zone

      Well, if travel is your "thing", I 'd suggest investing where you can easily get to and travel to visit fun places like Hawaii or Orlando. Being a landlord is a business.   


       The median home price is well out of my range in Phoenix.  If I'm not mistaken, the home prices have been declining the past two years and the rents have been falling the past year.  The rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense to me.

      Ideally I would invest in Minnesota where I grew up and travel every quarter for work.  That market is more stable and I have contacts there, but again out of my price range.

      1Reply
    • Ken M.
      Investor · Get yourself trained before doing something inadvisable. · Member since 2024 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:
      Quote from @Ken M.:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

      Your comment "I’ve never been to Ohio" and yet you are considering investing there? Have you thought about distance, snow, ice and broken pipes? Interesting. Have you thought about the hassles that out of state investing include and do you want to add miles and time zones to the equation ? My California investors opted to go "local" and invest in Phoenix. For good reason.

      Columbus is a nice place and all, I've been there a couple of times, but traveling to deal with owning a rental  . . . well, that's a lot of work.

      San Diego to Columbus 2,200 miles and 3 time zones
      San Diego to Las Vegas    332 miles and 1 time zone
      San Diego to Phoenix      355 miles and 1 time zone

      Well, if travel is your "thing", I 'd suggest investing where you can easily get to and travel to visit fun places like Hawaii or Orlando. Being a landlord is a business.   


       The median home price is well out of my range in Phoenix.  If I'm not mistaken, the home prices have been declining the past two years and the rents have been falling the past year.  The rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense to me.

      Ideally I would invest in Minnesota where I grew up and travel every quarter for work.  That market is more stable and I have contacts there, but again out of my price range.

      Well, if you insist on using a bank's money and paying bank's fees and paying bank's interest rates, you're probably right.

      However, using creative finance and taking over the existing loan of the property you are buying, changes the whole order of things. I buy using Subject To and Wraps and Lease Options (ask if you aren't familiar with those terms or put them into Google for definitions)

      The $425,000 house I just bought in Phoenix, cost me $30,000 and I'm making about $70,000 in addition to getting my money back. I simply took over the loan of the sellers at 4.5% interest instead of the 6.9% the bank was "offering". Anybody can do these. They've been being done for decades, as @Don Konipol: has said, and he's an old "experienced" guy, a couple of years older than me. :-) There are a lot of people doing creative finance and getting rich doing so.

      There is no special requirement, other than learning you can, I suppose.
      1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Ken M.:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:
      Quote from @Ken M.:
      Quote from @Jeffrey B.:

      Hi BP family,

      I'm a new investor based in San Diego and actively looking to purchase my first long-term SFR using the BRRRR strategy. Ideally, I'm targeting a light-to-cosmetic rehab property in a Class B neighborhood. I realize this may feel like a bit of a unicorn in today's market, but as a first deal—especially investing out of state—I'm focused on minimizing risk as much as possible.

      My total budget is $200k–$250k all-in. I have approximately 20% down in cash and plan to leverage a HELOC on my primary residence to fund renovations.

      Market-wise, I’d love to invest in Minnesota, where I grew up, but current pricing there is outside my target range. The markets that interest me most right now are Toledo and Columbus, Ohio, due to the lower barrier to entry. I’ve never been to Ohio and don’t have local knowledge yet, but from my research, Columbus offers a larger population and solid population growth, though with higher median home prices and a lower rent-to-price ratio. Toledo, on the other hand, appears to offer stronger affordability, better rent-to-price ratios, and solid home price and rent growth.

      At this stage, my main goal is to start building relationships. I’d love to connect with local investors, agents, property managers, or anyone active in these markets who could potentially serve as boots on the ground or help me better understand the nuances of each area.

      Thanks in advance, and I appreciate any insights or connections you’re willing to share.

      Your comment "I’ve never been to Ohio" and yet you are considering investing there? Have you thought about distance, snow, ice and broken pipes? Interesting. Have you thought about the hassles that out of state investing include and do you want to add miles and time zones to the equation ? My California investors opted to go "local" and invest in Phoenix. For good reason.

      Columbus is a nice place and all, I've been there a couple of times, but traveling to deal with owning a rental  . . . well, that's a lot of work.

      San Diego to Columbus 2,200 miles and 3 time zones
      San Diego to Las Vegas    332 miles and 1 time zone
      San Diego to Phoenix      355 miles and 1 time zone

      Well, if travel is your "thing", I 'd suggest investing where you can easily get to and travel to visit fun places like Hawaii or Orlando. Being a landlord is a business.   


       The median home price is well out of my range in Phoenix.  If I'm not mistaken, the home prices have been declining the past two years and the rents have been falling the past year.  The rent-to-price ratio doesn't make sense to me.

      Ideally I would invest in Minnesota where I grew up and travel every quarter for work.  That market is more stable and I have contacts there, but again out of my price range.

      Well, if you insist on using a bank's money and paying bank's fees and paying bank's interest rates, you're probably right.

      However, using creative finance and taking over the existing loan of the property you are buying, changes the whole order of things. I buy using Subject To and Wraps and Lease Options (ask if you aren't familiar with those terms or put them into Google for definitions)

      The $425,000 house I just bought in Phoenix, cost me $30,000 and I'm making about $70,000 in addition to getting my money back. I simply took over the loan of the sellers at 4.5% interest instead of the 6.9% the bank was "offering". Anybody can do these. They've been being done for decades, as @Don Konipol: has said, and he's an old "experienced" guy, a couple of years older than me. :-) There are a lot of people doing creative finance and getting rich doing so.

      There is no special requirement, other than learning you can, I suppose.

       Ken that sounds amazing.  I'll keep that in mind.

      1Reply
  • Arman AhmedPro Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus Cleveland Dayton, OH · Member since 2024 · 2k+ posts · 908 votes
    7mo

    @Jeffrey B.

    Jeffrey, For a first out-of-state BRRRR, Toledo offers stronger cash flow and affordability, while Columbus gives growth and long-term appreciation. Focus on realistic ARVs, light rehabs, and having local support lined up. Start simple in B and C class neighborhoods near jobs and hospitals, that's where you'll see solid, reliable results and learn quickly what works on the ground.

    [email protected]614-418-6081
    1Reply
  • Patrick DruryBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH & Cleveland OH · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7mo

    @Jeffrey B. 
    If you are looking in Columbus, I recommend areas like Hilltop, Linden, Eastmoor/ Whitehall, and Franklinton. These are areas where you can cash flow in Columbus because the rent-to-price ratio is favorable. Out of these areas, Franklinton and Linden are seeing some of the most development. With things like the ONE Linden plan in Linden, which is a 50M plan to improve the neighborhood. Of that 50M, 25M was allocated for the construction of a new recreational faculty that has since been completed. Franklinton has been seeing lots of developments, like the completion of Gravity Phase 1 and Phases 2 and 3 on the way. As well as coffee shops like Bottoms Up Coffee, are moving in and small microbreweries like Brew Dog and Land Grant.

    [email protected]614-412-4565
    Reafco-555 Reviews
    View Page
    1Reply
    • Jeffrey B.
      OP
      New to Real Estate · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 34 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Patrick Drury:

      @Jeffrey B. 
      If you are looking in Columbus, I recommend areas like Hilltop, Linden, Eastmoor/ Whitehall, and Franklinton. These are areas where you can cash flow in Columbus because the rent-to-price ratio is favorable. Out of these areas, Franklinton and Linden are seeing some of the most development. With things like the ONE Linden plan in Linden, which is a 50M plan to improve the neighborhood. Of that 50M, 25M was allocated for the construction of a new recreational faculty that has since been completed. Franklinton has been seeing lots of developments, like the completion of Gravity Phase 1 and Phases 2 and 3 on the way. As well as coffee shops like Bottoms Up Coffee, are moving in and small microbreweries like Brew Dog and Land Grant.


       Noted areas.  Thanks!

      0Reply
  • Travis TimmonsPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Ellsworth, ME · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7mo

    I think you're going to get a better return from an index fund than you will investing out of state in a cheap market. I get the itch of wanting to get into real estate. I've invested locally and out of state and have been around here for a few years. Most out of state investors that buy cheap properties sell at a loss within 2-3 years. 

    Those that buy above the median home price in cheaper markets and focus on quality (renting to tenants with a 700+ credit score) are the ones that I have seen have the most success. They are more stable assets that appreciate in both value and rents and are easier to manage given the tenant pool. 

    3Reply
  • Scott AllenBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2020 · 449 posts · 471 votes
    7mo


    @Jeffrey B. Welcome to BiggerPockets! If you're looking for more cashflow, look at Toledo. If you want a mix of cashflow and appreciation, look into Columbus. 

    [email protected]614-698-1227
    Reafco - Columbus, OH
    WebsiteView Page
    2Reply
  • Gladimir Lobo
    Real Estate Broker · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2023 · 206 posts · 78 votes
    7mo

    Welcome to BP JB,

    1. Stay away from the so-called Investor Friendly Realtors, they are useless to investors, especially a new investor. They don’t invest and cannot add any value beyond opening lockboxes.

    2. There is no “B class” brrrr in a $250k budget for an OOS in Cleveland or Columbus.

    3. I have been doing brrrr for over 22 years in Cleveland, so trust and believe your best bet is a nice C-class rental in the burbs.

    Brrrr’s are for sharks. You may be getting in some deep waters, but you’re no shark.

    Check out Great Lakes REAI if you want to hear 1-3 again from other active local investors.

    Now, if you decide to jump in, keep my contact handy. I specialize in rescuing investors that are adventurous and bite on more than they can chew.

    Keep your head on a swivel. Good luck!

    1Reply
    • Sam McCormackBusiness Member
      Real Estate Agent · Cincinnati, OH/NKY · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 833 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Gladimir Lobo:

      Welcome to BP JB,

      1. Stay away from the so-called Investor Friendly Realtors, they are useless to investors, especially a new investor. They don’t invest and cannot add any value beyond opening lockboxes.

      2. There is no “B class” brrrr in a $250k budget for an OOS in Cleveland or Columbus.

      3. I have been doing brrrr for over 22 years in Cleveland, so trust and believe your best bet is a nice C-class rental in the burbs.

      Brrrr’s are for sharks. You may be getting in some deep waters, but you’re no shark.

      Check out Great Lakes REAI if you want to hear 1-3 again from other active local investors.

      Now, if you decide to jump in, keep my contact handy. I specialize in rescuing investors that are adventurous and bite on more than they can chew.

      Keep your head on a swivel. Good luck!


       Hey Galdimir, I am curious on your definition of an "Investor Friendly Realtor" that you talk about in your first point?

      [email protected]859-443-4952
      Sam McCormack Realtor
      View Page
      0Reply
  • David Stephens
    Member since 2025 · 29 posts · 13 votes
    7mo

    Hey @Jeffrey B. I'd agree with others in this thread, in that you'd ideally want to be closer. You can definitely get into something in Phoenix given your budget. You should reach out to @Jeremy Holden he's an investor/realtor in Phoenix who I'm sure would be willing to help you explore some options in your budget.

    1Reply
  • Min ZhangBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7mo

    Hey, Jeffrey! Welcome to BP and kudos for thinking through risk on your first out of state deal, that mindset alone puts you ahead of most people jumping in. 

    What you're describing such as light cosmetic, solid B area, BRRRR friendly numbers does exist in the Midwest, but I agree it's tighter than it was a few years ago. For a first remote deal, I've seen a lot of people underestimate how much that boots on the ground piece matters such as contractor discipline, PM communication, and realistic rehab scopes can make or break a BRRRR.

    If you're open to it, I'd focus less on picking the perfect market and more on building a strong local team first. Once that's in place, the deal flow and clarity tend to follow. Happy to swap notes or share what I've seen work and not work for first time out of state BRRRR investors.

    [email protected]614-412-2912
    Reafco.512 Reviews
    View Page
    1Reply
  • Gladimir Lobo
    Real Estate Broker · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2023 · 206 posts · 78 votes
    7mo

    You know Sam, license and a smile. Zero properties owned.

    Investor Friendly Realtor debacle explained: 

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/517/topics/1272671-5-mu...




    0Reply
    • Sam McCormackBusiness Member
      Real Estate Agent · Cincinnati, OH/NKY · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 833 votes
      7mo
      Quote from @Gladimir Lobo:

      You know Sam, license and a smile. Zero properties owned.

      Investor Friendly Realtor debacle explained: 

      https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/517/topics/1272671-5-mu...





       So not really "Investor Friendly Realtors", actually just "Realtor", without any investing experience. To an extent, I say be weary of. But I was there once, due to lack of financing. But yes ask the right questions

      [email protected]859-443-4952
      Sam McCormack Realtor
      View Page
      0Reply
    • Gladimir Lobo
      Real Estate Broker · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2023 · 206 posts · 78 votes
      7mo

      Dude, that’s a lot of conjunctions.

      Realtors who do not invest calling themselves Investor Friendly Realtors do so at the expense of their investor clients while adding no value. Simply put, it’s malpractice.

      1Reply
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.
Log InJoin for Free