Newbies: investing is not rocket science - don't let the gurus tell you otherwise

[Marcus Auerbach]

Alright, I just read a post from a guru pitching services on BP. I did not want to respond with what I really think, but let me tell you my story here instead.

In 2007 I went to a RichDad seminar: after the free Thursday night pitch, I signed up for the $300 weekend class. Sitting in a hotel conference room just outside of Milwaukee with probably 300 people I got a tour of every possible way how to make money in real estate followed by the obligatory pictures of checks cashed to proof the point. At the end of the weekend we were asked to sign up for courses. I believe about a dozen different ones, each one for $8,000. We were asked to select at least 6 and put them on a credit card - we would make the money back in no time, so the promise.

A few weeks later I got a call asking me why I did not sign up. And if I would be interested in a one year personal coaching for $3,500. That sounded more reasonable, so I signed up. Books came in the mail and my coach scheduled a (initailly) weekly call. I had material to study, home work to do, some field research and then to present to my coach every week. I asked my coach how many deals she had done and I always got a vague answer. I have to say the curriculum was very comprehensive, they covered everything from sandwich lease options to sub2. Felt like a college education and after you are done and get your first job, you realize you have to start learning all over again.

Eventually I bought my first duplex. I still own it, I think mostly for nostalgic reasons. A year later I had the confidence to buy another one and after that it was on. Fast forward in 2015 I quit my W2. Looking back I would say even though the course was interesting, it was not necessary and I took a gigantic detour, lost a year (with increadible buying opportunities - even though at the time it did not look like this) and could have bought a property instead. Buying a rental property and renting it out is not that hard. 

If you are new to this, here is what I want to tell you: buying rental properties is not complicated at it's core. Don't let anyone tell you different. People have done this literally for thousands of years. Read a couple books (Brandon Turner's are very step by step), find someone who has been doing this for a while and can guide you and probably most importantly: buy a quality property. You will never have a problem finding quality tenants. 90% of investors I have every met, who failed or gave up, had one thing in common: they bought in the hood. 

Nobody has ever regreted buying a quality property. Don't worry too much about how much the water bill is going to be exactly; if the bank is willing to finance your deal, you'll be good. The business model makes it actually really hard to really screw up in a big way. You won't go bankrupt over buying a duplex. I have bought plenty of bad deals: I overpaid, rehab ran 30k over budget, appraisal comes back low, contractors from hell, you name it - but real estate has that thing, a few years later it does not even matter anymore, even if you overpaid for the property.

Get comfortable not knowing everything before you start. You will figure things out when you have to. BP nation is here to help. And fellow local investors at a local REIA are always happy to help if you need advice. After doing this for 15 years I am still learning new tricks. You have to know it takes effort and a lot of time, play the long game, but it's totally worth it. Don't expect it to be easy or to make you rich quick. The years of buying cashflow with zero money are also over. We are back to normal: you will actually need some money to invest and a W2 to qualify for a loan. But plenty of investors have built their portfolio in similar markets. In the 80s interest rates used to be double of what they are today and people still succeeded.

Get started. Don't let anyone tell you you need to buy more guru courses before you are ready!

[John Underwood]

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Quote from @Brandon Rich:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Amen Marcus!!!

When I hear how much people are spending on education with gurus or even 'local' coaches, it breaks my heart--that money could've been a downpayment on a house.

If one is committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars whether upfront or splitting a minimum amount of deals, it's one of the worst mistakes that you can make in my opinion...

In a world where information is at our fingertips and there is a blueprint that exists for everything, you'd be better off investing in courses on overcoming fear of change, lack of motivation, etc. John Assaraf is a great guy to watch on YouTube about this concept. 

Exactly my thoughts on how that capital could have been used for a downpayment on REI. If a new investor has that kind of money, then why doesn't the "coach" offer a JV of sorts and actually teach a new investor a thing or two while being hands on.. It's anyone's guess lol.

I've never known anyone to buy into the RichDad thing, but sounds like they do just enough to legally not be a scam, but it pretty much is a scam IMO. Real estate is by nature a very local business. Local REIA's, like gareia.com, have a yearly membership for only 200/year and you will meet plenty of people there that are happy to help guide new investors. They want you to succeed because they need you to succeed - It's a mutual thing in this business.

My journey in real estate began with dropping 25k on FortuneBuilders, which is another guru course. They seem to have gone dark somewhat--I think after one of the other guru programs got sued. I compare it to college vs on the job training...because they will show you the basics but to actually take action upon them, you need to learn locally and on the job. That's why most of the people never take off that sign up for Guru programs, because they don't give you actual steps which is how most people learn--you learn the blueprint and execute the steps. Giving the steps would really be a liability seeing as they don't know laws or how things work in individual states. I will say that FortuneBuilders gave me the kick in the a** I needed to move forward--that's what 25k of debt will do to a person :) ...but ironically everything I really learned was by networking locally and doing deals.  I heard our REIA offers training but require a 50% split on a minimum amount of deals which some have told me were 10 so in my opinion, it actually would cost more than a guru program but all REIAs are independent. I'm starting to see that people who aggressively sell big ticket coaching are relying on their 'students' to get them deals. 

I laugh when people tell others to go to their REIA. They will only find lenders locally. Total BS. People I work with everyday are getting funded. One lender even "qualifies" people into 5% down loans. So again I laugh at the REIA thing.

I get that's your opinion and experience.
My experience is that I belong to a great local REIA. It's a nonprofit. It focuses on education.
People do deals with each and there are people who loan money from their SDIRA's.
I have bought properties from people in my REIA. We have national speakers cone to out REIA and teach on RE topics.
I wouldn't be as far in RE if I had not joined my REIA 10 years ago. 
It's also great to surround yourself with like minded people to keep you on the correct path.

[Jay Hinrichs]

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Quote from @Brandon Rich:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Amen Marcus!!!

When I hear how much people are spending on education with gurus or even 'local' coaches, it breaks my heart--that money could've been a downpayment on a house.

If one is committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars whether upfront or splitting a minimum amount of deals, it's one of the worst mistakes that you can make in my opinion...

In a world where information is at our fingertips and there is a blueprint that exists for everything, you'd be better off investing in courses on overcoming fear of change, lack of motivation, etc. John Assaraf is a great guy to watch on YouTube about this concept. 

Exactly my thoughts on how that capital could have been used for a downpayment on REI. If a new investor has that kind of money, then why doesn't the "coach" offer a JV of sorts and actually teach a new investor a thing or two while being hands on.. It's anyone's guess lol.

I've never known anyone to buy into the RichDad thing, but sounds like they do just enough to legally not be a scam, but it pretty much is a scam IMO. Real estate is by nature a very local business. Local REIA's, like gareia.com, have a yearly membership for only 200/year and you will meet plenty of people there that are happy to help guide new investors. They want you to succeed because they need you to succeed - It's a mutual thing in this business.

My journey in real estate began with dropping 25k on FortuneBuilders, which is another guru course. They seem to have gone dark somewhat--I think after one of the other guru programs got sued. I compare it to college vs on the job training...because they will show you the basics but to actually take action upon them, you need to learn locally and on the job. That's why most of the people never take off that sign up for Guru programs, because they don't give you actual steps which is how most people learn--you learn the blueprint and execute the steps. Giving the steps would really be a liability seeing as they don't know laws or how things work in individual states. I will say that FortuneBuilders gave me the kick in the a** I needed to move forward--that's what 25k of debt will do to a person :) ...but ironically everything I really learned was by networking locally and doing deals.  I heard our REIA offers training but require a 50% split on a minimum amount of deals which some have told me were 10 so in my opinion, it actually would cost more than a guru program but all REIAs are independent. I'm starting to see that people who aggressively sell big ticket coaching are relying on their 'students' to get them deals. 

I laugh when people tell others to go to their REIA. They will only find lenders locally. Total BS. People I work with everyday are getting funded. One lender even "qualifies" people into 5% down loans. So again I laugh at the REIA thing.

I get that's your opinion and experience.
My experience is that I belong to a great local REIA. It's a nonprofit. It focuses on education.
People do deals with each and there are people who loan money from their SDIRA's.
I have bought properties from people in my REIA. We have national speakers cone to out REIA and teach on RE topics.
I wouldn't be as far in RE if I had not joined my REIA 10 years ago. 
It's also great to surround yourself with like minded people to keep you on the correct path.

One thing I have learned being a guest speaker at many REIAs around the country is there can be a vast difference in approach and monetary goals for those running them.  IE kick backs Vs no kick backs.

[John Underwood]

Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Quote from @Brandon Rich:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Amen Marcus!!!

When I hear how much people are spending on education with gurus or even 'local' coaches, it breaks my heart--that money could've been a downpayment on a house.

If one is committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars whether upfront or splitting a minimum amount of deals, it's one of the worst mistakes that you can make in my opinion...

In a world where information is at our fingertips and there is a blueprint that exists for everything, you'd be better off investing in courses on overcoming fear of change, lack of motivation, etc. John Assaraf is a great guy to watch on YouTube about this concept. 

Exactly my thoughts on how that capital could have been used for a downpayment on REI. If a new investor has that kind of money, then why doesn't the "coach" offer a JV of sorts and actually teach a new investor a thing or two while being hands on.. It's anyone's guess lol.

I've never known anyone to buy into the RichDad thing, but sounds like they do just enough to legally not be a scam, but it pretty much is a scam IMO. Real estate is by nature a very local business. Local REIA's, like gareia.com, have a yearly membership for only 200/year and you will meet plenty of people there that are happy to help guide new investors. They want you to succeed because they need you to succeed - It's a mutual thing in this business.

My journey in real estate began with dropping 25k on FortuneBuilders, which is another guru course. They seem to have gone dark somewhat--I think after one of the other guru programs got sued. I compare it to college vs on the job training...because they will show you the basics but to actually take action upon them, you need to learn locally and on the job. That's why most of the people never take off that sign up for Guru programs, because they don't give you actual steps which is how most people learn--you learn the blueprint and execute the steps. Giving the steps would really be a liability seeing as they don't know laws or how things work in individual states. I will say that FortuneBuilders gave me the kick in the a** I needed to move forward--that's what 25k of debt will do to a person :) ...but ironically everything I really learned was by networking locally and doing deals.  I heard our REIA offers training but require a 50% split on a minimum amount of deals which some have told me were 10 so in my opinion, it actually would cost more than a guru program but all REIAs are independent. I'm starting to see that people who aggressively sell big ticket coaching are relying on their 'students' to get them deals. 

I laugh when people tell others to go to their REIA. They will only find lenders locally. Total BS. People I work with everyday are getting funded. One lender even "qualifies" people into 5% down loans. So again I laugh at the REIA thing.

I get that's your opinion and experience.
My experience is that I belong to a great local REIA. It's a nonprofit. It focuses on education.
People do deals with each and there are people who loan money from their SDIRA's.
I have bought properties from people in my REIA. We have national speakers cone to out REIA and teach on RE topics.
I wouldn't be as far in RE if I had not joined my REIA 10 years ago. 
It's also great to surround yourself with like minded people to keep you on the correct path.

One thing I have learned being a guest speaker at many REIAs around the country is there can be a vast difference in approach and monetary goals for those running them.  IE kick backs Vs no kick backs.

What topics do you teach?
Do you have products you sell?

[Jay Hinrichs]

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Quote from @Brandon Rich:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Amen Marcus!!!

When I hear how much people are spending on education with gurus or even 'local' coaches, it breaks my heart--that money could've been a downpayment on a house.

If one is committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars whether upfront or splitting a minimum amount of deals, it's one of the worst mistakes that you can make in my opinion...

In a world where information is at our fingertips and there is a blueprint that exists for everything, you'd be better off investing in courses on overcoming fear of change, lack of motivation, etc. John Assaraf is a great guy to watch on YouTube about this concept. 

Exactly my thoughts on how that capital could have been used for a downpayment on REI. If a new investor has that kind of money, then why doesn't the "coach" offer a JV of sorts and actually teach a new investor a thing or two while being hands on.. It's anyone's guess lol.

I've never known anyone to buy into the RichDad thing, but sounds like they do just enough to legally not be a scam, but it pretty much is a scam IMO. Real estate is by nature a very local business. Local REIA's, like gareia.com, have a yearly membership for only 200/year and you will meet plenty of people there that are happy to help guide new investors. They want you to succeed because they need you to succeed - It's a mutual thing in this business.

My journey in real estate began with dropping 25k on FortuneBuilders, which is another guru course. They seem to have gone dark somewhat--I think after one of the other guru programs got sued. I compare it to college vs on the job training...because they will show you the basics but to actually take action upon them, you need to learn locally and on the job. That's why most of the people never take off that sign up for Guru programs, because they don't give you actual steps which is how most people learn--you learn the blueprint and execute the steps. Giving the steps would really be a liability seeing as they don't know laws or how things work in individual states. I will say that FortuneBuilders gave me the kick in the a** I needed to move forward--that's what 25k of debt will do to a person :) ...but ironically everything I really learned was by networking locally and doing deals.  I heard our REIA offers training but require a 50% split on a minimum amount of deals which some have told me were 10 so in my opinion, it actually would cost more than a guru program but all REIAs are independent. I'm starting to see that people who aggressively sell big ticket coaching are relying on their 'students' to get them deals. 

I laugh when people tell others to go to their REIA. They will only find lenders locally. Total BS. People I work with everyday are getting funded. One lender even "qualifies" people into 5% down loans. So again I laugh at the REIA thing.

I get that's your opinion and experience.
My experience is that I belong to a great local REIA. It's a nonprofit. It focuses on education.
People do deals with each and there are people who loan money from their SDIRA's.
I have bought properties from people in my REIA. We have national speakers cone to out REIA and teach on RE topics.
I wouldn't be as far in RE if I had not joined my REIA 10 years ago. 
It's also great to surround yourself with like minded people to keep you on the correct path.

One thing I have learned being a guest speaker at many REIAs around the country is there can be a vast difference in approach and monetary goals for those running them.  IE kick backs Vs no kick backs.

What topics do you teach?
Do you have products you sell?

I make presentations on benefits of land in the path of progress and show some of my deals / I go through the benefits of long term timberland ownership and I talk about land development and building  new construction And of course how to be a PML / HML as an individual or in their IRA.
You know every thing but how to be a land lord or buy rentals.. I leave that to the rest of the folks and of course I want nothing to do with wholesaling.

I do not have any thing I charge for although I do some consulting one on one and that I do charge for my time but its as I state one on one.. I get/got hammered all the time on BP to mentor etc as I am sure you do with your genius tax sale plays and to weed out the tire kickers I find those that are serious are Ok paying for a little bit of my time for one on one.  I dont do much of it maybe once a month or so.. But its better than just saying no to each person.. And when I started the heroshome.org charity a few years ago on BP.. I traded the consultations for donations to the charity myself and a few other BP members put together and we were successful raised 200k And gave a home away to a Hero in Memphis totally free to them.

What I see happening with the local REIA here in Portland is kickbacks and bringing in old Tired guys/gals selling programs there they put together 20 years ago.. so not to keen on our local one.

[Jay Hinrichs]

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

Quote from @John Underwood:

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Quote from @Brandon Rich:

Quote from @Rebecca Knox:

Amen Marcus!!!

When I hear how much people are spending on education with gurus or even 'local' coaches, it breaks my heart--that money could've been a downpayment on a house.

If one is committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars whether upfront or splitting a minimum amount of deals, it's one of the worst mistakes that you can make in my opinion...

In a world where information is at our fingertips and there is a blueprint that exists for everything, you'd be better off investing in courses on overcoming fear of change, lack of motivation, etc. John Assaraf is a great guy to watch on YouTube about this concept. 

Exactly my thoughts on how that capital could have been used for a downpayment on REI. If a new investor has that kind of money, then why doesn't the "coach" offer a JV of sorts and actually teach a new investor a thing or two while being hands on.. It's anyone's guess lol.

I've never known anyone to buy into the RichDad thing, but sounds like they do just enough to legally not be a scam, but it pretty much is a scam IMO. Real estate is by nature a very local business. Local REIA's, like gareia.com, have a yearly membership for only 200/year and you will meet plenty of people there that are happy to help guide new investors. They want you to succeed because they need you to succeed - It's a mutual thing in this business.

My journey in real estate began with dropping 25k on FortuneBuilders, which is another guru course. They seem to have gone dark somewhat--I think after one of the other guru programs got sued. I compare it to college vs on the job training...because they will show you the basics but to actually take action upon them, you need to learn locally and on the job. That's why most of the people never take off that sign up for Guru programs, because they don't give you actual steps which is how most people learn--you learn the blueprint and execute the steps. Giving the steps would really be a liability seeing as they don't know laws or how things work in individual states. I will say that FortuneBuilders gave me the kick in the a** I needed to move forward--that's what 25k of debt will do to a person :) ...but ironically everything I really learned was by networking locally and doing deals.  I heard our REIA offers training but require a 50% split on a minimum amount of deals which some have told me were 10 so in my opinion, it actually would cost more than a guru program but all REIAs are independent. I'm starting to see that people who aggressively sell big ticket coaching are relying on their 'students' to get them deals. 

I laugh when people tell others to go to their REIA. They will only find lenders locally. Total BS. People I work with everyday are getting funded. One lender even "qualifies" people into 5% down loans. So again I laugh at the REIA thing.

I get that's your opinion and experience.
My experience is that I belong to a great local REIA. It's a nonprofit. It focuses on education.
People do deals with each and there are people who loan money from their SDIRA's.
I have bought properties from people in my REIA. We have national speakers cone to out REIA and teach on RE topics.
I wouldn't be as far in RE if I had not joined my REIA 10 years ago. 
It's also great to surround yourself with like minded people to keep you on the correct path.

One thing I have learned being a guest speaker at many REIAs around the country is there can be a vast difference in approach and monetary goals for those running them.  IE kick backs Vs no kick backs.

What topics do you teach?
Do you have products you sell?

John on my consulting stuff I have also added how to do sub 2 and wraps.. safely !!!!

[Chris Seveney]

We reached out to some REIA groups to speak and many first question they ask is "what's our kickback?"

I was like - I am not selling anything I just want to provide some education for free.

Response: no thanks we only bring on people who have something to sell and give us a kickback

One was up I think in New England where the guy was a complete POS and that was confirmed based on reviews

[Gino Barbaro]

@Marcus Auerbach

I had a similar experience. I do have to say I would not be where I am without investing in education, from buying multifamily, to scaling, to building a brand. These are all skills that can be learned, but, if you find the right mentor, you will save a ton of time, and mistakes

Gino

[Guy Gimenez]

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Yep. Gurus! 

 Stealing this...but I'll give you credit. This is beautiful. 

[Nate Marshall]

Quote from @Guy Gimenez:

Quote from @Nate Marshall:

Yep. Gurus! 

 Stealing this...but I'll give you credit. This is beautiful. 

 I stole it. I think it was some car shark guru! 

[Diane Chapman]

Thanks for the advice! Much appreciated!