35 Replies

The website screams SCAM to me, just from a five second glance. It may be a legit lender, however, they claim to be BBB accredited, but the BBB has no record of them on their site, under any permutation of Flip Funding (including their URL).

Also, this is in their privacy policy regarding their use of your info:

  • Internal record keeping.
  • We may use the information to contact you with additional business services
  • We may use the information to improve our products and services.
  • We may periodically send promotional emails about new products, special offers or other information which we think you may find interesting using the email address which you have provided.
  • From time to time, we may also use your information to contact you for market research purposes. We may contact you by email, phone, fax or mail. We may use the information to customize the website according to your interests.

There is also a logo for "WCAP Financial Services" on their page, a business that isn't BBB accredited either. Based solely on their deceitful BBB "accreditation", I wouldn't use them.  

It would have to be the reverse of a Ponzi scheme.  In a ponzi, you give your $ to the scammer.  In this, they are apparently offering $ to you, at 0% interest.  Hhhmm.

The BBB icon link takes you to reviews for Seed Consulting aka Seed Capital.  The reviews appear to be positive.

I don't see enough to think it's a scam, but it sounds "too good to be true" which usually mean "good chance to get screwed".  But who knows - this could be legit.

@Gary Freidman how did you find these guys?

this company is the same as seed capital. Essentially what they do is sign you up for a lot of credit cards and charge you a very large fee to do that. Here's a link to a review from customer that got burned . 

this HTML class. Value is http://wcap-financia

I just got an email from WCAP Financial Services stating that I've been pre-approved for 80-100k in funding....interesting since I've never applied to them. Doing a search on them brought me to this thread. I've got a good scam nose, too.

they contacted me saying basically the same thing. Banks do these things the way they do it for a reason... If it were legit they'd require you to provide income verification, require proof of what your going to use the money on... Not for me. 

Originally posted by @Rudy Villarreal :

this company is the same as seed capital. Essentially what they do is sign you up for a lot of credit cards and charge you a very large fee to do that. Here's a link to a review from customer that got burned . 

this HTML class. Value is http://wcap-financia

 I agree with you! That is exactly what they did to us and I do not recommend them. They are also known as WCAP Financial 

Thank you all for caring enough about this platform and the community to post this information.  I am new to the business and to bigger pockets, but so far really appreciate what I see.

Thanks for all the advice and opinions on this topic. BiggerPockers has proven time and time again to be the best place to be for information on investing. I always see positive encouragement and helpful investors offering advice. 

Glad to be a part of this community. 

Flip 4 Funding, I also spoke to one of their reps, they have set up cool facebook advertisement and ask for permission to call you, setting up a meeting time online. Nice approach from marketing stand point. They offer unsecured loan, based on your credit score, those with bankruptcy do not qualify, basically they will negotiate several "lines of credit" they said, actually I believe they will apply for credit cards on your name, to accumulate a total of average 80K - 100K in approved credit. They were specific about "multiple" lines of credit, meaning multiple credit cards on your name. They tangle the presentation a bit, offering "no points" and "no pre-payment penalty". Of course, credit cards never charge a pre-payment penalty and do not add points. They did not mention if there is a yearly maintenance fee to keep each "line" open, so be aware, if this is how you pursue to fund a deal, get all details up-front. Of course, 0% introductory rate for 12 to 18 months is then achievable, not a scam, they seem to be credit cards facilitators, they thing is they charge a flat fee of abt 5K to 9K, so you do the interest rate math you will pay for your loan.... pretty high compared to conventional financing, lines of credit. They promise they charge their fee as a one time fee, and that in 12 or 18 months they help you to re-negotiate your "lines of credit" to transfer to a second round of funding, meaning they will shoot for balance transfers if you have not paid your balance in full yet. Of course, if for any reason balances cannot be transferred, they said after 12-18 months the rate could be anywhere between 8%-11% . They did not mention what type of legal contract they would use to at least secure their terms. The part that still leaves me wondering is how can they offer cash for flipping, I mean, any credit card company will immediately charge an interest rate for cash advances, so there goes the 0% promise out the window....funny enough, they mentioned you can access your "lines of credit" in different ways, credit cards, checks, cash. These guys are creative for sure, but I don't think this type of funding is for me. If anyone has had an experience getting the funding, please share your comments.

I actually met with one of their rep in person at San Diego investors Expo by Think Realty. Bo Winder talk to me about  unsecured line of credit. He made me go through Creditvav.com to check my own credit and I was "approved " within min for 100K. When I start asking him questions about, he promised to give me copy of the contract,but when I come back after breakout sessions, he and his assistant was gone... For past 4 days I have been trying to reach them but none reply...Now I feel that it is a good that this is happen. I looked them up on BBB and just last month there is a complain about them and this person explained in detail what they did to her. 

My next question is, Do any of you know some legitimize company who land money this way and who we can trust? I need it to rehab my investments that I am buying now. Please advice. 

I've been working with Patch of Land and they seem totally legit, but I haven't closed yet. Seed capital seems like a scam. I'll keep the community posted on my Patch of Land experience!

Hello and welcome to BP!  Do not do business with an  unexperienced person who is not just an overnight business for crooked people and ignorant people.  Watch out for people who are only interested in ripping you off and making emotional sales.   I do not have any recent activity to refer you to an honest company because of my medical condition keeps me home.  You have reminded me that this is for honest people and has turned into a company business that is full of crooks who will do just about anything to take your hard earned money..  That is probably the main reason I never got into doing something that is filled with dishonest people are in this business to take advantage of others.

Eventhough I was a broker for about 30 years in Dallas Texas which is full of dishonest people.  To hell are those of us were grown up to believe in honesty and appreciate that but in this country you always have to remember that this country is full of people that get by in their life by stealing from other people and do not believe in hard work.  Maybe it is because I am 60 years old that I write this way  but I believe there many crooks out there and you have to be aware of them no matter what you do.  I believe that they are after real estate people because three is much money there.  Getting a good lender from a referral is important.  Please treat me with care and understand that this is not a personal thing, and that you just set me off.

Good luck to you!

Make sure that you need the money bad enough and that this is your only option. They can deliver the money they promise, but it is extremely damaging to your personal credit and can interfere with your finances. It actual cash comes to you a little bit at a time also, which limits your plans on using it. I will spare the time to write about the fees that were not in the contract; however they DID make that right by refunding some of the upfront “consulting fee”. In short… You are paying them to open up several credit cards in your name. They told me 3-5 cards. However, it ended up being SEVEN cards. They are then just coaching you how to do cash advances and balance transfers from card-to-you and card-to-card in order to get cash. These seven credit cards caused my credit score to go from the high 700’s to the mid 500’s. This triggered a negative domino effect of other issues within my personal and business finances. My own long time credit card canceled me because I was now considered a credit risk. I used that cash reward card for everything for close to 10 years, and I paid the balance to zero every month. However, that was the first thing that was taken from me and began a crash. The seven credit cards and damage to my credit then went on to interfere with my long time business line of credit. WCAP/funding4flipping/seed capital did try to help out by “coaching” me how to repair damage. They try to say that your credit score will even come up higher when all over. I went through it all. I ended up having to reach out to a real, private hard money lender for the cash to bail myself out of the credit card mess. To add to that, I had to deal with higher percentages on the true lender, because of the poor credit score that the funding 4 flipping program created. However, when all said and done, my credit score never bounced back up. Now, most recently… some of the credit cards or “bank cards” that they opened up in my name are now reducing the limit, because I have too many credit cards (all cards that this program opened in my name). So now, the amount of cash (which is really just credit limits) is less than what they said. And because these credit card companies are reducing the credit limit…it throws of the balance to limit ratio…causing my score to drop again. If nothing else, at least understand what is happening with this “lender”. You are paying them a consulting fee to open up however many 0% credit cards it takes to reach the amount they tell you. That is how they tell you it is a “0% loan”. It is not a cash loan. These are your normal credit cards. And this company is getting you the cash by balance transfers, credit withdraws, and the % fees that goes along with each transaction. Also, know that these funds are not accessed immediately. The cash trickles in due to different credit card company policies. Some of these cards only allow certain dollar amounts at a time, and they only allow one transfer every so often. So you do not get the amount you need or promised all at one time. This program did nothing for me. It actually caused a chain of events that really destroyed a lot of my personal finances. I am still digging out of it and will be for a long time. Maybe in certain situations, this program would work. It would only be those where you didn’t need all of the money right away for a purchase and where you didn’t worry about the damage that all those credit cards will do. There are plenty of private hard money lenders out there wanting to lend money on good investment deals. You may pay a little more for them, but there is no damage done, they don’t affect your credit and personal finances, and you get the money you need when you need it. BE CAREFUL AND KNOW WHAT THIS PROGRAM REALLY DOES. 

Thanks so much family. I smelled a scam when I spoke with the rep today. Money to loan at 0% interest, what a bargain, lol. I asked a few key questions and he cut the presentation short. I am so glad that you all confirmed my suspiciouns.

I have a great credit score and have cash reserves but was curious about his financial fairy tale.

My dad, who is a hard money lender, wondered why anyone would even consider entertaining such a ludicrous propositition. There is no such thing as a free lunch. 

Thanks once again.

This has all been so interesting! I am a realtor in Orlando and have been in business for 22 years and work strictly by referral only. I love what I do and I do it because I want to not because I have to or I need the funds. The majority of my clients are first time home buyers. I really pride myself in taking good care of my clients, by not rushing them and always making sure they get all the information they need before making a decision which is why I almost always receive referrals.  I was recently contacted by a former client of mine because she attended a seminar with WCAP and signed up with them by giving them a credit card to charge $500 for signing up but before the 3 day right to cancel expired she wanted to ask me about them and if they were legit she wanted to use me as her realtor to help identify properties to flip and then she forwarded to me the email they had sent her which stated they were ready to get started. I told her I smelled a rat but I did all my research and got back to her and I told her to RUN away from these people and RUN fast! I advised her to call them and cancel the signup fee before they could charge her because in my opinion they were not legit. I promptly referred her to this site as well as a couple of others I had found and the BBB site with several really awful reviews and details. Well, would you believe that after she called them and told them upon the advice of her realtor she no longer wished to do business with them, they asked her for my info (which was fine) then I received 2 phone calls at 4:02pm and 5:30pm from a Salt Lake City Utah number by a woman who wanted to speak with me to explain that they are not conducting business the way I described to my client and I had been misinformed and she would like the opportunity to explain to me who they are and what they do. I did not respond to her either time. Guess what happened next?!! I received a nasty text message at 8:00 pm from a guy claiming to be a supervisor and I will retype it exactly as it is on my phone errors included: "Hello Valerie, this is Arno, I am a supervisor here at WCAP. As a disclosure, this is monitored by our attorney as well. You comments constitute defamation. If we lose a sale as a result of your inaccurate accusations we will be forced take this to the next level. We are not and have never been Seed Capital. That is an entirely different entity. We have never changed names since we started the company. Feel free to reply to this message to get your information from another source besides the internet. Again, if we lose the sale we will take this as defamation and this might escalate."

Now ain't that a trip!! I couldn't stop laughing! They actually threatened me for telling my client the truth!!! Sounds like a really desperate scam artist to me for sure so he just proved my point!! STAY AWAY FROM THESE PEOPLE!!

WOW!!!.....I just got off the phone with WCAP Financial a.k.a Funding for Flipping…..I have heard some BS stories and lines in my 30years, but this company.....whew.....I mean come on.....I was born at night but not LAST NIGHT. As a seasoned NYer we can spot BS light-years away. We ALL have heard taking out credit cards and they provide a 0% but after the grace period then the 18.5% interest rate comes into play. Now imagine you do with MULTIPLE credit cards. Now take 10-20kon each card and say it is 5 cards….Now you are obligated at 18.5% interest rate at 100k….rarely will any RE investor pay off that kind of debt within 1 year grace period working on multiple projects. Why would even consider 18.5% interest rate?....The 0% is the hook for unsuspecting RE investors, especially new ones. Do yourself a favor cultivate relationships on BiggerPockets with financial people who provide you with REALISTIC and manageable terms. By the way I do not see WCAP Financial as a member on BP. He kept pulling out his BBB rating like a gun….LMAO!!! Well guess what If I pay 450 for a year’s membership and get a few questionable endorsements only after 3 years in business …..I would get an A+ too…… My gut is usually correct and this has the smell of a scam that will wreck your credit rating based on credit cards……Borrow from legitimate financial people who have been in business for at least 10 years, there is no free lunch.

Account Closed I have read some of your other posts relating to credit cards, and I just have to ask, have you worked in the industry before? Do you mind if I quote your overview from one of your recent posts? I think it will be very valuable  information to be said here!