Landlord · Dallas, TX · Member since 2012 · 505 posts · 34 votes
As the topic states, I received an angry call today off one of my yellow letters. The individual stated if they ever receive a yellow letter from them again they will seek legal action. I returned the call and was able to diffuse the situation.
But my question is, if someone were to press charges for yellow letter solicitation, would they have a leg to stand on? I just told the individual its just like any other ad you receive, if you get an ad from direct TV and dont want to purchase their services you just throw the letter away.
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
Don't let it get to you. What charges would they be pressing, exactly? If they ask you to stop, and you continue, there might be harassment. I don't know about where you are, but I've yet to see anyone fork over the $435 filing fee for my county's superior court, plus attorney hours because they got a letter asking if their property was for sale. Yawn.
To be fair, I think the yellow letter is obnoxious, and smacks of mass marketing. I don't like getting them so I don't send them. I can imagine asking someone not to send any more. But even tasteful letters will generate anger or frustration. All you can do is say they are off the list and sorry for the inconvenience.
I don't get many angry calls, but yesterday I got an email from someone who had gotten my letter and was writing to tell me he figured out what I was. He said, and I quote: "You are one of those corporations' agent who are sucking blood out of middle class...shame on you Ms Republican." He kind of missed the mark, at least on the corporate, agent and Republican part. We got a good laugh out of that one. I thanked him for that, from the bottom of my bleeding-heart-liberal, registered Democratic heart.
Rental Property Investor · Mercer Island, WA · Member since 2008 · 22k+ posts · 14k+ votes
13y
People threaten to sue all the time. Doesn't mean they have a case.
The people you're mailing too may well have some reason they're upset. You're poking a stick at whatever's already upsetting them. Some are going to react angrily.
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
Don't let it get to you. What charges would they be pressing, exactly? If they ask you to stop, and you continue, there might be harassment. I don't know about where you are, but I've yet to see anyone fork over the $435 filing fee for my county's superior court, plus attorney hours because they got a letter asking if their property was for sale. Yawn.
To be fair, I think the yellow letter is obnoxious, and smacks of mass marketing. I don't like getting them so I don't send them. I can imagine asking someone not to send any more. But even tasteful letters will generate anger or frustration. All you can do is say they are off the list and sorry for the inconvenience.
I don't get many angry calls, but yesterday I got an email from someone who had gotten my letter and was writing to tell me he figured out what I was. He said, and I quote: "You are one of those corporations' agent who are sucking blood out of middle class...shame on you Ms Republican." He kind of missed the mark, at least on the corporate, agent and Republican part. We got a good laugh out of that one. I thanked him for that, from the bottom of my bleeding-heart-liberal, registered Democratic heart.
Landlord · Dallas, TX · Member since 2012 · 505 posts · 34 votes
13y
@Jon Holdman, Thank for your reply I appreciate it
K. Marie Poe Thanks for the reply. Nice story I bet when you told them your party bias it quickly diffused the situation lol! You stated you dont like yellow letters, what do you use out of curiosity post cards?
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
There was no diffusing that situation, let me tell you. Pure looney tunes.
I use letters that I've been tweaking over the years. It says I'm interested in making an offer if they are interested in selling, that I buy as-is, etc. I never used postcards before, but I'm testing one starting this week. I send mail that I wouldn't mind receiving. I find what freaks people out the most is when they think you know something that they think is private. I rarely call out their particular distress, but make general comments about buying as-is, or buying property with liens, etc. After they call and we talk a bit, sometimes they ask why they received a letter. But they almost always know.
Real Estate Professional · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2010 · 609 posts · 163 votes
13y
I have twice had people hire an attorney to write me a letter back to threaten legal action if I dont stop sending letters. Of course neither letter stated on what grounds the legal action would be taken. They could have saved some money and time by just calling or emailing me and asking to be taken off my list.
BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
13y
Gary Parker - I find it hard to believe anyone would go through the expense of hiring an attorney on something like this. I wonder if the lawyer was a) invented or b) a friend or relative? Other than harassment, I can't quite see what they could sue you on.
Investor · Dallas, TX · Member since 2009 · 718 posts · 913 votes
13y
Joshua DorkinI've gotten one of these threats as well. I'm a plaintiff's lawyer and I can't for the life of me figure out what kind of cause of action one of these idiots could bring. Intentional infliction of emotional distress, maybe, but the conduct has to be super egregious to prevail on a claim like that. Sending a letter asking if their property is for sale sure doesn't seem close to the type of conduct that satisfies this claim.
I agree Josh that it had to be friend or family that sent the letter.
Real Estate Professional · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2010 · 609 posts · 163 votes
13y
Joshua Dorkin I did make the assumption both letters were written by a hired lawyer. I was assuming one letter was written by a hired lawyer because one of the letters stated something to the effect "My firm has been retained..." I understand this could still be a family friend or something. The other letter came from the lawyer of a very wealthy and established family from the area. One of my letters must have gone to the 7th cousin or something.
Real Estate Professional · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2010 · 609 posts · 163 votes
13y
Oh the memories of funny stories form angry callers. I guess at some point sometimes it becomes almost humorous, and I mean that as respectfully as I can. Last year a lady called screaming, I could not get a word in and she hung up without giving me her name or address. This happened each time a letter went out to her because I couldn't take her off my list. Finally she let me talk and her name was removed. Sorry if this is too OT for this thread.
Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
I save all my crazy seller voice mails. I download them to a folder appropriately labeled "Crazy Seller Calls." I've been called everything and threatened so many times. I think it's hilarious. One lady said she knew my scam; I threw termites at the houses then went back home and mailed a letter asking if the house was for sale because I buy it as-is. Insanity.
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
Aaron Mazzrillo Years ago I got a call like that. The seller called to tell me she was reporting me to the police department for arson. She said that my letter arrived soon after the house burned. I told her I thought a business model that involved burning down houses in the hood in order to buy them didn't sound sustainable.
Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
13y
What a great thread! Haven't we all had calls like this? After listening to Aaron Mazzrillo's presentation at the conference last spring, I started having a little fun with these folks when I manage to catch them live, asking them if they get this upset over every piece of marketing they get in the mail.
Samantha M., welcome to the wonderful world of direct mail! I know that you've just recently upped the ante and started sending out a serious amount of mail. More angry calls are to be expected. But no, there is no leg for them to stand on. Just take them off the list when you're able to identify and move on. Let it roll right off of you.
I happen to also do quite a bit of mailing to Probate leads, and I can tell you there is no other group near so sensitive. They either love you or hate you, and there is no in between. But the deals that come from this niche are lucrative enough to thicken the skin to all the haters.
K. Marie Poe, I'm curious to know what makes the yellow letter any more obnoxious than any other marketing piece. Are you speaking of the copy typical to such letters, or the paper itself, or what? You speak of "letters that you'd like to receive" and I'm trying to picture what that might be....in my experience, I find that anything typed, anything in a #10 envelope gets opened less, read less, and responded to much less.
Lender · Greater LA/Orange County area, CA · Member since 2012 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
Aaron Mazzrillo - I knew that's was in the jar (termites) in the back of your truck!Any tips on "how" to throw them? Do you sprinkle them near the footings or cast them into the wind?
Samantha M. - I would hope that by now you are getting a taste for what other seasoned marketers experience from callers. I'll offer a couple of things, however:
1) Yes, there are lots of crazies out there. I'll save my own stories for other posts (and yes, a number of mine will beat out the competition). However, sellers with issues can be very profitable. A seller who is pulling their hair out can be a very motivated person, indeed, if you can tolerate the insanity. It's really useful to know and understand that people make decisions based on feelings, accurate or not as they are. Consider incorporate this into your marketing and sales conversion process.
2) If you really are bothered by the crazy people who call, consider modifying your sales funnel. Yes, you can design ways to screen them before you ever talk to them via answering services, better filters, hoops-and-hurdles, etc.. but it'll be at the cost of people who call on an impulse, and that's a great many.
You could consider an entirely different approach to your marketing, such as marketing to the people who refer the type of sellers you do want to work with. For example,for the past 20+ years I prefer to market to the attorneys who refer their clients. Clients are pre-conditioned and must take several steps before they'll ever get to talk to me. That's a big help because I only talk to motivated people.
At a certain point crazy people are easier to tolerate, like learning to appreciate the gagging smell of cat urine in a target property. As a connoisseur, I've learned to discern and appreciate a stench-filled room be it from Siamese, Tabby, Calico or other feline appellations, 'cause it still smells like money to me.
Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
I have another one who must have recently relocated here from North Korea or some other dictatorship. She very matter of factually states that she is reporting me to the attorney general because 'marketing is illegal.'
Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
13y
Originally posted by Aaron Mazzrillo:
I have another one who must have recently relocated here from North Korea or some other dictatorship. She very matter of factually states that she is reporting me to the attorney general because 'marketing is illegal.'
I too will be reporting you to the attorney general as it is illegal to wear a red tie in your profile picture posted publically.
Wholesaler · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2010 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
13y
Originally posted by Will Barnard:
I too will be reporting you to the attorney general as it is illegal to wear a red tie in your profile picture posted publically.
Sorry Will, but you're also in violation....hi-jacking threads is a major violation of the internet marketing protocols. Please confine yourself to your home pending summons and surrender your Pro Member privileges indefinitely
Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
13y
Jerry Puckett Most yellow letter copy I've seen attempts to make the sender appear less sophisticated than a savvy real estate investor. (I realize that with so many newbies using the letters, there's a good chance that they are, indeed, not savvy). I have been frustrated or annoyed (and sometimes amused) by every piece of mail that I opened thinking it was one thing when it was another. Getting someone to open the mail is an art, no doubt about it. I feel a lot of mail marketing crosses over into deceit or trickery. Invitation style envelopes, lumpy mail, handwritten fonts, yellow legal paper.....it all helps get the mail opened, but at what price? If it has no negative effect on you when you get such marketing, then it would make sense to recreate it for your own marketing. It annoys me when I get it, so I don't recreate it.
Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
13y
K. Marie,
If you're truly trying to help someone, isn't your responsibility to do whatever it takes to get them to open the envelope so they give themselves the best opportunity to be helped. By not tricking them into opening the envelope, you may be doing them a disservice...
Landlord · Dallas, TX · Member since 2012 · 505 posts · 34 votes
13y
K. Marie Poe Thats a good point. Invitation style envelopes, hand written fonts and colored blue might get your mail opened more, but will it increase the QUALITY of your leads? Im somewhat skeptical. Im sure you will get more calls with that approach, but it will likely be out of curiosity.
I will reserve my judgement until I try invitation envelopes next month, but thats my initial thought process.