Are you a CHEAP INVESTOR?

95 Replies

Do you suck as an investor? You know what I mean, are you an investor who just sucks knowledge and resources from others without giving anything in return? Do you expect others to just impart their experience and knowledge to you simply because they have it and you want it? 

Here is an example, would you ask a fellow investor for the specific documents that they use for free that they have paid hundreds of dollars to a lawyer to create?

Would you take an investors time and ask them to teach you for free?

Would you ask other investors for all of their contacts that they use in their business that have taken them years to vet because you are new in town and you want to get started?

Are you an entitled investor who thinks others should give because they have and you don’t?

For those that have been approached by an investor like this, what was your experience like?

Uh, I'm not that person. I've had a few people approach me like that since I've been doing this but I either ignore them, put them off, or tell them point blank I don't share that information. I do help a lot of people and am glad to do it but anyone who was just a leech I would send down the road. 

A lot of this depends on the person and situation.

I would like to think I don't take advantage of other investors, but how would you know if that is true, unless they were completely open about it and told you they felt you were taking advantage of them.

At the moment I feel bad for my realtor, as I have dragged him to 20+ houses, put in a handful of offers and haven't landed one. Not to mention these are low priced homes, so he is not going to be getting a big paycheck when we do finally close. He shows no signs that I am a "bother", but not sure that he would ever tell me that.

I have asked advice and opinions, however feel that I would be willing to share any/all advice and opinions that I could. Kind of a do unto others thing. I helped an investor by loaning him my staging furniture, helping deliver it, setting it up and taking better photos of the property for him. I also offered suggestions on things to address on the house, to help it sell.

If there is someone you feel is "using" you, then let it be known and either it will change, or you will have to cut ties with that person.

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Oh- you mean an entitled taker. Lots of those on here.  

I've had to amend my profile to appear like an old leave me alone grump because of this.  Didn't start out that way.  Learned behavior.

I get at least 3 colleague requests a week from folks I don't know wanting to go deep into seller financing, or LOs, my contracts, contacts, etc.  They think saying 'hi' at the beginning of the 3 paragraph question is enough for me to guide them for weeks through things that took me years of dedicated education to master.

Funny thing is - they will find me through a related thread I wrote in and they didn't even bother to vote on the post that prompted them to find me!    Because of this or no message at all with the request I deny at least 5 to 1, but I didn't start out intending it to be this way.  Learned behavior.

@Jd Martin did deep requests pick up for you after your awesome podcast?  I bet it did.  3rd reason for me against being on it.  Cheers!

I believe in giving as much as I could possibly take. For that reason I try to answer every message I get. Sometimes it does get a bit ridiculous though. I once had someone ask me the same question, 3 weeks apart...even though I had responded to the initial question.

I don't think it is a "suck" to ask for a contract, that can be emailed in less than 5 mins. 

I have experienced some of the scenarios in the past and they have irked me, but then I understand that I was in their shoes back in the day. I try to help them as much as I can, but try to do it in a teaching manner.

for example, if they ask me for a contract I give them this resource: https://www.ok.gov/OREC/Contract_Forms_and_Related...

And say "I use this a resource, anything more specific I would talk to a lawyer. Cheers!"

Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan :

Oh- you mean an entitled taker. Lots of those on here.  

I've had to amend my profile to appear like an old leave me alone grump because of this.  Didn't start out that way.  Learned behavior.

I get at least 3 colleague requests a week from folks I don't know wanting to go deep into seller financing, or LOs, my contracts, contacts, etc.  They think saying 'hi' at the beginning of the 3 paragraph question is enough for me to guide them for weeks through things that took me years of dedicated education to master.

Funny thing is - they will find me through a related thread I wrote in and they didn't even bother to vote on the post that prompted them to find me!    Because of this or no message at all with the request I deny at least 5 to 1, but I didn't start out intending it to be this way.  Learned behavior.

@Jd Martin did deep requests pick up for you after your awesome podcast?  I bet it did.  3rd reason for me against being on it.  Cheers!

 LOL. They did but I'm kind of an easy-going dude so I don't mind an e-mail or two. For people who want to really mine my mind, I send them over to my website. I don't make any real money over there, but it at least sorts out the tire kickers from the people who are serious about learning, and I find that it's more important to me to feel like I'm not wasting my time talking to someone who has no serious intentions. I figure if someone's hell-bent against paying less than $100 for a week/month's worth of my time, they're probably one of the takers anyway or are computer screen dreamers :)

Here's how I look at it. When I was younger I had a lot of people help me along the road of life. I couldn't be where I am today without their gracious help. I was blessed to have the parents I had and the upbringing that I received. Yes, I have paid my dues, taken chances and then taken more chances. However those chances were "educated" chances because of the people that helped me in the past.
Do some "suckers" cross the line? You bet and I drop them like a hot potato. I know that @Steve Vaughan and @JD Martin have taught this old dog a few tricks! Hopefully I am giving more to the BP community than I am taking. With the state that this country is in right now, I am glad when I see a "snotty nosed kid" trying to make a name for himself! I just look in the mirror and say "that was me 35 years ago. No money but plenty of tenacity to make it happen"!

"Bend over backwards to help your friends, but never forwards."--Terry D. Miller

why join a community built for sharing info and experience if not to share your experience? It seems like you're guilty of the same thing you're accusing others, which is, or could be, learning off the backs of others while not sharing what you've learned. 

Now that's pretty harsh of me. But I am in fact a newbie. I fit in the camp of everything to learn and not much to share. Mostly I feel like I should be a success myself before I go spouting off how intelligent I am and why someone should listen to me..., 

One thing I'll say here or repeat is that lots of things I've read about and thought I learned were not the same as buying my first "deal" or duplex I'm living in. I learned more by the experience, or at least I didn't truly understand the things I've read here on BP until I went out and took some action. 

So you feel like you're giving away what you worked hard for, but in fact, whoever receives the info has to still go out and apply it, which is guaranteed not to be as seamless and and easy for them as you imagine. That's been my experience on the newbie side

Is what you are complaining about different than what you do? As an investor I hope you are trying to buy properties from someone at X minus 40% (getting a discount (plug any %)). Is that "entitled investor" just trying to get a document for X-100%? Wouldn't you try to buy properties for X-100% if you could? The only difference is the FMV of what you are trying to obtain. Like the sellers you negotiate with, all you can do is say no, I want X or no I want X-10% or No, your offer was insulting. But that decision is up to you. But don't knock them for trying to get the best deal they can.

"We make a living by what we get but we make a life by what we give."

Winston Churchill

Just say no when they cross the line.  You also never know who may be your next bird dog or private investor too...there are ways to make this a win/win.

I think you are missing the point of this community. This is a place for people to share their experience and knowledge. If you don't want to share then what are you doing here?

@JD Martin thanks for your comments. It sounds like you have also experienced people who suck.  Now some people might be offended by that comment, but I mean it in the literal sense of the word.

Now I don’t expect a new investor to be able to contribute a ton and that isn’t what this post is all about. It is about a mindset of expecting things for nothing. 

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@Brian Pulaski thanks for your comment. I think that it is great to be helpful to others by helping them move furniture. 

As far as working with a realtor, my business partner is the realtor in our partnership. We make several offers a week site unseen. The offers are sent to the sellers realtor by email stating that we are interested in putting in an offer at a specific price and then asks if we should write up the offer.  Then his assistant writes the offer and sends it in. If it is accepted, then we go to inspect the property. This way it saves a lot of time for the investor and the realtor.

Everyone is different and I am approached frequently by people in this capacity.  I keep in mind that once upon a time I was new to this and didn't know how to properly navigate the waters.  I am patient and helpful but very conscious of my time.

@Shiloh Lundahl I really don't get the point of this thread. I am not one of those people and don't take offense to your post what so ever, but at the same time, I don't see the point of it. Like others have mentioned, these forums and website are full of new investors that are looking for answers. They probably don't even know the effort that you went through to get to where you are, or that you even paid hundreds of dollars for a few pieces of paper. You think they "suck" and are "cheap" but maybe they are just ignorant to the efforts behind what they are asking for.

Are there some new investor bad apples out there? Sure, but I'm sure there are some more experienced people out there trying to take advantage of the newer folks too. 

If you expect something in return for what they are asking, why not just tell them that? Educate them on the effort it took to get what they are asking, or ignore it if you really can't stand it and think they are leaching.

I would hope that threads like this never discourage people from reaching out for help or posting questions.

Wow. Excellent topic. I am still brand new to BP, and I love scouring all the critical info on this site. When I get to a point where I have useful and important information I can share, I will most definitely share the info with the community. I really admire all the experts on this site, and the wealth of expertise they have in their head. Of course time is money, and one needs to be respectful of other members time and expertise, and I believe it is imperative to be thankful for the information and time given. Still being a Newbie, I am at about 77 thousand in my savings and just learning and gleening information so that when I pull the trigger on my first property, it will be a wise choice. Due Diligence first, for sure. But in OC, California, it's not cheap! I'm hoping to buy in Palm Springs, but I have to research the rental market out there. Anyway, thank you to all the experts on here, I really appreciate the amazing information to all of us just starting out. Have an excellent Wednesday!  ~Daniel 

Account Closed thanks for your input.  I love how you put that most people wont do the work necessary to be successful yet they want success now. I have seen that too.  

I think some people might be misunderstanding what I am saying. I am not saying not to share any time or knowledge with people who are new and wanting to learn. What I am saying is some people, whether they are new or not, ask for things from experienced investors, that took the experienced investors time and money to obtain. And they just expect the investors to share it with them because they are asking for it.

Here is an example, about a year ago, a new investor reached out to me saying he had some money to invest and be wanted to meet up with me to talk about starting to invest in real estate. So I told him we could meet up for lunch and chat.

When we met for lunch he stated as we were ordering that he felt embarrassed but he had forgotten his wallet. So I ended up paying for lunch. Then he proceeded to ask me questions which I answered. I mentioned to him a way where he could partner on a deal with us and earn a little bit of money and gain some hands on experience.

Then after that, he never returned any calls.  This is what I am talking about when I say some people suck and want things for free and expect others to just give it to them.

@Jay Patel Totally agree Jay. When I read this post initially I was embarrassed that I have asked a couple questions on the forum. I to am new to RE investing, have watched 70% of the podcasts, and have scoured the forums for information. What has been consistent through everything is the advice to ask questions from the community. I personally don't know how much money it costs to draw up a lease. I don't realize the time it took someone to learn. I guess my assumption is most people have gleaned information from others along the way. 

I guess in life, job, whatever, you always have the choice to either help people or be selfish. To each their own I guess.

@Shiloh Lundahl Hey, what is your formula for adding value to more experienced investors or people in the industry you want to gain value from?

If I were you I would say: sorry but I can't share this with you because it is propitiatory and I spent hundreds and hundreds of dollars to create it". This way you tell them to beck off in a very nice way. 

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