Who pays for painting materials?

Question

Quick question for everyone. My contractor gave me labor quotes, and I am purchasing the material list for work to be completed. The painter has added items such as graco pump armor and gracO spray tips (for his paint gun). Who typically bears this cost?

If labor and materials combined in quote is this stuff usually factored in?

thanks everyone

If labor and materials combined in quote is this stuff usually factored in?

thanks everyone

Chris C. · Answer

I have been doing labor only contracts with good success over the past couple of years.  We have a very detailed system that creates our SOW's and materials list.  My contractors get a detailed SOW and materials list for them to quote.  If it is not in the materials list then they are responsible for it.  Mud, tape, nails, sprayer tips, etc are all provided by the contractor and he knows this up front to include in his quote.  We only provide "Finishing' materials.  Lights, paint, faucets, etc.

The benefit to this is that there are very few areas that we can control cost.  Price we pay for the home of course and how much we pay for materials.  Everything else is pretty much fixed.  Labor rates, closing cost, insurance, etc are all going to be about the same for all of us. (Adjusted for your area of course.)

Our system prints out our materials list with Lowe's item numbers.  We take this to the pro desk and they get us a quote generally saving us 12-20% off retail.  They then deliver all materials to the job site and we never have an issue with contractors waiting on us for materials.  When you are buying a $100k in materials a year this quickly adds up to significant savings that a contractor is not going to get for you.  It also allows us to buy in bulk and move items from one job to the next.

Contractors are understandably hesitant the first time they work with us and generally up charge a little due to concerns with getting materials on time etc.  After about 2 properties with us they are appreciative of not having to deal with materials themselves and we can negotiate even better labor rates.

We are able to make this successful due to our systems so your success may vary.

Aaron McGinnis · Answer

Materials include equipment consumables used for the job.

Yet another reason why labor only contracts are terrible.

Brian Pulaski · Answer

Unless you know the ins and outs of each contractor, why not let them buy "materials"? Who buys the tape if they need to tape? Who buys roller covers, brushes, etc? I could see a stipulation that you would buy the paint only, but never "materials" in general.

JD Martin · Answer

Depends on how much painting is going to be done. One room, I would probably balk. Entire house, perfectly reasonable. Tips wear out. If you are buying materials, you wouldn't expect him to bring used rollers. Besides that, you want a good job, and you're going to want a fresh sprayer tip. If you are super concerned about it, let him know you'll be keeping the tips when he's done.

I personally also think labor only contracts are a bad idea, and I wouldn't work under one as a sub. It only leads to disputes when there's shortages, overruns, bad materials, and the like. If the contract was for material & labor, this question would never come up. Besides, most professionals get bulk discounts that allow them to make a little profit on the materials but still charge the same kind of money it would cost Joe homeowner to go get the materials himself, and then the contractor gets to be responsible for materials (i.e. ordering the right stuff, bad materials, etc).

This kind of thing always puzzles me. Home rehabbing is one of the few professions I know of where people see this as acceptable. No one would show up to the dealership to repair their car with a box full of parts, or bring their own bandages and casts with them to the doctor's office.

David D Painter · Answer

I am a painting contractor who prices everything with materials and labor so no one is surprised.  If his contract covers labor only, you probably are responsible for roller covers and some portion of paint brushes and/or spray tips, etc. However a spray tip will certainly last a lot longer than one job.

Chris C. · Answer

@Bob Okenwa Sorry for the slow reply.  I have been out of the country.

My spreadsheet generates this but here is a sample of my Painter SOW from a recent job.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwfHXCzMW3kNUl9n...

This is global sow of work that lets all trades know roughly what everyone else is doing so they can work together.  This is posted at the job site at the start of the project.  You will also see the materials.  Each material is assigned a trade that is responsible for the installation so it shows up on the sow.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5X9eL6GbSRmYXM3...

Luc Boiron · Answer

@Logan Turner I know that you don't always remember everything to put in a contract. I try to start with simple guidelines that shows that you and the contractor agree in principle on the types of things that are included, then specifically lay out what I can think of. This way, if you forget to put something in, you can see if it falls under the principle or guidelines you set out.

I try to do this with a lot of contracts that I use. This may not be the best way, but I lay out the intentions, so that if a neutral third party reviews the agreement in the future, they can understand what we have agreed to even if something is left out.

Chris Clark · Answer

Everything is a tool on a standard job except:  Paint, Primer, Tape, Putty, Caulk and Thinner if you have oil base-trim.

Pump armor is a lubricant for HIS machine.  Spray tips, brushes, roller covers, 5 n 1's, etc are tools.

Do not pay for tools.

Jim Adrian · Answer

Like @Chris C. said, having a detailed Scope of Work (SOW) is better.  The more detail the better.  Think of it as your ground rules for the project.  Tools for the job falls under "Means and Methods" by the contractor typically.  Are you going to buy the contractors drills and drill bits to screw in the screws? I bet not.  I can also see @Jd Martin points as well.  I am not familiar with the "ins and outs" of a labor only contract but I would re-read your contract. Sounds like there are holes in the contract.

Chris C. · Answer

@Logan Turner I handle that by being very specific that the only thing I pay for is what is in my materials list.  They are responsible for everything else.

Is it in the materials List?  Nope!  I don't pay.

They can include it in their itemized quote but all I look at is the total quoted price and compare that to others.

Who pays for painting materials?

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