Buy More, Wait, or Reinvest Cash Flow? (2025 Buyer’s Market)

Dave:
We may be in a buyer’s market, but does that actually mean it’s time for you to buy real estate? We haven’t seen this type of market for a long time, so we’re going to break it down today and talk about whether you should buy new properties, pay down your mortgages, or wait for even better opportunities down the line. I am Dave Meyer. Welcome to On the Market, and today we’re joined by our expert panel, Kathy Fettke, James Dainard and Henry Washington. Kathy, how are you?

Kathy:
It’s so good. Yeah, it’s surf week here in Malibu, so that’s why I’m wearing a hat.

Henry:
Isn’t that like saying it’s Rain Week in Seattle?

Dave:
Hey, this summer’s very nice here, James. Happy birthday.

Henry:
Oh,

Dave:
That’s right my man. You had a good party it looked like.

James:
Yeah, we were out of a seafair. Blue Angels air shows, hydroplanes boats, best kind of birthday.

Kathy:
James, when was your birthday? I feel like a dummy.

James:
It was on the second.

Kathy:
Oh, happy belated.

James:
I prefer if I didn’t have any anymore.

Henry:
No, I don’t dunno if you know what that means. If you don’t have any more birthdays,

Dave:
Either get old or die. Got to love the birthdays.

Henry:
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Dave:
And Henry, how’s it going man?

Henry:
I am great. I for one, like being alive, so I would love some more birthdays.

Dave:
Yeah,

Henry:
Amen.

Dave:
Believe

Henry:
It that.

Dave:
Alright, we’ve got a great show for you guys today. We are talking about the fact that we are in a buyer’s market, but as you probably all know, this does cause some confusion because some people see a buyer’s market as an opportunity, some people see it as a risk. So we are going to take sort of a big picture, look at the whole nationwide real estate market and talk about regional differences of course. But generally speaking, who should be buying? Who should be paying off their mortgages? Who should be waiting maybe who should be selling? Let’s just talk big picture strategy about the market that we’re in right now. Kathy, let’s start with you. What are the indications that you see that tell you whether it’s a time to buy, time to wait, time to sell? What are the things that you’re looking at to sort of frame this strategic conversation?

Kathy:
That is such a big question.

Dave:
Yeah, answer it all

Kathy:
In one minute. The bottom line is if you want to see more buyers than things, it all comes down to affordability. And it’s so funny because when you look at the media or you see headlines, people freak out about everything, whether prices are going up, prices are going down, but the fact of the matter is in many markets, prices are going down or stabilizing and at the same time we’re seeing mortgage rates come down. When you have that combination, you have more affordability. It’s not great, but it’s better. And anytime affordability gets better, more people come off the sidelines because now they can afford. So these are just some of the things to look at. Again, if you’re a flipper, that means you might have more buyers, but also it means that if you’re a buyer, prices are down and you can really negotiate some awesome deals. So I hope that summarized it.

Dave:
I was joking when I said do it in one minute, but that was pretty good.

Kathy:
Oh man, I was

Dave:
Rushing. I like it. You’ve got a lot of energy today, James. I mean, I feel like you’re probably doing all of the above. So how are you thinking about this question? Big picture, what are the right moves to make in this transitioning market? We’re going from a strong seller’s market to a buyer’s market. How are you thinking about your own strategy?

James:
My own strategy right now is buy, buy, buy.

Dave:
Oh yeah.

Henry:
James, when is your strategy? Not buy, buy, buy.

James:
That’s true. Right now you have four buys on this one. Not three.

Henry:
No. Bye bye. Bye bye bye. Bye bye. Pause. Bye. Got it. Okay.

James:
You know what? When my phone starts ringing a lot and I’m getting blown up all day long to buy stuff, that means everyone else has already told them no. Especially when I haven’t talked to people in a couple years and I’m seeing a massive gap in that right now. And so if you’re getting that many calls, the more inventory you got to kind of dig into some things. And the cool thing about that is last 12, 24 months, people are going, well, you can only get a flip or you can only get this right now and it’s really hard. But now with the amount of inventories coming our way, you can cut up deals so many different ways right now, make rentals, make flips, make development. It’s an open map right now. It’s an open roadmap to do what you want.

Dave:
And what has changed there? Just price. You’re getting better deals.

James:
Yeah, price especially. But it really what’s changed is this seller’s mindset. There’s always this little switch of fear or something that gets clicked on and people are like, they’re reeling and dealing. They’ll call me with a number and I’m like, sorry, that dumb pencil, I got to be 20% below that number you just offered it to me at. And they’re coming around real quick. And so it’s just get through deals, stick to your numbers. I’m seeing so many cool opportunities on our plate right now.

Dave:
Well, that’s pretty cool. I want to dig into the tactical element of that, but Henry, how many buys do you have? One buy, two buys, three buys.

Henry:
Yeah, I’m a three buy kind of guy right now.

Dave:
Buy, buy, buy,

Speaker 5:
Buy,

Henry:
Buy, buy. It is a good time to be buying property because you can negotiate. This is probably one of the best times we’ve seen in the last five years to buy deals on the market.
But I think when people hear that they think, oh cool, I’ll just go do some looking and I’ll put in an offer or two. No, it takes work to find the needle in the haystacks and you need to have a system so that you can actually capitalize on the deals that are out there because in all honesty, there’s a deal out there on the MLS right now and that seller doesn’t even know that they’re ready to sell it for a deal. You have to make them the offer for them to realize that they might be willing to take that offer.

Kathy:
But be cool, be cool on that offer. I just thought a couple of letters today, you’re always getting the text. Do

Henry:
Not be cool. No,

Kathy:
No, no, no. I got this letter today that said we are offering to buy your property because all caps, it has serious problems. I’m like, excuse me, it’s been rented for 10 years straight and the rents keep going up. I dunno what you’re talking about. But then I got another letter for the same property also in the mail and it was like, if you have any issue, we are here to help you. That was a much better letter.

Dave:
The letters I hate the most. I don’t know if you guys get these, but the ones that are like, I’m standing outside your property at blah, blah blah right now. And they send a picture and I’m like, get out of here. I don’t want you stalking me. That’s my home. Yeah. James, I’m curious, can you give us an example of a type of deal that wasn’t available a year or two ago that you are now seeing today?

James:
Clean, multifamily. I’m starting to see some opportunities to not have to leave a lot of cash in. One of the benefits of buying a cleaner product is you don’t have to do much work. There’s less maintenance when it’s a little bit newer. It’s just a better building in general typically, but you don’t get to leave no money in those deals a lot of times, especially when you’re in a better area. There’s a deal I’m looking at right now where it’s been a long-term multifamily building for a seller and they have what, 16 units? All three bed, two bath, and they’re built in 2007. I don’t see that product a lot with what I buy most of the times. If I’m going to leave no money in a deal and make some cashflow, I have to do a lot of heavy construction around town. This one I got to do countertops, paint and carpet. And so a great opportunity and really it’s just because the sellers are going, it’s time to unload and look at putting my money elsewhere. And that’s the cool thing about this. It’s not brain damage. And so that’s definitely a deal. I’m very, very close on.

Dave:
What about you, Henry? Do you have an example?

Henry:
Yeah, similar to what James is talking about here. I have a deal that we’re about to list on the market that I probably wouldn’t have been able to find previously. We know that there are boomers retiring, getting out of their businesses that are also getting out of their real estate. There are tons of landlords right now that are looking to sell off some of their properties. So this is a retiring landlord, free and clear property. They want to sell their property. The property’s in very good shape. It’s been a rental property, it’s just dated. And when I say dated, it was built in the early two thousands and so it hasn’t had a remodel since the early two thousands. So it’s got solid wood cabinets and formica countertops, just the two thousands aesthetic square beige floor tiles. But it was a great house in a great neighborhood in great shape. So a RV on this property is about 3 75, but he would probably have to sell it for three 50 and it would take some time. So I came in and I offered the guy 300, 300,000. He can have your money in seven days. You can be out, you can be done. We’re spending about five grand. We put some quartz countertops in. We put a subway tile backsplash in. I just used subway tiles. I had leftover from other jobs.

Speaker 5:
Nice.

Henry:
I used grout. I had leftover from other jobs. We just ordered a light package from Amazon. We replaced light fixture in the house to make that part look updated. We left the tile floors, we left the carpet. The carpet was all cleaned. It had just been cleaned. We left the LVP in the living room and we’re not even painting the walls, we’re just doing touchup paint in the walls. But I brought my sister-in-law in and she just did two accent walls in the master bedroom and one in the living room to give it a little bit of a high-end feel. $5,000. We’re going to put this thing on the market for $365,000. It’ll compete with the flipped houses that have a full renovation. I don’t expect it to sell for 3 75, but it’ll sell somewhere between 3 55 and 365. I’ll make 20 to 30 grand for a little cosmetic rehab. And so finding those opportunities is easier now because he knew I could put it on the market and I could make more, but it’s going to take me six months and I’m still probably going to have to fix some of these and update some of these things I don’t want to update. And it’s paid off. It’s free and clear. And so he was willing to take the 300 in seven days and be done and let me make up the difference and I’ll go get the 20 or 30 grand he left on the table because he was willing to let that go just to not have to hassle with the competition in the market right now.

James:
So my question is though, did you paint the grass? Did

Henry:
I paint the grass?

James:
Did you paint the grass? I feel like that’s the magic tinsel on top of that cleanup right there.

Henry:
That’s a thing. People paint grass. Oh, that’s the thing. Oh yeah, send me the product James. I’m not opposed to painting some grass. I’ll paint some grass right now.

Kathy:
Oh yeah, you got to paint the grass. Yeah,

James:
Just make sure there’s some trick behind it. If it doesn’t sell in the first month, you’re in a little bit of

Henry:
Trouble. If the sprinklers come on and the green starts to run down the sidewalk, we need

Dave:
To get a camera crew out here. I want to see Henry painting some grass. Okay, well these are really good examples. Wait, you just asked me. I was going to ask you a different question, but you better have something good now.

Kathy:
I had to share that I was on stage with Ken McElroy with this very topic, what are you doing and what are you excited about? And Ken McElroy has been doing multifamily for over 40 years, billions in assets and he is all in all in on multifamily because again, same thing. You’ve got so many multifamily operators that just did not do the underwriting properly and now that they’re needing to refi into higher rates, they just can’t make the numbers work. So prices have come down substantially on multifamily units. I mean as much as 30%, maybe even more in certain markets. So that is why we are starting our multifamily fund because those deals you guys know, they go fast and if you don’t have cash ready, you’re going to lose the deal. So I think that’s another message to people. Find a way to make sure your financing is in place and you’ve got cash available because when those hot deals come, you got to be ready to pounce.

Dave:
Yep, absolutely.

Kathy:
Getting

Dave:
A lot of great insights here, but we do have to take a quick break. We’ll be back with the full panel right after this. Welcome back to On the Market. I’m here with James, Kathy and Henry debating whether it’s a good time to buy, pay off your mortgage, wait, sell, what’s the right move right now. So let me ask you guys something then. This is going to be controversial. I don’t know how you guys are going to say this, but if deals are just getting better and better for the average investors who are not the three of you who are buying deals all the time, if you have money to buy one deal in the next year, should you buy now or should you wait until deals actually get better?

Kathy:
Well, why if the numbers work

Dave:
Now, but what if they’re going to work even better in six months?

Kathy:
Well, we’re seeing interest rates come down and we’re seeing price, like I said, only about 4 million homes, trade hands every year and you have millions and millions, you’ve got over 78 million or something millennials and the largest group is in that first time home buying age. So the moment, a few of them, you don’t need a lot of ’em. You just need a few of them are able to afford, it’s going to move the market.

Henry:
So I’m going to ask you a question, Dave. You spend a lot of time looking at data and analytics about the market, about economics, about policy, looking to your crystal ball and you tell me if interest rates in the next 12 months are going to go up, are going to go down, or if you think housing prices are going to go up, are going to go down and you have to be right. If I asked you that, would you be able to answer it?

Dave:
No, of course not.

Henry:
So the future is uncertain.

Dave:
I feel pretty confident,

Henry:
But I can’t. Right. And you are paid to do this for a

Dave:
Living.

Henry:
So for the normal person, we have no fricking clue what’s going to happen in the future, but we know right now there’s opportunity. So if you have the means and you have done the proper amount of research, then taking advantage of what we know now is better than taking advantage of what you think may happen in the future. Nobody freaking knows.

Kathy:
Well said.

Dave:
We decided we needed an on the market employee of the month before we started recording today, just so everyone knows. I think Henry just won with that answer.

James:
And here’s what I’ve learned over 20 years of buying and selling stuff and we’ve been involved in a lot of deals. I have never once sold at the top and I have never once bought at the bottom.

Dave:
Yeah, that’s true.

James:
You have to just ride the wave. And I think that’s important for anybody who’s on the fence right now. If you’re on the fence, make sure you have clarity before you buy or don’t buy,
But
Stop listening to everyone else whether they’re going to buy or sell right now you have to go, Hey, I have a certain amount of cash here. This is my savings or this is my money to put wherever I want, whether it’s real estate, bitcoin, stocks, whatever you want to do. And there should be a magical number for growth in there for you. If I’m going to leave money in a deal, I want to make 10%. And if I know that number that tells me to buy or sell, it doesn’t matter about marketing timing is what can I make on that money in the short term or the long term and is it hitting my minimum? And if it doesn’t, don’t buy the deal. Yeah,

Kathy:
And if you’re investing for the long term, it really doesn’t matter because you have no idea what’s going to happen in five or 10 years. But you do know that people will always want a place to live. John Shaw is one of my early mentors. He’s just like a godfather of real estate. He’s like, just buy a house every year. Don’t worry about timing. In 10 years you’re going to be super glad you did it because over 10 years, even after the great recession where prices went down in a lot of areas in Vegas and California and Florida, they were down like 70% in some cases. But you know what? After 10 years they were back up. So if you’re thinking long-term, even with the worst recession in that 10 years, guess what? You’ve paid down your mortgage or you haven’t your tenant has. So time is on your side more than timing, huh? I’m going to coin that.

Dave:
There you go. Kathy’s making a run for employee of the month. Also. I trying. It’s hard, tough. I’m just going to put all your pictures up on the wall behind me with little stars for the record. I agree with you. I’m just trying to play devil’s advocate. I do think it’s an important question. I do think it is something that a lot of people are probably thinking about that if you have the money to make one, should you wait because prices may drop more. I guess the only reason you would do that, right is if you actually think there’s going to be a crash. If it’s more than a modest correction or slow down, we’re seeing if you thought prices were going to go down 10 or 20%, you might want to wait, but personally don’t think that’s going to happen. So I don’t know. That’s up to you.

James:
Yeah. My thing is does it matter?

Dave:
Not if you’re holding, I would think it matters. I mean it matters, right? If you were to buy right before a crash or right after a crash, that certainly matters on your return matters,

Henry:
Your return. I feel like that happens to me every time I buy a stock or crypto anyway. So

James:
Yeah, whether the thing goes up or down, if you’re making your 10% or your 12% or your 18% or your 5%, if that’s what you’ve identified, that that’s what you can grow with then doesn’t matter, I guess is the question. Now it matters if you’re flipping. It can be painful when you time it wrong.

Kathy:
Matters is flipping, but,

Dave:
But I guess I agree with you James. I target a certain ROI or IRR and if I get that I’ll buy things. But certainly someone who just has one deal, if you bought a deal at 400 grand and then two months later it’s worth 350 grand, that matters, you’d rather buy it at three 50 because again, I agree it’s going to grow again. But that’s a question of whether it just comes back to your original price or you actually make 20%.

Henry:
Let’s ask that differently though. So I’m going to play devil’s advocate from the outside looking in is the person that bought at 400 and then 90 days later or six months later, the house has gone down to three 50 and they hold onto that house so they in a better position than the person who decided not to buy because they were worried about a crash and then the market came down and they didn’t buy anything.

Dave:
Well, assuming they didn’t buy anything, it depends on the numbers, but let’s assume someone’s buying something here. That was question, right? Is it better to buy before a crash or after a crash? It’s a pretty simple answer.

Henry:
No, the question was should they buy or not buy based on if they think a crash is coming? I would argue that if the person bought it 400 and they’re going to hold for a long time in 10 years, they’re in a better position than the person who bought absolutely nothing.

Kathy:
And Dave, what if it goes to four 50 in a couple months and they’re like, dang it, I didn’t buy. Now it’s more

Henry:
The bounce back is real.

Kathy:
We’ll see, we’ll see.

Henry:
Yes, buying at three 50 is better than buying at 400, but buying at 400 is better than not buying at all

Kathy:
Or buying at four 50.

James:
But I think what people really need to step back and look at is don’t confuse yourself. What happens?

Henry:
Listening to this podcast may not be helping.

James:
You think there’s more risk in the market, right? If my number’s 10%, if I will buy a rental, if I can get a 10% return on my cash, if I think that the market’s going to go from 400 to three 50 or there’s a possibility that it could, my new number’s 12% or 13% or 14,

Dave:
Yeah, that’s a good way to put it. Yeah,

James:
Just don’t say I’m either buying or not buying or waiting. Adjust the numbers.

Dave:
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

James:
That’s how investors work and I think that’s where people get so confused and they lock up. Don’t get confused. Just adjust. Be greedy.

Dave:
Yeah, that makes sense. Alright, this has been a great debate. We have more questions coming up to argue over is it a good time to pay off your mortgage or maybe even sell some properties. But we do have to take a quick break. We’ll be right back. Welcome back to On the Market. I’m here with Kathy, James and Henry talking about should you buy pay off, wait, sell, what should you be doing right now? We’re having a fun conversation right now. I want to turn our attention to a question about paying off your mortgages. I see actually a lot more people doing this or even buying rentals with less leverage than they were in the past putting 30% down, 40% down. Henry, is there any scenario that you would think about doing this?

Henry:
Well, as somebody who’s actively focused on paying off my portfolio now I can tell you that yeah, there is a scenario where you do that, but I can also tell you that my decision to start paying off my real estate has nothing to do with the timing of the market. It has everything to do with what I want for my real estate business and how long I plan to be there in. And so I have to execute this strategy in any given market. Now, how aggressive I am in selling a property will have to do with the market because if the market is hot and things are selling over asking, if we hit a 2021 again, 2022, I’m going to be super aggressive and I’m going to try to sell as much as
Possible.
And in the market that we’re in now, I’m not super aggressive on what I’m selling. I’m super strategic on what I’m selling because I’m not going to get the most amazing top dollar for certain properties. So what I choose to sell to pay off other things matters based on what’s happening in the market. But the fact that I’m paying off my portfolio is not about market timing.

Dave:
Yeah, I totally agree. I sort of went through this recently with thinking about paying off some of my portfolio. That’s just more of what stage you’re in in your investing career than it is about market timing. I think there’s a certain point where most investors want to take risk off the table. They want to simplify after you go through this growth expansion stage that a lot of people go through, this just naturally happens. I think it makes a lot of sense for some people. The only way I would say that I sort of went through this equation for myself is on my primary residence, should I pay down my mortgage? Should I put less down? But ultimately the way it came out to is like my mortgage, I was able through a relationship with a bank with my brokerage account, get a pretty good light. I’m in the fives, which is pretty solid.

Henry:
That’s pretty awesome.

Dave:
Yeah, it’s great. And so the way to think about it’s, I could pay down that mortgage, but if I can get a higher than a five and a half percent return on that money, why would I pay off my mortgage? And even with deals the way they are, I could get five and a half on market in almost any market right now that kind of return. So there’s no reason why to pay it off from a market timing perspective, unless you have a 9% mortgage rate and then you can only find a 6% cash on cash return, then maybe you pay off your mortgage.

James:
I think this is such a hard, no, I don’t know why people do this.

Dave:
Pay off your

Henry:
Mortgage,

Kathy:
Don’t do it.

James:
Now if you’re rich, then do that. Right? But if you’re trying to grow, I mean it doesn’t take much to beat the interest rate on the bank.

Kathy:
Exactly. And it offers asset protection a bit because people can so easily search and see if you own a property free and clear and then go trip and fall on your property.

Dave:
Oh, I never even thought about that. Oh

Kathy:
Yeah, Dave, do you got any

Dave:
Properties that I could go trip and fall in front of?

Kathy:
You got to leverage them to the and yeah, if it’s even 6%, there’s lending funds, right, that pay 10%. So now you’ve made 4% on your money, you’re doing better than the banks.

James:
And I don’t necessarily agree with leverage it to the hill.
We’re not maxed out on our loan values on our portfolio from 2008. I don’t like to have too much debt on me, but I’m not paying it down. Once I get that loan, there’s so many other things I’d rather pay off than my housing mortgage interest rate, which is typically going to be cheaper than any other kind of line of credit card, car loan, whatever it is, the debt. If you want to pay down your debt, focus on the most expensive, who cares if it’s housing or not. I get the concept because it pays you money over time. But if you really want to pay down your debt, increase your equity, like the deal I was talking about, you can buy and sell things, pay it down and still leave your on hand to grow.

Dave:
I mean, I guess the reason sort of what Henry’s saying and what I would say is that at a certain point I just don’t care that much about growing. I would rather try and reduce my risk and just simplify my portfolio. So I think that’s why I’m saying it’s like a timing of your investing stage.

Henry:
I think that’s where James and I are different as investors. James is like we’re growing. We’re getting as big as possible. I want no part of that. I want no part of growth for growth’s sake. I don’t need to wake up in the morning and feel like I’m a better human being. I’m going harder. I just want to protect the assets I have. I want to get to a point where I never have to work again and I can live off my cashflow. And then after I get to that point, if I decide I want to go do more real estate, if I decide I want to go build a skyscraper, then I’ll go do it. But I’ll always have those assets paid off free and clear, taking care of my family forever.

James:
I got a question for you, Henry.

Henry:
Yeah, I’m here.

James:
You borrow hard money through flipping houses, right?

Henry:
Absolutely.

James:
So if you take a thousand bucks a month, 500 bucks a month, pay down your rental that you’re getting at six and a half, which eats up cash and now you have to borrow money at 12, it’s a net loss. That’s how I look at that. If I’m borrowing money short-term at 10 to 12% and I’m taking that cash that I could just take less leverage on the short-term money and I’m paying down my rental, not only am I paying a higher rate, I’m paying off a loan that it is just a lower mortgage.

Dave:
That’s like a point.

James:
I disagree with you, Henry, unless you’re done flipping houses or accessing short-term capital because why pay down to pay more over here? That doesn’t make any sense.

Dave:
So you’re saying if you had access to that capital, you would just use less debt on your flips to lower your interest costs?

Kathy:
Yes. Okay,

Dave:
That makes sense.

Kathy:
That’s good. Yeah. And then also if let’s just say you really don’t want to grow and you just want to live on cashflow and you leverage your properties at 6% and you take a million cash out of all the properties and you invest it at 10% elsewhere, that’s $40,000 more a year in cashflow just by reinvesting that money passively.

Dave:
That is totally true. If you want to grow,

Kathy:
Not grow, but just cashflow. If you just want to make money on your money,

Dave:
But there’s something about a paid off rental, to me that is one of the lowest risk investments that you can make. And so if you’re trying to create an overall balance in your portfolio, to me, some rentals with low or no leverage, it just provides a backstop
That
Just allows you, for me, a certain piece of mind that is great and honestly allows me to take risk, allows me to put money into syndications. I got some paid off rentals and that’s not going anywhere.

Henry:
I do not claim to be the smartest businessman and I am in no way saying that my plan is the smartest or best way to get there. But I can tell you this, I’m going to pay off 25 to 50 of my rental properties and then I’ll move on to something else. And if it takes me a little longer to get there, it takes me a little longer to get there. That’s just how I’m going to do it. I’m going to do it. That’s the least stressful way I can think of to get to where I want my family to be.

Kathy:
I think Henry’s getting that award. Again,

James:
This is what you call the tortoise and the Harris scenario. Yeah.

Dave:
Okay. The only reason I would say it’s not a tortoise in the hair scenario is because my strategy, and Henry and I have talked about this, and I think Chad Carson talks about this really well too, is that it’s not, you’re not growing. It’s that a certain point, you’ve grown enough, it’s not going slow on purpose. There’s a time to go fast. But once you have a certain level of growth, then there’s a time to say, alright, I’ve worked really hard to get ahead. I’m ahead. So now it’s time to maybe take some risk off the table to make sure and sort of lock in some of that gains that you work so hard for.

Henry:
What James is saying is pay down the debt in a way where you’re not paying as much interest to get there. And I’m open to that. James, you want to come sit down and be my financial advisor and tell me how to get there faster? Let’s hear it. I’m down for it for sure. But as long as the plan is to de-leverage, I mean,

James:
Yeah, well, and I think, yeah, it goes into a ride situation where you’re like, Hey, I want to get this down. And then there’s how do you get to that pain down that balance the fastest, right?

Henry:
Yeah. With you. Look, I told you, I tell everybody, I’m not the smartest businessman in the world. So if you got a better idea for how I can get to my goal that’s going to get me there faster, that’s not going to make my brain explode. Let’s hear it.

Kathy:
And it is what I just said where banks borrow money and then they lend it out and they put a 3% margin on that. So if you think banks are smart and some aren’t and some aren’t, but if you are able to borrow money and lend it out again for 3% more and do it passively, why would you not do that?

Dave:
Because there’s risk to it in lending out money,

Kathy:
There’s risk to lending. And that’s true.

Dave:
That is true. But I mean, it is a great way to make money. But yeah, I guess that would be the only counter argument. But this is a perfect example. There’s no right answer here. You’re going to have to just figure out what’s right for

Henry:
You. Pick your plan and stand on business.

Dave:
Yeah, exactly. I think it’s different. People have different objectives in real estate, which is why we have a whole panel here to talk about different perspectives about how to go about it.

Kathy:
But do talk to your asset protection attorney, because that is one of the things they talk about three different ways to protect yourself. Of course, umbrella insurance, of course LLCs, and then leveraging the property so that it’s really not interesting for somebody to try to take it from you.

Dave:
That is a really good point. I have never thought about that. I didn’t even know that was a thing. Alright, well this was a very fun conversation. Congratulations. You all had the employee of the month for at least one or two minutes. Oh yes. I think James ended with it though. So it’s like the fantasy football trophy. He holds onto it until next time. Next, and then someone else can win it from him. Oh

James:
Wow. Okay. I have an award like this since I was 21 and I was Red robin server of the year and they got me a Letterman’s coat with a big bird on the back.

Henry:
Please, dear God, tell me, you still have this.

James:
I can’t find this coat. How many pieces of

Henry:
Flare did you put on that thing?

James:
Oh, I crushed the promo competition and the review card competition nationwide. I smoked it because that was not playing around.

Dave:
This is my favorite fact that changed. It was for the whole country, right?

James:
Top server of the year, whole country. And then they tried to get me to move to Colorado to work in corporate Red Robin America. And I ran,

Dave:
This is funny, but I’m not even joking. That is legit impressive that you won. That’s our best server for the, that is really a pretty impressive accomplishment. Well, this was a lot of fun. Thank you all so much for being here. We appreciate it. And thank you all so much for listening to this episode of On The Market. We’ll see you next time.