Where to Live Once You Achieve Financial Independence?

Where to Live Once You Achieve Financial Independence?

Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 11 votes

Hello Bigger Pockets!  I'm new to these forums and hoped to ask my first question - for those that have already reached their goals of financial independence, or are are getting close and making plans, I'm curious to hear where you have chosen to live and locate your primary residence or where you're eyeing to do so?  I have spent the last 20 years living in Los Angeles and NYC, but am interested in exploring a much more diverse list of potential cities for "early retirement" (i.e. a place to live when I no longer require traditional employment).  I'm fascinated by the potential to live anywhere without the need to be located in the largest job markets as I have been bound to thus far in my life.  I have a number of years before I will reach my own passive income goals that will allow for this type of freedom, but this search is one of the motivating factors pushing me to achieve those goals.   

A few considerations:

  • Cost - I anticipate having relatively significant resources and want to live in highly desirable locations, but at the same time, I want to cut costs significantly from my lifestyle in the LA market.  To me this means having a primary residence in the under $1mil range (but doesn't necessarily have to be under $500k).
  • I will still have school aged children and need access to great schools, ideally public to avoid the cost of private
  • I would still value the ability to access metropolitan environments, though I don't need to live in the urban core.  Our family loves great restaurants, entertainment, etc. and would find it difficult to lose access to that.
  • No state income tax states get major bonus points
  • We love the outdoors.  Not that we're avid enthusiasts, but we enjoy skiing, scuba diving, etc.  I also greatly appreciate scenic beauty.  I live in a SoCal beach town now, but love the mountains, lakes, etc. as well.
  • Relatively convenient access to a major airport would be valuable to me

I hope this topic isn't too far removed from the real estate discussions most commonly posted to the forums, but I thought many in the Bigger Pockets community would have done a similar analysis in their personal lives and might point me in some interesting directions.  All of the "best places to live" lists and articles online aren't the perfect fit because they often heavily weigh the local employment market, a factor that will be of little relevance to me when I eventually make this jump.

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Dave FosterBusiness Member
Qualified Intermediary for 1031 Exchanges · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 9k+ votes
8y

Well this string is off to an auspicious start.  I like the question @Chris Szepessy.  Its a dream and dreams are just the foundation of a plan to reality.  

But I'd say the answer is today.  That's it today.  You don't know your health in 10 years.  You don't know your interests in 10 years.  You don't know anything about 10 years from now except today.  So the answer to where to live 10 years from now is "where you want to".  And the answer to the same question for today is the same answer.  

And please don't ever forget for a minute that all of those great views, exciting activities, and stunning houses and neighbors are not what your children will remember.  They will only remember your face and your love (well and the refrigerator box one year that was more fun than any of the Christmas presents).  So maybe my ultimate philosophized answer is that the best place to live in 10 years or today, when you're rich or when you're poor is in the hearts and memories of your children and the people you have impacted for good on your journey.

If you define success the right way you'll always achieve it.  

The 1031 Investor5137 Reviews
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  • Specialist · Paradise Valley, AZ · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Mike Akerly:

    Hello Bigger Pockets!  I'm new to these forums and hoped to ask my first question - for those that have already reached their goals of financial independence, or are are getting close and making plans, I'm curious to hear where you have chosen to live and locate your primary residence or where you're eyeing to do so?  I have spent the last 20 years living in Los Angeles and NYC, but am interested in exploring a much more diverse list of potential cities for "early retirement" (i.e. a place to live when I no longer require traditional employment).  I'm fascinated by the potential to live anywhere without the need to be located in the largest job markets as I have been bound to thus far in my life.  I have a number of years before I will reach my own passive income goals that will allow for this type of freedom, but this search is one of the motivating factors pushing me to achieve those goals.   

    A few considerations:

    • Cost - I anticipate having relatively significant resources and want to live in highly desirable locations, but at the same time, I want to cut costs significantly from my lifestyle in the LA market.  To me this means having a primary residence in the under $1mil range (but doesn't necessarily have to be under $500k).
    • I will still have school aged children and need access to great schools, ideally public to avoid the cost of private
    • I would still value the ability to access metropolitan environments, though I don't need to live in the urban core.  Our family loves great restaurants, entertainment, etc. and would find it difficult to lose access to that.
    • No state income tax states get major bonus points
    • We love the outdoors.  Not that we're avid enthusiasts, but we enjoy skiing, scuba diving, etc.  I also greatly appreciate scenic beauty.  I live in a SoCal beach town now, but love the mountains, lakes, etc. as well.
    • Relatively convenient access to a major airport would be valuable to me

    I hope this topic isn't too far removed from the real estate discussions most commonly posted to the forums, but I thought many in the Bigger Pockets community would have done a similar analysis in their personal lives and might point me in some interesting directions.  All of the "best places to live" lists and articles online aren't the perfect fit because they often heavily weigh the local employment market, a factor that will be of little relevance to me when I eventually make this jump.

    When we moved from up north, we looked at Santa Barbara, La Jolla, Newport Beach and settled on a small town next to Phoenix. There are more resorts here than anywhere, golfing galore, great weather (most of the year) low taxes, a big hole in the ground called The Grand Canyon, skiing, (yes an 11,000 ft mountain for skiing) we have more peaks than Colorado I'm told, great hiking both in the desert and in the mountains, exquisite restaurants, nice people, good roads, lots of activities, and we are only hours away from the ocean. According to US News & World Report 6 of the top 10 schools in the country are here.

    https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools...

    Did I mention that investing here is far far easier and more profitable than California? What we don't have are earthquakes, tornadoes, hurricanes, urban forest fires, slides, and tsunamis. I actually don't miss any of those. ;-)

  • Catskill, NY · Member since 2018 · 636 posts · 668 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:
    Originally posted by @Mike Akerly:

    Hello Bigger Pockets!  I'm new to these forums and hoped to ask my first question - for those that have already reached their goals of financial independence, or are are getting close and making plans, I'm curious to hear where you have chosen to live and locate your primary residence or where you're eyeing to do so?  I have spent the last 20 years living in Los Angeles and NYC, but am interested in exploring a much more diverse list of potential cities for "early retirement" (i.e. a place to live when I no longer require traditional employment).  I'm fascinated by the potential to live anywhere without the need to be located in the largest job markets as I have been bound to thus far in my life.  I have a number of years before I will reach my own passive income goals that will allow for this type of freedom, but this search is one of the motivating factors pushing me to achieve those goals.   

    A few considerations:

    • Cost - I anticipate having relatively significant resources and want to live in highly desirable locations, but at the same time, I want to cut costs significantly from my lifestyle in the LA market.  To me this means having a primary residence in the under $1mil range (but doesn't necessarily have to be under $500k).
    • I will still have school aged children and need access to great schools, ideally public to avoid the cost of private
    • I would still value the ability to access metropolitan environments, though I don't need to live in the urban core.  Our family loves great restaurants, entertainment, etc. and would find it difficult to lose access to that.
    • No state income tax states get major bonus points
    • We love the outdoors.  Not that we're avid enthusiasts, but we enjoy skiing, scuba diving, etc.  I also greatly appreciate scenic beauty.  I live in a SoCal beach town now, but love the mountains, lakes, etc. as well.
    • Relatively convenient access to a major airport would be valuable to me

    I hope this topic isn't too far removed from the real estate discussions most commonly posted to the forums, but I thought many in the Bigger Pockets community would have done a similar analysis in their personal lives and might point me in some interesting directions.  All of the "best places to live" lists and articles online aren't the perfect fit because they often heavily weigh the local employment market, a factor that will be of little relevance to me when I eventually make this jump.

    When we moved from up north, we looked at Santa Barbara, La Jolla, Newport Beach and settled on a small town next to Phoenix. There are more resorts here than anywhere, golfing galore, great weather (most of the year) low taxes, a big hole in the ground called The Grand Canyon, skiing, (yes an 11,000 ft mountain for skiing) we have more peaks than Colorado I'm told, great hiking both in the desert and in the mountains, exquisite restaurants, nice people, good roads, lots of activities, and we are only hours away from the ocean. According to US News & World Report 6 of the top 10 schools in the country are here.

    https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools...

    Did I mention that investing here is far far easier and more profitable than California? What we don't have are earthquakes, tornadoes, hurricanes, urban forest fires, slides, and tsunamis. I actually don't miss any of those. ;-)

    I'm at least 10 years from being able to "retire," but occasionally look at places to live once I do. My wife and I plan to travel the US, but I've thought of buying a place in AZ. My brother has been talking about moving there for years and after doing some research, I realized why. You've just confirmed it even more!

  • Dave FosterBusiness Member
    Qualified Intermediary for 1031 Exchanges · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    8y

    Well this string is off to an auspicious start.  I like the question @Chris Szepessy.  Its a dream and dreams are just the foundation of a plan to reality.  

    But I'd say the answer is today.  That's it today.  You don't know your health in 10 years.  You don't know your interests in 10 years.  You don't know anything about 10 years from now except today.  So the answer to where to live 10 years from now is "where you want to".  And the answer to the same question for today is the same answer.  

    And please don't ever forget for a minute that all of those great views, exciting activities, and stunning houses and neighbors are not what your children will remember.  They will only remember your face and your love (well and the refrigerator box one year that was more fun than any of the Christmas presents).  So maybe my ultimate philosophized answer is that the best place to live in 10 years or today, when you're rich or when you're poor is in the hearts and memories of your children and the people you have impacted for good on your journey.

    If you define success the right way you'll always achieve it.  

    The 1031 Investor5137 Reviews
  • Specialist · Paradise Valley, AZ · Member since 2018 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y

    Haven't been to Arizona, eh. That's too bad. You'd probably like it. I didn't have anything to do with making it this way. I'm just answering the man's question. And rather than spurting off abut things you know nothing of, tell us why Coppell TX is the best place in America and worth uprooting and moving to.

  • Investor · Coppell, TX · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 646 votes
    8y

    Hello Mike!  Coppell is popular for any reasons.  Just one is good reason is because it's cheap.  I see bad stuff about California everyday.

  • Scott WolfPro Member
    Lender · Boca Raton, FL · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 956 votes
    8y

    Learn a foreign language and move to one of these places? (great for really expanding the kids global education)

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/02/five-european-cities-where-you-can-retire-on-35000-a-year.html

  • Catskill, NY · Member since 2018 · 636 posts · 668 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Dave Foster:

    Well this string is off to an auspicious start.  I like the question @Chris Szepessy.  Its a dream and dreams are just the foundation of a plan to reality.  

    But I'd say the answer is today.  That's it today.  You don't know your health in 10 years.  You don't know your interests in 10 years.  You don't know anything about 10 years from now except today.  So the answer to where to live 10 years from now is "where you want to".  And the answer to the same question for today is the same answer.  

    And please don't ever forget for a minute that all of those great views, exciting activities, and stunning houses and neighbors are not what your children will remember.  They will only remember your face and your love (well and the refrigerator box one year that was more fun than any of the Christmas presents).  So maybe my ultimate philosophized answer is that the best place to live in 10 years or today, when you're rich or when you're poor is in the hearts and memories of your children and the people you have impacted for good on your journey.

    If you define success the right way you'll always achieve it.  

    You make some very good points. I wish I could vote for your post 10 times.  I guess at this point it is a dream. Lol. In 10 years I’ll be 42 and my kids will be 18 and 21. Hopefully by then I will still be in great health and my kids will independent. But yes, many things can change in the next 10 years. Thanks! 

  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 11 votes
    8y

    @ Mike M:  That's a great list of potential spots.  I know Paradise Valley and it's a beautiful place to live.  I'm actually working on a couple projects in Scottsdale.  It's definitely hard to beat the outdoors in the area.  Thanks for sharing.

  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 11 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Scott Wolf:

    Learn a foreign language and move to one of these places? (great for really expanding the kids global education)

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/02/five-european-citi...

    @Scott Wolf: I would love to do that, at least for a couple of years.   

  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 25 posts · 11 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Dave Foster:

    Well this string is off to an auspicious start.  I like the question @Chris Szepessy.  Its a dream and dreams are just the foundation of a plan to reality.  

    But I'd say the answer is today.  That's it today.  You don't know your health in 10 years.  You don't know your interests in 10 years.  You don't know anything about 10 years from now except today.  So the answer to where to live 10 years from now is "where you want to".  And the answer to the same question for today is the same answer.  

    And please don't ever forget for a minute that all of those great views, exciting activities, and stunning houses and neighbors are not what your children will remember.  They will only remember your face and your love (well and the refrigerator box one year that was more fun than any of the Christmas presents).  So maybe my ultimate philosophized answer is that the best place to live in 10 years or today, when you're rich or when you're poor is in the hearts and memories of your children and the people you have impacted for good on your journey.

    If you define success the right way you'll always achieve it.  

    @ Dave Foster I couldn't agree more that your answer is a great reminder that wee don't always have the luxury of time that we think we might and what the priorities really should be.  To some extent, I need to stay where the work is for a while, but the part about remembering that from your children's perspective it's all about your time and love, is as spot on as it gets.  

  • Lee RipmaPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Prairie Village, KS · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y

    @Mike Akerly

    This is something I think about too and I’m currently in LA as well. I am also building assets and cash flow for that early retirement. I lived in San Diego for 10 years and might just move back. It’s got all the CA problems-high cost, high taxes, traffic. But at the end of the day I might WANT it anyway. 

    Here are some places I’ve considered: 

    Jackson Hole. Wyoming has no state income tax. I love skiing. 4 season recreation. Great lifestyle. No major airport. 

    Park City. Same as above but with Utah state taxes. Major airport. 

    Flagstaff. Skiing and 4 season recreation. Close to CA and close to warm escapes in southern AZ if you are tired of snow. Fairly major airport in Phoenix. 

    Durango. Same as all the others, 4 season reaction and great lifestyle. No major airport. 

    Kansas City. This is where I’m building up my rental holdings. Nice folks, fairly major airport, culture. Low cost of living. Weather not the best. 

    Other places to consider that are not on my list:

    Seattle or other place in Washington state. No income tax. Major airports and culture. Too rainy for me! 

    Would love to hear your short list! 

  • Real Estate Agent · Sevierville TN · Member since 2018 · 305 posts · 224 votes
    8y

    @Mike Akerly the best answer is Anywhere you want!!!

    Personally my very long term goal, and has since been before I even knew the term financial freedom was to own a few hundred acres in Montana or somewhere similar where I’d run a wildlife refuge specializing in wolves. 

    In the interim I hope to spend a lot of time in a lot of places, first plan once freedom becomes reality is Tuscany, I was there for a short visit this summer and fell in love with the history and culture. I want to spend a minimum of 4-6 weeks there. 

  • Catskill, NY · Member since 2018 · 636 posts · 668 votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Derek Tellier:

    @Mike Akerly the best answer is Anywhere you want!!!

    Personally my very long term goal, and has since been before I even knew the term financial freedom was to own a few hundred acres in Montana or somewhere similar where I’d run a wildlife refuge specializing in wolves. 

    In the interim I hope to spend a lot of time in a lot of places, first plan once freedom becomes reality is Tuscany, I was there for a short visit this summer and fell in love with the history and culture. I want to spend a minimum of 4-6 weeks there. 

     Montana! Beautiful state. We traveled through there 20 years ago when my father took us on a cross country trip. If it wasn't cold there, that would be on my short list of places to live as well. I will definitely get back there to visit and stay a while.

  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    8y

    Jackson, Wyoming is one of the most expensive places to live. A modest home will run a cool million.

    The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews
  • Lee RipmaPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Prairie Village, KS · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    8y
    @Nathan G. Also true of San Diego, Los Angeles, and the Bay Area! And CA has state income tax!
  • Rental Property Investor · NY MA CT VT MT, MO · Member since 2015 · 200 posts · 116 votes
    8y

    Bozeman!!  I've been thinking about this for 10 years myself, and have been travelling to every possible place I've considered.

    Aquifer is gigantic so future drought may not be a problem, public schools are unbelievable, everyone is outdoorsy and healthy, so it inspires you and your kids to get outside and appreciate it.  Great airport, though small... Best skiing in the world IMHO, both cross country and downhill.  City's books are stunningly strong.  Very Progressive, and somewhat green.

    I was in Colorado at 9000 feet and loved the altitude, so BZN's altitude works for me.  

    Getting expensive, but in your range.  

  • Rental Property Investor · NY MA CT VT MT, MO · Member since 2015 · 200 posts · 116 votes
    8y

    @Mike Akerly, sorry, forgot to put your handle on there!

    See above

  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    8y

    A mix of San Diego and Grand Cayman. 

  • Olathe, KS · Member since 2018 · 148 posts · 207 votes
    8y

    I keep wondering if people's homes in California are going to get so expensive that they literally can just sell them and retire in the midwest.  I think some people don't even realize how cheap you can live out in small towns in like Nebraska, like $100 rent or sometimes even free.  I remember some friends of mine from high  school were staying in a house (4 of them) for $50 a month...COMBINED, lol.  $12.50 apiece.  The towns are shrinking and rather than let the house fall apart, people will just let other people stay in them just to keep it up.  Not that it would be the most ideal thing for most people, but if you're idea of paradise is a house overlooking a lake on farm within an hour of a major city, those are in ample supply all over the country for a fraction of California prices.

    I find that Denver is one of the nicest places I've been.  But so does everyone else unfortunately.  Skiing at Breckenridge is awesome. 

  • Rental Property Investor · Los Angeles · Member since 2018 · 844 posts · 1k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Aaron Taylor:

    I keep wondering if people's homes in California are going to get so expensive that they literally can just sell them and retire in the midwest.  I think some people don't even realize how cheap you can live out in small towns in like Nebraska, like $100 rent or sometimes even free.  I remember some friends of mine from high  school were staying in a house (4 of them) for $50 a month...COMBINED, lol.  $12.50 apiece.  The towns are shrinking and rather than let the house fall apart, people will just let other people stay in them just to keep it up.  Not that it would be the most ideal thing for most people, but if you're idea of paradise is a house overlooking a lake on farm within an hour of a major city, those are in ample supply all over the country for a fraction of California prices.

    I find that Denver is one of the nicest places I've been.  But so does everyone else unfortunately.  Skiing at Breckenridge is awesome. 

    Sure, we realize the situation and that's why some of us sell our houses and buy both a house and a neighboring local business at the same time. I totally understand that line of reasoning and wanting to get away from the traffic and all the other negatives that accompany big city living. And I applaud those people who have taken that initiative to fulfill their dreams. 

    However, some of us have also lived here all their lives and do not want to move. I've lived in So Cal my whole life and moving to a small city in the Midwest would be too difficult a transition for me. I love living in the big city. Wilshire Blvd, which urban planners at UCLA consider to be the future corridor for metropolitan growth in the city of Los Angeles, is two blocks from where I live. But amazingly, my street is very quiet and has been designated a historical preservation zone. In short, I live in my dream house already because I get the residential feel but trendy shops are within walking distance and I'm also central to everything in LA. 

    My friends and family live here..my wife's friends and family live here. I can't imagine not being able to see them whenever I want. This is why my plan is to achieve the level of financial independence whereby I can keep my 105 year old beautiful money-pit of a home.

    So to answer the OP, my plan is to stay right where I am, but at the same time, I'm sure my wife and I will be traveling 6 months out of the year...vacationing, visiting relatives, who knows.... maybe even visit some of properties of the syndicated deals we've invested in over the years. 

  • Investor · Arlington, VA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 491 votes
    8y

    Denver!  Or maybe Bend, Oregan 

  • Douglas LarsonPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2008 · 410 posts · 337 votes
    8y

    Wow... Fun question! Only you'll know the answer though, and it will take some exploring to figure it out. 

    I lived most of my life in San Diego's North County. I loved it . . . most of the time. 

    I lived in Hawaii for about 10 years - split between Oahu and Maui. I LOVED IT . . . most of the time. 

    I lived for a couple years in Minnesota, another couple years in Colorado and spent a lot of time in England. All fun to visit but not where I wanted to live permanently. 

    I currently live in Utah, where I have some family and some great friends. I love to snowboard and fish and wakeboard. I love it here . . . most of the time. The cost of living is about 50% less than San Diego or Hawaii or England, if you don't fall for the 6,000 sq. ft. home and the Big Toys for every season. It's fairly easy to run my real estate business here and it's fairly easy to travel to warmer spots when I get sick of the cold. The schools are good for my 3 kids and it's a great place for families overall. The Mormon influence is significant and not for everyone, but it's been great for us! If you make it out this way in your search for Utopia, drop me a message and I'll show you around. . . unless I'm visiting Maui.

    Have fun!

  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    8y

    I think most people would classify me as financially independent and I live in San Diego but not because I think it is perfect.  I live here because my family is here. my friends and my wife's and child's friends are here, and my RE investments are here.

    San Diego has a lot of nice features (weather, recreation, beach, mountains, desert, etc.) but it is also crowded, air could be better, and it is not cheap. 

    I liked San Diego much better 25 years ago than I like San Diego today (much less crowds).  When it snows you cannot go to the local mountains due to the traffic.  When the desert wild flowers are in bloom, you cannot go see them on the weekend due to the traffic.  Try to find an isolated beach spot; When I was a teenager I knew a handful of beach  spots that would have no one in sight.

    Even with the short-comings, I would be hard pressed to choose a location in the US I would choose over it (maybe Santa Barbara area) even if I did not have the personal attachments.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Dan H.:

    I think most people would classify me as financially independent and I live in San Diego but not because I think it is perfect.  I live here because my family is here. my friends and my wife's and child's friends are here, and my RE investments are here.

    San Diego has a lot of nice features (weather, recreation, beach, mountains, desert, etc.) but it is also crowded, air could be better, and it is not cheap. 

    I liked San Diego much better 25 years ago than I like San Diego today (much less crowds).  When it snows you cannot go to the local mountains due to the traffic.  When the desert wild flowers are in bloom, you cannot go see them on the weekend due to the traffic.  Try to find an isolated beach spot; When I was a teenager I knew a handful of beach  spots that would have no one in sight.

    Even with the short-comings, I would be hard pressed to choose a location in the US I would choose over it (maybe Santa Barbara area) even if I did not have the personal attachments.

    Totally agree. I love San diego.  Have you thought about getting out of the east county burb of Poway and moving to SD proper? I grew up in Escondido before moving to pacific beach, then downtown, now mission hills (where I’m about to add a third story to my house since I can’t bring myself to pay cash for a bigger house in this market)

    Not trying to bag too much on Poway but I think it’s not the best example of what SD has to offer 

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