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All Forum Posts by: Leo R.

Leo R. has started 16 posts and replied 584 times.

Post: New Construction buy and hold

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693

@Michael A. I think you may be operating under a few assumptions that I'd suggest re-considering...

First, buying a cashflow negative property with the assumption that it will appreciate and become cashflow positive in the future is the definition of speculation. ...which begs the question: do you have a net worth that can withstand the hit if your speculation doesn't pan out?  ...Warren Buffet has a net worth that can withstand a few speculative purchases that don't pan out...but, unfortunately, most of us are not Warren Buffet :(    

Speculative purchases should only be a very small percentage of an investor's net worth because, at the end of the day, nobody knows what markets will do in the future.

Second, you mentioned that you're focusing on new construction because you want a property that has minimal headaches/maintenance issues.

One of the biggest misconceptions by inexperienced RE investors is that new houses are inherently less costly/less headache to maintain than older houses. This is true some times, but in some scenarios, brand new properties end up producing significantly MORE maintenance/repair headaches than older properties.

The reasons are:

1) Some building techniques/materials are far superior to those used in the past, but some are not, and some are unproven. For instance, I'm very doubtful that pex will have a longer service life than copper plumbing. The trend toward flat roofs is just silly in most areas (bc it causes water diversion problems, which then cause a myriad of other problems). Lumber quality today is mostly trash. Etc., etc.

2) A new house hasn't gone through its "growing pains" phase. All sorts of problems can emerge in the first few years. For instance, inadequate/improperly designed water diversion systems can cause major problems (e.g.; rot, masonry degradation, foundation settling) that won't emerge for several years. I personally know people who bought brand new, multi-million dollar, beautiful luxury homes, only to have serious foundation settling over the first 5-10 years of ownership (and the repair bill was in the hundreds of thousands!).

On the other hand, an older house has been around so long that these types of problems have either occurred and been addressed by previous owners, or they're often plainly visible. For instance, if there's an unresolved settling issue, you can probably see cracks in the foundation, buckling, un-level floors, un-plumb doors, etc. ...but, if everything is solid now on an old house, it'll probably remain pretty solid for the foreseeable future. As my GC says: "if it's stood straight and true for the last 100 years, it'll probably make it at least another 25".

I own properties from the 1910s, 1940s, 1960s, and early 2000s –and frankly, the older properties are some of my best performing, and least headache-causing properties of the portfolio!

Don't get me wrong; there are plenty of issues/problems/quirks that old houses have that new houses don't, and an old house can obviously have hidden problems and big repair/maintenance bills too--which is why thorough due diligence is fundamental to REI...but, the point is: a brand new house is not a foolproof solution to repairs/maintenance headaches (and in some cases, a brand new house can be a much bigger gamble than an older house).

This is a particularly important lesson for inexperienced investors, who tend to be the most prone to "shiny object syndrome" (the tendency to let nice aesthetics distract from real, underlying issues). There are no shortage of lipsticked pig properties out there, and learning to spot them is essential for successful RE investing...we're all susceptible to "shiny object syndrome", but being aware of it is the first step to avoiding it!

Good luck out there!

Post: Trouble Grasping This Concept:

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693

@Chris Farinella as @Drew C Grossman a lot of it boils down to: rent does not increase proportionately to the price of the property.

Why does rent not increase proportionately with the price of the property?

Some of it has to do with the fact that the market for a higher priced property is fundamentally different than the market for a lower priced property.

For instance, let's say you had a very expensive rental that you were trying to rent for $10k/month. If someone can afford $10k/month rent, they probably also have the money to buy a pretty nice property (and many do)--making it harder for you to find a tenant. 

Also, the higher the rent, the smaller the tenant pool of people who can afford to pay that rent--again, making it harder for you to find a tenant. ...and there's a point where a rent price is so high that it becomes  impossible to place a tenant. 

These factors help create a ceiling effect--where, no matter how much the house is worth, there's a limit on how much you can charge in rent.

And, as you mentioned--if leverage is involved, the debt service of a more expensive property often overshadows how much you can charge in rent.

These factors contribute to rent not increasing proportionately with the price of the house (and there are probably other factors too, that I'm just not thinking of at the moment...haven't had my coffee yet).

Having said that, there are some extremely niche markets with rental properties that cater to multi millionaires, and which are extremely expensive (certain areas of LA, for instance...probably the French Riviera --where there are probably lots of transient tenants worth tens or hundreds of millions)...but, those types of markets are obviously the exception to the rule...

Good luck out there!

@Sean Bramble how much does it cost?  

A lot of these types of programs tend to be extremely expensive (thousands or even tens of thousands)...Although I'd definitely recommend surrounding yourself with as many experienced mentors as possible, I'd be pretty hesitant to spend large sums--especially not before the coach/mentor had proven that they were providing assistance that was worth whatever you were paying...

Quote from @Chris Mason:
Quote from @Leo R.:

LOL ....next up: a videogame simulator for doing your taxes. "TaxMaster 2023"   :)

 We have supply chain issues in our country, not he least of which is a shortage of truck drivers.

Flipping through tiktok (hold your laughter until the end, please), guess what I saw on tiktok "live," with THOUSANDS of viewers? 

A tiktok live of a dude playing a long haul truck driver simulation. But it wasn't just the video game, he had 3 or 4 monitors, 180 degree view, a steering wheel, pedals, an 18 gear shifter, you name it. He probably spent more on his setup than it would take to get the actual license. Like... dude.... GO DRIVE A TRUCK IRL. Get paid for it!

The folks sitting there watching this guy drive a truck through fake rush hour traffic (oh no, this wasn't an "action" game, it was a "simulation," very realistic) for hours on end? I don't even know what to say, except to hope that it's all kids who do not yet know the pain of rush hour commute, and think all things "grown up" are cool grown up things. 


 what a time to be alive!

@Sean Smyth it's not really possible to provide a "correct" answer because it depends on dozens of factors you haven't mentioned...for instance:

What's the grade of the property?

What's the grade of the neighborhood?

How much hassle will the property be to manage?

What's the tenant pool like, and how easy is it to find good tenants?

What types of rehab / capex costs will be required? (if any)

How many units is the property?

How much does the property cashflow, given different financing terms?

What's the purchase price of the property?

What types, and how many exit plans are feasible?

How much could a significant unanticipated capex cost, and how would you pay for that?

What type of financing terms can you get, and what type of access would you have to additional lines of credit?

etc., etc., etc.

I'd suggest writing these types of factors down and weighing how important each is to you--doing that will give you a better idea of how to proceed.

Good luck out there!

Post: No cash flow. Does it make sense ?

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693

@Amar Amar you mentioned you "want to play safe, buy relatively new houses".  The age of the house alone really has little to do with how "safe" it is to invest in the property, and looking only for newer houses might end up working against you--and could even prevent you from cashflowing.

One of the biggest misconceptions by inexperienced investors is that new houses are inherently less costly, and less headache to maintain than older houses. This is true some times, but in some scenarios, brand new properties end up producing significantly MORE maintenance/repair headaches than older properties.

The reasons are:

1) Some building techniques/materials are far superior to those used in the past, but some are not, and some are unproven. For instance, I'm very doubtful that pex will have a longer service life than copper plumbing. The trend toward flat roofs is just silly in most areas (bc it causes water diversion problems, which then cause a myriad of other problems). Etc.

2) A new house hasn't gone through its "growing pains" phase. All sorts of problems can emerge in the first few years. For instance, inadequate/improperly designed water diversion systems can cause major problems (e.g.; rot, masonry degradation, foundation settling) that won't emerge for several years. I personally know people who bought brand new, multi-million dollar, beautiful luxury homes, only to have serious foundation settling over the first 5-10 years of ownership (and the repair bill was in the hundreds of thousands!).

On the other hand, an older house has been around so long that these types of problems have either been addressed by previous owners, or they're often plainly visible. For instance, if there's an unresolved settling issue, you can probably see cracks in the foundation, buckling, un-level floors, un-plumb doors, etc. ...but, if everything is solid now on an old house, it'll probably remain pretty solid for the foreseeable future. As my GC says: "if it's stood straight and true for the last 100 years, it'll probably make it at least another 25".

I own properties from the 1910s, 1940s, 1960s, and early 2000s –and frankly, the older properties are some of my best performing, and least headache-causing properties of the portfolio!

Don't get me wrong; there are plenty of issues/problems/quirks that old houses have that new houses don't, and an old house can obviously have hidden problems and big repair/maintenance bills too (which is why you need a strong due diligence process)...but, the point is: a new house is not a foolproof solution to repairs/maintenance (and in some cases, a brand new house can be a much bigger gamble than an older house!).

This is a particularly important lesson for inexperienced investors, who tend to be the most prone to "shiny object syndrome" (the tendency to let nice aesthetics distract from real, underlying issues). There are no shortage of lipsticked pig properties out there, and learning to spot them is essential for successful RE investing...we're all susceptible to "shiny object syndrome", but being aware of it is the first step to avoiding it!

Lastly: cashflow v. appreciation. If you are buying a property that doesn't cashflow, and you're just *hoping* it will appreciate and cashflow in the future, you're not investing--you are speculating. ...it's one thing for Warren Buffet to put a small fraction of his net worth toward speculative purchases, but for those of us not named Warren Buffet, speculation is basically gambling. Anyone making speculative purchases on cashflow negative properties had better have the net worth to absorb the loss if their speculation doesn't pan out.

Good luck out there!

Post: Pros and Cons of using a Mortgage broker

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693
Quote from @Kevin Pfeil:

@Leo R. Thanks for the advice! Very good points with not all brokers are created equal. I guess the most logical question is how did you find a good one for yourself? I am looking on findamortgagebroker.com but I'm not sure how to tell the different brokers apart. There's a solid list of brokers for the Madison area, however I'm only seeing one person who has an actual review. What would you recommend in trying to find a solid broker?

I found him via word of mouth...First, I found an "investor friendly" agent (who has a TON of experience in nearly every area of residential REI--I've also continued to work with him for many years and across many deals), and he suggested the broker... so, I'd suggest asking around to see if anyone you know has a broker they like--especially ask other RE pros like agents and investors at your local REIA.

Also, there were some signs right off the bat that this broker probably knew his stuff...he was a middle aged guy who was one of the highest grossing brokers in the area, and he could tell me--in detail--about his level of experience...plus, whenever I would ask him fairly technical questions, he either always had a thorough answer, or--if he didn't know the answer--he would openly admit that he didn't know, but then he would look into it and quickly get back to me.  His customer service was quick, detailed, and very professional. In all our conversations, he came across as highly competent, and HIGHLY detail-oriented (which is what you want)...all these things indicated that he was a pro.  Over the years, he's only continued to prove that he's one of the best around, and so I keep doing business with him...

There are probably articles/forum posts/other resources out there on how to screen/interview brokers, agents and other professionals--probably worth studying up on those resources.

Good luck!


Post: Duplex for house hack

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693
Quote from @Patrick Buntubwimana:

Thank you @Leo R.,

Let me break it down.

Property price 212,000

3.5% 

...is it actually still possible to get an FHA loan for 3.5%? (that sounds way low, but I'm not an FHA expert--if a lending pro can educate us on that, it would be helpful).

FHA loan for 30 years.

one unit has a bedroom which I will be living in. another units has three bedrooms which will be rented $1200.

Okay, so it brings in $1200 while you're living in one unit. How much rent will it bring in if both units are rented? (because presumably, you won't be living there forever).

And what are the total monthly expense? (incl. mortgage payment, mountainous, and PM fees)?--this is one of THE most important factors, and I don't think you mentioned it--so we don't know what the cashflow looks like...

B class neighborhood.

It does need small stuff for safety like Handrails and riders.

I am not sure how easy but so far they told me that tenants are always available on this area. I will hire a property manager. 

I'd strongly suggest against taking other peoples' word for how "easy" it is to find tenants (or anything else)--it's YOUR responsibility to do that due diligence. ...it's OK to trust what others say, but always verify what they say--ESPECIALLY on issues that are critical to the financial viability of the property (like the tenant pool).


Post: New Real Estate Investor

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693

@Kaz Iyama first off, you do NOT need to pay $20k (or anything close to that) to learn the fundamentals of real estate investing--all the most important info on REI is available for free, or for very little money (the cost of a few books).

Before you can ever find a partner or mentor, you'll need answer the question: "What value am I bringing to the partnership?" ...if you're not 100% clear on this, then a partnership/mentorship will never materialize, and if it does materialize, it will likely fail. The value you bring might be in the form of capital, experience, access to deals, the ability to put in a lot of work, etc., etc., but you have to bring SOMETHING to the table. 

Regardless of what type of value you bring, it has to be sufficiently valuable for the partner/mentor to benefit (and if the partner/mentor is a highly experienced and successful RE investor, they ain't gonna come cheap! --this is because perceived "value" depends on a person's net worth. For instance, a thousand bucks holds totally different "value" to a poor person (for whom it could be life-changing) than it does to a millionaire (for whom it's almost pocket change). If I have no net worth, and you do something that saves me (or makes me) a thousand bucks, you've just changed my life!...but, if I'm a millionaire, I really couldn't care less if you saved or made me a thousand bucks--I've got much bigger fish to fry!

Why should a high net-worth, highly experienced investor put their time, money, experience, reputation, and resources on the line for someone with no experience? ...you'll have to answer that question if you want to figure out a partnership/mentorship with anyone who brings any real value to the table.

Now, I'm not saying these things to try to dissuade you from finding mentors--quite the opposite; I'd highly recommend surrounding yourself with successful mentors! I'm just saying these things to hopefully give you a better idea of how to find a good mentor.  I have partnered with, and have also mentored inexperienced aspiring RE investors in the past, but those arrangements were mutually beneficial, and the partner or mentee brought significant value to the table.

You are on the right track mentioning local REIAs--those are great places to start networking; I'd definitely suggest attending those meetings. Go to REIA meetings regularly, keep engaging with BP forums, tell everyone you know that you're looking to meet real estate professionals, and soon enough you'll be building a network of mentors and colleagues.

Good luck out there!

Post: Duplex for house hack

Leo R.Posted
  • Investor
  • Posts 590
  • Votes 693

@Patrick Buntubwimana this isn't necessarily enough info for us to go on....as others have mentioned, these "rules" aren't absolute, and how closely you should follow a rule depends on other factors...

We need to know other factors, such as:

What's the price of the property?

How much will you put down?

What type of financing will you use, and what are the basic terms?

What will be the monthly cashflow? (both with you living in one unit, and also with you renting both units)

Does the property need any rehab or does it have impending capex, and if so, how much?

What's the grade of the property, and the grade of the neighborhood?

How easy (or difficult) will it be to find and keep tenants for this property, and how easy will it be to manage?

etc.

...provide this type of info, and the forums will be able to provide you with much better feedback.

Good luck out there!