How do you KNOW your lender isn't going to buy your find?

49 Replies

@Eric Adobo I may or may not be the first person to call this out, but subtle isn't my M.O. You've been on BP for less than a week, and from what I've seen so far, I wonder: do you have anything NOT negative/critical to say about anything? Are you posting everywhere like mad to actually help other people, or is it just to make yourself feel like you're a better person? Because the tone of your posts say it's the latter. If BP had an award for "Most Negative Attitude" you'd be a runaway winner.

@Michele B. Thank you for your comment. I'm not exactly Hard Money experienced, but I did notice they all want to know the address before they will give you numbers. It's understandable, but we fill out an online form, click send and give them all the details... I lost a local property within 12 hours. It was available, then *POOF* all gone the same afternoon after I made 2 inquiries about financing..... I guess I'm old school and want to make sure financing is approved before making the commitment. Money talks, B.S. walks. :)

I'm not eyeing your deals. I do this for a living. No one deal is worth a career. I maybe could see a part timer doing it, that person who has a full time W2 job, and is an MLO on the side, and is an insurance agent, and is 3 other things -- that guy might.

As someone doing this for a living, however... No. Just like your dentist isn't going to steal your wallet while you're knocked out. I could ask "How do you KNOW your dentist isn't going to steal your wallet?"

Now, if you decide you don't want the property, over a reason that I think is overblown in your head, and I think it's a great deal at that price and under those terms regardless of that issue that is scaring you off, might I call the listing agent and pitch him on selling it to me? Sure, but I'll tell you first: "I think you're wrong and this property is a great deal... if you don't buy it, I will." And then I'll send you a "thank you" card & offer to buy you dinner once a year when I'm done working up my Schedule E. :P

But, almost every time, the reason for someone backing out is a good one and the above statement is uttered not. One of my colleagues who has been doing this 25 years has picked up a grand total of three properties this way. One every 8 years...

I only utilize reputable Hard Money Lenders in NJ that other guys have done business with. Besides, most lenders are hesitant to even lend in my area (It real Ghetto) so I don't have that problem haha

@Peter Prawel Man Peter, with me being a broker here in chicago, i feel like my response needs to be loaded with scenarios but I'll just keep it simple. Personally I've never considered such a thing. I'm to busy trying to keep my pipeline filled along with getting my loans to closing. Also, this is a business based on trust and rapport. I'm not saying they're aren't snakes in any profession but i am saying myself and the lenders i work with are some pretty awesome folks who focus on getting the deal through so you as an investor can make money and hopefully use us again on your next project. If someone is that shady, they won't last long in this business or any business for that matter. Please try to believe in the good guys out here in the world and stay on the hunt for your deals Sir 👍😉

I have enjoyed this conversation with everyone and I hope it continues.... Please Understand, I'm not trying to give lenders a black eye but the property was sitting in a rural area and was a bank owned undervalued property.  It had sat for 12 days with no action... I had called the realtor to inquire if it was available,  he said yes... Then I made 2 inquiries on the financing.  The next morning i called to get the offer going.... Gee, someone had just made an offer!  The timing was just odd.... I had slept overnight and the place was gone by morning....  so obviously I'm scratching my head....  It "could" have been a coincidence that someone showed up at 8pm and did the deal. but it also was VERY LIKELY that I attracted interest in a deal that had been out there sleeping and I placed a big neon sign right on top.... I'll never know.  Since then? Well I've hesitated in sharing the specifics of the deal.   It's nothing personal. The timing was just too much to be a coincidence. Who knows...   

@Eric Adobo I don't really understand what youre trying to say. But we are talking about real estate. Where each property could potentially bring in thousands of dollars. People complaining about bank accounts are probably just irresponsible. People investing in RE are generally responsible. 

I think the people concerned about being scammed, have either been scammed previously, have trust issues, or just realize that its a dog eat dog world... the majority of people in this world only want to benefit themselves (that's just the truth). But like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned that type of attitude doesn't last long. But the point is, that it can and does happen sometimes. Doesn't mean you cant trust the majority of the lenders.

Originally posted by @Peter Prawel :

I have enjoyed this conversation with everyone and I hope it continues.... Please Understand, I'm not trying to give lenders a black eye but the property was sitting in a rural area and was a bank owned undervalued property.  It had sat for 12 days with no action... I had called the realtor to inquire if it was available,  he said yes... Then I made 2 inquiries on the financing.  The next morning i called to get the offer going.... Gee, someone had just made an offer!  The timing was just odd.... I had slept overnight and the place was gone by morning....  so obviously I'm scratching my head....  It "could" have been a coincidence that someone showed up at 8pm and did the deal. but it also was VERY LIKELY that I attracted interest in a deal that had been out there sleeping and I placed a big neon sign right on top.... I'll never know.  Since then? Well I've hesitated in sharing the specifics of the deal.   It's nothing personal. The timing was just too much to be a coincidence. Who knows...   

 One thing you could do is just get pre qualed up front this happens all the time.. just call your lender and say you have some offers to make but they require prequal letters.. You need that before you can make the offer so you don't have a property in mind … For instance my wife wont work with anyone who has not been pre qualed by a lender she knows can close..  doing these on line without talking to someone I can see how that happens your just robo qualifying.. get on the horn and talk to someone.. :)

the market in all areas is pretty brisk these days so its not unusual for an offer to come in.. someone may have been looking at this property for a few days and the offer just got in and signed around.. unless you talked to the listing agent you have no way of knowing if the offer was presented 3 days ago and a round of counters went back and forth and it just became pending.. 

I had some guy here on BP from Portland call me or PM about a deal in Portland he wanted to sell or flip.. Now I realize he was a wholesaler but he was super paranoid.. he would not give me the address until we met and talked.. and he said he wanted to do business with what he called a friend so he wanted to meet for drinks ( Dutch of course LOL)  I told him I have plenty of friends don't need anymore and I don't want to have drinks with you.. if you don't want to give me the address then there is nothing more for us to talk about.. LOL  and left it at that..  I have not seen this guy on BP in a year just another wholesaler that appears to be a one and one player.

Originally posted by @Peter Prawel :

I have enjoyed this conversation with everyone and I hope it continues.... Please Understand, I'm not trying to give lenders a black eye but the property was sitting in a rural area and was a bank owned undervalued property.  It had sat for 12 days with no action... I had called the realtor to inquire if it was available,  he said yes... Then I made 2 inquiries on the financing.  The next morning i called to get the offer going.... Gee, someone had just made an offer!  The timing was just odd.... I had slept overnight and the place was gone by morning....  so obviously I'm scratching my head....  It "could" have been a coincidence that someone showed up at 8pm and did the deal. but it also was VERY LIKELY that I attracted interest in a deal that had been out there sleeping and I placed a big neon sign right on top.... I'll never know.  Since then? Well I've hesitated in sharing the specifics of the deal.   It's nothing personal. The timing was just too much to be a coincidence. Who knows...   

 Share the deal. .......

Originally posted by @Steve B. :
@Peter Prawel someone made a post here once talking about how his hard money lender kept backing out of his deals only to find out later tjat the lender bought three of them himself and kept it secret while still getting him to bird-dog more deals

 That's disgusting.  Seriously, don't know how people sleep at night.  

Originally posted by @Peter Prawel :

I have enjoyed this conversation with everyone and I hope it continues.... Please Understand, I'm not trying to give lenders a black eye but the property was sitting in a rural area and was a bank owned undervalued property.  It had sat for 12 days with no action... I had called the realtor to inquire if it was available,  he said yes... Then I made 2 inquiries on the financing.  The next morning i called to get the offer going.... Gee, someone had just made an offer!  The timing was just odd.... I had slept overnight and the place was gone by morning....  so obviously I'm scratching my head....  It "could" have been a coincidence that someone showed up at 8pm and did the deal. but it also was VERY LIKELY that I attracted interest in a deal that had been out there sleeping and I placed a big neon sign right on top.... I'll never know.  Since then? Well I've hesitated in sharing the specifics of the deal.   It's nothing personal. The timing was just too much to be a coincidence. Who knows...   

 I doubt it. You know the old saying "There's nothing new under the sun"? It's entirely likely it was just coincidental. That's a good reason you should always have your checkbook ready. If it was that tremendous of a deal, you should have been ready to put your offer in right there, instead of inquiring about financing and sleeping on it only to find it was gone in the morning. Just by you calling did not prompt the realtor to whip out his rolodex (does anyone still use those?) and start calling everyone he ever met, just trying to get it locked under contract. No, what would have been more likely if it was *not* a coincidence would have been another offer or two and a call for best and final. If they were ready to lock it up - as would be the case here, if it was "gone" by morning, which means they were already under contract - then you would have had it locked up that day. 

Originally posted by @Steve B. :

@David Weintraub have you read the wholesaler posts or those guys who post about collecting data from the obituaries to go after deals from beareaved widows?  We have people posting borderline shady antics in here daily 

  I don't get when a person passes why the landlord has to  wait weeks be4 

taking care of business. Per most here.. 

If I died in a rental I'd want my heir to contact the landlord the next day. The world doesn't stop because I die. 

@JD Martin I appreciate your input. As we all know, realtors are human. Lenders are human. I'm not here to give anyone a black eye but as we all know, small town business shuts down at 4pm. :) My hunch is that I awoke a sleeping deal. Whether it was the realtor or the financial, who knows... but this was definitely the fish that got away.... You all were correct, I should of been right on that contract. but sight unseen? Well that makes everybody a little nervous... Lesson learned? I guess I'll have to quietly stalk my prey.
Originally posted by @Peter Prawel :
@JD Martin I appreciate your input. As we all know, realtors are human. Lenders are human. I'm not here to give anyone a black eye but as we all know, small town business shuts down at 4pm. :) My hunch is that I awoke a sleeping deal. Whether it was the realtor or the financial, who knows... but this was definitely the fish that got away.... You all were correct, I should of been right on that contract. but sight unseen? Well that makes everybody a little nervous... Lesson learned? I guess I'll have to quietly stalk my prey.

 Not really. I have signed an offer on a house sight unseen only from pictures and based on the seller's description. I had an inspection contingency in there so that if anything was missing/damaged/undisclosed I had the ability to make it right, and if not I was in the clear. As it turned out, the house had numerous defects and I told them we would have to renegotiate or the deal would be dead. We couldn't meet on price and I walked. A couple of weeks later, after someone else had walked, I resubmitted an offer to them based on what the numbers should have been based on the condition of the property and they accepted.

After a while, you can just about judge whether something is a deal, or potential deal, or not just from some pictures, the price, and an understanding of the geography on the ground. Your inspection contingency covers you for problems not disclosed or discovered after inspection. 

As JD pointed out, make offers with contingencies.  End of day, know your market.

There are black eyes for every profession, be it lenders, realtors, the president, PRIESTS, you name it.  

If you can't read another person you're ultimately DEKCUF.  

Link <---this will cheer you up... 

Originally posted by @Peter Prawel :
@Michele B. Thank you for your comment. I'm not exactly Hard Money experienced, but I did notice they all want to know the address before they will give you numbers. It's understandable, but we fill out an online form, click send and give them all the details... I lost a local property within 12 hours. It was available, then *POOF* all gone the same afternoon after I made 2 inquiries about financing..... I guess I'm old school and want to make sure financing is approved before making the commitment. Money talks, B.S. walks. :)

 I have never asked for the address of the property until I know the client is under contract for the property.  Seems there must be others who don't do business that way. We must be different than the rest.  Maybe why we have 8 billion in loans already this year. 

@Peter Prawel I knew my potential lenders before I knew the property they would be lending on. I would say it might behoove you to establish relationships with lenders ahead of time so you know you've got that part of your team locked down. It'll also help speed things up once you actually find a property you would like to put an offer on.

Originally posted by @Michele B. :
Originally posted by @Peter Prawel:
@Michele B. Thank you for your comment. I'm not exactly Hard Money experienced, but I did notice they all want to know the address before they will give you numbers. It's understandable, but we fill out an online form, click send and give them all the details... I lost a local property within 12 hours. It was available, then *POOF* all gone the same afternoon after I made 2 inquiries about financing..... I guess I'm old school and want to make sure financing is approved before making the commitment. Money talks, B.S. walks. :)

 I have never asked for the address of the property until I know the client is under contract for the property.  Seems there must be others who don't do business that way. We must be different than the rest.  Maybe why we have 8 billion in loans already this year. 

 Wow 8 B in 6 months  16B in one year that makes you guys top 20 in the US  right up there with BOA  WElls Fargo US bank etc..

pretty impressive.

For most of us little guys the reason we want an address or me personally is I want to google it and make sure I want to loan on it before I waste anyone's time.. very simple.. big lenders who have no personal connection and never meet their borrower or actually see the property I can get that.. its all just a process.. Most of us guys that have small HML companies we are hands on .. and know our clients personally and visit the properties etc.

I lost a property once when I submitted my 1031, actually what happened was it verbally went pending (not accepting backups) the night I turned my paperwork in. The next day it "officially" went pending. Due to time zone differences etc I felt got poached...but really I just had bad luck lol.