Having a hard time growing.. Looking for ideas

Having a hard time growing.. Looking for ideas

Rental Property Investor · White Plains, NY · Member since 2018 · 348 posts · 86 votes

Hey all, 

I've been in the real estate game for a good many years, and I will say I've learned more from my failures than my successes.  I originally started with 2 and 3 family homes, which I purchased with cash.  Then I purchased one rehab in a good area, but been fighting with the city government on approvals for the last year.  And I purchased so far one multi-family in a good area, which is doing fine.  The others are in C areas and I own them outright.  I tended to buy the small buildings because I can buy them for cash and not have to worry about a mortgage.  Since most of these tenants are, well, low income, section 8/dss or blue collar, we've had a few evictions over the year.  It's annoying enough having to evict and turn over the unit, but it's even more annoying and stressful if I had to also pay for a mortgage.  I am thinking maybe I should shoot for larger 1.25 million dollar properties or higher so I can take advantage of the Freddie Mac Small Balance Loan program.  I do not seem to be growing with this small units.  I believe it's partly because over the past two years I had to rehab two buildings completely and redo and rebuild a commercial space.  I am still fighting the city on a downtown building, which is taking forever to get approved (they approved the work, but not the materials if you can believe this).  I can sell the building vacant and unfinished, but since I dumped 200k into the building (after completions, the building will be worth over 600k. Paid 35k for it), I think these three buildings have been taking a lot of my profits to get them completed.  Two out of three are now complete, so things should be hopefully smoother.  However, me and my team seem to always have to run after a handful of tenants to pay their rent.

So, in terms of DRTL, should I look into slowly selling off these small buildings (I'd profit 30%+ on each) and look for more expensive ones so I can grow?  I just do not feel like I am growing anymore.

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Charles SoperPro Member
Rental Property Investor · Merritt Island, FL · Member since 2015 · 253 posts · 178 votes
7y

Agree with @Luke Miller and @Greg Dickerson, systems and larger properties. You could 1031 into larger B and C class properties in good or gentrifying areas and get rid of the “chasing tenants for rents” inefficiency.  Can’t really speak to the commercial spaces but it would seem that just staying on top of the city folks to get your approvals so you can finish is key, get it stabilized and move on.

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  • Developer · Charlottesville, VA · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y

    @Account Closed the way to grow is to do more volume am or larger deals. I prefer the bigger deals. They are easier and do not require much more effort than small deals. Sometimes even less.

    Scaling is all about systems and efficiency. Making the and doing the most with the least amount of time energy and effort.

    I am happy to help. Feel feee to reach out if you would like to discuss your situation and strategy.

  • Investor · Front Royal, VA · Member since 2013 · 586 posts · 418 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed that sounds frustrating. I think the biggest "scaling" moment for me wasn't focusing on purchasing as many units as possible, but instead focusing on the best value units. In my situation that was focusing on B and C class tenants in desirable areas. 

    I think the answer to your question depends on where you want to be in real estate investing. If it were me, i'd sell the properties and roll that money into something like commercial syndication. That's a big way to scale, but you can afford the better tenant base and professional property management. 

  • Charles SoperPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Merritt Island, FL · Member since 2015 · 253 posts · 178 votes
    7y

    Agree with @Luke Miller and @Greg Dickerson, systems and larger properties. You could 1031 into larger B and C class properties in good or gentrifying areas and get rid of the “chasing tenants for rents” inefficiency.  Can’t really speak to the commercial spaces but it would seem that just staying on top of the city folks to get your approvals so you can finish is key, get it stabilized and move on.

  • Real Estate Agent · Luray, VA · Member since 2016 · 460 posts · 293 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed  It sounds like scaling into larger deals (in good areas) would be the best route based on your original post.  Maybe you could hold onto the deals that aren't requiring as much of your time and are producing decent returns while selling off the other ones in order to focus on larger deals?  

    Some people will also look at the ROI/ROE for the properties that have been purchased with cash since they are likely to be giving pretty low percentage returns. Looking at the properties from ROI/ROE and a time point of view may help you make the decision.

  • Investor · Front Royal, VA · Member since 2013 · 586 posts · 418 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed syndication is just a fancy word for group investing. You can pool investor money together and purchase larger commercial sized buildings as a way to scale. Of course it gets much more complicated, but the foundation is simple. 

  • Rental Property Investor · NJ/PA · Member since 2016 · 555 posts · 149 votes
    7y

    Why not fastest - value -growing class A property?   Close to largest cities  

  • Investor · Morrisville, NC · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 673 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed If you have access to millions (that's the impression I have from reading your previous post), then you should definitely consider value Add investing via forced appreciation. You would need the expertise to understand how to buy undervalue, increase NOI and exit/refinance.

  • Realtor · McLean, VA · Member since 2009 · 184 posts · 80 votes
    7y

    If you structure the syndication right there won't be too many cooks in the kitchen.  The partners you raise capital from are passive investors so you still control the deal.  Multifamily is a team sport but you are still the coach.

  • Investor · Northbrook, IL · Member since 2017 · 352 posts · 295 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed -  What is your definition of grow?  You have increased the number of units, and types which is by definition growth.  Please elaborate.

  • Investor · Fishers, IN · Member since 2012 · 520 posts · 499 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed I know exactly how you feel. I too was in residential REI with SFH's and then "graduated" to multi-family many years ago. And I too learned many hard lessons along the way, the main one (because it hurt the most) was being on the verge of a financial collapse.

    At my wife's consistent prodding & urging we turned our attention to Self Storage.  Beforehand it had never crossed my mind because, well, we were "sophisticated" investors.

    Since then we've never looked back.  And did I mention there's no toilets, no tenants, no trash?  In fact, we now own only one house - the one we live in, but lots of rentable square footage around the country.

    Anyhow, just a suggestion...

    If you're interested PM me.

    Thanks!

    Scott

  • Investor · Northbrook, IL · Member since 2017 · 352 posts · 295 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed - Thank you for replying to my question, and defining your goal. It appears your current path is to use Investment A to generate enough profit so you can get into Investment B. There is merit to that strategy, but as you are experiencing it may not be the "quickest" way. Quick may not mean better for you, as your strategy is based upon buying with all cash. Most commercial properties are not bought with all cash except large REIT's which need to place investment funds. On a smaller level or individual level, most are bought with a combination of debt and equity. Yes debt will impact cash flow, but you are also increasing the rate of return on the cash via the leveraged equity. So there are pluses and minuses to both strategies. The strategy you have implemented is the "safest" as you do not have the pressure of a mortgage payment, but your overall rate of returns are lower due to the lack of leverage.

    So, in order to grow your faster, your strategy would require evaluation.  Either incorporating debt, equity partners, or both would allow you to grow faster.  You are also correct the current apartment market with the low cap rates is a challenge to find a deal strong enough economically to make it attractive for an investor.  That is why we sold our apartments.  Like Scott Meyers, we too have moved into other real estate markets like self storage.

  • Northern NJ · Member since 2018 · 128 posts · 39 votes
    7y
    You look at cash on cash when you use leverage and mortgages can be had around 5% with experienced partners.
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    Another problem I am facing is evaluating properties for mortgages. Since all my past purchases were cash, ROI was really good. The ones I am looking at now show an ROI of around 6% - 7% in Greenwich, CT and Stamford, CT mainly. If the mortgage is 6%, how does anyone make money? I must be missing something. I hope someone can clarify.

  • Rental Property Investor · Stamford, CT · Member since 2015 · 60 posts · 33 votes
    7y

    @Account Closed It's tough to scale here in Stamford/Greenwich as an individual investor, you may have to look somewhere else. That being said, if you're ever looking to sell the properties you have around here, I'd be glad to take a look at them.

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