Hello everyone,

My story comes out of North Jersey where it seems that being a landlord is becoming more and more of a nerve-racking stroke-causing endeavor. 

My parents have owned and operated a 3 family house out of Paterson since the 1980's. They never had any major problems with tenants until last August. It all started when a tenant, who we rented the third floor to, brought in two new individuals who we have never seen before. My parents immediately gave him a call and asked him who those two people were. The tenant never really gave us a straight answer. We then sent a notice to quit a few days later.

A week or so later we had several agencies from the city calling us and telling us we had an "illegal rooming" house and several violations we needed to fix asap. The two individuals had built a makeshift wall in the living room and accused us of building it and renting the apartment as a "rooming house" which it was not and never has been. Coincidentally enough it was around this time (i think a week or so earlier) that my mom filed to evict the third floor for non-payment. And then the fun began. 

Thinking it was a routine eviction (we had probably done one every two years for the past decade) we went into court. While there we saw the two individuals and our tenant with a lawyer. (Big red flag. Most of our evictions the tenants would never have lawyers because it woukld always just be about non-payment) The proceedings started and the attorney immediately accused of of renting a "rooming house" which the house inspectors had declared it was on their report. We told the judge it was all lies but wouldnt really hear us out probably since we didnt have an attorney and he had already expressed dissatisfaction with this. He granted SIX MONTHS RELOCATION FEES TO OUR TENANT. In order to have possession of the apartment we had to pay, which we did the same day. Because of the slow court system it took us almost 5 months (from the time we filed the original eviction) to finally have the apartment back. Now a few days later after we took possession the other two individuals are suing us and saying they also rented from us as a "rooming house" and want six months relocation fees as well as any other damages and attorneys fees. 

We've had an attorney on this case for a few months now and he's as dumbfounded as we are. Neither him nor I understand how someone can illegally move into an apartment, build a makeshift wall with a couple of 2x4's and sheetrock and then claim it is an illegal rooming house and have the court believe them. I asked my attorney what constitutes a rooming house? He said that the people rooming have to pay the landlord separately. These individuals never paid us a dime. Yet in court they lied on the stand saying they did pay us (no receipts, no documents, no pictures, no nothing) and the court believed them. 

It seems that in New Jersey this is becoming more and more of a common practice. I've talked to neighbors in towns like clifton, passaic, newark and paterson who have experienced tenants taking advantage of small time landlords.  Tenants who are taking advantage of the friendly tenant laws and the system. The ones who are the most vulnerable are the small or medium sized landlords and they know that. I'm becoming sick of it.

So, our fear is that the 2nd floor is good friends with the guy who got evicted and is telling them to do the same thing. Simply put a mattress in the living room and claim that you are living in a rooming house and the tenant friendly court will give you 6 months relocation fees. They can do this for each individual living in the apartment. ITS SOMETHING THATS BEYOND WORDS. 

I thought I'd share this story to you all as a warning. If anyone wants to share your thoughts or advice please feel free.

Sounds troubling... Is there a way you can track in the courts a series of cases like this? I'm not an attorney, however, I am of the opinion that if you can prove habitual abuse of the system, there might be some recourse. Case in point, although not landlord related, my friends who are contractors, separate from my company, ran into a homeowner who habitually did not pay contractors for work. The homeowner would cite various legal issues and would always win their cases against prior contractors in court. In their case, it reached a point in their litigation where the judge allowed the contractors to open up other cases involving this homeowner and other contractors. Since they were able to prove this homeowner habitually never paid contractors for a wide array of services for, at the time, legal reasons, the judge ruled in favor of the contractors. Yes, it's a stretch from your case, however if you and your family can show evidence of a portion of a population that is employing this tactic, it could set precedent in identifying scammers in the system. Best of luck.

What are your recommendations so that doesn't happen again? What have the courts said to help you as the landlord?

I have always heard that New Jersey is very tenant friendly and that it can take a very long time to get a problem tenant out and be very expensive to do so.

Sounds like this is an example of such.

Luckily Georgia (my state) tends to be fairly landlord friendly (so far).

And one of the landlords on another site who resides in Arizona keeps posting about problem tenants "disappearing" into the dessert.

Gail

Originally posted by @Mark Y. :

Hello everyone,

My story comes out of North Jersey where it seems that being a landlord is becoming more and more of a nerve-racking stroke-causing endeavor. 

My parents have owned and operated a 3 family house out of Paterson since the 1980's. They never had any major problems with tenants until last August. It all started when a tenant, who we rented the third floor to, brought in two new individuals who we have never seen before. My parents immediately gave him a call and asked him who those two people were. The tenant never really gave us a straight answer. We then sent a notice to quit a few days later.

A week or so later we had several agencies from the city calling us and telling us we had an "illegal rooming" house and several violations we needed to fix asap. The two individuals had built a makeshift wall in the living room and accused us of building it and renting the apartment as a "rooming house" which it was not and never has been. Coincidentally enough it was around this time (i think a week or so earlier) that my mom filed to evict the third floor for non-payment. And then the fun began. 

Thinking it was a routine eviction (we had probably done one every two years for the past decade) we went into court. While there we saw the two individuals and our tenant with a lawyer. (Big red flag. Most of our evictions the tenants would never have lawyers because it woukld always just be about non-payment) The proceedings started and the attorney immediately accused of of renting a "rooming house" which the house inspectors had declared it was on their report. We told the judge it was all lies but wouldnt really hear us out probably since we didnt have an attorney and he had already expressed dissatisfaction with this. He granted SIX MONTHS RELOCATION FEES TO OUR TENANT. In order to have possession of the apartment we had to pay, which we did the same day. Because of the slow court system it took us almost 5 months (from the time we filed the original eviction) to finally have the apartment back. Now a few days later after we took possession the other two individuals are suing us and saying they also rented from us as a "rooming house" and want six months relocation fees as well as any other damages and attorneys fees. 

We've had an attorney on this case for a few months now and he's as dumbfounded as we are. Neither him nor I understand how someone can illegally move into an apartment, build a makeshift wall with a couple of 2x4's and sheetrock and then claim it is an illegal rooming house and have the court believe them. I asked my attorney what constitutes a rooming house? He said that the people rooming have to pay the landlord separately. These individuals never paid us a dime. Yet in court they lied on the stand saying they did pay us (no receipts, no documents, no pictures, no nothing) and the court believed them. 

It seems that in New Jersey this is becoming more and more of a common practice. I've talked to neighbors in towns like clifton, passaic, newark and paterson who have experienced tenants taking advantage of small time landlords.  Tenants who are taking advantage of the friendly tenant laws and the system. The ones who are the most vulnerable are the small or medium sized landlords and they know that. I'm becoming sick of it.

So, our fear is that the 2nd floor is good friends with the guy who got evicted and is telling them to do the same thing. Simply put a mattress in the living room and claim that you are living in a rooming house and the tenant friendly court will give you 6 months relocation fees. They can do this for each individual living in the apartment. ITS SOMETHING THATS BEYOND WORDS. 

I thought I'd share this story to you all as a warning. If anyone wants to share your thoughts or advice please feel free.

 I'm very sorry to hear about the difficulties you and your family has experienced. I'm not a lawyer, so you should certainly ask your own lawyer, but I wonder...would it be worth your time to include in your lease "This is a [describe apartment]. Tenant understands this is NOT a rooming house. Landlord expressly prohibits sub-leasing..." etc. etc. etc.

I live in a university town and have an addendum to my lease (with signature required) stipulating the zoning ordinance for single family homes and who can and cannot reside there. 

Originally posted by @Robert S. :

Sounds troubling... Is there a way you can track in the courts a series of cases like this? I'm not an attorney, however, I am of the opinion that if you can prove habitual abuse of the system, there might be some recourse. Case in point, although not landlord related, my friends who are contractors, separate from my company, ran into a homeowner who habitually did not pay contractors for work. The homeowner would cite various legal issues and would always win their cases against prior contractors in court. In their case, it reached a point in their litigation where the judge allowed the contractors to open up other cases involving this homeowner and other contractors. Since they were able to prove this homeowner habitually never paid contractors for a wide array of services for, at the time, legal reasons, the judge ruled in favor of the contractors. Yes, it's a stretch from your case, however if you and your family can show evidence of a portion of a population that is employing this tactic, it could set precedent in identifying scammers in the system. Best of luck.

 Thats a great point. I believe the county court house has a search system in the court library where you can look up docket numbers and names of previous cases. I believe they only go back about two years though. Im sure each jurisdiction is different though.

Originally posted by @Jack Edgar jr :

What are your recommendations so that doesn't happen again? What have the courts said to help you as the landlord?

Thanks for the reply Jack. My recommendations are: Cameras, if you can afford it. If we had placed cameras prior, we could have looked at the footage and seen the individuals bring in the 2x4's and sheetrock. Another recommendation is to have a set of locks on the front door of the building which does not allow tenants to copy the keys. But ultimately there is little one can do against these unscrupulous tenants in NJ. This is why I wanted to write this thread.

The landlord tenant laws (I'm speaking of what constitutes a rooming house for example) in NJ are a mish mash of complex codes and case law that most real estate attorneys are not able to navigate. But many who do, use it to take advantage against landlords like us. It's sad because these tenant laws were created years ago to protect unscrupulous landlords who take advantage of honest tenants. The individuals who realized that these laws can be exploited have found a gold mine. For example the individuals who we evicted had lived for free for almost 6 months with ZERO repercussions. and now are asking for another 6 months of rent on top of that.

As to what can the courts do to help the landlords? I would say almost nothing. (By the way I would love to see what other NJ landlords have to say about this, my experience is the courts are extremely unhelpful to landlords without attorneys. They treat us as if we're all millionaires instead of a level playing field.) In NJ, the landlord has almost no rights. After the case was over and my dad asked the judge "so how will I get my 5 months rent back" "the judge said 'why are you asking me ask your attorney" (this was during the original eviction when we had no attorney.

Originally posted by @Susan H. :

Originally posted by @Mark Y.:

Hello everyone,

My story comes out of North Jersey where it seems that being a landlord is becoming more and more of a nerve-racking stroke-causing endeavor. 

My parents have owned and operated a 3 family house out of Paterson since the 1980's. They never had any major problems with tenants until last August. It all started when a tenant, who we rented the third floor to, brought in two new individuals who we have never seen before. My parents immediately gave him a call and asked him who those two people were. The tenant never really gave us a straight answer. We then sent a notice to quit a few days later.

A week or so later we had several agencies from the city calling us and telling us we had an "illegal rooming" house and several violations we needed to fix asap. The two individuals had built a makeshift wall in the living room and accused us of building it and renting the apartment as a "rooming house" which it was not and never has been. Coincidentally enough it was around this time (i think a week or so earlier) that my mom filed to evict the third floor for non-payment. And then the fun began. 

Thinking it was a routine eviction (we had probably done one every two years for the past decade) we went into court. While there we saw the two individuals and our tenant with a lawyer. (Big red flag. Most of our evictions the tenants would never have lawyers because it woukld always just be about non-payment) The proceedings started and the attorney immediately accused of of renting a "rooming house" which the house inspectors had declared it was on their report. We told the judge it was all lies but wouldnt really hear us out probably since we didnt have an attorney and he had already expressed dissatisfaction with this. He granted SIX MONTHS RELOCATION FEES TO OUR TENANT. In order to have possession of the apartment we had to pay, which we did the same day. Because of the slow court system it took us almost 5 months (from the time we filed the original eviction) to finally have the apartment back. Now a few days later after we took possession the other two individuals are suing us and saying they also rented from us as a "rooming house" and want six months relocation fees as well as any other damages and attorneys fees. 

We've had an attorney on this case for a few months now and he's as dumbfounded as we are. Neither him nor I understand how someone can illegally move into an apartment, build a makeshift wall with a couple of 2x4's and sheetrock and then claim it is an illegal rooming house and have the court believe them. I asked my attorney what constitutes a rooming house? He said that the people rooming have to pay the landlord separately. These individuals never paid us a dime. Yet in court they lied on the stand saying they did pay us (no receipts, no documents, no pictures, no nothing) and the court believed them. 

It seems that in New Jersey this is becoming more and more of a common practice. I've talked to neighbors in towns like clifton, passaic, newark and paterson who have experienced tenants taking advantage of small time landlords.  Tenants who are taking advantage of the friendly tenant laws and the system. The ones who are the most vulnerable are the small or medium sized landlords and they know that. I'm becoming sick of it.

So, our fear is that the 2nd floor is good friends with the guy who got evicted and is telling them to do the same thing. Simply put a mattress in the living room and claim that you are living in a rooming house and the tenant friendly court will give you 6 months relocation fees. They can do this for each individual living in the apartment. ITS SOMETHING THATS BEYOND WORDS. 

I thought I'd share this story to you all as a warning. If anyone wants to share your thoughts or advice please feel free.

 I'm very sorry to hear about the difficulties you and your family has experienced. I'm not a lawyer, so you should certainly ask your own lawyer, but I wonder...would it be worth your time to include in your lease "This is a [describe apartment]. Tenant understands this is NOT a rooming house. Landlord expressly prohibits sub-leasing..." etc. etc. etc.

I live in a university town and have an addendum to my lease (with signature required) stipulating the zoning ordinance for single family homes and who can and cannot reside there. 

 Thats the crazy part. They signed a lease that says exactly that. No subletting, only two bedrooms, only people who are on lease can live here etc etc. We even sent them a letter saying do not sublet. Yet to the "judge" it did not matter. 

The landlord tenant regulations and tenant friendly legislation is the root cause.

My jurisdiction, Ontario Canada, I believe holds the North American title for the Professional Tenant Capitol due to it's extremely pro tenant regulations.  Our government has even gone so far as to make welfare recipients a protected class. The regulations state that a persons income must only equal or be higher than the rent preventing us from using 3X rent as a income standard. We also can not legally collect/garnish income from anyone one on welfare.

The vast majority of professional tenants up here target landlords of SFHs and in many cases drive them into bankruptcy before they move on to their next target landlord all with the full support of our landlord tenant board.

@Mark Y. Thanks for posting your story. As a new landlord, this is exactly what I want to avoid. Kinda crazy how you ended up losing that much even with all the proof you had. Gotta love our beautiful NJ :)

@Mark Y. What county in NJ has this happen to you? Believe me we have it worst here in NYC.

@Mark Y. And how much was the relocation fee if you don't mind me asking

@Mark Y. as mentioned by @Thomas S. Ontario is the magic land of free rent and easy pickings. There used to be THE BEST resource for landlords (sorry BP) in the forums at OntarioLandlords.org which is now defunct. It had HUNDREDS of threads about stories just like yours.

The number one question when someone posted the problem and asked how to avoid it in the future:

Tell us about your tenant screening process.

Sorry to hear this @Mark Y.

Obviously your current situation needs to be handled by your lawyer and hindsight is 20/20.

That being said I do know some landlords that take pictures or videos before move in so they have proof for security deposit reasons. In your case that same evidence would hopefully show that you rented out a single unit. 

I wish you the best in getting this resolved.

Mark Y.,

A pre-occupancy walkthrough with an independent party (such as an attorney/notary) who will certify to the condition of the property and the occupancy status and also photograph the property on the date of occupancy is what you should do.  It's a very minor cost in the long run and you can increase the rent proportionately to cover it if you want.  You just include terms in the contract that the tenant must submit to this pre-inspection and hopefully always cover yourself against this kind of behavior. 

One suggestion I've heard thats similar to what @Jason Timmerman said was to take pictures of the property (time stamped) and include them in the lease.  I'd imagine that would protect you for the most part.  If the lease started jan 1st and you had a timestamped photo from jan 1st in the lease with the tenants signature right on it, I'd hope that would be more than enough proof

@Gail K. New York is the same as NJ. i had tenants who lived 10 months for free that i can't even hire a lawyer or anyone. they started to pay rent late for 2 months then paying partial rent for 3 months after the late payments. that's 5 months. then the process of court and evictions for over 10 months cause they know the game very well. they don't show up in court (that;s extending the stays). after that 5 months of late or partial payments. i already used high interest credit card to pay for my mortgage. off course i know it's a big negative. do i want foreclosure cause by the junkies? my mortgage (2 family house in NYC) with both tenants don't pay rent at the same time cost me an arm and a leg. at this point, i have no money to hire any lawyer or anyone but myself going to the court thousand times.

@Thomas S. i agree cameras help only if you have a multi family. nobody want you to install the cameras if you have SFH. cameras helped me. i had no help getting my non paying tenants out. i opened the main door downstair a few times which they live upstair and slammed it close on purposes. she text me why you opened my door. i was naked(which i don't believe). i told her i smell gas leaking which i don't live there and told her i wasn't in your house. you could see my leg was holding the storm door opened on my cameras. i just want to make sure no gas leaks before i called 911 for fire department. i did it a few times to put fears on them. cause i know i can't get them out and not garnish their money.i have nothing to lose at that point. the reason i tell the story i want to help out the landlords. no matter what proof or cameras you have, the judges will let them live for free.

you stole something from the store, you robbed someone....etc. you go to jail. i have a mortgage to pay and tenants don't pay rent. they could stay for free without going to the jail. what kind of non sense is that. can the bank let me don't pay the mortgage for 10 months?

it is not about screening or luck. they could be perfect when you screen them. people could change overtime. they could become smarter while they live there. they could lose their jobs. they have child support which they don't have that while screening.  the court gotta improve the system. people live free for their whole life by doing this every 6-10 months. 

@Eddie L. Well said and spot on, I say NYC is and will be the most tenant friendly city and nothing will be done for landlords.

Thank god I finish investing in New York, there is no positive outcome for beginner and mid level investors.

security cameras can help you prove that people are going in and out of your house that are not on your lease.  It will be more difficult to see them moving construction supplies unless you know exactly when they did it and you are able to backup that video before that footage gets overwritten.   i agree with some of the other members by taking pictures and a video at lease signing and possibly doing periodic inspections. whenever i send my electrician, plumber, exterminator, etc, i ask them 'how did the unit look'? sometimes i would go with them.  

Account Closed where is your next area to invest? is there any states that's landlord friendly LOL?

@Eddie L. I been focusing on the NJ market. I wish I could invest south were is all landlord friendly but I guess I'm stuck in the east coast tenant territories.

Regardless NYC will always be the worst and I can't blame it because 9 million population city is build on a system where they can't be in the streets.

yes. i thought NJ and NY markets are the same. it was the news all over in the world that attracts homeless to NY that the city using taxpayer money to house them. it's $2000 per person a month. google any NYC pay homeless, tons of news. non paying tenants, paying homeless....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3995098/Ne...

There was a news few years back that NYC panhandlers who own a few condo apartments by putting dirty make up on without getting haircut or some with a dog. 

this is one of the news even on International Business news.

http://www.ibtimes.com/how-much-do-panhandlers-mak...

no offense, why we want to invest real estate? why you want to study and get the plumber or contractor license? why you go to college? LOL

I've found that NJ tenants are fine as long as you are in the better areas.  Avoid the bad NJ cities (Newark, Trenton, Elizabeth, Paterson, Camden, etc.) and you'll be fine.  I think the problem is that a lot of investors are looking to rent low cost properties so you are getting a LOT of low class tenants.  Look more to the suburbs and you'll have very few issues with tenants.  There are areas in Monmouth and Middlesex counties where rent is $1800-$2000 a month for a two bedroom and you'll get 20-30 tenant applications within a week of listing it.  At least 10 of those tenants will have 750+ credit scores and a combined $130,000+ income.  A lot of young lawyers, teachers, engineers, etc.  None of them want to ruin their credit scores.  They just need to rent a place for two or three years while they save money to buy. 

Hi, @Mark Y

That is just a horror story for a landlord.

 I don`t know what to tell you but to hire a good lawyer and appeal the verdict. if you stuck, try to call your local newspaper or TV and see they can do a program on this. See if you can get help from someone else and not deal with this entirely on your own.

Sorry to hear about the problem, but I guess early notice that something is not right (sheetrack, new ppl in the building would be a red flag) I love the idea of having a lock that doesn't allow others to get a new set of keys without your involvement.

Good luck to you and keep us posted how it turns out!