Tenants Broke the lease, trashed, and vacated the Property | WTD
Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes
Tenants Broke the lease, trashed, and vacated the Property | WTD
Most Popular Reply
Rental Property Investor 路 East Wenatchee, WA 路 Member since 2014 路 10k+ posts 路 16k+ votes
5yOriginally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
Steve, no they were just vvery messy people. They had a dog, but they also had a pet rent. I don;t think the dog did too much damage. They problem is they left their junk in the house, Every room has stuff in it. They even bought an extra refrigerator. The garage is full of garbage. Probably like 30+ trash bags. Not sure why they didn't throw away on trash days.
Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
I had a tenant text me this morning telling me that they moved out of the property last month. There was no prior communication of the tenant vacating. The lease was a 5 year lease and each year was guaranteed unless both parties agreed to part ways 90 days before the new lease year started. The first lease year ends on November 30th and I was contacted today (Novermber 9th) and informed that the tenants already moved. The place is completely trashed with garbage and flies everywhere. Do I have any legal footing here?
I usually don't get a text, just discover it vacant.
At least they left and you have possession. Bjorn gave great ideas for next steps.
What was missed with your screening criteria? Smokers? Animals? Roommates?
So just trash out and cleaning? Not bad. You're definition of 'place is completely trashed' will change over time probably.
I like to swing by where my applicants currently live to ask a few final questions. At least look in their car when they view. That and previous references should help avoid this in the future馃憤
31 Replies
- 5yBjorn AhlbladPro MemberInvestor 路 Shelton, WA 路 Member since 2017 路 6k+ posts 路 6k+ votes
@Sean Witherspoon Sorry to hear about your troubles. I had one of those a couple of years ago-fired the PM.
You have a couple of ways to go .........you can take them to small claims court and attempt to get money for vandalism and back rent. Also call your insurance company and have them send an adjuster out. Take some pics and have some showing the condition prior to move in.
When the smoke clears and the adjuster is gone get it cleaned up and rented. Inspect every 6 months for new tenants. More frequently if you are nervous about anything. All the best!
- Rental Property Investor 路 East Wenatchee, WA 路 Member since 2014 路 10k+ posts 路 16k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
I had a tenant text me this morning telling me that they moved out of the property last month. There was no prior communication of the tenant vacating. The lease was a 5 year lease and each year was guaranteed unless both parties agreed to part ways 90 days before the new lease year started. The first lease year ends on November 30th and I was contacted today (Novermber 9th) and informed that the tenants already moved. The place is completely trashed with garbage and flies everywhere. Do I have any legal footing here?
I usually don't get a text, just discover it vacant.
At least they left and you have possession. Bjorn gave great ideas for next steps.
What was missed with your screening criteria? Smokers? Animals? Roommates?
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Bjorn, would insurance cover anything? I will look into small claims. At least they paid this month's rent even though they were not living in the property. It just sucks because of the short notice. If they would have told me 60 days ago, I would have been fine.
Originally posted by @Bjorn Ahlblad:@Sean Witherspoon Sorry to hear about your troubles. I had one of those a couple of years ago-fired the PM.
You have a couple of ways to go .........you can take them to small claims court and attempt to get money for vandalism and back rent. Also call your insurance company and have them send an adjuster out. Take some pics and have some showing the condition prior to move in.
When the smoke clears and the adjuster is gone get it cleaned up and rented. Inspect every 6 months for new tenants. More frequently if you are nervous about anything. All the best!
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Steve, no they were just vvery messy people. They had a dog, but they also had a pet rent. I don;t think the dog did too much damage. They problem is they left their junk in the house, Every room has stuff in it. They even bought an extra refrigerator. The garage is full of garbage. Probably like 30+ trash bags. Not sure why they didn't throw away on trash days.
Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
I had a tenant text me this morning telling me that they moved out of the property last month. There was no prior communication of the tenant vacating. The lease was a 5 year lease and each year was guaranteed unless both parties agreed to part ways 90 days before the new lease year started. The first lease year ends on November 30th and I was contacted today (Novermber 9th) and informed that the tenants already moved. The place is completely trashed with garbage and flies everywhere. Do I have any legal footing here?
I usually don't get a text, just discover it vacant.
At least they left and you have possession. Bjorn gave great ideas for next steps.
What was missed with your screening criteria? Smokers? Animals? Roommates?
- Rental Property Investor 路 East Wenatchee, WA 路 Member since 2014 路 10k+ posts 路 16k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
Steve, no they were just vvery messy people. They had a dog, but they also had a pet rent. I don;t think the dog did too much damage. They problem is they left their junk in the house, Every room has stuff in it. They even bought an extra refrigerator. The garage is full of garbage. Probably like 30+ trash bags. Not sure why they didn't throw away on trash days.
Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
I had a tenant text me this morning telling me that they moved out of the property last month. There was no prior communication of the tenant vacating. The lease was a 5 year lease and each year was guaranteed unless both parties agreed to part ways 90 days before the new lease year started. The first lease year ends on November 30th and I was contacted today (Novermber 9th) and informed that the tenants already moved. The place is completely trashed with garbage and flies everywhere. Do I have any legal footing here?
I usually don't get a text, just discover it vacant.
At least they left and you have possession. Bjorn gave great ideas for next steps.
What was missed with your screening criteria? Smokers? Animals? Roommates?
So just trash out and cleaning? Not bad. You're definition of 'place is completely trashed' will change over time probably.
I like to swing by where my applicants currently live to ask a few final questions. At least look in their car when they view. That and previous references should help avoid this in the future馃憤
- Real Estate Agent 路 Queen Creek, AZ 路 Member since 2018 路 64 posts 路 35 votes5y
I'm sorry you are in the middle of that. I had that happen with my first rental and it was gross. They left rotten food in the kitchen trash for weeks. Im in the Phoenix area and it does not take much time at all to find a new tenant. So I did not seek any legal action against these tenants for breaking their lease. They texted and gave permission to keep the deposit, so I used that to pay for the clean up and got a new tenant in there within two weeks. How long do you think it will take to get it cleaned up and get a new tenant in there?
- 5yBjorn AhlbladPro MemberInvestor 路 Shelton, WA 路 Member since 2017 路 6k+ posts 路 6k+ votes
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
Bjorn, would insurance cover anything? I will look into small claims. At least they paid this month's rent even though they were not living in the property. It just sucks because of the short notice. If they would have told me 60 days ago, I would have been fine.
Originally posted by @Bjorn Ahlblad:@Sean Witherspoon Sorry to hear about your troubles. I had one of those a couple of years ago-fired the PM.
You have a couple of ways to go .........you can take them to small claims court and attempt to get money for vandalism and back rent. Also call your insurance company and have them send an adjuster out. Take some pics and have some showing the condition prior to move in.
When the smoke clears and the adjuster is gone get it cleaned up and rented. Inspect every 6 months for new tenants. More frequently if you are nervous about anything. All the best!
Insurance can cover lost rent and damages to property minus wear and tear. There is generally a deductible but they will pursue the tenant's insurance if you required the tenant to have that. In the future always insist and have them include you as an 'additional interest' that way you get notified in case of default. These are the experiences we learn from.
Like @Steve Vaughan said check your screening process. If the tenant proposed the long lease term that should have been a red flag-always be on the lookout for anything unconventional.
Change the locks even if they left you the keys.
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Angel, yes this is similar. They gave me permission to keep the security deposit. I actually don鈥檛 live in the area anymore. But had a friend go and check the place out for me. He sent over 100 pictures. So I think I have a pretty good understanding. The tenants left a lot of their belongings. But a massive clean will be the bulk of the expenses. In addition to a few dry wall patches and door frame fixes.
Originally posted by @Angel Ginnett:I'm sorry you are in the middle of that. I had that happen with my first rental and it was gross. They left rotten food in the kitchen trash for weeks. Im in the Phoenix area and it does not take much time at all to find a new tenant. So I did not seek any legal action against these tenants for breaking their lease. They texted and gave permission to keep the deposit, so I used that to pay for the clean up and got a new tenant in there within two weeks. How long do you think it will take to get it cleaned up and get a new tenant in there?
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Bjorn, yes they did propose the long term lease. This was my first rental. I will definitely learn from this situation. I required renters insurance but didn鈥檛 verify if they had it. I will definitely take your advice. Thanks for taking the time to comment!
Originally posted by @Bjorn Ahlblad:Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
Bjorn, would insurance cover anything? I will look into small claims. At least they paid this month's rent even though they were not living in the property. It just sucks because of the short notice. If they would have told me 60 days ago, I would have been fine.
Originally posted by @Bjorn Ahlblad:@Sean Witherspoon Sorry to hear about your troubles. I had one of those a couple of years ago-fired the PM.
You have a couple of ways to go .........you can take them to small claims court and attempt to get money for vandalism and back rent. Also call your insurance company and have them send an adjuster out. Take some pics and have some showing the condition prior to move in.
When the smoke clears and the adjuster is gone get it cleaned up and rented. Inspect every 6 months for new tenants. More frequently if you are nervous about anything. All the best!
Insurance can cover lost rent and damages to property minus wear and tear. There is generally a deductible but they will pursue the tenant's insurance if you required the tenant to have that. In the future always insist and have them include you as an 'additional interest' that way you get notified in case of default. These are the experiences we learn from.
Like @Steve Vaughan said check your screening process. If the tenant proposed the long lease term that should have been a red flag-always be on the lookout for anything unconventional.
Change the locks even if they left you the keys.
- Member since 2020 路 671 posts 路 937 votes5y
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
They even bought an extra refrigerator.
DO NOT OPEN THE REFRIGERATOR!!! - 5yColleen F.Pro MemberInvestor 路 Narragansett, RI 路 Member since 2013 路 8k+ posts 路 4k+ votes
@Sean Witherspoon I see by trashed you mean literally full of trash. Itemize your expenses against the security deposit and send a letter to the forwarding address in a timely way for your state. This is to cover you even though they said oh keep our security deposit. If it is alot more it also helps if you want to go to court. If it is less itemize projected rent until new tenant for the difference or trash disposal if you haven't completed it. Its extra paperwork but it covers you better then the text.
Since you have a duty to mitigate damages in most states that 5 year lease really does nothing for you in residential. I never do more then about 18 months on a lease. People leave when they want to leave. People asking for longer leases are often just shouting pick me, pick me. Don't be swayed.
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Originally posted by @Colleen F.:
@Sean Witherspoon I see by trashed you mean literally full of trash. Itemize your expenses against the security deposit and send a letter to the forwarding address in a timely way for your state. This is to cover you even though they said oh keep our security deposit. If it is alot more it also helps if you want to go to court. If it is less itemize projected rent until new tenant for the difference or trash disposal if you haven't completed it. Its extra paperwork but it covers you better then the text.
Since you have a duty to mitigate damages in most states that 5 year lease really does nothing for you in residential. I never do more then about 18 months on a lease. People leave when they want to leave. People asking for longer leases are often just shouting pick me, pick me. Don't be swayed.
Thanks for the reply Colleen. And thanks for the advise. Got a quote to get all of the junk and trash picked up for around $400. Still have to find a contractor to fix holes in the wall, broken trim, and painting. I plan on turning the property into a STR. So the tenants leaving isn't a huge problem. Its just a major inconvenience because I have to rehab the property before turning it into a STR. Which has to be fully furnished. But I think in the long run, the STR will at least double the rent from the tenants. So this may be a good thing 2 years from now.
- Real Estate Agent 路 Queen Creek, AZ 路 Member since 2018 路 64 posts 路 35 votes5y
$400 isn't bad. And it sounds like you found a better use for the property as a STR. Silver linings around that cloud. Stay positive! You're growing and learning so much!
@Sean Witherspoon doesn't sound like you're in all that bad of a situation. "Trashed" and "bagged trash" are two completely different scenarios.
1) Definitely don't involve your insurance company. It doesn't sound like there's enough "damage" to warrant any claim.
2) Rent a small dumpster and just start hauling the trash out. You'll be surprised how quickly it cleans up. After all belongings and trash are out, then you can begin looking for hidden damage the tenants caused.
3) Keep track of your time and expenses
4) At the end of all this, decide if it's worth your time/money to take the tenants to small claims court. Most experienced landlords will tell you it's not worth it since it's pretty difficult to get money from tenants that don't have much to begin with.
- Real Estate Investor 路 Coos Bay, OR 路 Member since 2011 路 21 posts 路 12 votes5y
Going from a 5 year lease to a STR??? Maybe just place good tenants on a 6 month lease and let it go M2M afterwards, sometimes keeping it simple and letting the rental do the work for you is a lot easier than trying to be too clever...
- 5yColleen F.Pro MemberInvestor 路 Narragansett, RI 路 Member since 2013 路 8k+ posts 路 4k+ votes
@Sean Witherspoon hopefully you have looked into the specifics of what restrictions there may be on STR in your area before you put money into it.Also set up processes for turnover and such. If you can't find a handyman now to repair moldings and paint, it will be a crisis when something goes wrong in a STR. In any case though time is your enemy in a turnover. The more time you take the more you lose.
- Rental Property Investor 路 Saint Augustine 路 Member since 2019 路 26 posts 路 7 votes5y
Originally posted by @Colleen F.:
@Sean Witherspoon hopefully you have looked into the specifics of what restrictions there may be on STR in your area before you put money into it.Also set up processes for turnover and such. If you can't find a handyman now to repair moldings and paint, it will be a crisis when something goes wrong in a STR. In any case though time is your enemy in a turnover. The more time you take the more you lose.
Collen, yes the short-term rental is managed by a company. They handle all maintenance requests, cleaning, and everything associated with the property. It's my job to buy the furniture and such. They handle the setup and everything. They manage the property next door to mine. I was told that in peek season, the house next door brings in $10,000 / month. My house is very similar to that house. That's why my tenants abandoning the property may be a very good thing for me long term.
- Rental Property Investor 路 Sioux Falls, SD 路 Member since 2015 路 9k+ posts 路 18k+ votes5y
@Sean Witherspoon this is good. Thankfully they are gone. Clean it up and rent it out. Never sign a 5 year lease with any tenant, ever. Lease has no effect on how long someone stays. All it does is box in a landlord and protects the tenant. I have had tenants tell me they plan to live somewhere for years, only to break the lease a few months later. Hopefully you didn't discount rent due to the longer term - that is often why people ask for a longer term, to get a lower price.
- 5yColleen F.Pro MemberInvestor 路 Narragansett, RI 路 Member since 2013 路 8k+ posts 路 4k+ votes
@Sean Witherspoon you talked to both the owner and the company on the property next door? Evaluate the occupancy rate and if it works might be a win for you. For furnishing look at what the competition has. Good Luck!
- 5yWill GastonPro MemberRental Property Investor 路 Columbia, SC 路 Member since 2010 路 1k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
@Joe Splitrock's advice is spot on. Although there are some rare exceptions, the lease protects the tenant not the landlord. I've learned this lesson the hard way.
I'd disagree with the post advising you on calling your insurance company. Making claims needs to be something you try to avoid as much as possible.
Some good advice here, but I just want to add that you should hire a professional property manager.
Owning a rental property is inherently risky, but a solid property management company will minimize your risk and should make you more money than you lose by paying them.
I also would echo that a lease term longer than 1 year is fraught with risk of its own. 1-year leases allow you to see what you're working with and then offer 12-month extensions based on the tenancy and market conditions.
If you're seriously considering the STR route, I would definitely get with a PM Company that handles them and get a sense of what you need to do to make the property attractive as a STR and determine if that's worth the hassle.
For $10k/month, I would put up with a bit of hassle!
Real Estate Solutions4.3379 Reviews- Investor 路 El Dorado Hills, CA 路 Member since 2012 路 1k+ posts 路 1k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:
Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
Steve, no they were just vvery messy people. They had a dog, but they also had a pet rent. I don;t think the dog did too much damage. They problem is they left their junk in the house, Every room has stuff in it. They even bought an extra refrigerator. The garage is full of garbage. Probably like 30+ trash bags. Not sure why they didn't throw away on trash days.
Originally posted by @Steve Vaughan:Originally posted by @Sean Witherspoon:
I had a tenant text me this morning telling me that they moved out of the property last month. There was no prior communication of the tenant vacating. The lease was a 5 year lease and each year was guaranteed unless both parties agreed to part ways 90 days before the new lease year started. The first lease year ends on November 30th and I was contacted today (Novermber 9th) and informed that the tenants already moved. The place is completely trashed with garbage and flies everywhere. Do I have any legal footing here?
I usually don't get a text, just discover it vacant.
At least they left and you have possession. Bjorn gave great ideas for next steps.
What was missed with your screening criteria? Smokers? Animals? Roommates?
So just trash out and cleaning? Not bad. You're definition of 'place is completely trashed' will change over time probably.
I like to swing by where my applicants currently live to ask a few final questions. At least look in their car when they view. That and previous references should help avoid this in the future馃憤
It is funny how your definition of trashed changes over time. When I had some Class D rentals I was thrilled if they didn't flush concrete down the toilet and steal the HVAC unit.
- Rental Property Investor 路 Dayton, OH 路 Member since 2019 路 293 posts 路 440 votes5y
@Sean Witherspoon suck it up, clean your unit, rent it out and never sign a long term lease as you do not know what our real estate market may do year after year. That鈥檚 also horrible for an exit strategy! I鈥檒l explain
We purchase large multifamily and we have negotiated 100k off a deal just because of leases. If you decide you have to sell it, a lease can throw a wrench in the deal as the new owner does not want to be locked in for 5 years without being able to raise rents. We鈥檝e walked away from deals due to this. 12 months is plenty
- Property Manager 路 Raleigh, NC 路 Member since 2014 路 729 posts 路 596 votes5y
@Sean Witherspoon
First, inform the tenant they are responsible for the rent until you can get a new lease signed. They may or not pay, but you need to document it. Second, go through the property and list everything they owe for damages. Send them an itemized list of damages and a due date. Third, fix the property and get a new tenant in.
Doubtful if the tenant will pay the amount due. Decide if you want thw hassle of small claims court and move on with your life.
- 5yTheresa HarrisPro MemberMember since 2019 路 15k+ posts 路 11k+ votes
Document everything, take photos, then start cleaning up and get it rented. Take them to small claims court for damages if it exceeds the deposit. $400 isn't bad, I've had one that cost me 4 times that. If they left without giving notice, you can also keep money for the 30 days' rent. Make sure you itemize the expenses (clean up, outstanding rent) and send that to the tenants within the timeline required by your state.
Someone mentioned getting a PM, I don't think that would have prevented this. In the future, don't do a 5 year lease. One year at a time.
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.