How to make a basement unit legal in chicago?

Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes

I bought and rehabbed a 2-flat in chicago this year and now I'm turning my attention to the basement. It was a legal 3-flat but the last owner had it decoverted to storage a year before the sale. I was told there was a plumbing problem in the basement and a clean out had to be installed.

When the last owner had it converted to storage, the took out the bathroom/kitchen plumbing and electrical. They even poured concrete in the toilet and shower drain.

Where do I start to get it back to a legal 3?

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Bruce WoodruffPro Member

Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes

I googled it and it said something about 2500 SF of lot size per unit...I didn't read it all though, go check it out

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Brie SchmidtBusiness Member
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Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:
I bought and rehabbed a 2-flat in chicago this year and now I'm turning my attention to the basement. It was a legal 3-flat but the last owner had it decoverted to storage a year before the sale. I was told there was a plumbing problem in the basement and a clean out had to be installed.
When the last owner had it converted to storage, the took out the bathroom/kitchen plumbing and electrical. They even poured concrete in the toilet and shower drain.
Where do I start to get it back to a legal 3?

What does the zoning cert say from when you bought it?
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Wayne Brooks
Real Estate Professional · West Palm Beach, FL · Member since 2012 · 23k+ posts · 13k+ votes
5y
If it is Currently zoned/allowed for 3 units…you need permits which means you need certified/stamped plans for whatever you want to do.
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Brie Schmidt:
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:
I bought and rehabbed a 2-flat in chicago this year and now I'm turning my attention to the basement. It was a legal 3-flat but the last owner had it decoverted to storage a year before the sale. I was told there was a plumbing problem in the basement and a clean out had to be installed.
When the last owner had it converted to storage, the took out the bathroom/kitchen plumbing and electrical. They even poured concrete in the toilet and shower drain.
Where do I start to get it back to a legal 3?

What does the zoning cert say from when you bought it?

It says two dwelling units. Property is zone RS3.

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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
5y
How big is the lot?
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Bruce Woodruff:
How big is the lot?

lot size says 3750!
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
5y
Don't you need 2500 per unit unless there are a certain percentage of 2 flats already on the block?
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Bruce Woodruff:
Don't you need 2500 per unit unless there are a certain percentage of 2 flats already on the block?

the house size is 2540 sqft. Im guessing that just for the 2 legal units. because each unit is ~1200 sq
The whole block is zoned RS3 witch allows for 3 flats. The property was a legal 3 flat just last year. the basement has its own hvac/electrical/gas.
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
5y
I googled it and it said something about 2500 SF of lot size per unit...I didn't read it all though, go check it out
1 Reply
Kyle D Birch
Rental Property Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2019 · 77 posts · 36 votes
5y
For clarity, what’s your evidence to support it being a 3 flat last year? Are you saying the owner went out of their way to get the property rezoned to reduce units? Do you see permits pulled on the city website to support the deconstruction? Why would they do that she. The value of the property is higher as a 3 vs 2. Many two flats in the city have amazing garden units that to everyone else looks legal, but in reality are non conforming.
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Brie SchmidtBusiness Member
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Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:
Originally posted by @Bruce Woodruff:
Don't you need 2500 per unit unless there are a certain percentage of 2 flats already on the block?

the house size is 2540 sqft. Im guessing that just for the 2 legal units. because each unit is ~1200 sq
The whole block is zoned RS3 witch allows for 3 flats. The property was a legal 3 flat just last year. the basement has its own hvac/electrical/gas.

RS3 means residential single family, for a 3 unit zoning you need at least RT-4. Because the cert says 2 units you can't just add another unit. If it is in a pilot zone you can apply to add a unit, if not you have to contact the alderman and try to get it rezoned to RT
https://www.chicagocityscape.c...
https://secondcityzoning.org/z...
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Kyle D Birch:
For clarity, what’s your evidence to support it being a 3 flat last year? Are you saying the owner went out of their way to get the property rezoned to reduce units? Do you see permits pulled on the city website to support the deconstruction? Why would they do that she. The value of the property is higher as a 3 vs 2. Many two flats in the city have amazing garden units that to everyone else looks legal, but in reality are non conforming.
There is a permit for having the Basement Unit converted to storage. It does show on the city's website.

100896537 10/21/2020 DECONVERTING FROM 3 UNITS TO 2 UNITS

100897139 11/06/2020 DECONVERT BASEMENT PER BULDING VIOLATIONS - ELECTRICAL PERMIT # 100896537 - SUBJECT TO FIELD INSPECTIONS

I'm guessing the basement was decoverted for this violation.
Thanks your guys help!

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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
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@Michael D Valadez
Storage is not conditioned living space...
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Brie Schmidt:
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:
Originally posted by @Bruce Woodruff:
Don't you need 2500 per unit unless there are a certain percentage of 2 flats already on the block?

the house size is 2540 sqft. Im guessing that just for the 2 legal units. because each unit is ~1200 sq
The whole block is zoned RS3 witch allows for 3 flats. The property was a legal 3 flat just last year. the basement has its own hvac/electrical/gas.

RS3 means residential single family, for a 3 unit zoning you need at least RT-4. Because the cert says 2 units you can't just add another unit. If it is in a pilot zone you can apply to add a unit, if not you have to contact the alderman and try to get it rezoned to RT
https://www.chicagocityscape.c...
https://secondcityzoning.org/z...

I can find legal 3 units zoned RS-3. Heres one Right near my property on Red Fin: 4018 W Oakdale Ave 60641.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic...
I appreciate all your guys help! and I will contact the alderman
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Brie SchmidtBusiness Member
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Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:

I can find legal 3 units zoned RS-3. Heres one Right near my property on Red Fin: 4018 W Oakdale Ave 60641.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic...
I appreciate all your guys help! and I will contact the alderman

Pretty much all side streets are zoned RS-3. The zoning map was created well after Chicago was built. So any 2-4 unit is grandfathered in and can remain that way till you alter it. By adding a unit you need to change the zoning of that lot, so having a neighbor grandfathered in doesn't have anything to do with you wanting to increase density.
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Jonathan KlemmBusiness Member
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Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
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@Michael D Valadez - Congrats on getting your 2 flat rehabbed, that's awesome and I am sure it was a ton of work.

Tons of great advice above, but I'd suggest the first you do is talk to a local Chicago licensed architect like @Prashanth Mahakali or @Samuel Pavlovcik. The issues with zoning and permitting through the City of Chicago are muddy and unclear. Talk with someone who knows the right steps.
If you for sure want to legally convert back into a 3 unit you will need some type of plans & permits, but it all depends on how the zoning shakes out.
Also, you could always just convert it back without getting permits, but that obviously comes with a certain amount of risk as well.
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Jonathan Klemm:
@Michael D Valadez - Congrats on getting your 2 flat rehabbed, that's awesome and I am sure it was a ton of work.

Tons of great advice above, but I'd suggest the first you do is talk to a local Chicago licensed architect like @Prashanth Mahakali or @Samuel Pavlovcik. The issues with zoning and permitting through the City of Chicago are muddy and unclear. Talk with someone who knows the right steps.
If you for sure want to legally convert back into a 3 unit you will need some type of plans & permits, but it all depends on how the zoning shakes out.
Also, you could always just convert it back without getting permits, but that obviously comes with a certain amount of risk as well
Other landlords in the area also tell me not to bother with permits. And just convert it back.
I will definitely talk to our architect about the situation.
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Brie Schmidt:
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:

I can find legal 3 units zoned RS-3. Heres one Right near my property on Red Fin: 4018 W Oakdale Ave 60641.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic...
I appreciate all your guys help! and I will contact the alderman

Pretty much all side streets are zoned RS-3. The zoning map was created well after Chicago was built. So any 2-4 unit is grandfathered in and can remain that way till you alter it. By adding a unit you need to change the zoning of that lot, so having a neighbor grandfathered in doesn't have anything to do with you wanting to increase density.

I did a little more researching on the city website. In my area is in the additional dwelling units pilot program. Website is recommend talking to a Illinois license architect to submit the plans. I'll give that a try.
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Brie SchmidtBusiness Member
Moderator
Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:
Originally posted by @Brie Schmidt:
Originally posted by @Michael D Valadez:

I can find legal 3 units zoned RS-3. Heres one Right near my property on Red Fin: 4018 W Oakdale Ave 60641.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chic...
I appreciate all your guys help! and I will contact the alderman

Pretty much all side streets are zoned RS-3. The zoning map was created well after Chicago was built. So any 2-4 unit is grandfathered in and can remain that way till you alter it. By adding a unit you need to change the zoning of that lot, so having a neighbor grandfathered in doesn't have anything to do with you wanting to increase density.

I did a little more researching on the city website. In my area is in the additional dwelling units pilot program. Website is recommend talking to a Illinois license architect to submit the plans. I'll give that a try.

Great! @Samuel Pavlovcik can help
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Samuel Pavlovcik
Architect · Chicago, IL · Member since 2020 · 214 posts · 236 votes
5y
Thanks @Jonathan Klemm and @Brie Schmidt for the mentions.

@Michael D Valadez, Unfortunately as you found, the Chicago Zoning Designations are a little odd in that the "3" in the RS-3 Zoning does not at all mean that it allows for 3-Unit residences. Additionally, based on your notes about the basement being deconverted to "Stoarage" before you purchased it, sounds more to me like the biggest issue was that the basement unit was Not a legally existing unit, and the City made them deconvert the unit in order to resolve building violations.
You've done a great job finding a lot of information on this over the past few days, and if your project is in fact located within one of the ADU pilot areas, then that is 100% the route to go in order to Legally add the 3rd dwelling unit. The ADU process will save a lot of time and money in compared to the alternative option which would be a ZBA Hearing...
Let me know if you have other questions or how else I could help!
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Michael D Valadez
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Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 6 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Samuel Pavlovcik:
Thanks @Jonathan Klemm and @Brie Schmidt for the mentions.

@Michael D Valadez, Unfortunately as you found, the Chicago Zoning Designations are a little odd in that the "3" in the RS-3 Zoning does not at all mean that it allows for 3-Unit residences. Additionally, based on your notes about the basement being deconverted to "Stoarage" before you purchased it, sounds more to me like the biggest issue was that the basement unit was Not a legally existing unit, and the City made them deconvert the unit in order to resolve building violations.
You've done a great job finding a lot of information on this over the past few days, and if your project is in fact located within one of the ADU pilot areas, then that is 100% the route to go in order to Legally add the 3rd dwelling unit. The ADU process will save a lot of time and money in compared to the alternative option which would be a ZBA Hearing...
Let me know if you have other questions or how else I could help!

That's amazing if the basement unit was illegal! The basement unit still has its own(active) electric meter, gas meter, HVAC, and even gets mail/bills from usps!
Ill fill out an application for the ADU and see's what happens.
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Samuel Pavlovcik
Architect · Chicago, IL · Member since 2020 · 214 posts · 236 votes
5y
@Michael D Valadez, unfortunately the ADU Process in Chicago is much more than just an application. They will require Architectural drawings, Licensed contractors, and a Building Permit, in addition to having field inspections of the work (even if it is already existing).
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Jonathan KlemmBusiness Member
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Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
5y
@Michael D Valadez - Let us know how it goes with your application. We can likely help with some of the construction process when you get to that point. Feel free to reach out.
I also just applied for an ADU at one of my properties so we can both keep people updated on this thread regarding how long the application takes, any issues that come up, and the overall progress.
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Grigory Pekarsky
Real Estate Broker · Chicago · Member since 2021 · 108 posts · 23 votes
4y
One of the most common issues with basements is that they are either illegal or not up to code. If you live in Chicago, this can pose some problems as it's one of the stricter cities when it comes to housing laws and regulations. Fortunately, there are a few ways that you can make your basement unit legal and safe. According to the City of Chicago, "All dwelling units must have either 1) one or more windows that face directly to the outside, and/or 2) a door that leads directly from the unit to a balcony" (this is assuming your basement is not connected with an above-ground entrance). This means you will need to make sure your current home has enough space for this type of entry. If you plan on adding a window or door to your basement unit, be aware that this would add additional costs.
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Jonathan KlemmBusiness Member
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Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
4y
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John Huynh
Member since 2021 · 16 posts · 5 votes
4y
Quote from @Grigory Pekarsky:

One of the most common issues with basements is that they are either illegal or not up to code. If you live in Chicago, this can pose some problems as it's one of the stricter cities when it comes to housing laws and regulations. Fortunately, there are a few ways that you can make your basement unit legal and safe. According to the City of Chicago, "All dwelling units must have either 1) one or more windows that face directly to the outside, and/or 2) a door that leads directly from the unit to a balcony" (this is assuming your basement is not connected with an above-ground entrance). This means you will need to make sure your current home has enough space for this type of entry. If you plan on adding a window or door to your basement unit, be aware that this would add additional costs.

@Grigory Pekarsky What is the difference between illegal/legal, up to code, and non-conforming/conforming?

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