Private Lender - Tap Commercial - ‘Taps Out’ Another Borrower By Taking Upfront Fees
Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes
Private Lender - Tap Commercial - ‘Taps Out’ Another Borrower By Taking Upfront Fees
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Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes
14yYes too much fraud out there.Kennedy funding is another group I heard of the closes very few deals to show they do actually close deals but make money off of the loan app.
I have about seen every scam.REAL LENDERS understand the fraud that is out there and will won't ask for a bunch of fees like that upfront.If I was the lender I would consider reviewing apps the cost of doing business.
The investors are so desperate to get these sweetheart loans that don't exist.Really ask your self if this is just a really good loan program you found or pie in the sky.
As I have said before do not let a lender hold any money or their escrow company.Many are fraudulent overseas accounts or shell corps to make it hard to track where the money went.
Have your local attorney hold funds and not dispurse until closing and funds from lender have been verified.
Usually scammers will not want to jump through those hoops and will just say they can't fund the loan and to seek another lender.
11 Replies
- Investor · San Ramon, CA · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 569 votes14y
Have your friend call that Gephardt guy from the News... he loves to track companies down when consumers have issues.
- Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes14y
I'm thinking of getting my SEO person to send it out all over the web!! ha ha ha. Can a company come after you for this? It's not libel if its true right?
- Investor · San Ramon, CA · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 569 votes14y
Libel no... but I believe they can come after you for harassment.
Someone once mentioned the idea of creating some sort of deadbeats database for landlords, etc... and a similar argument was brought up. True or not, them waters are dangerous.
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes14y
Yes too much fraud out there.Kennedy funding is another group I heard of the closes very few deals to show they do actually close deals but make money off of the loan app.
I have about seen every scam.REAL LENDERS understand the fraud that is out there and will won't ask for a bunch of fees like that upfront.If I was the lender I would consider reviewing apps the cost of doing business.
The investors are so desperate to get these sweetheart loans that don't exist.Really ask your self if this is just a really good loan program you found or pie in the sky.
As I have said before do not let a lender hold any money or their escrow company.Many are fraudulent overseas accounts or shell corps to make it hard to track where the money went.
Have your local attorney hold funds and not dispurse until closing and funds from lender have been verified.
Usually scammers will not want to jump through those hoops and will just say they can't fund the loan and to seek another lender.
- Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes14y
Thanks for your comments Joel, as always very insightful....
- Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes14y
This is what another broker sent to me today about Tap Commercial:
"I have personally also been TAPPED out by TAP and ABUCUS GUARD their alleged inspection company, as well as one of my clients for over $5400. We originally had 6 files with them. Thank Heaven that they didn't all give TAP the upfront inspection fee, but I did for a loan for a personal loan and for one of our clients. In both cases TAP said the loans were totally approved all we needed was inspections.
Our deal is a purchase and the building is located over 300 miles and a mountain pass from where our business operations were located last year. Due to the approval and promises from Tim, our UW, we relocated and are now stuck between a rock and a hard place. TAP said the inspection on our subject came back with NO value so they couldn't do the deal. That was after they told us that due to the rural location we were approved by the investor to go out 500 miles. I was told by Tim the requirements are the building and property on the comp have to be within 15% of the subject and we actually found one. We were so excited but that was before Christmas and I guess they never used the comp??
Our clients deal was a 45% LTV foreclosure bailout on land. They approved the loan in an hour and said it would "NO problem" close within 10days, per Tim our UW, it was an easy deal. "Just send the fee ASAP" so we did within an hour. When we got the file that's all the time we had before the auction date. The 10 days passed and no inspection we called numerous times and emailed and text they finally sent us a letter that allowed us to procure a 2 week extension on the sale. Then sadly in that 2 weeks the inspection supposedly came back with ground water/soil contamination. We have and sent proof from the engineer that the soil is in fact not contaminated at all.
We requested copies of these supposed inspections over 6 weeks ago, proof they paid ABUCUS GUARD, and an actual address for said inspection company as the one on their web site is a Title company. Seems very odd that they have the same contact system as TAP where you go into VM no real person answers and they have one email address so you never really know with whom you are talking. TAP even called our agent and lied about who was on the phone. I have an email apology for that one but still really have nothing at all. I have called, emailed, text TAP and Tim at least 20 times in the last month trying to get a hold of them and nothing. Then after finally sending an email Monday letting them know I have now contacted the Attorney General, FBI and Homeland Security as TAP is not licensed in the US but the Bahamas and so is the inspection company they work with, Tim our UW called in 5 minutes. They have now guaranteed a solution by Friday this week. I am praying that indeed does happen as they have ruined peoples lives here and its so sad to see how many. They cannot just get away with this its not legal or ethical in anyway. I even emailed Shelly Nickles who is on LinkedIn at least 4 times in the last 6 months, guess she is the person whom I guess collects their investments, and she hasn't even tried to help or return any of my emails.
I think they do indeed close A paper loans but say they can do everything just to collect the fee. Think about how much money they can make since it seems people just let it go. They called me everyday until they get said fee then the communication slowly worked its way down to nothing ... I so wish I had not trusted them but Tim and I talked on the phone for almost 9 months before I started sending them business. He and I became what I would consider business friends talked about our families, the trials and tribulations of the mortgage business and the fact that he is from a small town in Washington so he completely understood the issues with comps on our personal subject property and now its why we were denied?I am at a loss and so shocked stuff like this is happening.
We must unite in HONESTY and not allow this stuff to go on!!!"
-ANONYMOUSPlease pay attention to this story and do your due diligence on your private money lenders before giving them an upfront fee.
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes14y
"They approved the loan in an hour and said it would "NO problem" close within 10days, per Tim our UW, it was an easy deal. "Just send the fee ASAP" so we did within an hour."
And there it is. The habitual tell you whatever you want to hear to get the money and then never talk to you again.On to the next sucker.
If you DON'T give them the money they CAN'T scam you........... :)
Tell a lender no upfront fees,no fees after LOI or before closing,my attorney holds all funds.
If they haven't hung up by then you might just maybe have an actual lender on your hands but no guarantees.
- Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes14y
Joel Owens I may have to disagree with your last statement. (Wow! We actually disagree on something?) Real Lenders do charge small, upfront fees for loans that are paid to third parties, or are reasonable fees for a site inspection. Anything under $500 can be customary for a site inspection, appraisal, etc.
But once a lender quotes one, lump sum fee to cover a bunch of items (e.g. administration fee, application fee, appraisal, underwriting, legal = $1,200) this is probably a lending scam.
It's always a gamble when giving an upfront fee. But, think about it --if you've got a hard to fund deal that a lot of lenders have passed on, then some lender comes along and offers to fund it no problem --?? Hmmmm. A good rule of thumb is -- If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.---
Thanks for the comment Joel. There's a lot of gray area with regard to upfront fees.
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes14y
Sure those are small fees but you have to be careful that they are legit.
Some people say only 500 bucks but then it adds up for these scammers.
There are legitimate appraisal etc. but those items are paid direct.If the lender is quoting a package deal to pay for them they are most likely padding fees.
Again if I am looking at a commercial loan for 1 million or more and making points I won't want to lose the deal with a strong buyer client over a few hundred bucks.
- Tulsa, OK · Member since 2012 · 1 post · 0 votes14y
I have closed a deal with a “Tap Commercial”. Is the Tap out of NV? Might be a different “Tap”.
Also, I read through the different posts and there is one that did not have a name that interested me.
It sounds to me like a loan that was disqualified for value. In fairness, I don’t think not doing your loan means it’s a scam. They were refreshingly thorough and seemed to be honest. From what they are saying, the loan failed for a valid reason. We would definitely know if they closed it with someone else.
I had a run in with a scammer company about two year s ago called Remington Fin. One of the principles was indicted. They were taking fees (quite large too) and not doing anything. But get this…the part they got popped for wasn’t taking fees it was tax evasion.
One reason I knew they were a scam company was because after a loan I had with them failed, I got it done right away and could have with a bunch of others.
I don’t know Tap commercial all that well but they did close a deal for me last December. It strikes me as odd as to why they aren’t telling their story or no names are given. Just saying I would like more.
It is tough to stay on top of things lately in this industry. It seems like everyone has a story but no real details are given. That is except the one that failed for lack of comps. - Lender · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2012 · 714 posts · 169 votes14y
George,
Yes its Tap Commercial out of Nevada. You have closed a deal with them? You are 1 of thousands and thousands. This is a common trick of fee collector lenders. They cherry pick and fund only the very best deals. The rest they collect fees on to pay their overhead. Then they can say they fund deals. It's a huge racket. Stay away from Tap Commercial...There's a reason why no names are disclosed in a post. People want to remain anonymous. If Tap wants to come and defend themselves in this forum then we can talk about names and such. If you go to Mortgage Grapevine and type in Tap Commercial, you will read plenty....
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