Two people on Deed and the bother wont answer sister's calls

20 Replies

I have a motivated seller who has two houses with her name and her brother's name on the deeds.  The houses are in Ohio, is there a way to legal remove the brother's name?  I am thinking a public notice or something along those lines.

Please help this could possibly be my first wholesale deal and it involves two houses!

Thanks

call your attorney. It will take a court order. Not likely. Probably a dead horse.

You and your wife are on the deed to your house , she is a motivated seller and you are out of town on business . How does she get you off the deed and sell the house ?

You dont know the whole story , only half . A friend of mine is an 1/3  heir to a property , 1 wants to sell , one doesnt care , and the last doesnt want to sell . They all hate each other , this situation has been going on for 20 years . Last man breathing  wins .

I hope I can find a way around this but thanks for the replies.

thanks for the wiki link, yes calling the brother is in my steps of action. I wanted to prepare myself as much as possible before calling him, if he even answers. I also feel I will get the best deal if he is out of the picture. But I do understand every possible avenue to get him involved will need to be taken before the courts would consider allowing a sale to take place.

This ain't a wholesale deal. It's a deal for a sophicated investor.

If I were working it, I'd buy Sister's share for 10-20 cents on dollar, then give Brother a chance to buy me out. He could use purchase money note.

If he did not cooperate, I would sue for Quiet Title and Partition Action.

Better be enough meat on the bone to make the hassle worthwhile. If not, walk. 

I had a deal about this time last year with the same issue. Brother and sister on the deed and they don't like each other, nobody want's to talk, a total stalemate. And a total waste of my time.

No you can't remove someone from a deed. And as an outsider trying to purchase the property, no amount of psychology will work to get the siblings to "act right".

Take my advice. Make a quick decision here. Don't spend more that 5 to 10 minutes. Analyze the deal, is there money to be made here. 

Determine your price point you need to get in at and price point your end buyer is willing to pay. 

Use the strategy Rick Harmon just mentioned with see if the will sibling will sale her share. If this is a no or maybe. Move on, follow up periodically but, don't spend any time here.

this is an option I did not realize was possible. She is in full control of the properties she actually rents to my parents which is how I came across the whole thing. If she sold her share, again I was not aware this was possible. I would simply replace her role and continue to rent the properties. If the brother ever came around I would simply sell out or buy out. Do I have a correct understanding of this option?

a little info on the properties, they are side by side and roughly worth $50k each. Niether one is in great shape but nothing serious is needed to be done.

This is a landmine without the brothers participation.  As @Rick H. stated you could be spinning your wheels.  First if you can get the sister to to sell for pennies on the dollar you have just set the market value for 50% ownership that the brother can use in court against you.  He may have no interest in the property now since he is allowing the sister to benefit from the income BUT it could be a cherished  property that he will NOT allow to move outside the family.  See how sympathetic the court will be towards you when he shows how you defrauded his sister and are now trying to force him to sell you the family home.  Thousands of dollars in legal fees later and no house for you.  You would also have to worry if something happened to the sister before any possible title change as the brother could be the heir and probate could wipe out any claim you have.

Understood, without the okay from the brother I will not get involved. I will leave it to her and her lawyer to sort it out and contact me when it is done. Until then I will go on my merry way looking for less complicated and risky deals thanks for the input.

Bob, I think your trying to help but you are making inaccurate statements w/out ever going through a partition action before. 

Dustin, You will need to hire an attorney to help you partition the property.  You can google it (Ohio civil code partition, Ohio partition attorney or something).  Price out the misadventure and see if it's worth your time.

Btw- I did not get into buying factional interest in real property until I had A LOT of experience under my belt- walk slowly towards the deal & go in light on the cash.

Good luck

Will do, and I plan on offer as little as possible with how much trouble this is sounding like it could be.

Originally posted by @Dennis Lanni :

Bob, I think your trying to help but you are making inaccurate statements w/out ever going through a partition action before. 

I don't believe I stated my experience.  What inaccurate statements are you referring to?

I found this:

§ 5307.01

Tenants in common, survivorship tenants, and coparceners, of any estate in lands, tenements, or hereditaments within the state, may be compelled to make or suffer partition thereof as provided in sections 5307.01 to 5307.25 of the Revised Code.

The content of the petition is governed by statute:

§ 5307.03.

A person entitled to partition of an estate may file his petition therefor in the court of common pleas, setting forth the nature of his title, a pertinent description of the lands, tenements, or hereditaments of which partition is demanded, and naming each tenant in common, coparcener, or other person interested therein, as defendant.

The Court orders partition:

§ 5307.04.

If the court of common pleas finds that the plaintiff in an action for partition has a legal right to any part of the estate, it shall order partition of the estate in favor of the plaintiff or all interested parties, appoint one suitable disinterested person to be the commissioner to make the partition, and issue a writ of partition. The court on its own motion may, and upon motion of a party or any other interested person shall, appoint one or two additional suitable persons to be commissioners. If the estate to be partitioned extends beyond the county in which the action is commenced, the court may appoint a separate commissioner or commissioners, not to exceed three, to make the partition of that portion of the estate located in the other county.

- See more at: http://www.josephandjoseph.com/partition-action/#s...

Darn Bob I wish would not have made a comment.  Here are a few things that my experience has shown w/ similar situations (in California not Ohio).

1. A court of law will establish value of the property with an apraisal not the purchase price.  

2.  The court will follow the civil code not emotional agreements about how mom's belongs in the family.

2. With a purchase contract from 2 willing parties I don't see how the buyer defrauded the seller.  Have the seller sign a disclaimer that you intend on making a lot of $$$.

3. You would record the 1/2 interest (and can insure it, borrow against it, ect...) just like any other transaction.

4.  List goes on.  You get the idea here.

I did not intend to do a figure pointing thing here.  Just trying to help out & solve or make an opportunity here.

Originally posted by @Dennis Lanni :

Darn Bob I wish would not have made a comment.  Here are a few things that my experience has shown w/ similar situations (in California not Ohio).

I would agree you should probably have not made a comment based on California experience.  Your whole list of what should happen can be thrown out the window.  I was born and educated in the tri-state area. I have experience dealing with the courts and have experienced being the "outsider" despite this.  You may accomplish your desired result but if the local brother wants to fight you he will have the good old boys on his side to make it cost you dearly.

Originally posted by @Dennis Lanni :

Darn Bob I wish would not have made a comment.  Here are a few things that my experience has shown w/ similar situations (in California not Ohio).

1. A court of law will establish value of the property with an apraisal not the purchase price.  

2.  The court will follow the civil code not emotional agreements about how mom's belongs in the family.

2. With a purchase contract from 2 willing parties I don't see how the buyer defrauded the seller.  Have the seller sign a disclaimer that you intend on making a lot of $$$.

3. You would record the 1/2 interest (and can insure it, borrow against it, ect...) just like any other transaction.

4.  List goes on.  You get the idea here.

I did not intend to do a figure pointing thing here.  Just trying to help out & solve or make an opportunity here.

There are some problems here that might result you getting mired in a negotiation mess. The ideal situation involves the buyer signing a purchase agreement for the property, then the plaintiff in the partition action electing to purchase the whole interest in the property at its court-appraised value in order to consummate the sale. If the brother also elects to purchase the property at appraised value, then the court will probably order a public auction which the buyer would have to try to win the bid.

@Rick H. How does one sell their interest in a property? Does it involve handing over their POA for the property?

Here's how it works from a pragmatic standpoint:

Two or more persons own real property, each with a distinct, separate interest. 

In this case, A and B, who happen to be siblings.

A can sell or transfer her undivided share to C, and guy like me who is a Bottomfeeding Opportunist. Now, I bought and received A's 1/2 for a song because I have to deal with B, the brother. Lucky me. 

Now B can either sell to me or not. If I have possession, he can complain all he wants. If he has possession, I have to do a lot to compel resolution by either pursuasion or force via court action. You cannot just evict someone who has legal title. Believe me, if there was a way...

So, the victor will be the challenger who is an effective negotiator or efficient litigator or young enough to wait out the other party and deal with their heirs. 

You can always hope the othe party "B" becomes incarcerated where his rent is paid and his attachment to the property becomes lowered.