All Forum Posts by: Dale Walker

Last June, I rented to a lady and her little daughter. They said they had the first months rent and deposit ready. They got though the background check, had sufficient income, references checked out. We scheduled a day to sign the lease and we met. They did have the deposit but were a couple hundred dollars short on the first months rent. I made the mistake of letting them catch up when she got paid in a week. Reluctantly, I rented to them and gave them the keys. Two months later, I filed for their eviction. I agree with others here, If they don't have the minimum to move in DON'T do it! Find another tenant who will be completely honest with you and have the money ready.  I learned my lesson, trying to be nice cost me over a thousand dollars and my time in court.  Save yourself a headache and let tell them no.....      I have found, when you say no, they can come up with the money and they just don't want to. There are too many people who are accustomed to take advantage of nice people just because they can. Everyone has a hard luck story to tell. People to feel they are the victim will not feel bad when you are a victim of your own kindness to them. 

Art,

I think the next best step is to get a handyman to cut a piece of drywall under the toilet. I would then have the handyman look at the toilet pipes when I flush the toilet above. That may give him an idea of where the water is coming from. If that can't be identified, pull the toilet and reseal it. Once the leak has been fixed, have the handyman patch the wall. A reasonable cost should be $200-300 if they pull the toilet, replace/repair the drywall.  I suggest you pay attention to what he does and you will learn alot. 

BTW.....I knew nothing about plumbing before I bought rentals as well. Paying handymen/contractors and watching them has saved me alot of money over the years. I thought it was money well spent. Youtube has a tutorial on just about everything.  My rule has been, if I don't feel comfortable doing it myself, hire it out and watch. 

Art......

Question for you. Is the leak constant or only when the upstair tenant flushes the toilet? It is possible that the seal on the toilet is bad and it is leaking. It is also possible a water line is leaking at the valve to the toilet. I would use a drywall knife ($10) and open a 1 foot x 1 foot hole in the drywall directly above the leak. Take a look up and see where the leak is coming from. $200 is a little steep for me for 10 minutes of work just to cut the ceiling.  I would find a different handyman. I would have the toilet pulled again and see what the seal is doing. It will need a new wax ring anyway when you pull it. Be sure the wax rings they put in are tall enough to sit the toilet correctly. If the flange is too low, it may not make a seal with the toilet and water/sewage can get past the wax ring. Any water damage to the floor around the toilet? Water tends to warp the wood floors around a leak.  

Once you find where the leak is coming from you can have it fixed. Once fixed, you may be able to use the same drywall you cut out and patch it back in. Look at youtube videos if you have any questions. You will need to mud and sand down the patch and repaint the area or even the entire ceiling if the color differences are significant (or get someone to do it). a Handyman may charge you about $100 to do it. 

I can't give you a quote on the entire job because we have not established a cause of the leak. Replacing a leaky valve is probably a $75-$100 job for a plumber.  Resitting a toilet should be about $50-100$ if you hire someone. 

Good luck. Let me know if you have any questions.

@Sean Autry

I have inherited my fair share of terrible tenants. You are doing the right thing and get them out. Be firm and things get better. 

I don't know NC law. In Idaho, a tenant must go to court and have a judge decide if a repair must be done if the tenant and LL disagree. Tenants can only withhold rent for repairs in 1 circumstance and that is buying fire alarms. 

If this was my tenant, (If on a month to month) I would pay the 200$ and them give them 30 days notice to vacate.  (If on a Lease), I would let them take me to court.  Maybe letting them pay the filing fee will teach them something. I would save all my communication with the tenant and not get a lawyer for a small claims issue. The judge can explain to them or to me what NC judges expect from everyone. Also, I would add a clause to the lease that no repairs paid by the tenant will be reimbursed.

I would wait for the fire report. Did the tenant start the fire? New Years holiday and they left the stove on or smoking in the apartment. Who knows..... 

If the tenant didn't start the fire and is truly a victim as well. Best to return their deposit and any rent for January they paid for and won't be able to use.  Be glad you had insurance to help. Hope the red tape isn't too thick. 

I agree with Greg S. ask the tenant what they prefer. Why lose a good tenant if you don't have to. 

Your lease should state when the security deposit will be returned. Typically it would be when all the signers of the property have vacated the property and turned over the keys back to the LL.  Did you collect deposits from 5 individuals when they moved in or just one? Since 1/5 are moved out, check your lease and see what it says. 

If it is silent about this issue, refund the deposit and update your lease to include that security deposits will be returned within 30 days after ALL signed tenants have vacated the apartment.

I would consult an attorney and have them send the management company a certified letter. That letter would detail that I had moved out (on a specific date ) and the keys are on the counter. Second, that I would be responsible for any loss until the end of the lease until a new renter can be found. I would detail that approved applicants have been found on a specific date.  If two months penalty is not in the lease, then you have no obligation to pay it. Your obligation is to pay the rent each month by a certain date. If the PM company wants a re-rent fee, they should put it in the lease as a cost of breach. 

Third, I would document that any claim toward my credit would be a cause of action against their company as it is their responsibility to mitigate their losses and they chose not to act promptly.  

If they sue you, you will have this documentation and representation. If they claim against your credit, you may have cause to get damages from them. 

I suspect a letter from a lawyer which outlines these issues, will prevent them from a foolish action of attacking your credit or suing you.  It may motivate them into getting it re-rented ASAP. Read your lease carefully though. You will be responsible for their losses as long as they are trying to get their apartment re-rented in a reasonable amount of time.

Dee,

Take Pictures of everything!!! Document ALL damage. Keep a list and make a reasonable cost of repair for the damages they did. 

If you withhold deposit for any damage, have a picture of it. If you end up in court, the judge will expect you to have documentation and pictures of each damage you claim/cost you withhold. 

If damages exceed deposit, send them a list of the damages and invoice them for the balance due minus the security deposit.  Remember though to not include reasonable wear and tear. Don't try to charge them for new carpets, new floors etc. Charge for depreciated carpet and floors etc. 

I recommend you use a list as Brian said which details what you will charge if certain repairs will cost. This needs to be part of your lease so this list won't help with your current issue but will for future tenants. 

One thing I do is take pictures then email the pictures to my email. This gives it a date/time stamp. The tenant in court can't claim those pictures were taken before they moved in as the email shows it was taken on the day they moved out.  Tenants always want ALL their deposit back and rarely accept that their damage is their fault.  Always take pictures before they move in and after they move out!!