All Forum Posts by: David C.

@Irina Badal

Holding title in a land trust will keep your personal name out of the public records when purchasing or financing a property.  A professional trustee such as Exeter Trust Company is the way to go if you want it done right, imo.  You of course have to judge if anonymity is worth the addition cost.  There can be challenges getting loans and title insurance but a professional trustee can help navigate.  The title holding trust (land trust) is as its name implies simply for holding title, an estate planning trust (what I think you refer to as a personal residence trust) would be the beneficiary of the land trust.

@Richard Ferraro

No need to pay buyers broker in CA, AB2992 allows the buyer to walk away from the buyer-broker agreement "if the out-of-pocket costs to pay their agent remain to great ..."

CA AB2992: Allows buyer to walk away from buyer-broker agreement

If a WY LLC buys a property all cash there is no public record with your name on it, the manager/member remain private. If the WY LLC gets a loan there is a security instrument (deed of trust or mortgage) that needs to be signed and recorded. That security instrument is signed by the member/manager of the LLC ... if you personally are the member/manager your name will show in public record.

If a trust buys a property all cash, the trust name along with its trustee will show in public record.  If there is a loan involved, the trustee name will also show on the security instrument.  If the trustee is you, your name will show.  If the trustee is somebody else, your name will not show.

If you want anonymity, either the LLC has to own the property with member/manager being a trust (with trustee other than yourself). Or, the trust (with trustee other than yourself) owns the property with LLC as beneficiary.

Costs: LLC registration, annual secretary of state fees, agent for service fees, bookkeeping fees, tax prep fees, attorney fees to unravel structure mistakes, others I can't think of.

Also, there are challenges getting title insurance, property insurance and loans for a trust.

This is a way to get your name out of public record, no comment on whether it's good or bad.  I'll leave structure to the attorneys.

Your anonymity is blown if you as manager/member of your WY LLC sign a mortgage ... i.e. get a loan.

If you own property in a revocable trust (land trust) with someone other than yourself as trustee you can achieve anonymity, since that trustee will sign the mortgage. Your WY LLC can be beneficiary of the trust, giving whatever liability protection that offers. That's a way to get both anonymity and liability protection. Unless someone here knows otherwise.

Having said that, personally I'm not sure how valuable anonymity is compared to the cost of the structure ... as many have said here on BP. Also, be aware that your identity will eventually come out depending how far litigation goes.

I'm curious how CA agents can make a living with laws like AB2992 that state:

• "If the out-of-pocket costs to pay their agent remain too great and the seller and buyer have not yet reached an agreement on the sales price and/or terms, the buyer may walk away from the subject property provided there is an exit clause, proceed without representation, or approach the seller's agent about possible dual agency representation."

 If you have more than one property rehab going on at the same time, how does irs/lender/investor know which expense goes with what property? ... Bank statement and credit cards don't separate out property.  Seems like a great way for rehaber to make the financials look any way they want.

@Stuart Udis

Any reason a title holding trust (with trustee other than oneself) and LLC as beneficiary wouldn't give anonymity and limited liability? Of course, if title is held in your personal name before transfer to trust there is a trail, and similarly with the mortgage. But if property is originally purchased in trust, and mortgage, if any, signed by trustee, there is anonymity and limited liability as far as I can tell.

If a claim is filed all this will eventually come out. And insurance is still required.

I’m not suggesting this as the go-to strategy, simply trying to better understand. I happen to agree with most of the folks on this board that this kind of structure is overkill.

Also, understand there can be issues getting a mortgage with an institutional lender and potential problems getting title insurance.

@Colin C.

Just curious, what forms do you use? I looked into this a while back and determined it cost basically the same to be a MLS only broker and buy forms directly from CAR, as it does to join local board and CAR. With local board and CAR membership, in addition to MLS access and CAR forms, you get CAR benefits such as a free lawyer and full access to their website. They probably structure pricing this way to encourage CAR membership.

Change $22,000 to $2,200 and you get 11.01%.  They likely misstated the question.

Make it simple on yourself. Since you already paid, file a claim in small claims court naming whoever is on the payoff demand, FCI in this case apparently.

Something similar happened to me a while back.  Escrow closed on a property I sold, I was charged for taxes I already paid, that fact was clear as could be.  I spoke with everybody at the escrow company .... talk, talk, talk ... nothing.  I filed in small claims court, nothing until the day before hearing, escrow called and paid me.