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All Forum Posts by: Jon Martin

Jon Martin has started 33 posts and replied 986 times.

Post: Depreciation to offset W2 income

Jon MartinPosted
  • Posts 997
  • Votes 855
Quote from @Bonnie Griffin Kaake:
Quote from @Jon Martin:
Quote from @Kevin Chubet:

Assuming it is an STR that you materially participate in then yes.

Now it comes down to what the improvements are and when the property is placed in service. If it is furnishing the property, land improvements, ect. then utilize 39 year. I usually function aggressively in the depreciation space because over 39 years with time value of money that deduction honestly is terrible

Yes this would be an STR.

One other thing I'm confused about. As we transition into 80% bonus depreciation in 2023 (and 60% in 2024, 40% 2025 etc assuming no action by congress), what happens with the remaining 20% of that allowed expense that I cannot write off for 2023? Does that get divided over the remaining years of depreciation allowed for that type of expense? 

Example: If I spend $10K in furnishings in 2023 and the depreciation cycle is 5 years, would I deduct $8K in 2023 then $5K/year for the next 4 years?

Big thanks! @Kevin Chubet

Cost segregation was valuable even when we did not have bonus depreciation. The tangible property was still separated into 5, 7, 15 years and 27.5 or 39 for the structure and building systems. Then, the benefits were taken over that accelerated time for each classification. The bonus just allows you to take whatever percentage of the identified 5, 7 & 15 year in the first year the study is done. The rest would be depreciated ongoingly for the remainder of the 5, 7, 15 years and of course, the 27.5 or 39 years. I hope that further clarifies your question.  

Thank you @Bonnie Griffin Kaake ! That is exactly what I was hoping to get answered. To answer your questions from the previous posts: 

1) Yes, same year for improvements as purchase (2022)

2) Improvements- floors, drywall (demo'd the old wood paneling), open floor plan, new doors, new paint inside & out, etc

3) Yes

4) Yes, contracted 

FYI I will seek professional advice so I am certainly not holding anyone to this. 

@Jared Asch Thank you for the post. Can you clarify how Bonus Depreciation will be calculated in the 2023-26 years as it is being phase out? With 80% bonus depreciation in 2023 (and 60% in 2024, 40% 2025 etc assuming no action by congress), what happens with the remaining 20% of that allowed expense that I cannot write off for 2023? Does that get divided over the remaining years of depreciation allowed for that type of expense?

Example: If I spend $10K in furnishings in 2023 and the depreciation cycle is 5 years, would I deduct $8K in 2023 then $500/year for the next 4 years (5% for 4 years=20%) ?

Do I have it right? 

Red Awning is a joke. I spoke on the phone with them. IIRC they charged 10% and were strictly a booking engine. They don't respond to guest complaints, arrange cleaners, or any of the actual management. 

Lots of threads about Evolve here, and the consensus is that they underperform and take far too much control over your listing. 

Post: Depreciation to offset W2 income

Jon MartinPosted
  • Posts 997
  • Votes 855
Quote from @Kevin Chubet:

Assuming it is an STR that you materially participate in then yes.

Now it comes down to what the improvements are and when the property is placed in service. If it is furnishing the property, land improvements, ect. then utilize 39 year. I usually function aggressively in the depreciation space because over 39 years with time value of money that deduction honestly is terrible

Yes this would be an STR.

One other thing I'm confused about. As we transition into 80% bonus depreciation in 2023 (and 60% in 2024, 40% 2025 etc assuming no action by congress), what happens with the remaining 20% of that allowed expense that I cannot write off for 2023? Does that get divided over the remaining years of depreciation allowed for that type of expense? 

Example: If I spend $10K in furnishings in 2023 and the depreciation cycle is 5 years, would I deduct $8K in 2023 then $5K/year for the next 4 years?

Big thanks! @Kevin Chubet

Post: Depreciation to offset W2 income

Jon MartinPosted
  • Posts 997
  • Votes 855
Quote from @Kevin Chubet:
Quote from @Bonnie Griffin Kaake:

@Carlos Ptriawan @Kevin Chubet There is a misunderstanding of STR here in these posts. First, STR must be depreciated over 39 years, not 27.5. Second, You don't have to be a Real Estate Professional to make your STR an active investment, you simply have to materially participate in its management according to the IRS' terms. Active participation in a STR is a business and is treated much like a hotel. Having a W2 income and claiming RE Professional Status is a great trigger for an IRS audit. On the other hand, if a spouse actually meets the qualifications for being a RE professional (meticulous documentation) and you have W2 income, you may be in the clear.


STR materially participate yes can offset

Long-Term rental without RE professional status will stay passive. 

STR is 39 years, traditional 27.5 but you are in it for the bonus depreciation if you want to offset income. The building/components getting depreciated over the longer life won't have much impact

If I make improvements to the structure, let's just say $50K, can I use 100% bonus depreciation to deduct the full $50K in the tax year that I made the improvements? Or does that get added to the cost basis of the overall structure and amortized over 39 years (~$50K/39 = ~$1282/year deduction). 

For added context I am also not a RE professional, this would offset W2 income. Thank you all in advance for your clarity. 
Quote from @Adah N.:

@Jonathan W.

The open floor plan where the kitchen opens to the breakfast/dining area is great. The one where everything, living room, family room, dining, kitchen is all one room is a no-no for me. Yes, people need some privacy sometimes, more so with the wfh trend.


 I could get behind that. Even some partial partition walls can go a long way. 

@Charles Clark I appreciate the honest reply and I always welcome opposing viewpoints, especially when someone is willing to take an unpopular opinion. Here is where I disagree. 

Kitchen aesthetics: A lot of the things you listed (stainless steel, backsplash, etc) would still be highly desired in a closed off kitchen for most buyers. Not only do those ameneties make it more aesthetically pleasing, they also facilitate easier cooking and cleaning. As for the cost, you can make a kitchen look pretty amazing with a modest bump to your budget over baseline home cheapot materials. 

Entertaining: I agree that this is overstated relative to how often most people entertain. However I think the real benefit is being able to keep an eye on your kids while you cook and/or watch some mindless entertainment, and also be able to communicate with your family while also doing kitchen tasks. 

Privacy: I don't know if I buy this one. With a closed off kitchen, do you think the parents are going to hang out in the kitchen while their kids and their friends get rowdy in the living room? I don't see it. Seems that you would need an additional living space like a TV-free "living room" (something I had in the midwest growing up, but aint nobody got space or $$$ for that in California) or a finished basement (another non-existent luxury where I live) if you want an additional living space to spread people out. 

FTR I grew up in mid-century segmented midwest homes and have lived mostly in open floorplan homes as an adult. I'll take the latter any day, so it has nothing to do with what HGTV told me to like. I've also been the guy preparing food for the ***holes watching the epic game in the other room, which is not something I ever want to have to go through again, even for my own family! 

An STR buy and hold is also perfectly viable in lots of markets. I'm not sure why it has to be an either/or. Given a choice I'll go for the option that provides the best returns.

All valid points. Where open floor plan looks especially awkward is when the living room is already narrow from side to side and goes straight back into kitchen like a train car. I see this often with new construction where they are trying to fit a a 2 story 3/2 with a 2 car garage on a postage stamp lot. Definitely helps to break it up with a breakfast bar. I think we could also see more partial open floor plans with offset kitchens that open up into a more square and defined living/family room. 

Shiplap also comes up on those lists lol. Reminds me of the godawful wood paneling I just spent a fortune to Sheetrock over. I would also like to see word art die a quick yet painful death real soon! 

Seen this pop up on several “top 10 trends going out of style in 2022” type articles. It cites Covid work from home as the reason, where people desire more privacy now. 

Personally I’m having a hard time coming up with Cons, and that the Pros greatly outweigh them. Mainly being able to cook and clean the kitchen without missing out on the game or movie. Especially for parents who need to cook and don’t want to feel left out, while also making sure that their toddler isn’t running around with a butter knife and trying to stick it in electrical sockets. Open floor plans generally feel larger too. 

Does anyone actually see the open floor plan trend going in the other direction, back towards the mid century era of dark closed off living spaces?