All Forum Posts by: Michele V.

My hunch is you can charge them for everything (not my professional opinion, b/c I'm not a real estate atty).  I'm sure you have a real estate atty.  Perhaps pick their brain, while separately asking your lawyer friend, as suggested.  Run the situation past him/her and then, only after they've shared their professional opinion, tell them who you were talking about the whole time.  That should guarantee a candid response while also ensuring a conflict later if necessary.  

But these people are real louses.  It's a real shame.  It's tough b/c they were probably living in their last home at the time you interviewed the prior LL. So you wouldn't have been able to find out about their antics and shenanigans with the last security deposit when you were considering their application to lease your place.  :/ 

thank you for the great info, Minna, Greg & Travis! I'm on the market for a single family property in Jacksonville that will cash flow and appreciate, and that's also in a good (ok, I'll take not so bad) school district (what's up with the schools?!?) I'm not at all happy to be looking to buy right now (I'm 1031 exchanging). So I'm grateful for the helpful insights.

I love the idea of maxing her out with the first and last month's rent plus the security deposit. I would also ensure that she has someone to co-sign on the lease as well, ensuring that that person understand exactly what they are getting themselves into. The bank statement concept is great as well.  Besides those points (and the others already raised), I would seriously consider putting her on a 6-month lease only for starters.  It would be easy to evict her during this pandemic season once her lease has expired, I think.  

All that said, to me, it sounds like this lady may have personality issues that may end up being a headache that you can't afford.  The fact that she has lived there for a while is nice, but you don't know what she's like.  Is it that easy to be fired from a job in the school system?  How likely is it that she's right about being the victim?  If everything that's ever gone wrong in her life is everyone else's fault, all this work you're going to get her financials straight will be a total waste (and you'll have a baby keeping you busy on top of a potentially high-maintenance tenant?). I say smile sweetly and pass.  you can do it. :) 

Love these answers.  For me, the deal breakers are the recency of the offense and the fact that he's living in the same house with you (although you should be just as concerned about others' safety).  

I will say this: as far as the underlying circumstances are concerned, I wouldn't take the wife's word for it.  The female significant other ALWAYS does a great job putting a spin on the circumstances that got their husband in trouble long before they even met.  I sense that you are struggling turning down people with whom you feel connected, and you might be inclined to let them move in despite the concerns.  I get it (I sound like I don't have a conscience, but I do).  If I'm right about that, I would encourage you to reach out to the jurisdiction where the offense took place.  He was 17 at the time, but was treated like an adult.  So you should be able to reach out to the clerk's office or the relevant police department's records section and get your hands on a report or factual summary describing all that took place.  If the person who he is said to have murdered killed his sister (I think that's what the wife said) and he was 17 years old at the time, I have to say that I SERIOUSLY doubt that he would have been sentenced to all that jail time.  I know it varies depending on a number of factors (I am a career prosecutor (way older than I look)).  But still.  These things are red flags in the wife's story that cause me some concern.  Do not move that family into your property just b/c they seemed nice and connected well with you when they came over.  I'm sure you've asked your friends and they all think your nuts for even considering them in the first place, which is why you're asking your BP family.  We all do that and I totally understand.  But PLEASE take the time to check into the back-story, b/c something is not adding up for me.  

Amazing and wise answers, all.  But, based on the hand-wringing I can sense in you (which is totally understandable), I have to go with the response that said you should just kiss the money goodbye.  I only suggest that b/c you are clearly (and legitimately) concerned about the relationship with various members of your family.  It's unfortunate that you have a family member who knows you have money and also knows that you value family more than you value your money.  In some ways, I'm sure we all wish we had a family member we could hit not once but twice like that.  But the chickens do come home to roost, so it's better to steer clear of conduct like that. The man is a low-life.  It would be great to sue him.  It's easy to tell you to do that from over here.  But if you're more concerned about rocking the relationship-boat, you are going to have to 1) kiss the money goodbye, 2) forgive yourself for the time you burned by giving that much money away (b/c now you have to figure out how to recoup what you lost and that will take time), and 3) figure out a way to look the man in the eye every Thanksgiving.  That can be done, but not easily.  

Alternatively, and I think this is the real issue, you are going to have to get over your fear of confronting this issue head-on.  You don't have to cause a big fight about it.  But you do have to put your foot down, first with yourself (the bigger challenge) and then with him.  Many families have a human ATM.  For whatever reason, this man thinks that's who you are and he has no respect for you.  I'm just telling you the truth.  If the tables were turned, he wouldn't be doing all the soul-searching you're doing.  There is a way to diplomatically point that out, expressing that you don't appreciate being exploited, and explaining that your investment goals and timelines are no less important than his.  He won't grasp that, b/c he honestly thinks his idea of what to do with your money is superior to yours.  He knows you as sweet, generous, and a push-over.  There's nothing wrong with being meek.  But it's absolutely possible to be confident at the same time, and being disrespected by another man in your family is more than a little obnoxious, in my opinion.  And I'm not even a man.  If you are going to do something about it, you should schedule a polite and respectful meeting with him privately at a time and place where none of the wives and sisters are around or even aware.  Sit him down, tell him how he is messing up your life, and graciously put him on a timeline, explaining that you have already spoken to an attorney about the situation.  If he has a fit (which he may), maintain your composure and explain that HE has left you no other choice.  

BUT if you can't see yourself doing that and if all the women in the family are going to create merry you-know-what if you do it, then take a deep breath, apologize to your wife, kids, and grandkids, and let it go.  
   

If the man is an on-going liability to your property and a danger to other tenants, it seems to me that putting something on the door to keep it from staying open is the least of your worries.  It is unfortunate, considering his age.  But I would recommend that you focus your attention, energy and money on getting him out of there. 

Thank you for the reminder to look at job growth, Charles!  Miami has certainly been doing well on that front as far as South Florida is concerned.  At least based on my little review of the job growth in the state, I think I'm right in saying that Jacksonville and Orlando are doing well up north.

Everyone, thanks so much for your thoughts! I will keep my expectations low while reaching out to my local credit union as well as a broker. After considering house hacking a 4-plex for a while, I began to prefer the idea of a 5-unit. But I can't make the down payment. So I will just have to start where I am & aim at a smaller multifamily for now.

Everyone, thanks so much for your thoughts! I will keep my expectations low while reaching out to my local credit union as well as a broker. After considering house hacking a 4-plex for a while, I began to prefer the idea of a 5-unit. But I can't make the down payment. So I will just have to start where I am & aim at a smaller multifamily for now.

Happy July 4 all, 

I'm checking in with a question that might be so stupid that it's insulting, but I'd like to know your thoughts if you wouldn't mind sharing them.  I am analyzing my options in my goal of investing in a multifamily property.  I'm happy to house hack - I love the idea of only having to put down 5% for a 4-unit if I'm going to live there.  

The challenge is that I'd really like to be able to invest in a 5-unit, but I don't have the 25% down-payment that's required for commercial properties.  

So my question is: if I plan to be an owner-occupant in a 5-unit property, is the 25% down payment still required (or might a lender allow for a lower down payment, for whatever reason)?