All Forum Posts by: Sid Payne

It sounds like you've done virtually no research and have virtually no plan.
Good luck with that.

Is this place free or something? I know your partner is going to supply it but are they getting it for free or something?

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A quick synopsis, I have 4 short term rentals in the Disney World area. I am looking to get a 5th. I have found a house I like that would be a direct sale. The guy wants $310K and I have the down payment for a conventional mortgage. He is pretty firm but I thought I would offer him $302,500.
However, I am thinking I can save a ton of money in fees (appraisal, closing costs, etc.) if we do seller financing. I am not sure, but I think he owns it outright. If we did seller financing it would be easier for me to get to the $310K that he wants.

My lender is quoting me 5.3% on a 30yr fixed mortgage.
My question is, how hard is it to setup seller financing, would I offer him the same rate (or better) and is it worth it to go that route compared to the hassle of the mortgage process. I estimate I'd probably save a few grand by not going though a bank.
One place I would not try to save money is the inspection, that would still be a must.
Essentially, I can qualify for a mortgage but I would like to have fewer mortgages on the books for future investments and I hate paying all those fees.

Any advice?

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Originally posted by @Tim Schroeder:

Originally posted by @Michael Greenberg:

Thanks @Tim Schroeder! So do you think it's worth the monthly investment? It seems that it takes the headache out of a lot of the daily monotonous tasks. Are you using any of their "pro" features?

$20 for 2 properties. I'm also using the Channel Bridge Pro feature which they're going to start charging a bit extra for soon.

How do you find the Channel Bridge Pro feature? I don't think it works with VRBO/HomeAway yet, correct?

Is this what you're using?
https://www.ownerreservations.com/blog/introducing...

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Lots of great advice on here already. I would reiterate a couple of them.

For a new listing, I discount heavily for the first couple of months to get traction and reviews. I openly say that in the description. Something like "New Listing Special!!!" at the beginning of the title and then something like "This is a new listing and we need reviews. We are running a special for the first two months to get folks in here". Obviously, you should play with the wording. Some cash flow is better than none and may at least cover your costs.

I would agree that things look dated. This is a competitive business and it can be expensive to keep up. Luckily, once you upgrade some things, it should be a long time before you do again.

Professional photos are a must. And, you only have 15 photos? VRBO/HomeAway allows you to have up to 50 and rewards you with better search rankings for having more high quality photos. I know it may be hard to get 50, but if you add some pictures of the closest mountain, that might help. Also, no pictures of the view from the deck? Is there a peaceful view from there? It looks like there would be.

Look at your competitors listing and see if you can do better. In looking at your competition, it seems like you should be able to pretty easily. At the same time, none of them look that booked up either. That might not be a great sign.

Good Luck!
Sid

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Originally posted by @Michael Greenberg:

Thanks @Tim Schroeder! So do you think it's worth the monthly investment? It seems that it takes the headache out of a lot of the daily monotonous tasks. Are you using any of their "pro" features?

Absolutely, I think I pay $29 per month to manage 5 properties. The time it saves on emailing alone is well worth the cost.

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Originally posted by @Michael Greenberg:

Hi @Sid Payne,

I was a focused Airbnb'r until last year (though always ran both VRBO and ABB). That shifted this year as for whatever reason I saw my ADR with Airbnb starting to erode as my market in Arizona became more saturated with STR's. I also found that my larger homes were getting more attention on VRBO and I was able to get paid in advance (cash is king), whereas Airbnb sits on the guests cash until they have checked in, then it takes even a few more days for them to transfer the funds to me (or you can pay them to send it earlier - BS in my opinion). At times it can be challenging to manage two many of those nuances anyway. So for now, my focus is VRBO/HA and my secondary option is Airbnb to fill those extra "lower rate" available days. I would recommend experimenting in your market with both and if it becomes too burdensome, you can always dump Airbnb.

Question for you about OwnerRez: What's missing? What do you have to manage yourself? Do they support both ABB and VRBO with the same feature set? Are you using their premium features and are they worthwile? I am considering an off-load of the day to day management.

Best,

Mike

I think I would go crazy in this business without OwnerRez (https://www.ownerreservations.com/?referredBy=oru5b14b3cf4bx). I know there are other platforms out there that are similar but this is the one I know. I can't remember why I picked them over the competition, probably price combined with feature set.

For me, they have a huge number of features and is critical for keeping everything in line. The vast majority of my bookings come from VRBO but once they are booked, I create the booking in OwnerRez. I do not like to sync calendars automatically between the two as I don’t trust it to work 100% of the time and keeping your calendar straight is probably the most important thing you can do (there are a lot of “most important things” but having a double booking is a complete nightmare). Also, their sync does not bring over all of the information. That is changing and I think has already changed with Airbnb.

Once the booking is in OwnerRez, it manages all of my automated guest communications (things to do in the area, a welcome email and follow/thank you email). It also allows me to pull reports, including what we have brought in so that I can more easily pay the sales taxes.

There are tons more features and it can seem a little overwhelming at first but I just used it for the very basics as first and then added features I was using it over time. They are very reasonably priced and their support has been great. I have even sent them feature suggestions and they have implemented them.

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Originally posted by @Nancy Bachety:

@Sid Payne I never thought about that before. In your experience, do you think the folks who pay the $499 get a better ranking? To answer your question about airbnb, no, hosts only pay a 3% fee, it's the guests who pay more. Our prices on VRBO are higher because we pay more on that platform.

@Luke Carl With all the bookings you get from VRBO, why don't you pay the annual fee? Isn't it less expensive doing it that way?

Age aside, personally I find that the airbnb app and platform are way more functional and user-friendly on my android and iPad, and now our new iMac but I know I'm biased against VRBO, for some reason I can't put my finger on.

I am not against working. I'd list on both platforms in a heartbeat. It's not the work, it's the value.

@Chris Watson That's great information, thank you for sharing. Can I ask where your property is and how long you've had it? If you wouldn't mind sharing your listing I'm certain I'd learn a lot from that, enough to list on VRBO too.

I think there are a lot of metrics that go into determining where you rank on VRBO/HomeAway and an annual subscription is one of them. There is a threshold of books where it makes sense to subscribe and I don't think it is that high. I think VRBO/HomeAway rewards you for playing by all of their silly rules (number of pictures, response time, reviews, etc.) and lot of people don't like that. However, I have found it to be worth it by showing up higher in the search results.

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Originally posted by @Tim Schroeder:

Originally posted by @Luke Carl:

@Nancy Bachety We're in Pigeon Forge Gatlinburg Wears Valley Sevierville. I do not pay the annual fee on VRBO. We get about 40% VRBO. Many of our clients do not want to list on more than one platform because they're concerned it will be twice as much work. There is of course an initial time investment to get your listing set up, but once it's up it's no big deal.

I use both platforms. Many folks only use VRBO and many only use Airbnb. I figure the more people looking at my listings the better!

We find. after hundreds of folks we've taught to self manage, the percentage per platform depends on the host. Older hosts tend to prefer VRBO just as older guests tend to prefer VRBO. Younger = Airbnb. People with iPhones prefer airbnb and get more airbnb. Android = VRBO. @Tim Schroeder and @John Underwood don't like when I point this out. You're not old dudes! You're beautiful!

Nancy, I'm in the same area as Lucas, I get 45% from AirBNB and 55% from VRBO (those numbers are booked days. The revenue split is 37-63). It is true that the younger guests prefer AirBNB, but obviously the age of the hosts has nothing to do with which platform you use. I use both, because I want to maximize my exposure. Most people hate the $499/year VRBO fee. Me, I don't mind paying $41.58 per month for VRBO, especially when they give me most of my (substantial) revenue. My electric bill is literally 10 times that. But AirBNB is free, other than the 3% credit card charge which you cannot escape no matter where you get guests.

At the end of the day, having two listing companies is no more work than one. Get on AirBNB. It doesn't cost you anything. Why would you NOT be there?

Try OwnerRez or Logify --- they automate guest communications, emails, and much more and it makes it easier to be on multiple platforms.

Android rules, @Luke Carl :)

I was thinking the same thing, why not get the most exposure, unless the folks you get are a pain in the *** or trash your houses. ;-)

I second the OwnerRez recommendation. I have not used any of their competitors but they are a crucial part of my business.

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Originally posted by @Nancy Bachety:

We have a new cabin in Pigeon Forge area and to date only list it on airbnb. We've been on the fence about using Vrbo with it because we have another luxury house in St Augustine that we list on both but we get most of our guests there from Airbnb. We didn't choose the $499 subscription price and wanted to test it out for a year. So, if we decide to list on VRBO for the cabin too, we'll suck it up and pay that fee.

I think that this area of TN has historically been popular with VRBO so I'm curious to hear replies from other hosts in this area too.

I wonder if going with PPB has hurt your search ranking and maybe that's why you get more from VRBO/HomeAway. Do you have instant booking turned on? That can also make a difference. The truth is that you have to play by all of their rules in order to get a decent search ranking.
I wonder if Airbnb is the same? Do you have choices about how you do some

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All Forum Posts by: Sid Payne

Sid Payne has started 7 posts and replied 102 times.

Post: Vacation home rental

Post: Outfitting an Airbnb; economics vs. convenience

Post: Conventional mortgage or maybe seller financing on STR house?

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb

Post: failing, failing miserably

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb

Post: Successful on VRBO/HomeAway but considering adding Airbnb