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All Forum Posts by: Tony Kim

Tony Kim has started 12 posts and replied 831 times.

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @James Hamling:

Sad part, I don't think the average American has a clue. And I believe the average politician is too damn scared to tell the truth

I usually agree, but I don't think the average politician has a clue either. You're giving them way too much credit for intelligence, or more importantly common sense. Sure they have their Ivy League and Law school degrees, but that has become nothing more than a warning sign nowadays.


And the ones that happen to have half a clue know that it costs too much political capital to make a change that would actually benefit us in the long term. They can move to stop borrowing and stop printing money, but that would also end their political career.

Post: How to trust new syndicate

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Colton Hahn:
Quote from @Tony Kim:
Quote from @Colton Hahn:
Quote from @Lane Kawaoka:

a) How can I trust he is putting in $1M of his own money.

When people are new (under $250m of AUM) I would want to see 10-50% of the capital required. Granted when people are new their net worth is low so they probably don't even have more than 200k to throw into the raise.

b) I have done LP deals in professionally managed syndicates by PE firms before. First time doing Tenants in common. Are there things I need to watch out for

Do you background check. I would personally not do a deal with anyone who has less than 1B in AUM unless I knew them personally, had the ability to take over the GP, and there was an big split for me coming in and giving a newbie a chance (90/10 LP GP split for example).

c) Any other things to be careful about investing with a first time syndicate

Good luck... I would not do it but hey its your money.

 90/10 split? Thats a red flag that they are desperate for capital IMO


True, but I think equally bad is having a fund with a 60/40 split between 15% to 28% IRR. Won't mention what it becomes above 28% as the mere mention of that split would scar me for life.


 Let me know when you come across the 10/90 split I recently saw from a prominent sponsor, might want to have a defibrillator handy! They don't seem to be having issues raising capital.

Keep in mind it's all about risk adjusted returns, some investors are willing to eat a split 80/20 all the way for a deal that may have more operational (sponsor) risk. Others are willing to take on less operational risk to work with a sponsor whose track record speaks for itself :)

And then there are those operators with less operational risk who have excellent full cycle track records who do not charge exorbitant rates akin to highway robbery. Not defending the 90/10 split either, because I've never seen it before. I agree that that is a red flag and I agree with your statement on fund raising. 

Post: How to trust new syndicate

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Colton Hahn:
Quote from @Lane Kawaoka:

a) How can I trust he is putting in $1M of his own money.

When people are new (under $250m of AUM) I would want to see 10-50% of the capital required. Granted when people are new their net worth is low so they probably don't even have more than 200k to throw into the raise.

b) I have done LP deals in professionally managed syndicates by PE firms before. First time doing Tenants in common. Are there things I need to watch out for

Do you background check. I would personally not do a deal with anyone who has less than 1B in AUM unless I knew them personally, had the ability to take over the GP, and there was an big split for me coming in and giving a newbie a chance (90/10 LP GP split for example).

c) Any other things to be careful about investing with a first time syndicate

Good luck... I would not do it but hey its your money.

 90/10 split? Thats a red flag that they are desperate for capital IMO


True, but I think equally bad is having a fund with a 60/40 split between 15% to 28% IRR. Won't mention what it becomes above 28% as the mere mention of that split would scar me for life.

Post: California Vs Out of State (really, but why?)

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Darius Ogloza:

@Bruce Woodruff 

I used to own 6 duplexes and 2 SFR's in Rochester NY and replacing roofs there seemed to be some kind of semi-annual event. Also, hot water heaters. I really question whether you can expect the same life span given the weather difference, but I concede I am no expert. In any event, as Jay points out above, the main point is the 2 versus 20.

People who pay $5,000-$5,500 to rent a house in the Bay Area tend to be pretty easy on the properties and tend to stay for longish periods of time. There is always a line of tenants ready to take over so transitions are minimal. We withhold listing properties that become vacant in order to make repairs/paint because in virtually every case we otherwise have folks inundating us with requests to move in as is. Folks who invest "by the door" tend to underestimate (sometimes vastly) the cost of tenant transitions, and with 20 apartments you are going to have running transitions even if you buy 5 multi's in lieu of 20 SFR's.

Moreover, I personally have not paid a penny due to California's "regulatory" costs.  My property taxes are predictable from year to year.  This is in contrast with  the rest of the states where each year is a surprise ( true in my experience ion Florida and NY - especially school tax).  In 25 years, not a single eviction or threatened eviction in CA.  In fact, judges here do not take kindly to folks who make good six figures not paying their rent. They do not come off as sympathetic litigants.   I had a much harder time in Rochester city court trying to get rid of the $550/month tenants who refused to pay (and there were more than a few) as every one had a sob story and was able to get multiple extensions.

Of course, there's no disputing the management cost issue.  Self-managing 20 units is one hell of a pain any way you slice the proverbial pie.   


 Thank you !!!

This is one of the best post ever.

you should write this in 2019 :) 


As someone who used to invest OOS, I can positively state that the above pretty much mirrors my experience. There was an earlier post that mentioned Toledo...which is exactly where some of my units were located. OK, great price to rent ratios, but spot on about the never-ending capex. Never had an issue with California's dreaded tenant-friendly laws either. As a matter of fact, I'm actually a big beneficiary of them.

I hardly hear a peep from my local tenants and each of them keep my properties in beautiful condition. There is a huge difference between the kind of tenant you will get in area where rent/price ratios are good vs. Prime Socal.

Also, god help anyone who's highly levered in LV or Phoenix. 

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @James Hamling:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Luka Milicevic:

@James Hamling

My solution here is quite different.

If you watch videos of Milton Friedman's lectures from the 1970s and 1980s he talks non stop about inflation. His simple definition is that it is created in Washington, and there is nothing anyone can do about it.

In one of his lectures at UC Berkley, he showed charts of many different countries through different times in history and showed the correlation between the supply of money and the rate of inflation. Any country, at any time in history the correlation is 1-1. 

He also re-iterated on his show "free to choose" that inflation is entirely created by printing money.

You can perfect the tax code all you want. It's not the problem.

Endless money printing and spending is the issue. More dollars chasing finite resources.

And also, tariffs hurt the country that puts them on just as much as the country importing products. 

 The problem is significantly beyond that.  USA is not the country with the highest level of money printing.
It's Japan number one, also country like Belgium,Spain,France,Singapore has the same level as US. 

The most significant problem is since US Dollar is the default currency/reserve of the world, then if there're any **structural changes**
in interest rate in US, the Rest of the world has to adjust to US rate, this is especially true for country that has deficit on export where they
are buying things for their people in US Dollar.  Also the whole theory of 1928 inflation happened when Dollar is not the major world currency reserve. 

The US ciizen can prosper *easily* ***without too much work**** (note this) until this day because all other citizen of the world outside US has to pay their food, good and item following US Dollar. 

Indirectly the ROW  is sustaining the US economy.

IF the US Dollar too strong, then the ROW can't buy food for their people.  

That's why at this very second, investors in Japan is now selling their US bond.

In today's structure global world system. It's expected US and Japan to be have the lowest interest rate in the world, with the developing world having higher interest rate.

Interest rate hikes in US is equal to ecomic crash in Asia and ROW.

If this continue, this will trigger de-dollarization and ROW is starting to use non-Dollar as the alternative reserve currency.


 Yeah, it really is a complex web of many moving parts, interwoven into this rat's-nest it is today. 

The USD starts getting removed as world currency, oh-daddy will we see problems beyond the likes anyone has ever imagined. That's when all the M2 woe's will really come home to roost. I think that's when we see a shift to the Amero. Or DGC. Certainly won't be able to leap back into the gold standard. 

OR.... the great protector of inflation: war. 


Another 0.75% increase in rates today from the Fed. Can someone tell me how this is going to affect mortgage rates? You'd think someone who worked in finance for 30 years would know this, but alas, never worked in Real Estate.

Post: Best Market for MFU to CashFlow and Appreciate

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Nicholas L.:

Is anyone going to provide any cautionary info whatsoever on someone's very first investment being a random small multi in a market like Cleveland? Or is that now a risk free slam dunk - just like an FDIC insured savings account?

LoL, people gotta eat and make a living. Newbie looking for a place to invest her money OOS? All the same usual suspects are gonna make their pitch for why their city is best. 

@Michele Velazquez I'd go with someone who isnt beholden to a single location.....say a TK provider like @Mike D'Arrigo (Pinnacle) who also lives in CA and understands the dilemma we face. 

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @James Hamling:

I gotta add this - the cynic in me wonders how much of this Fed reaction is due to the upcoming election? Meaning that they are desperately trying to reduce inflation to help the side in power.

Or am I just getting too deep now....?


 no it has nothing to do with election or politics.

basically the fed is trying to avoid inflation of 70 and 28 , so they (think) their only weapon is to ........... kill the economy before the recession is growing too strong too long

that's kinda old people theory which some people (including James)  argue that would not be the case (as majority opinion also in ZH)


 It's too bad the Fed succumbed to pressure to reduce rates from the previous admin. Don't really blame them...he was a persuasive dude.

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Tony Kim:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:

Got it. 

Since this thread is about a market crash and Will was discussing the chances of a decline in California prices, just thinking out loud and can't help but think that demographics play a key role. If it didn't, then the country of India would have the highest real estate prices on the planet 🤣 It can't be easy for folks who grew up here to see all these foreign born folks come in and land high paying jobs and drive up real estate prices. Not everyone is ready for what has been happening to California and I don't blame them for leaving.


California home prices up or down is more related to Fed Interest Rate rather than immigration after all :)

The CA appreciation is created when there's huge hiring from tech company. The tech company can expand pretty much when the interest rate is low. With the cheap money policy, money is moving to tech. With interest rate hike is higher like this, investor choosesn not to invest at tech and they're halting the hiring spree or hiring outside CA. 

It's very natural for people to leaving CA, that's not new, and that's expected when economy is growing too fast too strong.


Agree 100% Interest rates play a huge factor. I think there are many factors at play here. Some of it, believe it or not, are the backward laws here that were intended to protect the middle and lower class....which like most laws, had the opposite effect. 

It would be interesting to see what would happen across the country if mortgage rates went into double-digits. This was a real possibility when there were plans to dismantle Freddie Mac.  I'm certainly no expert on what's going on, but I don't think that was a feasible plan, considering what it would do to interest rates. 


 The US interest rate already creates political crashes in Srilanka and other places. Today India announced to halt rice exports. Asian currency dropped like 1998 again unnecessarily, Yen dropped like 15% so far ? it's just so stupid. 

A quarter of those tech companies can't survive without cheap financing.

Freddie Mac gone from US is equal to the end of Biggerpockets.

Btw The Fed actually have not *started* to reduce the MBS purchase, I think it started in October. When they reduced the MBS purchase back in 2018-2019, market/real estate dropped.

It's actually a great time for us to pay down some of the small remaining debt we have for our home in S Korea as the currency rates are pretty crazy right now. Also, it's a good time to take a trip anywhere overseas. When was the last time the EUR and USD were 1:1?

Most tech financing is done through Venture Capital firms by issuing equity and not private credit though..unless special situations dictate they issue pref shares. Even then, the financing payments are done via PIK and not actual cash coupon payments.

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:

Got it. 

Since this thread is about a market crash and Will was discussing the chances of a decline in California prices, just thinking out loud and can't help but think that demographics play a key role. If it didn't, then the country of India would have the highest real estate prices on the planet 🤣 It can't be easy for folks who grew up here to see all these foreign born folks come in and land high paying jobs and drive up real estate prices. Not everyone is ready for what has been happening to California and I don't blame them for leaving.


California home prices up or down is more related to Fed Interest Rate rather than immigration after all :)

The CA appreciation is created when there's huge hiring from tech company. The tech company can expand pretty much when the interest rate is low. With the cheap money policy, money is moving to tech. With interest rate hike is higher like this, investor choosesn not to invest at tech and they're halting the hiring spree or hiring outside CA. 

It's very natural for people to leaving CA, that's not new, and that's expected when economy is growing too fast too strong.


Agree 100% Interest rates play a huge factor. I think there are many factors at play here. Some of it, believe it or not, are the backward laws here that were intended to protect the middle and lower class....which like most laws, had the opposite effect. 

It would be interesting to see what would happen across the country if mortgage rates went into double-digits. This was a real possibility when there were plans to dismantle Freddie Mac.  I'm certainly no expert on what's going on, but I don't think that was a feasible plan, considering what it would do to interest rates. 

Post: Housing crash deniers ???

Tony KimPosted
  • Rental Property Investor
  • Los Angeles
  • Posts 843
  • Votes 1,015
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Tony Kim:

Nice response, Tony! No problems with me.... And I am not anti-California, sorry if it comes across that way. I still have family and friends there and it is still a beautiful state.

And yes, I recognize the various demographic types that are coming and going but I see that as largely irrelevant to this particular conversation...we were discussing just the numbers game, or at least I was :-)

And as to your question: why has Cali outperformed....? My belief (as I have stated earlier in this thread) is that it's because California has incredible beauty, a never-ending list of things to do and see, and near perfect weather (at least in the south, I personally never cared for NoCal weather)

Got it. 

Since this thread is about a market crash and Will was discussing the chances of a decline in California prices, just thinking out loud and can't help but think that demographics play a key role. If it didn't, then the country of India would have the highest real estate prices on the planet 🤣 It can't be easy for folks who grew up here to see all these foreign born folks come in and land high paying jobs and drive up real estate prices. Not everyone is ready for what has been happening to California and I don't blame them for leaving.