Investing out of state in Milwaukee and Indianapolis, looking for local contacts.

32 Replies

Hello everyone,

My name is Anup Patel and I am Real Estate Investor based in California looking to invest out of state. I have some experience investing California. I looking for buy and hold properties as well as flips as well. After doing some market research and looking at demographics investing in Milwaukee and Indianapolis looks like a great place to invest.

I am planning to make a trip to Milwaukee and Indianapolis in March/April 2015, to look and scout both of these areas in person. I am hoping to network with real estate agents or property mangers who can find me single family homes below 25K-30K that require up to 5k in repairs  or duplex or triplexes that average about 25k a door. I would be purchasing these properties all cash if possible.

Please reply if you know anyone willing to work with out of state investors in either of these areas or just if you like to network via the biggerpockets community. Hopefully after getting some contacts I can finalize a trip and get to meet some if you as well. Thanks for help and Happy holidays.

Anup

Check out Lee Smith in Indianapolis.  I have bought quite a few properties from him ranging from 12k (needing 7k of work) all the way up to 85k.  He fixes them up and manages them for me.  Good luck in your investing endeavor.

Anup,

I am happy to meet and/or speak with you as to the Indianapolis market. I work with a lot of out-of-state and international investors in Indianapolis, including from California. 

Feel free to contact me. 

I look forward to hearing from you.

Anup,

I am in the Indianapolis area. I have personally flipped a few houses and do a lot of my own rehab.  Would be willing to help however I can.  Stay in touch

Thank you everyone for your advice, it is greatly appreciated! I look forward to networking with you all soon.

Hello Anup,

Glad you are thinking about the Indy market!  It is really very exciting right now.  Inbox me if you would like to chat and maybe set up some time to meet up early spring.  Steve L. is right, I would love to help you out!

Welcome to BP @Anup Patel  !

It sounds like at those price points you are looking at the lower end of the rental neighborhoods.

IMHO - I would suggest looking at a little better property to save yourself lots of future issues and headaches [I've been this route before and it's a tough road].

I'll be glad to point you the right direction with any questions you may have for the Indianapolis market.

@Anup Patel  

@Shawn Holsapple  is right. At those prices you will be in very rough areas of the city. They might look good on paper, but I can assure you that they will most likely be nightmares. I know the Indianapolis market and I know that anything all in for $30-$35K is in a ware zone. In my opinion, properties in that range are not going to be good long term buy and holds. Feel free to contact me if you want more insight.

@Anup Patel  

  I wrote an e book specific to this asset class it was for Australians that were getting hammered in the US.. buying very low valued assets.

the very low end only works in very specific circumstances.

You may want to give it a read PM me for a copy.. many picks have been broken as Mike and Shawn state when one goes under 50k all in for a mid west asset in  a large mid west town.  I owned personally 350 of them.  and sold them all last year.. plus I owned another 200 of them that I foreclosured on in 07 to 09 and sold OREO... so I have a little experience at this asset class.. not all  of mine were in the price point you talk about but some where and so I have some battle scar's for sure.

@Anup Patel  in Indianapolis you are going to be hard pressed to find 25-30k deals that only need 5k in repairs.  You usually find those price points in lower end neighborhoods and many times they need more than 5k in repairs.

Steve L. may be able to help you find more affordable homes with little work needed, but you will be looking at the 35-45k price range, but they need little to no work!

Originally posted by @Mike D'Arrigo :

@Anup Patel  

@Shawn Holsapple wn Holsapple Holsapplen Holsapple is right. At those prices you will be in very rough areas of the city. They might look good on paper, but I can assure you that they will most likely be nightmares. I know the Indianapolis market and I know that anything all in for $30-$35K is in a ware zone. In my opinion, properties in that range are not going to be good long term buy and holds. Feel free to contact me if you want more insight.

 Mike D'Arrigo,

You say, "anything all in for $30-$35k is in a war zone."

Danny Johnson a successful BP member and real estate investor, in his blog article, defines a warzone as areas where gangs, prostitutes, drug dealers, etc. are out of control (or in control – however you want to look at it).

Respectfully, I think you are making a sweeping generalization saying anything in Indianapolis all in for less than $35k is in a war zone.  I am confident that many of the professional Indianapolis investors who are on the ground and local here would agree with me. 

I closed on 737 Temperance Ave, a 3/1 house in the Christian Park neighborhood just last Friday.  The all in amount on that house to have it turnkey and renting at $750 is less than $35,000.  This includes new water heater, new furnace, new AC, and updated paint, appliances and flooring, and updating the electric service. It also has a really nice 2 car garage. 

I'm not sure how familiar you are with Christian Park, but I would have no hesitation taking my young son to the park to play in that neighborhood.  I certainly wouldn't classify this as a war zone. I would have had no problems living in that house myself, but I already own a home.

I sold a 3 bedroom brick ranch house, with a garage, and a full basement, on Pasadena Ave to Shawn Holsapple late last year in Lawrence Township that rents for $750.  This house was in a neighborhood full of post war built brick ranches and two story homes with full basements.  At the very least, 50% of the homes were owner occupied.  Owner occupants do not inhabit war zones.  The all in amount for this house was less than $35,000.

A few years ago I sold a house at 1610 Ringgold Ave to Ryan and Ashley Mullin in Bates-Hendricks neighborhood where the all-in amount was less than $35,000.  Bates-Hendricks is certainly not a war-zone and there are houses in that neighborhood that are now comping for $150k - $200k

One could argue that it's unfair for you to make sweeping generalizations such as the one above. There are many professional investors in Indianapolis who have different business models than yours, and these professional investors meet the needs of many out of state investors by selling them cash flowing properties for under $35,000. Many of these houses are in gentrifying neighborhoods where the prospect of higher than average appreciation balances the risk.

When you repeatedly make statements like the one above, you are making statements that are not based on fact, one may argue, that in essence, you are using a form of propaganda to promote or publicize how superior your business model is compared to the other Indianapolis turnkey operators or wholesalers. 

Your website, podcast, and forum posts are chalk full of great content, and you are a wealth of free information.  Therefore, it's also dangerous for you to make statements like these because you have a lot of influence on the community of out of state investors.  Many of these investors trust you, and rightfully so.  However, when statements like these are made you could be preventing an investor from taking justifiable risks and investing in gentrifying neighborhoods of Indianapolis.

I'm confident there are many successful Indianapolis investors in the BP community who can give examples of properties they bought all-in for less than $35,000 that meet their investment goals. I'm also confident that these properties aren't in war-zones.

One could also argue that you are trying to sway investors from doing business with turnkey companies or wholesalers in Indianapolis who sell more affordable properties than the properties you sell.  

Every out of state investor has different investment goals, and different levels of risk tolerance.  It's not your job to tell these out of state investors that it's wrong for them to buy houses for $35k because anything like that is in a war zone.  

The same goes for me. It's not my job to tell these out of state investors that they'd be crazy to buy one house for $120k, when they can buy 3 houses all in for $40k.

It is every wholesaler's and turnkey operators job to identify the investor's goals, identify their tolerance for risk, and steer them in the right direction even if that means they aren't buying a house from us because we don't carry the inventory.

I'm confident that many Indianapolis investors in the BP community can give examples of properties they bought from you for $100k+ that they are doing extremely well on.  

I wish you the best, and I'll continue to refer out of state investors to you when I can't meet their needs!

Originally posted by @Ben G. :
Originally posted by @Mike D'Arrigo:

@Anup Patel  

@Shawn Holsapple wn Holsapple Holsapplen Holsapple is right. At those prices you will be in very rough areas of the city. They might look good on paper, but I can assure you that they will most likely be nightmares. I know the Indianapolis market and I know that anything all in for $30-$35K is in a ware zone. In my opinion, properties in that range are not going to be good long term buy and holds. Feel free to contact me if you want more insight.

 Mike D'Arrigo,

You say, "anything all in for $30-$35k is in a war zone."

Danny Johnson a successful BP member and real estate investor, in his blog article, defines a warzone as areas where gangs, prostitutes, drug dealers, etc. are out of control (or in control – however you want to look at it).

Respectfully, I think you are making a sweeping generalization saying anything in Indianapolis all in for less than $35k is in a war zone.  I am confident that many of the professional Indianapolis investors who are on the ground and local here would agree with me. 

I closed on 737 Temperance Ave, a 3/1 house in the Christian Park neighborhood just last Friday.  The all in amount on that house to have it turnkey and renting at $750 is less than $35,000.  This includes new water heater, new furnace, new AC, and updated paint, appliances and flooring, and updating the electric service. It also has a really nice 2 car garage. 

I'm not sure how familiar you are with Christian Park, but I would have no hesitation taking my young son to the park to play in that neighborhood.  I certainly wouldn't classify this as a war zone. I would have had no problems living in that house myself, but I already own a home.

I sold a 3 bedroom brick ranch house, with a garage, and a full basement, on Pasadena Ave to Shawn Holsapple late last year in Lawrence Township that rents for $750.  This house was in a neighborhood full of post war built brick ranches and two story homes with full basements.  At the very least, 50% of the homes were owner occupied.  Owner occupants do not inhabit war zones.  The all in amount for this house was less than $35,000.

A few years ago I sold a house at 1610 Ringgold Ave to Ryan and Ashley Mullin in Bates-Hendricks neighborhood where the all-in amount was less than $35,000.  Bates-Hendricks is certainly not a war-zone and there are houses in that neighborhood that are now comping for $150k - $200k

One could argue that it's unfair for you to make sweeping generalizations such as the one above. There are many professional investors in Indianapolis who have different business models than yours, and these professional investors meet the needs of many out of state investors by selling them cash flowing properties for under $35,000. Many of these houses are in gentrifying neighborhoods where the prospect of higher than average appreciation balances the risk.

When you repeatedly make statements like the one above, you are making statements that are not based on fact, one may argue, that in essence, you are using a form of propaganda to promote or publicize how superior your business model is compared to the other Indianapolis turnkey operators or wholesalers. 

Your website, podcast, and forum posts are chalk full of great content, and you are a wealth of free information.  Therefore, it's also dangerous for you to make statements like these because you have a lot of influence on the community of out of state investors.  Many of these investors trust you, and rightfully so.  However, when statements like these are made you could be preventing an investor from taking justifiable risks and investing in gentrifying neighborhoods of Indianapolis.

I'm confident there are many successful Indianapolis investors in the BP community who can give examples of properties they bought all-in for less than $35,000 that meet their investment goals. I'm also confident that these properties aren't in war-zones.

One could also argue that you are trying to sway investors from doing business with turnkey companies or wholesalers in Indianapolis who sell more affordable properties than the properties you sell.  

Every out of state investor has different investment goals, and different levels of risk tolerance.  It's not your job to tell these out of state investors that it's wrong for them to buy houses for $35k because anything like that is in a war zone.  

The same goes for me. It's not my job to tell these out of state investors that they'd be crazy to buy one house for $120k, when they can buy 3 houses all in for $40k.

It is every wholesaler's and turnkey operators job to identify the investor's goals, identify their tolerance for risk, and steer them in the right direction even if that means they aren't buying a house from us because we don't carry the inventory.

I'm confident that many Indianapolis investors in the BP community can give examples of properties they bought from you for $100k+ that they are doing extremely well on.  

I wish you the best, and I'll continue to refer out of state investors to you when I can't meet their needs!

@Jay Hinrichs

Could I trouble you for a copy of that book as well? I'd really appreciate it. Thank you!

@Ben G.

 Before I address your war zone comments, l want  to address your personal comments about me using the forum for "propaganda". I'm a little surprised that you would make a comment like that.  If you will recall, you reached out to me over a year ago asking me if I would be willing to share my insight and experience with you which I gladly did with no expectations of selling you anything .I do this with a lot of people because I get satisfaction out of helping people which is why I do my radio show.  Secondly, I don't need to drum up business with propaganda because I have far more buyers than I have inventory right now. I could solve that problem and make a lot of money very easily. I could simply choose to sell cheap properties but I don't. I have years of experience doing this and I know that's where the problems are and I'm not going to jeopardize my relationship with my turn key investors. especially those who are out of state. Am I overly cautious when it comes to these cheap properties? Maybe so but that's because there's a very big difference between a turn-key company and a wholesaler. When I sell a turn-key property, I am creating a long term relationship with  the investor buyer and have to deal with all the problems that come up. I choose to minimize the possibility of that by offering better properties in better areas. As a wholesaler, you sell a property and move on. Anything that comes up is someone else's problem after that. Contrary to what you say, I am not trying to publicize my business model as being superior to others. I frequently say that there are lots of different ways to make money in this business and if you read my posts, I have often praised @Ryan Mullin as an example of someone who does a good job and can be trusted in spite of the fact that we have very different models. Wholesalers play a valuable role also. I beg to differ that it is not my job to share with my investors my thoughts and recommendations. They demand it. They are mostly out of state and need someone that can advise them. In my opinion, that's part of the added value that a good turn key company offers their clients. We don't just sling product at people without educating and informing them. That would be a HUGE disservice to them and consequently, I have had multiple and lengthy conversations with many new investors helping them make their decision based on their goals NOT mine. I take a consultative approach with every one of my clients which is exactly why their properties make money and they are happy.  

Now let me address some of your specific examples. Of course I know Christian Park. I make it a point to know the city on a neighborhood and street level and anyone who deals with me knows that. And I agree, Christian Park is a good area. We've sold properties right off English Ave and Emerson near the Temperance property that you are speaking off. I have to disagree with you that this will be an under $30K or $35K property however. If you recall, you e mailed me that property on 3/6 offering it at $29,997. Call it $30K. As you said in this post, it will need "new water heater, new furnace, new AC, and updated paint, appliances and flooring, and updating the electric service". That is NOT a small rehab. As a wholesaler, I don't know if you have ever done a rehab and know costs but you would be lucky to do all that for $10K and more when you count the unexpected things that come up. If you have a contractor that can do it cheaper than that then please

give me his name. Rehabs ALWAYS cost more than you start out thinking. So now we're at $40K which is not less than $30-$35K. Having said that, $45K is a good deal for that area and I would gladly sell properties over there.

You mentioned a property that you sold on Ringold a "few years ago" for $35K. Ben, where have you been? You live in Indy so you know 3 years ago was a lifetime. You know prices have skyrocketed since then--double digits sometimes. Median prices are currently up over 9% YOY. What do you think that $35K house 3 years ago would be selling for today?

The question I have for you Ben is why do you think we avoid the cheap properties under $40K? There is no barrier to entry keeping us from doing so. I'm sure I could sell a ton of them and I did in the past. I have chosen not to do so anymore because of my experience and the experiences of my investors.

@Mike D'Arrigo

As I said in my original post, I agree that you provide valuable information to the community. I’m not going to argue that. I also realize that you’ve shared information with me in the past about the benefit of buying higher priced properties, and I agreed with you.Since then, I have also learned there can be just as much benefit in buying lower priced properties as well if you know how to properly screen and manage the risk.

Like I said, you’re a big influence on the out of state and in state investors in Indianapolis, and that’s why I am confused as to that comment regarding all $35k or less properties being in war-zones.You’re knowledge of the Indy market is evident, and I was just trying to figure out why, with all your knowledge and expertise of the market, you would make a sweeping generalization like that.

Was it propaganda? No, it wasn’t. I overreacted and took your comment on war-zones out of context and I’m sure what you meant to say was, properties under $35k are tougher to manage, tougher to keep occupied, and riskier than higher priced properties. However, can we mutually agree, that with the right management, in the right neighborhood, and with the right tenant screening, some cheap properties have the potential to produce exceptional returns, and increased appreciation for investors?

Again, propaganda was the wrong word for me to use.I apologize. You have every right to be upset with me when I implied that you are trying to mislead investors. Your radio show, and the content you produce and information you share, with the exception of the war-zone comment is always accurate and informing.

For that reason, you should understand that when you make a comment like the war-zone one above, it can come off as a form of swaying investors from buying lower priced properties, and the likelihood of them taking that comment as fact is highly likely. The main point I was trying to make was that not all $35k properties or less are in war-zones.Would you agree with me?

If we were to switch it around, and I made a statement not based on fact that you mistakenly implied as threatening your business model it could go something like the following:“Investors who pay for higher priced properties will never make as much money as those who buy cheap properties because the cap rates on those higher priced properties are significantly lower than the cheap properties.”We both know this is not true, just like the war-zone comment is not true.

I’d like to address your comment about wholesalers not building long-term relationships and simply selling then moving on. First, I have the option to fix my properties before wholesaling them, and this is something I am considering in the future and therefore I always have to make sure that if I buy a property and resell it, that it will provide value for the buyer.

As a wholesaler, I don’t simply sell a property and move on. I do have buyers that are buying properties to add to their personal portfolio.Therefore, I too have to buy properties that enable me to build long-term relationships with my buyers whether they are turnkey companies or end-buyers.If I don’t sell my buyers performing properties or properties with the potential to perform, then they won’t buy from me in the future.Wouldn’t you agree?

To address my specific examples of sub $35k properties I have bought and sold:

Temperance was purchased for much less than $30k and I could have sold it for less than $30k and still produced revenue for my business.My buyer for this was an end buyer who added it to his portfolio. The marketing packet I sent to my buyers stated that all mechanicals and electrical were functioning perfectly fine.I stated that my rehab items were optional for my buyer.I didn’t have to do this, but I did, because I realize that some people want brand new everything.This investor has told me that if it’s functioning, then he see’s no reason to replace it. The house was occupied when I bought it, and there were no major issues found in the inspection.So as you can imagine, the rehab was minimal.

I don’t believe, that I said I purchased the Ringgold property for $35k.I could be wrong, but I believe I said it was purchased for less than $35k. That property was purchased for $20k and needed less than $15k in rehab, probably more like $10k in rehab. That transaction was two years ago, not three.Even with prices up 9% YOY it still makes it less than $35k two years later.

To answer your question, I’m not sure why you avoid the cheap properties under $40k. Perhaps you’re targeting a smaller group of investors, who want lower risk and that’s understandable!It’s not up to me to judge whether your customer’s criteria is the best option for them.

I do feel like you could be missing out on the opportunity to increase your inventory and your client base by also catering to those investors that are willing to take more risk for the chance at much larger returns on their investment and %9 YOY price increases in some of these gentrifying neighborhoods that have a lot of distressed property.It would be like an investment advisor buying small cap stocks for their client rather than bonds, because their client is willing to take on more risk.

Again, I want to apologize for me questioning your intentions and motives in a public forum.I should have contacted you privately.

I hope that we can still work together sometime in the future.

@Ben G. Thanks for the reply. I appreciate it. I still stand by my comments about cheap properties but I probably should have said hi crime or war zones. Actually, there are very few was zones in Indianapolis but there are a lot of high crime areas. Unfortunately, there have been some people who lure unsuspecting out of state or out of country buyers in to these rough areas because of the cheap prices without the buyer having a clue of what they are buying. You would be amazed at how many calls I get from these people asking for advice on what they can do or wanting me to help unload their disaster. Some of them have put their life savings in these "investments" that will never turn a profit. This is why I do feel it is my job to educate and inform people besides the fact that my investors want that kind of guidance. I'm not just picking on cheap properties however. When people ask me for my opinions on higher end B or A class properties, I often tell them that they can get more bang for their buck with a C class. It all just depends on their comfort zone and objectives. You're right that I could expand my inventory and sell more if I started selling cheaper homes but know what will happen. I'll be spending more time taking phone calls from investors that are having problems with their tenants and then are mad at me. You can tell people all you want that they are buying a higher risk asset and that they should expect more problems, but I guarantee you that when they have problems and that crappy tenant has to be evicted they will suddenly forget those conversations and what you told them and it is all your fault. That's just human nature to blame someone else. The other thing I hear over and over  is "I know it's higher risk but I have a great PM that can handle it and I'm willing to take on more problems for the higher return"  There's 2 problems with this. Even if your PM can walk on water, no matter how good they are, they can't place good tenants in lousy neighborhoods. The other problem is that they act as though those additional problems don't come with cost. Vacancy and turn over repair are the biggest cash flow killers, so these deals that look great on paper rarely pan out. Your deal on Temperance would be an exception because that's a great area but you'd be hard pressed to make that a scalable model. Deals like that are not a dime a dozen. Your deal on Ringgold however is exactly what I'm talking about. No, I wouldn't call Bates Hendricks a war zone by any means, however, Bates Hendricks is an area full of good little pockets surrounded by large areas of rough streets. Ringgold happens to be one of those streets that I wouldn't sell a turn key on. I'll share my reasons why in a DM.

@Mike D'Arrigo

@Ben G.

Having a little experience in this field  IE owned 350 of these C class houses and foreclosed on another 200 of them.. some in Indy as well.. And having clients who bought poorly in Indy.

I agree with Mikes general premise 30 to 35k homes are very risky for out of state land lords.. they are perfectly fine for in state on the ground I do this for a living investors who can be Johnny at the rat hole when issues come up.

I have dealt with many TK companies from my first loan to a TK company in 2001 when the model was just taking shape.. and an industry was born.. and it was actually this exact client that brought me to Indy in the first place...

Virtually every turn Key company that has survived and thrived has moved out of the 25 to 35k space in a BIG Metro area.. smaller metro areas its still OK in my mind ...

Can you find a pocket yes... Can you as a CA investor lose all your money  YOUR darn right you can and fast.. why do you think Ben is in business in the first place  he is buying homes and wholesaling them from landlords that failed.. a good % of these deals are where they come from I would venture to guess at least 50% of them. If these areas were so rock solid you would not be able to buy a board up or a home that needed extensive rehab because its been a rental.

One does have a much safer play from out of state when you go up the food chain it just makes Logical sense the best tenants want to live in the best homes and best neighborhoods with the best schools.. 30k in the Inner city of ANY major metro area is not were these type of homes are found...

So in Summary Local guys can make these work.. out of state its 50/50 gamble.. your either going to kind of make it work or Ben will be buying your home for 10k in 3 years once you have been through 3 tenant turnovers a complete strip of the home etc.

I have one of my personal investors who has a duplex in Indy he paid 60k for put 30k into it and has basically lost all his money.. Its been broken into and stripped 3 times.. And he lives in Australia so what can he do about it.. Nothing get out and invest with me were his money is truly safe LOL not in super low end rentals in the mid west... If he had bought 120k SFR out in the burbs we would not be having this discussion and he would have not lost his money... But people get sucked in thinking hey its 30k and rents for 750 its the 2% rule that's what every one says is good .. 1% is bad etc etc.

@Ben G.

when a CA investor is wiped out do you give them back the money you made wholesaling the house... or do you just chalk it up to they should have picked better.. the idea is your just a wholesaler and could care less about what happens to that house once its out of your inventory.. and you no doubt being young and if you stay in the game you will be back here on BP talking about the same house you have bought 3 times... Many of my veterans in the industry that I have funded over the years have done exactly that bought the same home 3 times.. and it was not from some poor sub prime home owner it was failed landlord.

@Mike D'Arrigo

Could you please identify the good pockets of Bates Hendricks and which ones are not so good? With the exception of Ringgold which you have already clarified as not being a good street.

Steve,

Bates Hendricks in my opinion is tricky. So is Fountain Square. There's some real good areas but it is so spotty it's impossible to identify areas by street boundaries. You really need to view it on a map. I'm sure you know that these areas are very street to street and you have to know them well. @Ryan Mullin seems to have a good handle on the area. Personally, I like to remove the margin of error or the possibility of the bad areas creeping in to the good areas. Even in gentrifying neighborhoods, you can still have good areas deteriorate if they are outside of where the gentrification is taking place. These neighborhoods can do well but it is no slam dunk by any means.

@Jay Hinrichs how do you know who I'm buying homes from?  I buy from owner occupants as well, not just landlords who fail, but also landlords who are successful. I have several video testimonials of owner occupant sellers praising me for the level of service and convenience I gave them.  If you'd like to see them, I'd be happy to share them with you.  

When you say I am buying homes from landlords who fail, this is another example of a sweeping generalization. 

Yes, some of my homes are purchased from landlords who fail.  Did they fail because of the asset location?  Landlords fail in Greenwood, Carmel, Avon, and Brownsburg as well.  Other homes I have purchased are from owner occupants, and landlords who are retiring and had success in the business.  I don't only buy from landlords who fail, and not all landlords fail in gentrifying neighborhoods.  I also don't buy in war-zones, I personally don't know anyone who buys in war-zones to be honest.  I learned very quickly when I first started to avoid those areas, even if I could buy the house for $5k. 

I have an email from you where I asked if you would be interested in JV funding deals. You offered to JV with me on deals or lend me transactional funding if as you said, "we can do a descent volume."

Why would you want to JV or do business with someone who in your words is, "just a wholesaler and could care less about what happens to that house once its out of your inventory."

Shouldn't you want to do business and partner with people who have integrity and generally care about helping others?

@Ben G.

being that I funded over 2,000 of these deals.. I know for a fact that every TK company , wholesaler etc buys from failed landlords. That's my point its not only you its everyone. In the business. It was deductive reasoning... I mean I foreclosed on over 200 landlords that failed and I was just one small HML...

My point is the lower in price point you go the higher the probability of failure for out of state investors. There is a constant back and forth on this website.. But just like I make a generalized statement that you disagree with.. YOur making generalized statement that all 30 to 35k homes are prudent investments for out of state landlords.. They just aren't end of that story...

And yes I fund all sorts of people in the business that do volume.. But before I fund them I come check them out spend a week with them... If I determined you were selling crap I would not fund you at all... My offer to look at your deals was just that a look see.

Now again I am all for you local boys buying these assets for personal use.. My guys in MS that I fund did over 60 of them last year that I funded then all and  they refinanced and now hold they have a 5 year target to amass 500 of them and I will fund virtually everyone of them Just like I did for many pre 08 crash.. .. Same asset class but they do it for a living. As for selling to out of state my funding side goes to higher end product that sells in the 65 to 125k range were I think out of state investors have a better than 50/50 chance.

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