Tricks of the trade... What is yours?
Dustin WoodleyBusiness Member
Real Estate Broker · Prattville · Member since 2018 · 68 posts · 40 votesTricks of the trade... What is yours?
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Investor · Prairieville, LA · Member since 2015 · 311 posts · 424 votes
7yOriginally posted by @Nathan Gesner:
Your trick doesn't make sense. You say to hook the garden hose to the "washer hookup on the house" but that's a water supply line, meaning water comes out of it. How are you pumping water into it?
And what difference does it make if you use a garden hose or if you use the washer hose from the back of the washer machine? It's a just a hose, just like a garden hose but sometimes nicer. Why would it matter if this is inside or outside or even used at all?
Basically, he is flowing water from the neighbor's outside faucet to the washer faucet inside the house that has no water service. Since the water company has closed the valve at the curb, you are effectively feeding water into the house via the washing machine faucet. The flow direction on that faucet is now in instead of out. The reason he mentioned a washing machine hose is because you need two female fittings, whereas a normal water hose has a female and male.
This is a way of not hooking up normal water service when you just need water on for an hour or so for cleaning purposes, therefore avoiding hundreds of dollars in hookup and usage fees. In certain cities, it is very expensive for water service and some charge every month even if the usage is zero.
81 Replies
- Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes7y
Your trick doesn't make sense. You say to hook the garden hose to the "washer hookup on the house" but that's a water supply line, meaning water comes out of it. How are you pumping water into it?
And what difference does it make if you use a garden hose or if you use the washer hose from the back of the washer machine? It's a just a hose, just like a garden hose but sometimes nicer. Why would it matter if this is inside or outside or even used at all?
The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews - Investor · Prairieville, LA · Member since 2015 · 311 posts · 424 votes7y
Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:
Your trick doesn't make sense. You say to hook the garden hose to the "washer hookup on the house" but that's a water supply line, meaning water comes out of it. How are you pumping water into it?
And what difference does it make if you use a garden hose or if you use the washer hose from the back of the washer machine? It's a just a hose, just like a garden hose but sometimes nicer. Why would it matter if this is inside or outside or even used at all?
Basically, he is flowing water from the neighbor's outside faucet to the washer faucet inside the house that has no water service. Since the water company has closed the valve at the curb, you are effectively feeding water into the house via the washing machine faucet. The flow direction on that faucet is now in instead of out. The reason he mentioned a washing machine hose is because you need two female fittings, whereas a normal water hose has a female and male.
This is a way of not hooking up normal water service when you just need water on for an hour or so for cleaning purposes, therefore avoiding hundreds of dollars in hookup and usage fees. In certain cities, it is very expensive for water service and some charge every month even if the usage is zero.
- Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes7y
Thank you, that makes more sense. I didn't realize you could pump water into an outlet, but I guess it makes sense.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews - 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
I think every LL needs a legal means to get rid of "undesired" tenants without the effort/bad feelings of terminating a lease or worse an eviction.
We use month to month lease and have never terminated a month to month lease for any reason other than missed payment. What we do instead is raise the rent above market rent. The tenant may think we are clueless to what the current market rent is but they end up providing us notice. If they give notice, it is tough for them to state that we terminated the lease for some illegal reason as we did not terminate the lease, they did.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
I first heard of this one from Landlording on auto pilot, Mike Butler. Refer to yourselves as the Property Manager not the owner. It provides a means to not provide answers to requests immediately. We need to check with the owners. It also could prevent them from being unhappy at you for any decision the "owners" made. Can we tear up the grass and use the yard as a bike lot? No the owners want the grass as it appeals to more potential renters than a bike lot. Can we put a storage container out front so we have more storage. No the owners think that storage containers detract from the curb appeal. Etc.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
This is real obvious but place as much as you can on auto pay. Mortgage payments, utilities, service contracts, etc.
Similar, the tenants should not be paying to you directly but pay to the accounts. They should not be provided a means to pay you directly, not by cash, not by check, not by any means.
Just watch the inflow and outflow but let as much of it happen without interaction as possible. Auto pilot.
- Sterman, MI · Member since 2017 · 378 posts · 306 votes7y
In Michigan, you HAVE to provide at more than one means of rent payment. Why would you want to restrict the way they pay you? Yes, electronic is nice but half of my tenants pay check, money order and sometimes cash. As long as they pay me.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
@Dan HeuscheleThat would be wonderful but low income areas that’s not going to happen . Cash is still king in tough neighborhoods
Most of our units are in a very working class area. I would have the general area as C but specific areas range from D+ to B- and our particular units in that area are C to C+. I have tenants that do not speak any English and tenants that speak very little English. I have tenants that are landscapers (total of about 10 of my tenants), handymen, truck drivers, tow truck driver, install flooring (2), etc. Most are working class (no level of education required) and the landscapers, in particular, are used to cash. They all get their rent deposited into our account. The wife will walk them through the process if that is required. Better to spend some time once then spend some time on-going.
Do you still go to the tenant to collect the cash? If so, how will that scale? You will need to find a more efficient method to scale.
Good luck
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Originally posted by @Jim S.:
In Michigan, you HAVE to provide at more than one means of rent payment. Why would you want to restrict the way they pay you? Yes, electronic is nice but half of my tenants pay check, money order and sometimes cash. As long as they pay me.
Why limit them? It is about our convenience and our ability to scale. We do not want to physically collect rent, especially cash which we would not desire the tenant to send through the mail. We do not want to need to go to the bank to deposit rent checks (or cash).
We want to make owning units as passive as we can.
Up until when we had about 10 units, we took various payment methods. First we got rid of accepting cash because we went to the tenants to collect the cash. That is time consuming. Eventually we eliminated every choice except deposit into our accounts.
Our current rent collection process consists of monitoring the deposits. On the due date we know who has not paid. In general, all of our tenants pay on time, every time. However, if the payment is late, it is dealt with immediately and they are informed what the payment will be with the late payment fee and that we expect payment immediately.
The one wrinkle is we have multiple units that utilities are shared and in our name, but we have the tenants pay the utilities. For those units we need to distribute the utility fee prior to the rent being due (we distribute it via text). It is not as passive as I would desire, but it is less work than collecting cash.
Are you certain about the need in Michigan to provide more than one means of payment? I thought I had learned this from a Detroit Landlord but I could be mistaken where I first learned this. It works well in San Diego county and the state of CA has quite tenant friendly laws.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
If you have many units on backflow valve protection, get them on the same check schedule (our municipality requires the valves to be checked by an approved vendor and evidence that they are working correctly be provided to the municipality). Doing all the valves at once may result in a savings to the cost of the checks but it also prevents taking care of one in August, 2 in October, 1 in December, etc.
Get them on the same schedule and find someone that will provide a bulk discount. Getting them all checked and providing the municipals the evidence the valves are working all at once will save time and possibly money.
This same process can be applied to other activities that need to be on a consistent schedule. For example, HVAC filter cleaning/swaps could be a candidate for placing all on the same schedule (but we use handyman for these type of activities and it requires less of our effort than the backflow valve check and therefore is not as critical).
Auto pilot.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Lockout protection: No one wants a call to let a tenant in because they are locked out. Most of our units have a shurLock (LandlordLocks.com) attached to the hose bib in the rear. These lockboxes require a combination to access and can be easily changed. The lock boxes have a different combination to remove the lockbox than to open the lockbox. The combo to remove the lock box is in reality a simple algorithm from the combination to open the lock box but the tenants do not know the algorithm.
We allow one lock out a year without charge. When they get locked out, we simply provide them the combination to the ShurLock. We tell them to put the key back once they enter the property. Next time we are over we check the key is there and change the combo to the ShurLock as a means to ensure the key is there when it is needed. We note the changed combo in a auto synced notes app (so we all know the combos).
Saves us from ever having to send someone over to let someone in. It has failed once when a tenant failed to put the key back and locked themselves out before we were over to have verified the key was present and to change the combo. We did not let them in. They needed to call her husband home to let her in; her fault.
Auto pilot
- Sterman, MI · Member since 2017 · 378 posts · 306 votes7y
Dan Heuschele, yes I'm sure about Michigan law. Only offering one method of payment is discrimination to people that don't do electronic banking. If you want passive, hire someone to do your job!!! So you won't go to the bank once a month for several thousand dollars??? I do, and I smile all the way there. And I get groceries at the same time. lol.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Access keys have many issues:
- Many units can imply many keys. Managing keys can be a hassle.
- Tenants turn over. New tenants deserve access keys that are different from all the previous tenants.
Enter LandlordLocks.com:
- A master key can swap cylinders in a couple minutes (when you first start using it they occasionally take a bit longer)
- They have entry locks and padlocks that can be keyed the same.
- A single Landlord key can open any of the locks associated with the landlord key sets.
- An common entry lock (such as for the laundry room) can be open by any tenants' key.
Our Process:
- We reserve one Key for our use. This is for areas we do not desire any tenants to have access and our home is on this key.
- We reserve one key for vacant. Various contractors get this key. The cylinder for this key is a different color that looks good with our standard color handsets. This allows us instantly to know that it is not in use by any tenant and can help insure that we swap back to tenant cylinder prior to providing the new tenant keys. Remember swapping cylinders takes maybe two minutes (worse case after you get used to it).
- We have a pool of tenant keys that get swapped between our units. I think our current tenant key pool is 6 different tenant sets of keys. We do not issue a key to a new tenant that has been used in that unit from a previous tenant. I.e. no previous tenant has the same key.
When a tenant moves into one of our units, we swap the empty unit cylinder to a tenant cylinder that has not been used on that unit; no previous tenant of that unit has a key.
The number of types of keys we have to manage is fairly small (6 different types of tenant keys). Finally we have a key that can be used to access all of our units. We do not need to carry a large set of keys around with us to ensure we have access to all units.
Auto pilot and scalable.
- 7yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Originally posted by @Jim S.:
Dan Heuschele, yes I'm sure about Michigan law. Only offering one method of payment is discrimination to people that don't do electronic banking. If you want passive, hire someone to do your job!!! So you won't go to the bank once a month for several thousand dollars??? I do, and I smile all the way there. And I get groceries at the same time. lol.
I am unsure but there seems to be some hostility but I could be wrong. if you thought I was indicating that you were definitely mistaken about the Michigan law I was not. I thought I learned that trick from a Detroit Landlord but I was not certain.
Many of my tenants do not have a bank account but it does not prevent them from depositing into my account so I do not believe it is a discrimination but it definitely is not discrimination of a California protected class. Not having a bank account is not a protected class in CA.
I do not care if the trip to the bank once a month is several thousand or several hundred thousand dollars. Our $15k/month RE is automatically deposited the same as our lowest rent unit. If I can avoid driving to the bank to make deposits then I would prefer to spend the time doing something I find more rewarding. If you enjoy going to the bank to make your deposits then you should continue to drive to the bank to make your deposits.
I suspect most of the Tricks of the trade will be items to either save time or money. I suspect many landlords will appreciate a tip that can save them a trip to the bank. I also think that because I have things on auto pilot is exactly why I would not need to hire a PM. Those that are over whelmed doing things without processes will find it hard to scale without a PM. Those with efficient processes can continue to scale without the use of a PM.
Auto pilot.
- Helen, GA · Member since 2015 · 96 posts · 68 votes7y
@Dustin Woodley, this is brilliant. Thanks for sharing.
- Rental Property Investor · Douglas County, MO · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes7y
We have never had a tenant call us about locking themselves out, but if it is a problem for you, use non-locking doorknobs. The only way the tenant can lock the door from the outside is with a key in the deadbolt.
- Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Dustin Woodley:
One trick we use sometime is take a water hose from the back of a washer machine... I carry one in my trunk (With a plunger). Go to the neighbor and offer them $10 cash to run a hose from their outside faucet to your house for a few hours. Run the washer machine (keep this part out side) hose and a garden hose to the washer hookup on the house you need water on and now turn the outside faucet on. In about 30 seconds you have running water for a few hours! We will sometime use this to get a house leaned really fast. Now you have not had to set up a account with the local water board and pay a turn on fee. The most a neighbor has ever charged us was $20 and some just say not worry about it.
Or do what I do if I need short term water, just turn the damn valve back on. Even if it’s locked, they’re flimsy and they can’t prove I broke it :)
I don’t do that crap anymore but I sure used to when I was poor and starting out :)
- Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Dan H.:
Originally posted by @Jim S.:
Dan Heuschele, yes I'm sure about Michigan law. Only offering one method of payment is discrimination to people that don't do electronic banking. If you want passive, hire someone to do your job!!! So you won't go to the bank once a month for several thousand dollars??? I do, and I smile all the way there. And I get groceries at the same time. lol.
I am unsure but there seems to be some hostility but I could be wrong. if you thought I was indicating that you were definitely mistaken about the Michigan law I was not. I thought I learned that trick from a Detroit Landlord but I was not certain.
Many of my tenants do not have a bank account but it does not prevent them from depositing into my account so I do not believe it is a discrimination but it definitely is not discrimination of a California protected class. Not having a bank account is not a protected class in CA.
I do not care if the trip to the bank once a month is several thousand or several hundred thousand dollars. Our $15k/month RE is automatically deposited the same as our lowest rent unit. If I can avoid driving to the bank to make deposits then I would prefer to spend the time doing something I find more rewarding. If you enjoy going to the bank to make your deposits then you should continue to drive to the bank to make your deposits.
I suspect most of the Tricks of the trade will be items to either save time or money. I suspect many landlords will appreciate a tip that can save them a trip to the bank. I also think that because I have things on auto pilot is exactly why I would not need to hire a PM. Those that are over whelmed doing things without processes will find it hard to scale without a PM. Those with efficient processes can continue to scale without the use of a PM.
Auto pilot.
Dan is 100% correct. It’s about scale. When I had a few properties I’d pick up cash. Sure whatever.
Try that with 100s of units. Or 1000s.
There are so many systems to take care of this. We even allow tenants to pay cash at a few places we partner with (711, ace cash express, CVS) where they take in cash and rather than buy a money order, they show a QR code and they $ goes right into their ledger
- Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes7y
I've talked about it before on BP, but it bears mentioning again. This is a tip for getting better BRRRR financing.
When you're in line for a lowball appraisal, switch out all the bulbs in the property to 5000K daylight at the highest wattage you can afford. Switch them back after the appraisal.There are basically three outcomes to an appraisal: you can get lowballed, you can get treated fairly, or you can get a high estimate. A very large part of successful BRRRR depends on getting the most money out of your properties. Banks have a vested interest in getting lowball appraisals in BRRRR situations, and if appraisers want to keep working for their main clients, those banks, they quickly learn to be well-versed in the art of giving the banks what they want, money-making lowball appraisals that screw you, the investor, and take money out of your pocket.
An appraiser is going to come in with a point-and-shoot digital camera, or, in the worst case, use her/his phone. All digital cameras in that price range are going to use what's called "CMOS" sensor technology. For many technical reason, these digital sensors all work better at capturing light at daylight temperatures than at the more common warmer indoor lighting temperatures. Many museums that allow photos nowadays play with variable-colored light in their indoor spaces to keep tourists with nicer digital cameras from accidentally getting the highest-quality shots of their pieces.
The appraiser is going to get fewer opportunities to get shots to justify a lowball appraisal if your property is very bright and the lights are at the daylight-colored range. The white balance of his camera will be more optimized, contrast and levels will be better judged by the camera's software, even the focus will be sharper if you flood the rooms with light. Any pictures the appraiser would like to take will just look...better.
The only exception to this lighting improving digital pictures is a dirty property. In a property slated to be BRRRRed, you're already going to have a tenant in place, so it's also well worth your time to have the place professionally cleaned and white-glove inspected immediately before an appraisal. Or, if you're like us, do it yourself. Your tenants will get a kick out of it and not be offended as long as you give them this technical information about camera sensors.
Finally, the human eye and brain are still much more advanced and capable than any lenses and cameras. When you have people coming through to judge a property to decide to live in or not, you're not going to want to have the same lighting.
- Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes7y
My tricks of the trade are: be the best landlord I can be so my tenants LOVE living in my units. I give my tenants my cell number so they can text me anytime. This saves me added expense when they get something repaired and i have to have it redone.
I also do rent via ACH and in Oregon this is legal. It makes it super easy for all. ( my units are high end student and market rate housing)
I also clean my units myself so i know what condition each unit is in so there is zero question when a tenant moves out.
I dont invest in RE to do nothing. I invest to make money. The better service i provide the more I can charge :)
Eta - my units rent before they are vacant and for the student units they rent 9 months in advance. So the above is definately worth the effort :)
- Developer · San Diego, CA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Dan H.:
Access keys have many issues:
- Many units can imply many keys. Managing keys can be a hassle.
- Tenants turn over. New tenants deserve access keys that are different from all the previous tenants.
Enter LandlordLocks.com:
- A master key can swap cylinders in a couple minutes (when you first start using it they occasionally take a bit longer)
- They have entry locks and padlocks that can be keyed the same.
- A single Landlord key can open any of the locks associated with the landlord key sets.
- An common entry lock (such as for the laundry room) can be open by any tenants' key.
Our Process:
- We reserve one Key for our use (H3 Properties). This is for areas we do not desire any tenants to have access and our home is on this key.
- We reserve one key for vacant. Various contractors get this key. The cylinder for this key is a different color that looks good with our standard color handsets. This allows us instantly to know that it is not in use by any tenant and can help insure that we swap back to tenant cylinder prior to providing the new tenant keys. Remember swapping cylinders takes maybe two minutes (worse case after you get used to it).
- We have a pool of tenant keys that get swapped between our units. I think our current tenant key pool is 6 different tenant sets of keys. We do not issue a key to a new tenant that has been used in that unit from a previous tenant. I.e. no previous tenant has the same key.
When a tenant moves into one of our units, we swap the empty unit cylinder to a tenant cylinder that has not been used on that unit; no previous tenant of that unit has a key.
The number of types of keys we have to manage is fairly small (6 different types of tenant keys). Finally we have a key that can be used to access all of our units. We do not need to carry a large set of keys around with us to ensure we have access to all units.
Auto pilot and scalable.
Do all your units have the same number of locks? The also use LandlordLocks.com masterkeyed locks on almost all properties, but I've found it challenging since some properties have 1 lock, some have 2, 3, or even 4. In this case, would you have 4 of every cylinder? Have you found an elegant case to organize all your cylinders and keys and such?
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