Direct Mail - is it still working?

147 Replies

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full trust and full disclosure, how much do you charge for your SEO services for both packages? Your website doesn’t mention a price.

You have been working SO HARD to push people to do SEO so it’s only fair that people know much you charge.

Originally posted by @Sharad M. :
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

I wish and sincerely hope that more people specially from my market would listen to @Jerryll Noorden and stop doing ALL marketing and just do SEO. It will make me so happy. I will even pay for their SEO services with Jerryll. 

Jerryll is happy getting one lead per day on average and making less than $5k/deal just so that he can show that his cost/deal is so low. That’s small time thinking. 

I would much rather spend $5k/deal and make $20k and do multiple deals a month than $0/deal to do one deal if that per month and only make less than $5k.

Jerryll is pushing so hard to get people to sign up for his SEO services that it’s sad and comical at the same time. I have shows actual numbers which Jerryll hasn’t shown. 

@Cody L. I presented the data but the guy making the most noise has presented no data on his business.

@Ryan Dossey no point arguing with anyone where logic isn’t applicable. 

Do you need help counting?

Use your fingers mate if you need help

My average is between 20 and 30 leads a WEEK. 

FOR FREE!

As for my $5K/deal..

This is one of our closed deals last month for my REI business.

And if you must know.. with my SEO company try $90K in about 2 weeks

Anything else you want to add?

No?

Good!

Yes. Came from DMM.

 

 This is truly pathetic dude.

Look I didn't ask to see your paycheck.

The reason I showed mine is because you accused me of making 5K/deal. And not that it matters, but just for you to stop lying out of your bum, I proved you wrong.

Why YOU are displaying your paycheck around, I have no idea. But good for you. 

Now how about leave it alone now?

This is getting seriously childish..

Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full trust and full disclosure, how much do you charge for your SEO services for both packages? Your website doesn’t mention a price.

You have been working SO HARD to push people to do SEO so it’s only fair that people know much you charge.

Will you care to please answer this in the interest of full truth and full disclosure? People need to know that you have an agenda to push SEO services because you are a provider so share how much you charge for your services?

 

You guys should do one of those amateur promotional boxing fights, couple of marketers wailing on eachother would probably raise a fair bit of money for charity! Haha

Originally posted by @Sharad M. :
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Duy Nguyen:

Hello all,

What kind of marketing strategy are you guys doing nowadays? Does DM still work in today’s competitive market? I sent out 3.9K letter this past month (I am committed for a 6 months campaign). It has been about 4 days since my mail hit, I got about 16 calls, most of them goes: “ f off”, “ don’t send me anything”, “ my house is not for sale”. No actual lead yet.

What are your thoughts? I am wondering if DM still works. Thanks in advanced

Hi Duy, Direct Mail still works but it's a long term marketing strategy and specially in a competitive market like Houston, TX you have to very careful with your list. Don't mail to list like Absentee High Equity and expect to get a deal on 1st mailing. Try more niche lists like preforeclosure, tax delinquent, water shut off, code enforcement, etc.

And IF you are going to do DM long term, then commit to 4-6 mailings to the same list. The magic of Direct Mail comes handy over long term. We get calls from people that we had mailed several months ago but they hold on to the letter or postcard and call back when they are ready to sell their house.

I would have other marketing going on also but if you have to pick a marketing strategy, pick the one you can stick with THE longest because THE MOST important thing with marketing is consistency.

 Also sending mailings to the same list is also a myth. It is an illusion it doesn't work! I am telling you it is an illusion.

It takes a long piece of text to explain exactly why this doesn't work and why it is an illusion, but I will if I have to.

Just because Direct Mail didn't work you doesn't mean it doesn't or won't work for anyone else. Here's the actual data. We closed 41 deals from Direct Mail.

I am part of several high level real estate masterminds and majority of the very top investors use Direct Mail for consistent deals. Again just because you didn't do so well in Direct Mail doesn't mean it doesn't work.

Please don't misguiding people that sending to the same list is a myth. Your incorrect statements and lack of experience about Direct Mail can hurt a lot of people in lost time and money. You are a freaking expert in SEO but that is not THE ONLY lead gen. To be honest, if I could get more traffic from my SEO I would love that because the ROI will be through the roof with SEO but you are leaving so much money on the table by not doing other marketing. We buy A LOT of houses from older people and they are not tech savvy and not going to Google to look for a home buyer.

People are reaching out to them via Cold Calling and Direct Mail. 

I have tried MANY marketing channels so I am speaking from experience.

The numbers below don't include revenue from 14 deals we have in the pipeline that will be closing soon and majority of those came from Direct Mail as well.

 
@Sharad M.: Nice numbers. Amid the noise and bluster I couldn't find how many mailers you sent to get 1880 leads. Do you mind mentioning that? And did you send envelopes or postcards?  I recognize that the list and the territory play a major role, but I am curious.

The numbers are over 1.5 years and now we are sending about 25,000 mailers every 2 months so on average 12,500 mailers a month and we expect to get 2 deals from that so on average about 6,000 mailers/deal at cost of $2,500-$3,000/deal. The numbers I posted are from last 18 months or so but with better tracking our ROI is getting better.

We alternate between PC and letters. Our cost for postcards is 36 cents and letters is 48 cents for a blended average cost of 42 cents/mail piece.

 

Not to get all Greta Thunburg on you, but do you have any moral qualms with basically sending trash to people?  I get it that it's a numbers game and if you send 10,000, then 1,000 will open, 100 will call, of that 10 will take an offer and 1 will close.  That's a lot of waste man, no?

Originally posted by @Cody L. :
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Duy Nguyen:

Hello all,

What kind of marketing strategy are you guys doing nowadays? Does DM still work in today’s competitive market? I sent out 3.9K letter this past month (I am committed for a 6 months campaign). It has been about 4 days since my mail hit, I got about 16 calls, most of them goes: “ f off”, “ don’t send me anything”, “ my house is not for sale”. No actual lead yet.

What are your thoughts? I am wondering if DM still works. Thanks in advanced

Hi Duy, Direct Mail still works but it's a long term marketing strategy and specially in a competitive market like Houston, TX you have to very careful with your list. Don't mail to list like Absentee High Equity and expect to get a deal on 1st mailing. Try more niche lists like preforeclosure, tax delinquent, water shut off, code enforcement, etc.

And IF you are going to do DM long term, then commit to 4-6 mailings to the same list. The magic of Direct Mail comes handy over long term. We get calls from people that we had mailed several months ago but they hold on to the letter or postcard and call back when they are ready to sell their house.

I would have other marketing going on also but if you have to pick a marketing strategy, pick the one you can stick with THE longest because THE MOST important thing with marketing is consistency.

 Also sending mailings to the same list is also a myth. It is an illusion it doesn't work! I am telling you it is an illusion.

It takes a long piece of text to explain exactly why this doesn't work and why it is an illusion, but I will if I have to.

Just because Direct Mail didn't work you doesn't mean it doesn't or won't work for anyone else. Here's the actual data. We closed 41 deals from Direct Mail.

I am part of several high level real estate masterminds and majority of the very top investors use Direct Mail for consistent deals. Again just because you didn't do so well in Direct Mail doesn't mean it doesn't work.

Please don't misguiding people that sending to the same list is a myth. Your incorrect statements and lack of experience about Direct Mail can hurt a lot of people in lost time and money. You are a freaking expert in SEO but that is not THE ONLY lead gen. To be honest, if I could get more traffic from my SEO I would love that because the ROI will be through the roof with SEO but you are leaving so much money on the table by not doing other marketing. We buy A LOT of houses from older people and they are not tech savvy and not going to Google to look for a home buyer.

People are reaching out to them via Cold Calling and Direct Mail. 

I have tried MANY marketing channels so I am speaking from experience.

The numbers below don't include revenue from 14 deals we have in the pipeline that will be closing soon and majority of those came from Direct Mail as well.

 
@Sharad M.: Nice numbers. Amid the noise and bluster I couldn't find how many mailers you sent to get 1880 leads. Do you mind mentioning that? And did you send envelopes or postcards?  I recognize that the list and the territory play a major role, but I am curious.

The numbers are over 1.5 years and now we are sending about 25,000 mailers every 2 months so on average 12,500 mailers a month and we expect to get 2 deals from that so on average about 6,000 mailers/deal at cost of $2,500-$3,000/deal. The numbers I posted are from last 18 months or so but with better tracking our ROI is getting better.

We alternate between PC and letters. Our cost for postcards is 36 cents and letters is 48 cents for a blended average cost of 42 cents/mail piece.

 

Not to get all Greta Thunburg on you, but do you have any moral qualms with basically sending trash to people?  I get it that it's a numbers game and if you send 10,000, then 1,000 will open, 100 will call, of that 10 will take an offer and 1 will close.  That's a lot of waste man, no?

It’s a numbers game. Most people will be upset but there are people who you actually help. People who are going through some really rough times and you are sending all that mail or other marketing to reach the person who really needs your help in getting them out of a bad situation. 

The game with marketing is to keep getting better and better at it every time so next time instead of 10,000 you only have to send 7,000 to get same results and then with more data you get that number to 5,000. Hope that makes sense.  

Originally posted by @Cody L. :
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:
Originally posted by @Duy Nguyen:

Hello all,

What kind of marketing strategy are you guys doing nowadays? Does DM still work in today’s competitive market? I sent out 3.9K letter this past month (I am committed for a 6 months campaign). It has been about 4 days since my mail hit, I got about 16 calls, most of them goes: “ f off”, “ don’t send me anything”, “ my house is not for sale”. No actual lead yet.

What are your thoughts? I am wondering if DM still works. Thanks in advanced

Hi Duy, Direct Mail still works but it's a long term marketing strategy and specially in a competitive market like Houston, TX you have to very careful with your list. Don't mail to list like Absentee High Equity and expect to get a deal on 1st mailing. Try more niche lists like preforeclosure, tax delinquent, water shut off, code enforcement, etc.

And IF you are going to do DM long term, then commit to 4-6 mailings to the same list. The magic of Direct Mail comes handy over long term. We get calls from people that we had mailed several months ago but they hold on to the letter or postcard and call back when they are ready to sell their house.

I would have other marketing going on also but if you have to pick a marketing strategy, pick the one you can stick with THE longest because THE MOST important thing with marketing is consistency.

 Also sending mailings to the same list is also a myth. It is an illusion it doesn't work! I am telling you it is an illusion.

It takes a long piece of text to explain exactly why this doesn't work and why it is an illusion, but I will if I have to.

Just because Direct Mail didn't work you doesn't mean it doesn't or won't work for anyone else. Here's the actual data. We closed 41 deals from Direct Mail.

I am part of several high level real estate masterminds and majority of the very top investors use Direct Mail for consistent deals. Again just because you didn't do so well in Direct Mail doesn't mean it doesn't work.

Please don't misguiding people that sending to the same list is a myth. Your incorrect statements and lack of experience about Direct Mail can hurt a lot of people in lost time and money. You are a freaking expert in SEO but that is not THE ONLY lead gen. To be honest, if I could get more traffic from my SEO I would love that because the ROI will be through the roof with SEO but you are leaving so much money on the table by not doing other marketing. We buy A LOT of houses from older people and they are not tech savvy and not going to Google to look for a home buyer.

People are reaching out to them via Cold Calling and Direct Mail. 

I have tried MANY marketing channels so I am speaking from experience.

The numbers below don't include revenue from 14 deals we have in the pipeline that will be closing soon and majority of those came from Direct Mail as well.

 
@Sharad M.: Nice numbers. Amid the noise and bluster I couldn't find how many mailers you sent to get 1880 leads. Do you mind mentioning that? And did you send envelopes or postcards?  I recognize that the list and the territory play a major role, but I am curious.

The numbers are over 1.5 years and now we are sending about 25,000 mailers every 2 months so on average 12,500 mailers a month and we expect to get 2 deals from that so on average about 6,000 mailers/deal at cost of $2,500-$3,000/deal. The numbers I posted are from last 18 months or so but with better tracking our ROI is getting better.

We alternate between PC and letters. Our cost for postcards is 36 cents and letters is 48 cents for a blended average cost of 42 cents/mail piece.

 

Not to get all Greta Thunburg on you, but do you have any moral qualms with basically sending trash to people?  I get it that it's a numbers game and if you send 10,000, then 1,000 will open, 100 will call, of that 10 will take an offer and 1 will close.  That's a lot of waste man, no?

Dude, he is NEVER going to get it/admit it. He counts on newbies to believe "it's a numbers game".

I seriously gave up. It is utterly beyond me how any DMM'er can justify these methods/numbers.


Look. if you have a TON of money and you can send 30K mailers out a week, Yes of course you will make money (and spend a LOT of it to make it). Again because "its a numbers game".

But when we are talking about newbies, or regular people without having 10K to spend a week, DMM is just not working.

It is like saying I will do PPC with a 10 dollar/month budget.  You will NEVER get a deal.

Sigh....

I really don't think it is his fault. Some people simply can't think on their own. Not being offensive here. I deal with this all the time. Some people simply can not see whats beyond their grasp.

Again, DMM is absolutely useful in some scenarios. If you have a hand selected few houses you really want to approach personally, you can send a well crafted direct mailer/letter. But that is a different story.

Again, people now have the numbers. Anyone that thinks that $2K/deal is good.. you are missing out.

Want to know how much I pay per closed deal..

NOTHING!! (except website hosting.. if you want to get technical)

Originally posted by @Sharad M. :
Originally posted by @Cody L.:

The game with marketing is to keep getting better and better at it every time so next time instead of 10,000 you only have to send 7,000 to get same results and then with more data you get that number to 5,000. Hope that makes sense.  

 "ONLY" 7,000 mailers....

yah.. Okay

Originally posted by @Sharad M. :

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

Originally posted by @Aninze A. :

@Jerryll Noorden, Does Investor Carrot have to be the host of your site? I have Wix hosting mine...

 

The "politically correct" answer is "No". You do not HAVE to have an investor carrot website.

Now... imagine you are building a house and you need to haul material from home depot to your work site. And you have a lame donkey to carry all the 2x4's etc. 


And I have a GMC Model BAD-ASZ with a 2 JerryllPower engine (that equivalent to a 4000 horse power engine) with a 20 foot bed to carry any thing you possibly can imagine.

The Jerryll Truck will be easier faster, more realistic to get the job done.

See it that way.

I too started with wix... believe it or not.

And I too saw investor carrot websites.. and i too said "Ewww" no way.

But then I asked myself the question. Do I want a pretty site? Or do I want a money making site. I chose... BOTH ha haaa.. no no.. I rather make money so I dropped my stinking Wix site and I went for investor carrot..

See my fabulous new friend you... do a search for "We Buy Houses In [city] [state]" and I bet you a dead smurf that there will be investor carrot sites on top.

Their sites are fast, secure and have all the good stuff under the hood that Mother Google loves.

And I love Jake at investor carrot. He is like a gummy (hairy) teddy bear ALWAYS going out of his way to put up with my crazy shenanigans and goes beyond to always help me out with what it is...

Yeah ... do yourself a favor and pick carrot.

Besides.. if you are good.. you can make it pretty pretty too. (not that I care for pretty.. I care for credibility.

Seriously.. go for it!

Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden :
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

Originally posted by @Duy Nguyen :

Hello all,

What kind of marketing strategy are you guys doing nowadays? Does DM still work in today’s competitive market? I sent out 3.9K letter this past month (I am committed for a 6 months campaign). It has been about 4 days since my mail hit, I got about 16 calls, most of them goes: “ f off”, “ don’t send me anything”, “ my house is not for sale”. No actual lead yet.

What are your thoughts? I am wondering if DM still works. Thanks in advanced


I wouldn't do DM at this point. What works better is to learn internet marketing.

 

Originally posted by @Siobhan Kelly-Roberts :
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden :
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.

Originally posted by Account Closed in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.

 That's the same thing I've heard about PPC - that's why I haven't gone that route yet.

Originally posted by @Siobhan Kelly-Roberts :
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

 I do not spend a single dollar on my leads brother!

The point to SEO is that the leads are of highest quality, and they are free!

Originally posted by Account Closed in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.


If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1. 

If it was "no big deal", everyone would be getting 30 leads/week for free.

Obviously... that is not the case right?

Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden :
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Siobhan Kelly-Roberts:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.

If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1. 

If it was "no big deal", everyone would be getting 30 leads/week for free.

Obviously... that is not the case right?

 Okay, now you've officially confused me.

In the post right above you say

Quote: "I do not spend a single dollar on my leads brother!

The point to SEO is that the leads are of highest quality, and they are free!"

Then you say Quote: "If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1.

Originally posted by Account Closed in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.

If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1. 

If it was "no big deal", everyone would be getting 30 leads/week for free.

Obviously... that is not the case right?

 Okay, now you've officially confused me.

In the post right above you say

Quote: "I do not spend a single dollar on my leads brother!

The point to SEO is that the leads are of highest quality, and they are free!"

Then you say Quote: "If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1.

 Understandable.

OK forget everything you know for 1 second.

Ranking #1 on google is SUCH a big deal people are willing to spend thousands and thousands of dollars to make it happen (i.e. hiring experts to get it done for them).

The REASON they find it a worthy investment is because once you rank #1, ALL your (ORGANIC) traffic is free.

Super motivated ready to sell yesterday, traffic.

#1 on Google is where everyone wants to be, and that is exactly WHY it is so hard ... think about it.

There can only be ONE #1 ranking website for a specific keyword. So The #1 ranking position, to get there, is VERY VERY competitive.

So by definition it can not be  "no big deal" to rank #1, when only 1 person can rank #1 whole every single person on internet is trying very hard to be #1.

So again, getting there is expensive if you hire people to help you.

Once there, all leads are free, and they are the best leads, EVER.

So now, take my case.

I didn't hire anyone to be #1, so all MY leads are 100% free (other than hosting my website of course).

Makes sense?

Try this.

Buying a Ferrari is expensive.  So I build my own, for free. So now, yes sure Ferraris are expensive buy I didn't pay anything for mine. Mine was free because I made it myself.

Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden :
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Mike M.:
Originally posted by @Siobhan Kelly-Roberts:
Originally posted by @Jerryll Noorden:
Originally posted by @Sharad M.:

@Jerryll Noorden in the interest of full truth and full disclosure, this is from your website so people understand why you are pushing SEO so hard because you charge thousands of dollars to other investors for your SEO services.

https://www.themightyinvestor.com/how-it-works-backup/

You just gave me 22 new clients.

Thank you!

BTW.. I get clients on Facebook through marketing.

On Biggerpockets I provide value and teach others how to do SEO for free. I am a huge proponent of not needing to pay anyone for SEO (INCLUDING ME).

Sure you can do what you want, but I empower everyone to do it themselves.

I do it myself, and if I can do it, so can you!

I'm very interested in how much you spend to get leads from SEO. It's a business model I haven't tested yet.

SEO pretty much means you set up your website to be easily found when people search. That from what I've heard isn't any big deal.

I was also recently told that you have to spend thousands a month if you want to see decent results using PPC.

If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1. 

If it was "no big deal", everyone would be getting 30 leads/week for free.

Obviously... that is not the case right?

 Okay, now you've officially confused me.

In the post right above you say

Quote: "I do not spend a single dollar on my leads brother!

The point to SEO is that the leads are of highest quality, and they are free!"

Then you say Quote: "If ranking #1 was no big deal, people wouldn't pay thousands of dollars to rank #1.

 Understandable.

OK forget everything you know for 1 second.

Ranking #1 on google is SUCH a big deal people are willing to spend thousands and thousands of dollars to make it happen (i.e. hiring experts to get it done for them).

The REASON they find it a worthy investment is because once you rank #1, ALL your (ORGANIC) traffic is free.

Super motivated ready to sell yesterday, traffic.

#1 on Google is where everyone wants to be, and that is exactly WHY it is so hard ... think about it.

There can only be ONE #1 ranking website for a specific keyword. So The #1 ranking position, to get there, is VERY VERY competitive.

So by definition it can not be  "no big deal" to rank #1, when only 1 person can rank #1 whole every single person on internet is trying very hard to be #1.

So again, getting there is expensive if you hire people to help you.

Once there, all leads are free, and they are the best leads, EVER.

So now, take my case.

I didn't hire anyone to be #1, so all MY leads are 100% free (other than hosting my website of course).

Makes sense?

Try this.

Buying a Ferrari is expensive.  So I build my own, for free. So now, yes sure Ferraris are expensive buy I didn't pay anything for mine. Mine was free because I made it myself.

I think I get what you are driving at. Pun intended. 

However, Time is Money and Money is Time. There is opportunity cost. The amount of time it takes someone to learn how to properly do SEO on their own, therefore "no cost", and then to actually do the SEO and then continue to monitor and improve SEO doesn't seem to return enough added value to overcome just paying someone to do that for them. I came from high tech and I am not afraid of using technology where it makes sense. But, my time is too valuable to do SEO on my time. Id' hire it out IMHO.

Seems to me someone should either be a property investor or should take up internet advertising.

Maybe what I am missing is that some people don't have enough leads coming in to keep themselves busy and SEO is a way for them to distract themselves while they are waiting for the phone to ring. They should try DM to get things started quickly.
 

I hear that all the time. My answer always has been...

1) do you not have time to make money? SEO = making money

2) as investors we are marketers. If there is one thing you need to make time for, it's marketing.