All Forum Posts by: David C.

at least that's not as bad as the Yelp! extortion, they call after you have a bad review and offer to make it go away for a fee. At least they were supposedly doing that.

I think Sandy's idea has merit, if they built something similar on BP, you'd know the contractors were 'flip friendly' or 'landlord friendly' - if your fellow landlords/flippers recommended them.

I might have a great guy who works slow and I use around my own house, but if you are flipping, time matters a lot more.

For a landlord, a contractor who suggests more durable finishes, or shortcuts that can save cost and time, but don't cheapen the result too much could be very valuable, right?

So someone with a great angie's list reputation might not be the best person for a landlord, right?

I'm looking at a condo that's a quasi-condo-tel - there's an optional front-desk-management program, to be in it, you must live up to the hotel finishes, but as a condo owner, you may opt out, and live in your condo, or use whatever management company you want to manage it.

On a cash-flow basis, its a loser, its far from the 2% rule, but because its in a vacation area, the occupancy is low in off-season, so you can have off-season use of your condo without really giving up any revenue. You can do 'in-season use' during the week, and not give up much income either, as weekends are always more popular anyway, you pick which days your unit is 'off the market' and they just make your unit 'booked' in their hotel system those days.

2% rule is so far away I'm ashamed to ask about it.

Cost: 195,000

Annual Costs:
Taxes 1633
Gross Rents 2012: 24,300
Annual Condo Fee: 6000
Pay 22% to the front desk: 5400
Pay maid fee for booked nights: 2000
Pay parking fee for booked nights: 1050
Electric: 1200
Netting: ~7200/year or $600/month for P+I

so... to get to cashflow neutral ASSUMING NO ADDITIONAL REPAIRS(which is quite a bad assumption). You need to put down 25% and get a mortgage under 3%.

So... if you don't count your 'use' as a significant 'return' - this is a total loser, right? Even if you do, this is a loser from a financial perspective. The only way it works is as 'speculation' which just means 'it doesn't work but you are hoping for magic' - right? It does give you a 'no-work' exposure to real-estate by using their front desk program. But if 'no-work' goes along with 'negative return' - its not attractive.

Supposedly these have been selling for over 200,000 lately and this is a 'motivated seller' situation.

At what price do these numbers 'make sense'? 160k? 100k?

In a vacation resort area, do the values ever make sense?

I know its meaningless, but these originally sold back in the condo heyday around 270,000. Which I'm sure never made any sense.

Any thoughts on this?

Wow Monique, that really sounds like someone threatened to sue you. I would not touch FB with a 10 foot pole. I have only read bad stories of all of these gurus. I'll admit no direct knowledge, so I guess this can't be slander but maybe they will call me to threaten me as well?

Stephen Dillard I apologize if you felt I was calling you out personally. I used your site as an example because I had just seen a posting by you and looked at your site. I tried to ask generically about the purpose of such pages and their success or failure.

Best of luck wholesaling, I hope you continue to make happy sellers and happy buyers.

I think it was a good move to respond.

Stephen Dillard as the OP I just want to say I was not really trying to single you out. I tried to phrase the question such that your page was an 'example' - many posters mentioned there were many pages like yours - so please don't take my question personally.

I'm insulted by your page - so what? Has it been effective? I'm not your target market. Are you getting solid buyers from that page? What kind of people are they? How else do you get your buyers?

I suppose in my 'real life' I could make a page that said 'all your programmers are stupid and build horrible systems for you!' and 'I have a secret way to get you the best programming for the best prices - but you must ACT NOW. This is an opportunity for VIP CIO's and IT Directors ONLY!' I'd be selling the same service I sell now which is sold almost completely through referrals - but maybe I'd get additional customers?

I think an important thing to keep in mind with yellow letters vs. white letters, hand-written vs. bulk printed, etc... is that Michael has done a least a few of these many times in large numbers, and he probably has data to back it up. That kind of data is more important that the impressions a few of us have.

I hate the insulting splash pages - but they work on a certain audience.

Some of us toss fake-urgents, but another audience opens them.

Some of us view handwritten as unprofessional, others view them as 'someone took the time to address me personally' - who cares - given some large numbers - do they work?

I find myself opening yellow letters and ever since I got on here, I find it a bit funny - but I do still get a slight interest peak when I see a yellow letter in the mail. The Big Envelope, I open every time. The only thing I've gotten harshly cold to is the car warranty things with the tear-off edges.

Until I saw this in my extended family, I similarly felt like the original sellers in any 'wholesale' deal were really getting shafted. Selling so low that a wholesaler could mark up a few grand and a bottom-fishing investor could still get a cash-flowing property. All the 'room' in these deals come from the sellers - but now I see one, and I understand.

Sure, they could keep it over the winter, heat it, fix the floors, get it inspected and re-do wiring and plumbing as needed, dredge the pond, knock the down the animal infested outbuildings, mow all fall and part of spring, check for snow dams and water damage all winter. Then maybe sell it for $50k more? or $80k more? after spending 20k or 30k? or maybe not? they are not experts in the property values, or experts in RE rehab - so they could do all of that, spend $30k and a lot of effort and get 10k more than the auction price.

Economically, it makes sense to sell properties that are in need of rehab, to rehab experts. They will manage the project better, they will make improvements that have pay-back, they have a set of trustworthy contractors, etc... So a rehab that costs a first timer or 'one-timer' $50k will likely: run longer, not be done as well, will have some 'wrong things done'.

They are not even willing to call a wholesaler to get an offer, but its family, so you offer suggestions and that's all you can do :)

They believe an auction will get them the 'auction price' which may or may not be higher than a wholesale price, but they do not expect 'market' - nobody goes to an auction looking to pay market, right?

They had a recent good experience with an auction, getting 85k for a house they think was worth around 115k? That home was in much better condition, but had much less land.

The land this time is in 'shale country' and they did get an offer for a drilling lease which they turned down - so that may add some value, but not much, gas prices have plummeted since and I think the gas companies are not running around leasing every inch of land anymore.

They plan to upgrade the homeowners to 'vacant homeowners' in case the pipes and wiring are stolen - but it would still be a huge hassle.

I know for sure they have no problem that a purchaser might be getting 'a deal'. If the next person makes some money, good for them, they will have earned it! They are a bit afraid that it goes for $10k because there are better auctions that day, or bad weather, or some other auction specific issue. I think they should get a wholesale offer and set an auction reserve a few thousand under that, in case its a rare late october sleet storm or noreaster or some other calamity.

My in-laws: their parents in their 90's are moving to assisted living. The property is 5 acres and 50 years old and a 30 minute drive from their home. They want out of the house quick. If they try to list it, it will need to pass inspection, deal with negotations, etc... Who knows what crazy plumbing and wiring grandpa has done. They want OUT of the property. But I could not talk them into finding a wholesaler - they don't even want to agree to a price! They insist on an auction so its out of their hands and left to fate. One benefit they are losing out on: if they were to wholesale it, they would never have to advertise the situation. With an auction it will be advertised(pretty much) that its vacant and the copper pipes are free for the taking.
They don't want to heat it for the winter, prepare it for sale, deal with inspection. Those are all value-add's delivered by a wholesale buyer.

Do homes with 'Absolute Auctions' ever really end up selling at crazy low prices?

How much risk is there in having this type of auction to dispose of unwanted property?

How much opportunity is there to buy at these? Are there so many investors these days that nothing 'goes super cheap'?

context: My in-laws are motivated sellers, the auctioneer says this is all they are doing in their area outside Akron, OH, no reserve auctions. How afraid should they be of getting a low turnout and only getting 10% of the value?