Still blows me away that people still pay for this stuff. I see it all the time advertised everywhere. Come to the free workshop blah, blah, blah then they ramp up the fees.
Saw one the other day. Literally thousands of these shops going around. Easier to take 4k to 40k off of someone and talk about great deals of yesterday then find deals today to buy.
I honestly do not know how some of these outfits sleep at night. Talking in generalities not this specific company or situation.
The flip side is that multi-millionaires that have made it do not have time to answer countless questions from people just wanting educating for free. They are busy running businesses and doing deals. So they have to choose wisely who they help and how much.
Why not learn from the successful friend with a portfolio worth millions? They seem to care about your best interests. Taking them to a nice dinner or lunch or maybe partnering on a deal might have been a better use of some or all of that 4,000.
the only seminar i'd go to is @Jim K. McRib International Seminar!
@Jeremiah Akindele Whether or not it's worth it depends on whether or not you take action on the information you got. Whether or not you could have gotten the same information for cheaper on Bigger Pockets is irrelevant since you already spent the money. Don't beat yourself up over it, use it as a learning experience (which it seems like you're doing already!) and just keep truckin!
Hey @Jeremiah Akindele I see you have already received tons of responses and maybe somebody mentioned this already, but actually @Brandon Turner has discussed about this very issue on the BP YouTube channel. You can watch it on YouTube by searching forThe #1 Real Estate Investing SCAM That You Can Avoid!
I don't see anything wrong with it as long as you feel that this is the kick in the *** you need to get going in the direction you want.
I've always been a trial-error kind of guy, and some want the expertise going in. At the end of the day, that payment isn't going to make anyone else do investing for you. It all comes down to you big guy.
However you decide to travel through REI, I wish you Good luck!
I agree with the others that you will need to read every book you can find on investing and talk to people who have actually done it, not those who have done 5 deals and are now a self proclaimed expert. I started in 2000 and there was no Bigger Pockets. I attended several of the free 'come on' one day seminars, then read lots of books, then went out and started looking at houses. I looked at about 80 in the same neighborhood, all 3/2 about 1200 ft and all selling for 80,000 to 90,000. When I found one that I could buy for under 70,000 I knew it was a good deal because it only needed paint and carpet. Then I talked to people until I found someone who had money and showed them the deal. They put up the money and I did the management. We both did well.
Fast forward 20 years and I have now done 95 SFR properties, sold some for cap gains and still have 60 on lease purchase agreements that average about $275/month positive cash flow.
I still have not attended any of the 3 day/mentoring $20,000 plus training programs. Most likely you can learn what they teach on the BP podcasts. I would recommend reading, watching, networking and doing at least 5 deals and make some money. Then if you still feel the need to attend, go ahead. I doubt that you will need to.
Just study until you know a good deal when you see one. Math will overcome the fear.
@Jeremiah Akindele I agree with everyone's general sentiment on how you shouldn't pay the 40k. But I also want to congratulate you on taking the first small piece of action by attending the seminar in the first place. Many people sit on the sidelines and don't do anything and then they let time fly by.
My thoughts on the 40K is that you should spend it on a mentorship program...but later in the future when you've had relative success. I think spending the money to take your biz to the next level can be worth it, but not now as a beginner when money is tight (I mean that generally, not making any projections to your specific financial situation). There are some great mentorship and mastermind clubs for relatively successful investors that could be beneficial down the line.
@Jeremiah Akindele I'm all for paying to increase your education but need to make sure you will see the ROI. For $40,000 I better see some significant returns! There likely are better ways to use that 40k but if you know others who have been through the program and are succeeding then maybe it's worth it. The more expensive the more research I would be doing and the more referrals I would speak to.
Originally posted by @Victor S. :
the only seminar i'd go to is @Jim K. McRib International Seminar!
That's great, Victor, because for you, we can do a once-in-a-lifetime special, two $2000 seminars for only $3,999! We've taken to calling this special "The McGangbang" here at headquarters. This opportunity won't last long, seats are filling up fast, hurry up and register today!
@Jeremiah Akindele Go on the meetup website, find some investor meetings near you and go to those. There will be realtors there that are also investors! There will be seasoned investors there. They LOOOOVE to talk about real estate. They have access to off market deals, they know the best banks to work with, things to look for, ect.
@Jeremiah Akindele It's a great question you raised, and clearly a lot of strong opinions and feelings on the matter, although I don't see any replies giving what i would consider the one and only point that matters which is what is the R.O.I.?
I read so many people saying don't "waste" 40K, which I would say don't "waste" any $, ever, not $1.00. But if something has a good ROI shouldn't the focus be to maximize that? Wouldn't that be placing as many 0's before the decimal as possible?
For me, be it $400, $4,000 or $4,000,000 it is all just pretty numbers on paper and zeros, all that matters is ROI. If there is good ROI I want to make it the biggest #'s I can, because I earn on %.
I will temper the thoughts with this; who can't figure out how to slice a piece of bread and to place lunch meat and vegetables on it? It's not rocket science, it's a sandwich. Yet countless people spend tens and hundreds of thousands every week to "buy" a Subway franchise. Yes, there is some brand value but 90% of what a franchisee is getting is, at it's core, mentorship. Mentorship is supposed to be exactly that, focused, experienced advice and step-by-step path to assured success. So, with that in mind let me ask, is $40,000 "too much" $ to pay to get assured success in becoming a profitable real estate investor? (anyone saying yes here needs to strongly re-evaluate their knowledge base in being a business owner more or less REI).
Look, I will be the first to say there is an epidemic of bad "gurus" and scams for mentorship programs, they abound. But that speaks only of the operators and not the premise. Are subway sandwiches bad because Jerrod is? The judge the premise and fundamentals by some of the operators is to label cars and trucks murder machines because persons have done so in them via dwi and accidents and so on. We all understand it's just a vehicle and the operator is who is at fault.
Playing devil's advocate, say a person will always be able to figure everything out on their own, always, every time (if true why do colleges, trade schools and universities exist?), again, playing devil's advocate, say all will always succeed. In how much time will it take a person to compile all that knowledge and experience? A week? A month? Four years? What is the value of time? How many years could that $40k education eliminate? 1 year, is that worth $40K? 2 years, 5? Time is a very valuable resource, very.
Now compound the value of time by the value of mistakes and accidents, and the expenses of those, NOT made due to having gained knowledge from others? I can tell you 1 bad flip can easily eat $20k and a whole lot more, a TON more.
To blindly say something is of value or not of value simply off it's expense is NOT an investor mindset whatsoever. What would Kiosaki say? Heck, what does he say on this?
Nothing is the value of its price, it is the value of what is being conveyed for the price, and if that is a good ROI. That is why franchise exists, they give time and eliminate a considerable portion of failure risk, that has a sizable value. No difference with a qualified REI program, if it will give me time, years, save from loss's, mitigate failure risk, assure success, hell $40k starts looking like a paultry amount for something that will make factors annually thereof.
R.O.I. rules all.
I think it depends on what knowledge you are looking for and what knowledge they are providing. If just general training, there are so many free resources in BP and i will think it is a waste. But if it is a specific knowledge that not too many people know, then yes.
Get out of their club ASAP while you still have money, these are professional sales artists, not real estate experts. Many of them have never done a real estate transaction. The only transactions they are interested in doing is the sound of Ching Ching on your wallet. Besides, for $20 you can buy a book that the author and editors poured their heart and soul into, usually for longer than a year. That’s $20 well spent!!
Investing money into mentor ship is never a bad thing, there’s good and bad to everything , when you’re lying 20,000 or more you’d want to have some good one on one time and advanced training and already have your business kinda started a bit and taking off I believe.
I’m in BC Canada where there isn’t a lot of wholesalers at all I’m almost one of the only in my area of 4 cities so I have to developer a good marketing campaign and network- the cash I used for meteor ship would have helped that take off a bit more so Hind-sight I would have invested closer to 20,000 for a smaller mentor ship program first then worked my way up to the more advanced ones etc.
The ROI for a good coach is infinite and when compared to what it takes to go to school for something like a doctor etc and the amount of time you go without making income anything under 100,000 dollars makes sense especially if your dedicated and disciplined, the time you'll save alone from have a coach to correct your path is worth it for sure
Definitely make sure it’s a quality program though, there’s good and bad in anything, there’s another route too just apprentice in a sense under someone you know already in the business and just bring them a deal to work on with you so they can profit off it and you can watch and learn as the deals goes through
A year ago I clicked a link to Bigger Pockets from an article I was reading. We were just doing high end renovations for other clients but besides one rental home we rehabbed years ago and rented then sold we never flipped homes or did anything income wise in the real estate sector. I started studying, reading articles, going to REI meetings, etc. Cost to do all of that obviously pretty minimal. To make it short, a year later, my husband and I dove in and started flipping houses...finishing up with one last client and doing this full time....and loving it. You can use that money for one or two properties and you are off to the races! Go to the REI meetings locally....so many great people willing to share advice!
You can definitely try to get a refund for that.
You can claim that all the info they gave you is free on YouTube and on bigger pockets, therefore it's a pure scam to charge $4000.
You can use that money for a down payment to get a house here in HOUSTON.
@Jeremiah Akindele Inest in Bigger Pockets my cousin advise me and he is successful real estate investor!
Thumbs way down...
@James Farrel thanks for the response James. I am sure glad I found biggerpockets before spending anymore money lol
@Jeremiah Akindele I know you have had a ton of replies, but I wanted to chime in and provide another point of view. We too attended the free workshop, paid a couple K for the 3-day workshop and then were up sold to the membership.
For us this investment has changed our lives. In the two years since investing 25k+ we have purchased almost 2 million in Real Estate both personally and Joint Ventures (Canada market), both my wife and I have left our previous careers to make real estate our full time career and we are on track to build, sell/hold another 2.4 million this year.
Did the REI guru do this for us no, could we have done it on our own, maybe... did I use the free resources at BP as another resource to make all this happen. Yes!!!
What I’m saying is everyone is different. For us the 25k investment gave us the motivation to take action. But I know many others who spent the money, did nothing and called the guru a scam. In the end it’s up to you and how you use the tools you are given.
@Jerry Duncan hey Jerry. I would be lying if I said I regret the workshop.
Pros: learned a great deal.
Networked with great people.
Did a walk around of 3 properties in my local area.
Got some free books and a manual to practice underwriting.
Got a bunch of videos to watch
Cons: sell sell sell
Buy advanced training.
They sounded like sales people after the first day.
I heard some of these gurus place people on their staff in the workshop to also generate interest.
@Jermell Shavers hey Jermell. Thanks a bunch for the info. Trust me I know better now and wish I could let more people know to avoid those hotel conferences and join bigger pockets Instead. Lol