Tenant said he'd be naked when I'm doing tours for new tenants

92 Replies

Originally posted by @Jack B. :

They gave notice of move out end of March. I've had two showings in about 1.5 weeks. Usually I do an open house in summers but it's slim pickings and waiting for enough people to justify an open house is not feasible, it would take a month and they would find another place by then.

The one room mate asked about an open house and I explained this to him.

Now the other room mate (there are four of them) called me after I gave notice that there would be a tour tonight at 6 PM (2 days in advance) that he doesn't want me there, it's valentines day, etc.

I explained to him I don't need his permission to enter the house, their lease and the law requires them to allow me to show the house. Interfering with that will result in a 10 day notice to comply or vacate....

He said he couldn't guarantee that he wouldn't be naked in the house...

What to do? Serve him 10 day notice to comply?

 Having managed 1,000's of tenant the best advice I can give you is to just wait till March to do showings. We only advertise and show properties to perspective tenants after the previous tenant has moved out and the property has been through our rent ready renovation and safety check. The reasons for this are simple. Attempting to advertise and show occupied rental properties creates many more problems than solutions.  We run into scheduling issues with the outgoing tenants and the property is not always presented to the perspective tenants in the best condition which causes perspective tenants who would have otherwise wanted the property to look elsewhere. 

On top of this outgoing tenants do not always move out on the exact date they are supposed to. If an outgoing tenant releases possession of the property to you late you'll be unable to give the incoming tenants possession of the property on time. This poses a serious problem as the incoming tenants have typically given a 30-60 day notice to their previous landlord so they are almost always under a time crunch and may have already made arrangements with moving companies and utility companies.

@Jack B.

How? He didn’t lock the door. He is in the home his lease gives him the legal right to occupy. Being naked in your home isn’t illegal.

You would have a REAL hard time making a case with that.

Pun intended?

Originally posted by @James Wise :

 Having managed 1,000's of tenant the best advice I can give you is to just wait till March to do showings. We only advertise and show properties to perspective tenants after the previous tenant has moved out and the property has been through our rent ready renovation and safety check. The reasons for this are simple. Attempting to advertise and show occupied rental properties creates many more problems than solutions.  We run into scheduling issues with the outgoing tenants and the property is not always presented to the perspective tenants in the best condition which causes perspective tenants who would have otherwise wanted the property to look elsewhere. 

On top of this outgoing tenants do not always move out on the exact date they are supposed to. If an outgoing tenant releases possession of the property to you late you'll be unable to give the incoming tenants possession of the property on time. This poses a serious problem as the incoming tenants have typically given a 30-60 day notice to their previous landlord so they are almost always under a time crunch and may have already made arrangements with moving companies and utility companies.


 With all due respect, as a PM that one month plus of lost revenue is not a loss you have to absorb - it's the owner's.  And I understand as a PM you would find it more labor intensive to show an occupied unit, but that is what the lease up and turn fees are for, I thought.  For the self-managing OP, I think it makes perfect sense to show the unit while occupied.

Originally posted by @Jason Munger :

@Jack B.

How? He didn’t lock the door. He is in the home his lease gives him the legal right to occupy. Being naked in your home isn’t illegal.

You would have a REAL hard time making a case with that.

Pun intended?

Interesting legal question.  I think you still can be charged with indecent exposure in your own home.  What if I paraded across my living room with the blinds open and neighborhood children can see.  I never spent a day in law school, but I'll bet that's violating something.   @Greg M. mentioned something to that affect earlier in the thread.

@Jack B. Maybe you've overreacted because you're sensitive to the term "power trip." Your attacks on me were our over the top and out of line. Anybody that reads my posts will understand that you're way off base. I am certainly not a troll....

I don't know the laws regarding renters in your area. From my experience dealing with renters and occupants here in CA and in other states across the country, my understanding is that you still need the cooperation of the tenants regardless of whatever notice you've given them. The 24 or 48 hour notice is necessary but doesn't give you the absolute right to barge into someone else's leasehold without their permission. They've paid rent, they're entitled to the use of that space for the duration of the lease. 

I think the guy's comment about being naked was a way of saying "no," that he really didn't want you to come at that time. Maybe he was intentionally being rude to you, I don't know. Either way, we clearly have differences of opinion. I'm sorry that "power trip" offended you. To my reading of it, your approach seemed aggressive and that was why I commented as I did.

@Henry Lazerow @James Wise Our approach to rentals and occupants is more in line with yours....

Originally posted by @Wesley W. :
Originally posted by @James Wise:

 Having managed 1,000's of tenant the best advice I can give you is to just wait till March to do showings. We only advertise and show properties to perspective tenants after the previous tenant has moved out and the property has been through our rent ready renovation and safety check. The reasons for this are simple. Attempting to advertise and show occupied rental properties creates many more problems than solutions.  We run into scheduling issues with the outgoing tenants and the property is not always presented to the perspective tenants in the best condition which causes perspective tenants who would have otherwise wanted the property to look elsewhere. 

On top of this outgoing tenants do not always move out on the exact date they are supposed to. If an outgoing tenant releases possession of the property to you late you'll be unable to give the incoming tenants possession of the property on time. This poses a serious problem as the incoming tenants have typically given a 30-60 day notice to their previous landlord so they are almost always under a time crunch and may have already made arrangements with moving companies and utility companies.

 With all due respect, as a PM that one month plus of lost revenue is not a loss you have to absorb - it's the owner's.  And I understand as a PM you would find it more labor intensive to show an occupied unit, but that is what the lease up and turn fees are for, I thought.  For the self-managing OP, I think it makes perfect sense to show the unit while occupied.

 The phrase "the cost of doing business" comes to mind here. Welcome to the party Wesley.

Originally posted by @Andy Mirza :

@Jack B. Maybe you've overreacted because you're sensitive to the term "power trip." Your attacks on me were our over the top and out of line. Anybody that reads my posts will understand that you're way off base. I am certainly not a troll....

I don't know the laws regarding renters in your area. From my experience dealing with renters and occupants here in CA and in other states across the country, my understanding is that you still need the cooperation of the tenants regardless of whatever notice you've given them. The 24 or 48 hour notice is necessary but doesn't give you the absolute right to barge into someone else's leasehold without their permission. They've paid rent, they're entitled to the use of that space for the duration of the lease. 

I think the guy's comment about being naked was a way of saying "no," that he really didn't want you to come at that time. Maybe he was intentionally being rude to you, I don't know. Either way, we clearly have differences of opinion. I'm sorry that "power trip" offended you. To my reading of it, your approach seemed aggressive and that was why I commented as I did.

@Henry Lazerow @James Wise Our approach to rentals and occupants is more in line with yours....

Andy agree you were just sayin what you would do.. Not sure why Jack then went on a tirade.  from my perspective V day is an important date night for many.. and well I think one wants to be careful also that the tenant does not get super peeved and create a lot of damage on the way out.. Tenants can be vindictive buggers.. And to me I would think it would have been just as easy to schedule a Sat. showing for this new perspective tenant and keep everyone calm and not get into a war of words with your tenants.. 

 

Originally posted by @Jason Munger :

@Jack B.

How? He didn’t lock the door. He is in the home his lease gives him the legal right to occupy. Being naked in your home isn’t illegal.

You would have a REAL hard time making a case with that.

Pun intended?

You're wrong, as another poster stated, you can be arrested for indecent exposure in your own home. You have ZERO clue what you are talking about. Google it. You can't invite a repair person into your home then wait for them naked. Even a 5 year old would understand that...Same thing here. I have a right to show the property. The law AND the lease state that they must allow me and cooperate in doing so. Him telling me he doesn't want me to come down then telling me he will be naked at 6 PM on Friday night after I tell him it's not his choice is a deliberate attempt to deny me access and indecently expose himself to me AND my prospective customers....

RCW 9A.88.010

Indecent exposure.

(1) A person is guilty of indecent exposure if he or she intentionally makes any open and obscene exposure of his or her person or the person of another knowing that such conduct is likely to cause reasonable affront or alarm. The act of breastfeeding or expressing breast milk is not indecent exposure.(2)(a) Except as provided in (b) and (c) of this subsection, indecent exposure is a misdemeanor.(b) Indecent exposure is a gross misdemeanor on the first offense if the person exposes himself or herself to a person under the age of fourteen years.(c) Indecent exposure is a class C felony if the person has previously been convicted under this section or of a sex offense as defined in RCW 9.94A.030.



http://www.nbcnews.com/id/34483145/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/man-convicted-in-home-indecent-exposure/#.XkglDDJKipo

There are tons of legal articles and news articles on this around the country. You CAN be arrested for this and so can he, considering he knows I'm coming and communicates intent to be naked. You don't have to be a lawyer to understand something this basic. 

Originally posted by @Wesley W. :
Originally posted by @Jason Munger:

@Jack B.

How? He didn’t lock the door. He is in the home his lease gives him the legal right to occupy. Being naked in your home isn’t illegal.

You would have a REAL hard time making a case with that.

Pun intended?

Interesting legal question.  I think you still can be charged with indecent exposure in your own home.  What if I paraded across my living room with the blinds open and neighborhood children can see.  I never spent a day in law school, but I'll bet that's violating something.   @Greg M. mentioned something to that affect earlier in the thread.

Yes, you can. I googled it, and the state law. Tons of news articles, legal articles and the state statute citing this tenant doing something like this is illegal. I can't invite a repair person into my house and then be waiting for them naked and say it's my house. Jay and Andy, I wish I could block your ignorant posts...