All Forum Posts by: Jerryll Noorden

Quote from @Roy Green:

Hi Jerryll - I'm new on the forum and have read a lot of your posts on wholesaling. Thanks for the helpful information.

I plan on putting up a website to generate leads like you're suggesting. I know that it takes time to rank highly on Google. So what is the best approach to generating leads until the website gets ranked? I was thinking of running Google PPC for however long it takes to rank.

Is there a better option?

No there is no better option. You are thinking about it correctly.
Of course, all strategies you choose has advantages and disadvantages, including SEO.

If a strategy existed without any disadvantages no one would do anything else.

The key is to analytically weigh in the disadvantages, feasibility, probability and risk when determining what to do. (I am a scientist and engineer, can you tell?)

In the diagram below I have outlined the advantages and disadvantages of both inbound and outbound lead generation strategies.


Take a look at this diagram:

When you look at it carefully, does something jump out of this?
Yeah right?

When you apply both you will get all the advantages, and none of the  disadvantages (kind of).

Looking at this diagram, it is clear, that the wisest thing to do is to do both.
Why?
Because you are an investor. Your job is to spend a dollar and make 10 dollars from spending that one dollar.

It is irrelevant how much money you spend, as long as you make far more in return right?

I am not just talking out of my butt here. This is real stuff. I do it, my students do it.

I am not showing you this pic to sell you something. I am showing you this because every smelly guru will sell you on their opinion but no one shows concrete evidence of what they are regurgitating actually reliably works.

He has a simple website and applied everything I teach right here in the free forums of BP and there you go:

https://www.christianbuyshousesingeorgia.com/

This is his website BTW.

Now, Listen carefully. I wouldn't do PPC however, I would do Facebook ads.

The Facebook ads structure is far better designed to generate motivated sellers than PPC ever can. This is not the same as me saying that PPC  will always give lesser results. I am simply saying that the STRUCTURE of Facebook ads is far better in line with generating motivated seller leads than PPC is.

If you want to know more about any of this,  just reach out. I have a ton of videos where I teach people for free... or just ask here in this thread and I will continue to provide my knowledge to anyone willing to listen (and use their brains).

Just curious how it is going. Are you making any progress?

You are not looking for properties. You are looking for motivated sellers.

Finding distressed properties doesn't mean the owners are willing to sell at a discount. It doesn't even mean they are willing to sell PERIOD!

This is one of the biggest mistakes investors nationwide make. They devise all sorts of systems or software like "propstream" and they sell you on the idea that it "works based on data".

Tell me this.

How come you still need to send 3000 - 5000 mailers calls or texts to the "motivated seller leads" probstream is giving you to get ONE louse deal?

It is an illusion, You are all being brainwashed. Analysis, thinking, and analytics go out of the window.

People hear: "propstream uses data to [fill in the blank]".. and you are all SOLD!

But how many of you even dare ask WHAT data? How is it accumulated, and how is it used to achieve the WHAT goal exactly? Because, if the goal is to find motivated sellers, no amount data can find them!

Honestly. How many of you asked this question?

Not many. because if you DID ask these questions you would realize that motivation is not a logical thing. It is an emotional thing. You can't data-analyze who or who isn't motivated.

If you think that you get a higher chance of finding motivation targeting people in some sort of distress, then again, answer me this

Why does it take you 3000-5000 mailers calls or texts to RANDOM people to get 1 deal and it takes the exact same numbers to people on some targeted list or people propstream gets you to get a deal?

The answer is that this number 3000 - 5000 Is not some magic number that is the key.

5000 mailers to get one deal is a 0.02% success rate.  This is pretty much 0!

This 3000-5000K is not some magic number. This number simply means, your chances of success are pretty much 0!

"but why then are there so many people successful doing this?'"

Again, you are not listening to me.

0.02% of many people is still many people right?

I estimate over 500M people according to Facebook audiences. (doubt this is accurate)

Regardless

0.02% of 500,000,000 = 100,000 people are successful

So you see ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND success stories, people holding up checks, bragging about how many Lambos they buy... but what you will never see are the rest of the 499,900,000 people quietly crying in the fetal position on the floor that lost a fortune trying those tactics.

You don't hear from them, you don't see them and you only see extremely incomplete data.

Again,

I would stop telling others it is a numbers game. It is NOT a numbers game. A numbers game implies you will eventually get success guaranteed.

The fact of the matter is unless you target every single person in the USA, AND there is a guarantee that at least one person is motivated, AND there is a guarantee they get no other mailers, or temptation from competitors and they pick you... 

Key is, they have to pick you. No amount of mailers guarantee they will pick YOU. 

NONE of these "ands" is a guarantee so it mathematically is incorrect to call it a numbers game.

it is NOT a numbers game.

The harsh reality of the matter is you need to think, and stop accepting opinions from others just because you want them to be true. You'll feel better yes, but success will most likely not be attained.

Instead I entice you to start being smart, start thinking, start analytically dissecting theories and opinions and validate them with logic and proof. Then form your conclusions, then build your systems based on these findings and when you do it correctly...

All these leads come to me. I don't look for them, I don't lift a finger. My wholesaling checks are 6 figures!

I am not just talking crap.

Step up, and think on your own! Don't you think it is time to take success into your own hands instead of relying on others when they themselves haven't figured it out yet?

Stop listening to people on Biggerpockets that themselves are struggling getting leads and they brush it off with "oh it is normal". If you are struggling getting leads, GREAT, you are doing good because it is normal. Everyone is.

Do you not realize how silly this is?!

Good luck all... (although luck has not a dang thing to do with it)

Quote from @Hector Perez:

Quote from @Jonathan Krauser:

Quote from @Hector Perez:

@Jonathan Krauser

After reading the letter for a second time, I would recommend changing the following

here is my two cents. 

In the second paragraph where it says "I will also pay cash" be careful with that statement. If you are targeting small multifamily properties, that statement can be true, but if you are targeting larger units, the chances of paying cash are very small to none, as many people will buy it using banks and a mix of syndication, so savvy investors will ignore your letter

The PS section where says " or if they have tenants in the property." This is what I typically use for my SFR direct mail campaign to landlords. but if you are targeting multifamily more likely they will have tenants in place, so that statement is not as powerful for your audience as it is for SFR landlords, that sometimes is hard to sell a property with Tenants in place

I hope that helps a bit

Thank you for the response. I created the list from the tax records. It consists of only owners that have duplexes and their mailing addresses. These letters are going to the landlords. I have the cash resources to purchase any of those properties. 

 Ok, I understand now, so the letter will work great for duplexes. Good Luck

Typically multifamily is 5 units or more and Single Families are 1-4 units, so I was confused, so thanks for the clarification

Quote from @Ecaterina Katerina Morosan:

1. Cold call the target area

2. Send out letters in handwritten envelops about your intention to purchase

3. Follow up

4. Send out flyers about recently sold/purchased

5. Cold call

6. Follow up

7. Send letters to mailing address instead of property address

etc etc etc

You need to become hyperlocal and more important to reach the person at the right time. Also, don't forget to bring up any off market deals you are aware of in the area. Have a list of them. I personally think it's not just mailers but a combination of actions that works. Good luck!

1. Cold call the target area

The area has nothing to do with people being motivated to sell. 

2. Send out letters in handwritten envelops about your intention to purchase

Handwritten letters only TRICK people into OPENING the letter. Tricking them to open the letter doesn't magically transform them from being non-motivated to being motivated!

And even when you TRICK them to open the letter, they will be disappointed right? They will feel like you tricked them and manipulated them into opening the letter. this does the opposite of building rapport, you are pissing them off. Don't do this. 

3. Follow up

Following up only pisses people off more. Think about it. If you have to follow up, it means they were not interested right?  So you know they are not interested so you bug them with a service they don't want.  You are not winning them over.

The danger in this is that you are not there on your own doing your thing. You have competition. If you were competing against us... a friendly respectful, professional-behaving couple that didn't monthly harass them like a desperate maniac you will lose.

4. Send out flyers about recently sold/purchased

You are enticing them to find an agent. Not what you want (if you are looking for motivated sellers). If the recently sold show market value,  you are driving their hopes up. Don't want to do that.

5. Cold call

Will piss them off, and you are reaching people that do not want to sell their house especially not at a discount. So I wouldn't do this either.

6. Follow up

Piss them off, harass them. Following up means they are not interested (or you wouldn't have to follow up). Bugging them constantly is not going to make them like you. more. Yes, some do deals with you, but that is all you see. You only see when it worked For every person you made a deal with during follow-up, you pissed 600 people off. That is not the way to run a business.

7. Send letters to the mailing address instead of the property address

See above. Mailers, lists, calls can't target motivated sellers.

You said:
"You need to become hyperlocal and more important to reach the person at the right time."

This is correct, but that is a bad thing. You will NEVER know when someone is about to become motivated. There is no way of knowing

My advice to everyone is this.

Stop thinking with a scarcity desperation mindset.

If you think it is ok to harass 1000 people to death to get one contract signed, you really need to reevaluate your business ethics and principles. You are looking for clients. You are providing a service to your clients. Your clients are motivated sellers.

You can NOT convert people who do not want to sell  (below market value) into people willing to sell below market value.

The mistake people make (constantly) is their efforts are based on forcing non-motivated sellers to sell, by constant harassment.

This is wrong.

Instead of mass mailing blanket mailing,  and putting your energy in finding random people and forcing them to become motivated by putting a ton of effort and money into follow-up, you need to focus on targeting the RIGHT people.

People who are actually looking for your service.

Hopefully, it changes your perspective and you can improve your business.

Quote from @Jonathan Krauser:

Quote from @Jerryll Noorden:

Quote from @Hector Perez:

Direct mail marketing works great for me, and I have never stopped in over 10 years of doing it consistently, and I have closed many deals from SFR, notes, land and commercial properties

 yes, you can do PPC or SEO, but you can spend thousands of dollars too, and no deals. 

Basically you need to know what you are doing in DM or Online for it to work, otherwise, you will spend thousands of dollars without success

@Jonathan Krauser. The letter looks good. Good Luck

Hopefully this message to you Hector helps you grow. I will be blunt so hold on tight. 

"DMM has worked great for me",  

What exactly do you mean by " it works for me" and what do you mean by "it works great". Quantify this for me.

1% success rate? This means every 100 mailers you send you get one deal. 

0.1% success rate? This means every 1000 mailers you send you make one deal.

0.01% success rate? You need to send 10,000 mailers to get one deal.

And you have been doing it for 10 years... Why even mention this as this has nothing to do with anything. 

I have been doing this for just 6 and I get more leads for free than you get chasing after them paying a fortune. But alas this is not about me or SEO.

Allow me to make my point.

Consider exhibit A: some actual data/numbers

All free, all motivated, all begging me to make them a cash offer, all 100% free. 

So tell me again, What does "it works great for me" truly mean? It's quite objective right? So what you are doing is misleading people. What you call "works great for me", to me is quite low performance.

So let's agree from now on to never again use mere opinion or baseless claims as a substitution for data. Agreed? Good!

Now:

You can spend thousands of dollars on SEO and PPC and still make no deals.  Yup! You can also die in a car accident, and/or you can also NOT die in a car accident.  Are you saying, we should not drive cars and just walk everywhere?

Yes you can spend thousands on PPC and SEO and make no deals, but you can also spend thousands on PPC and make a TON of deals. So?! Your point?! That what you said makes absolutely no sense. 

Are you saying DMM is acceptable because other methods CAN fail too? That is no reason to do DMM, what the hell?! Your conclusions are drawn out of thin air.

Let's run this experiment:

Step 1:

How many of you doing DMM are actually successful (RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY?  Write that number down, call it "X" 

Step 2:

Now, How many of you are doing DMM and get NOTHING out of it (other than a bunch of angry people threatening you?) Write THAT number down, call it Y

Step 3:

Compare those two numbers.

Hector be very honest for a second. Compare the numbers. There will be a HUGE difference between "X" and "Y". I am willing to bet that X is a couple of orders of magnitudes larger than Y.

My question to you is this. Can you be man enough to admit this?

If yes, then there you have it. If it "worked" there would be more success than failures, but there are FAR more failures than successes, so how can you be ok with telling people or advising people to do it when you know DARN well that every 1000 people you tell to do it, 999 will fail. Bet you don't refund them when they fail, do you? I bet that if you HAD to refund the failures you would absolutely not teach people this stuff.  Right? Am I right? huh? ;) ;)

Easy for all you gurus and coaches to say and make all sorts of claims without accountability, but if you were to be held accountable you wouldn't say these things. Most gurus (not you) think that the louder you bark the more people will listen, but none show data, proof, or evidence. WHY is that?!

Everyone is so fast to respond to questions, but no one, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU shows ANY evidence, proof or data backing up said claims, WHAT-SO-EVER!

Everyone just talks a strong talk. But that's all they do. 

Here is what you are teaching others:

1. Perform a ton of research on how to generate leads.

2. Listen to podcasts on your way to work.

3. Question the meaning of life, listening to, and
dissecting all that information.

4. Find A list, Filter That List, Buy that List, Buy stamps, Buy mailers.

5. Handwrite 5000 letters.

6. Include a pen inside the envelope for “lumpy mail”.

7. Send mailers.

8. Experience a short-lived feeling of accomplishment.

9. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton of angry calls from said mailers.

10. Get a ton of returned mailers.

11. Skip trace these addresses.

12. Pay for a new set of envelopes mailers and stamps.

13. Resend mailers.

14. Experience another short-lived feeling of hopefulness.

15. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton more angry calls from said mailers.

16. Listen to more podcasts.

17. Get a “AHA!” moment when discovering different color mailers, envelopes, and stamps.

18. Research what mailer or letter works best. (yellow, blue, handwritten, scribbles).

19. Slap a unique tracking phone number on each mailer design.

20. Spend another fortune sending mailers, again.

21. Get yelled at, again.

22. Remove people from the list that demand it, again.

23. Receive a bunch of returned mailers, again.

24. Spend another fortune to skip trace and resend the new mailers… again.

25. Subscribe to your favorite real estate investing forum and ask people what you are doing wrong.

26. Try hard to make sense of their response: “If all this is not working for you, it means you didn’t do it enough, do more (of what obviously is not working), and stay consistent”.

27. Get depressed.

28. Get yourself together.

29. Do it all over again.

30. If it doesn't work, keep telling yourself that it works, so do more, more and more.

31. If it STILL doesn't work,  in that case... DO MORE!! Stay consistent.

32. If it still doesn't work, remember how many people on Biggerpockets said "it works for me", so DO MORE.

"works great", Really dude?

Here is what I am teaching others.

You can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible. When you need something you take it upon yourself to find the solution to your problem. You resort to the internet. You don't look through your mail hoping someone sent you a DMM piece on how to solve your problem. You don't go through your text messages hoping a random stranger sent you a text coincidentally with the exact solution you need, you don't go to the library, you don't open a newspaper, you don't call your mom or your neighbor. You whip up your phone and go to GOOGLE!

Motivated sellers find you. YOU don't find THEM.


Which of the 2 makes more sense?

To think you have been doing all these 29+ steps for 10 years and you proudly say it out loud, as if it were a good thing? It is not!!

You and I obviously think very differently. But hey keep doing your 29 steps. That's on you.  But I wouldn't tell others to do it, there are far better and easier ways.

Work smarter, not harder. 

Thank you for the post. What have you found works in getting motivated sellers to talk with you?

 No worries man. My pleasure.

To answer this question you first need to understand what a motivated seller is because this is the root of all the inconsistent advice flying around. This is very important so see if you can stick with me here.

A motivated seller is not someone that want to, needs to, or even has to sell their house (like foreclosure, tax liens, job loss etc. etc.).

A motivated seller is anyone willing to sell their house below market value regardless of the reason why.

So it is the willingness to sell below market value is what separates a seller from a motivated seller.

Take someone in foreclosure. Don't they have to sell their house? Yes. And if they don't sell their house aren't they going to be in trouble? Yes.

Are they willing to sell their house below market value? Nope! 

Although they HAVE to sell are desperate to sell, NEED to sell, they are NOT motivated.

They rather pour concrete down the drain, destroy the cabinets then sell to you... at market value, let alone at a discount.

So, once you truly and fully understand this,  think about it. Who are you targeting by sending marketing to a list? People who want to, need to, or have to sell.

If foreclosures were motivated sellers, why does it take you 3000 to 5000 mailers calls or texts to get ONE deal?  The data and numbers are staring you in the face, but people choose to see what they want to see.

Now. Sadly, you can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible.

Why?

Jon,  do you own your house? 

Yes?

Great.

I am going to offer you 20 cents on the dollar for your house. Yes or no?

No?

Darn it.

Fine how about 50 cents on the dollar?

No?

Jeez man

FINE 100 GADAMN CENTS ON THE DOLLAR. I will give you market value for your house.

No still right?

Why?

Because if you had said yes, you would have to pack,  move, find a house, moving company... WHY? WHY take on all that crap when you were not motivated in the first place right?

So, ok you are not a motivated seller.

God forbid, knock on wood, something happens to you tomorrow and you BECOME motivated.

My question is this. 

Who knows that you Jon Krauser, living at 123 Main Street became motivated?

NO ONE!!

You do not magically appear on the motivated seller list in Propstream. You do not get a tag in the government registry that says "Jon right.... wait for it.. .waaaait for it.. NOW.. NOW Jon became motivated, everyone sends him a mailer call or text". It's moronic!

My point and proof, evidence-backed.

NOTHING can target motivated sellers because no one knows when someone else becomes motivated. No list no set of characteristics and predict motivation because motivation is based on emotion, NOT DATA.

If you were a lion in the dry savannah of Africa and you wanted food. Where would you go?

The watering hole right?

I don;t care who you are, your butt will be at the watering hole every single day

Where do you go when you need info, help, reviews, knowledge, entertainment, and answers? Library? No, Google. You go to the internet.

Well, guess what So does everyone else including actually MOTIVATED sellers.

The ONLY way to reliably get in touch with motivated sellers is for you to make it extremely easy for them to find you.

I call this "stalking the watering hole".

SEO is obviously the best, but  PPC and Facebook ads (a service I do not provide... meaning I am not just saying this BECAUSE I offer SEO) are the next best thing each with advantages and disadvantages.

Now, you are better off investing in an ever working lead generation system so you can automate this to generate the highest quality leads for free, than investing in a list, no matter the list and every single time you send mailers you have to 

1) Hope they see the mailer

2) Hope they open the mailer

3) Hope that when and IF they open the mailer they are in the mood to read it

4) Hope that when they 1. find the mailer, 2. and hopefully open the mailer, and 3. hopefully they are in the mood to read your mailer, and 4. they are coincidently in some sort of motivation state to act on the mailer, they will give YOU a call when they have received 400 other mailers from other people

You do realize that 50% of 50% is 25%. So hoping on a hope the numbers go down QUICK.

Can you make deals doing it the old way? Absolutely. No one is saying you don't. 

But if you want to become a serious Real Estate Investor, you better get with the times or you will become obsolete.

In short.

You don;t find motivated sellers, they find you.

If you have to pay for a lead tr chase a lead, per definition it is a bad lead. Why Because if it was a good lead you wouldn't need to change them They would be chasing the solution to their problem, YOU!

And this is not just blowing hot air.

You all seen my data, seen the evidence seen my leads pouring in and ...

Now you have seen my checks:

All these are Wholesale assignment fees!

That is what I find so stupid in these forums. People fight me on DMM cold calling lists,   WHILE they complain about DMM cold calling and lists. I tell them its wrong they defend it to the death, while they SEE me put undisputable proof that those methods are retarded!, yet they call themselves coaches and experts with absolutely no data to show While I am showing concrete proof that what I am telling them is solid, common sense logic, while THEIR OWN DATA  shows I am correct.

Un

Be

LIEV

ABLE!!!

Quote from @Hector Perez:

Direct mail marketing works great for me, and I have never stopped in over 10 years of doing it consistently, and I have closed many deals from SFR, notes, land and commercial properties

 yes, you can do PPC or SEO, but you can spend thousands of dollars too, and no deals. 

Basically you need to know what you are doing in DM or Online for it to work, otherwise, you will spend thousands of dollars without success

@Jonathan Krauser. The letter looks good. Good Luck

Hopefully this message to you Hector helps you grow. I will be blunt so hold on tight. 

"DMM has worked great for me",  

What exactly do you mean by " it works for me" and what do you mean by "it works great". Quantify this for me.

1% success rate? This means every 100 mailers you send you get one deal. 

0.1% success rate? This means every 1000 mailers you send you make one deal.

0.01% success rate? You need to send 10,000 mailers to get one deal.

And you have been doing it for 10 years... Why even mention this as this has nothing to do with anything. 

I have been doing this for just 6 and I get more leads for free than you get chasing after them paying a fortune. But alas this is not about me or SEO.

Allow me to make my point.

Consider exhibit A: some actual data/numbers

All free, all motivated, all begging me to make them a cash offer, all 100% free. 

So tell me again, What does "it works great for me" truly mean? It's quite objective right? So what you are doing is misleading people. What you call "works great for me", to me is quite low performance.

So let's agree from now on to never again use mere opinion or baseless claims as a substitution for data. Agreed? Good!

Now:

You can spend thousands of dollars on SEO and PPC and still make no deals.  Yup! You can also die in a car accident, and/or you can also NOT die in a car accident.  Are you saying, we should not drive cars and just walk everywhere?

Yes you can spend thousands on PPC and SEO and make no deals, but you can also spend thousands on PPC and make a TON of deals. So?! Your point?! That what you said makes absolutely no sense. 

Are you saying DMM is acceptable because other methods CAN fail too? That is no reason to do DMM, what the hell?! Your conclusions are drawn out of thin air.

Let's run this experiment:

Step 1:

How many of you doing DMM are actually successful (RELIABLY and CONSISTENTLY?  Write that number down, call it "X" 

Step 2:

Now, How many of you are doing DMM and get NOTHING out of it (other than a bunch of angry people threatening you?) Write THAT number down, call it Y

Step 3:

Compare those two numbers.

Hector be very honest for a second. Compare the numbers. There will be a HUGE difference between "X" and "Y". I am willing to bet that X is a couple of orders of magnitudes larger than Y.

My question to you is this. Can you be man enough to admit this?

If yes, then there you have it. If it "worked" there would be more success than failures, but there are FAR more failures than successes, so how can you be ok with telling people or advising people to do it when you know DARN well that every 1000 people you tell to do it, 999 will fail. Bet you don't refund them when they fail, do you? I bet that if you HAD to refund the failures you would absolutely not teach people this stuff.  Right? Am I right? huh? ;) ;)

Easy for all you gurus and coaches to say and make all sorts of claims without accountability, but if you were to be held accountable you wouldn't say these things. Most gurus (not you) think that the louder you bark the more people will listen, but none show data, proof, or evidence. WHY is that?!

Everyone is so fast to respond to questions, but no one, NOT A SINGLE ONE OF YOU shows ANY evidence, proof or data backing up said claims, WHAT-SO-EVER!

Everyone just talks a strong talk. But that's all they do. 

Here is what you are teaching others:

1. Perform a ton of research on how to generate leads.

2. Listen to podcasts on your way to work.

3. Question the meaning of life, listening to, and
dissecting all that information.

4. Find A list, Filter That List, Buy that List, Buy stamps, Buy mailers.

5. Handwrite 5000 letters.

6. Include a pen inside the envelope for “lumpy mail”.

7. Send mailers.

8. Experience a short-lived feeling of accomplishment.

9. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton of angry calls from said mailers.

10. Get a ton of returned mailers.

11. Skip trace these addresses.

12. Pay for a new set of envelopes mailers and stamps.

13. Resend mailers.

14. Experience another short-lived feeling of hopefulness.

15. Followed by an intense sense of depression and shock upon receiving a ton more angry calls from said mailers.

16. Listen to more podcasts.

17. Get a “AHA!” moment when discovering different color mailers, envelopes, and stamps.

18. Research what mailer or letter works best. (yellow, blue, handwritten, scribbles).

19. Slap a unique tracking phone number on each mailer design.

20. Spend another fortune sending mailers, again.

21. Get yelled at, again.

22. Remove people from the list that demand it, again.

23. Receive a bunch of returned mailers, again.

24. Spend another fortune to skip trace and resend the new mailers… again.

25. Subscribe to your favorite real estate investing forum and ask people what you are doing wrong.

26. Try hard to make sense of their response: “If all this is not working for you, it means you didn’t do it enough, do more (of what obviously is not working), and stay consistent”.

27. Get depressed.

28. Get yourself together.

29. Do it all over again.

30. If it doesn't work, keep telling yourself that it works, so do more, more and more.

31. If it STILL doesn't work,  in that case... DO MORE!! Stay consistent.

32. If it still doesn't work, remember how many people on Biggerpockets said "it works for me", so DO MORE.

"works great", Really dude?

Here is what I am teaching others.

You can't target motivated sellers. It is not possible. When you need something you take it upon yourself to find the solution to your problem. You resort to the internet. You don't look through your mail hoping someone sent you a DMM piece on how to solve your problem. You don't go through your text messages hoping a random stranger sent you a text coincidentally with the exact solution you need, you don't go to the library, you don't open a newspaper, you don't call your mom or your neighbor. You whip up your phone and go to GOOGLE!

Motivated sellers find you. YOU don't find THEM.


Which of the 2 makes more sense?

To think you have been doing all these 29+ steps for 10 years and you proudly say it out loud, as if it were a good thing? It is not!!

You and I obviously think very differently. But hey keep doing your 29 steps. That's on you.  But I wouldn't tell others to do it, there are far better and easier ways.

Work smarter, not harder. 

No man, and do me a favor.

Pretend for a moment I am not against you. I am not trying to grill you, I am trying to help you and others reading this.

Really let go of any reservations and emotions you have reading my message. I admit I am very direct and blunt. I don't "do" emotions when writing my replies. Nothing against you or anyone.

That said, please try to understand what I am saying.

I am not promoting anything. I am giving free value, and knowledge based on data. The fact that I believe so much in what I am teaching that I offer a service for it, backed by data has nothing to do with it.

Second.

This has nothing to do with  "aligning with MY/YOUR/HIS/HER/THEIR business model". This has to do with "is the strategy going to give you the success you are after". It's not about aligning with a business model. This is about are you going to get motivated seller leads reliably, consistently, and predictably. Makes sense right?

DMM success rate is less than 0.03%. 

Fact.

So you telling others that  "it works" while thousands are trying it while 90% of the people trying it fail.

You are pushing opinions, disguised as facts to others and that is not only dangerous, it is wrong and misleading. That is why I responded to your post.

So what you should consider is this:

Stop being emotional. Stop clinging to an ego. Stop trying to be right. Remove all of that and mind the data. I can prove to you that you are wrong.,

Would you run through a minefield when you have a 0.03% of surviving?

 Wait don't answer yet...  Would you run through a minefield when you have a 99.97% of blowing up to smithereens?

No, right?

Would you buy a car where every 3000 times you turn the key it only starts once?

No right?

Does the car work? Well, it starts right? (every 3000 times you turn the key)

No right?

There is absolutely no difference between these analogies and what we are talking about above.

I repeat. Remove ego. Remove the desire to be right.Be able to question your opinions and verify them using actual data, not ego, or the desire to be right. Not many can do this, but if you can make yourself do this, I promise you, success will follow far more reliably.

I am not defending, my opinions because they are mine. I am defining them with data, logic and common sense. Have you noticed that? I give you analogies, and explanations, I even give you statistically measurable numbers and data to back it up. All I see other people respond to this is with mere opinions, jabs, insults and anger.

Just, only, and simply, look at what is actually in front of you and draw conclusions from that.

Once you manage to do that you will realize that I am actually helping you. Your ego just doesn't allow to see that. And that is too bad.

The fact that you had to mention that I am offering a service and I am promoting it, is quite evident, your ego was bruised and you retaliated offensively. No need for that,. Just look at my data and good luck man.

Quote from @John O'Leary:

Direct mail works, but you typically need to hit them 3-5 times or be following up with cold calling.  Too many new wholesalers mail them once and give up. What lists are you targeting plays a large roll also.  

Everyone... please focus... (I am getting pretty tired myself sounding like a broken record).

Direct mail marketing works SO poorly, you need to send THOUSANDS of mailers, AND you need to send these thousands of mailers SEVERAL times to get a deal.

So:

BECAUSE the performance is SO low you need to send thousands to COMPENSATE for its poor performance AND hit the receivers several times BECAUSE the performance is so low to get a deal.

Conclusion: "Direct mail marketing works"

WHAT THE HECK?!

People, stop. By you all not thinking about what you are saying, this absolute nonsense spreads like a virus reinforcing the belief that because everyone regurgitates the same wrong stuff, it must be true. PLEASE stop this.

Let's end this false notion right here and now. Let's all make a vow to really think, analyze, verify before we dress up nonsense as "facts" or "data".

Imagine buying a car from a car brand that ALWAYS breaks down.

You are telling others: The car works fine. You just need to bring it in continuously every other day for repairs, to keep fixing the stuff that constantly breaks, to make it run, so because the car is always being fixed (because it always breaks), my conclusion is the car works, and so the car brand is A-Okay.

That doesn't make any sense, does it? 

Please stop saying DMM works. If it did work, why are 90%+ of the people doing DMM struggling?

Why isn't everyone doing DMM a multi-millionaire yet?

NO it doesn't work.

Can you get a deal from it? Yes, it is absolutely possible. So is winning the lotto. That doesn't mean "buying lotto works". No one is debating whether or not it is POSSIBLE to get a deal doing DMM. But claiming it "works" is a HUGE stretch.

It is like saying "if it doesn't;t work, then you didn;t do it enough". Do more.

When something doesn't;t work you don't do more to make it work. Come on people!

<<Space shuttle blows up>>

Houston: " Pick 7 more astronauts, put them in that rocket and send an other one up. 

<<Shuttle blows up>>

Houston: "Find me 7 more astronauts"

<<Shuttle blows up>>

It's ok, stay consistent. One of them HAS to reach orbit.

I mean... Do I really need to give more examples?

I can go on.

Hope you understand my point. Not an attack on you. Just frustrated with how difficult it is for people to adopt intelligence and common sense, backed by data and evidence, yet it is effortless for people to religiously embrace absolute NONSENSE.

Quote from @Nate Pickering:

@Jerryll Noorden  Where can I purchase the "motivated sellers" list?  That sounds really good.  I'll go out on a limb to guess that it doesn't exist.  What we do have are data points i.e. pre-foreclosures, foreclosures, vacant properties, divorce, probate, absentee owners, etc. that COULD be an indicator for a motivated seller.  Getting in contact is the next thing, but we need the initial list to start.  That is why investors stack lists to increase the probability of someone who is motivated.  Just a thought.  Seriously though, if you have a way to get in front of the motivated sellers without these other lists then I would love to learn about it.  Thanks.

No no no no no no

That is the exact thing I m trying to tell you all.
Try to focus on what I am saying. CLear your mind. Unlearn everything you think you know. Forget everything you think is a fact, open your mind, and try to really listen.

Experiments have been performed where flyers were handed out at a mall entry, and mailers sent through a targeted list.

The results were pretty much identical. It is simply random.

The entire notion of foreclosures, and absentee owners "COULD" be an indicator for motivation. Sure. So is being white, black, having a car, or having a banana for lunch.

Being in foreclosure has NOTHING to do with being motivated. It is as much as a data point as the fact there are ants on this planet. Motivation is an emotional thing. Not a logical thing.

You can't say, You are dealing with this, this, and that, which means your chances are a bit higher being motivated.

Not at all.

2 people in a bank and a bunch of robbers break in and hold everyone hostage. Person 1 cowers on the floor in a fetal position while person 2 becomes the hero and beats them all up.

2 different people act completely differently in the exact same situation.

Why? Because they are different people. Different emotions. All have the same logic, they all think it is a bad situation, but they both act and decide differently.

Let me repeat.

Being in foreclosure has ABSOLUTELY ZERO impact on being motivated or not.

The biggest mistake you make is this.

You think that a motivated seller is someone who wants to, needs to, or has to sell their house.

That is why you make this mistake in thinking.

This is not the case.

A motivated seller is anyone willing to sell their house below market value, and the reasons why don't matter.

Now with this new data, consider your message.

Being in foreclosure could make them motivated.

Take someone in foreclosure. Don’t they HAVE to sell? Yes, And if they don't sell aren't bad things going to happen to them? Yes.. so according to YOU, COULD be motivated.

But let's ask 1000 people in foreclosure to sell their house. Their response...

I rather pour concrete down the drain than sell to you. (at market value, let alone at discounted value).

Do you start to see your flaw?

Foreclosure has NOTHING to do with the fact that they are willing or not willing to sell below market value.

And that my friends, is why people fail.

You need to think. Analyze and be smart.
Don't see what you want to see, Analyze.

No, again.

There is no room for opinions here. If you have a different opinion, it simply means your opinion is wrong.

1=1 = 2 no matter what your opinion is. And if you think it is not 2, then great you have an opinion but it is wrong.

 I get that. But that is wrong.

Let me explain.

Experiments have been performed where fliers were handed out at a mall entry, and mailers sent through a targeted list.

The results were pretty much identical.

THe entire notion of foreclosures, absenty owners "COULD" be an indicator for motivation? Sure. So is being white, black, having a car, having a bannana for lunch.

Being in forclosure has NOTHING to do with being motivated. It is not even an indicator. It is a complete illusion. THAT is what you do not understand. That is what SOOO many of you just don't seem to grasp,

Motivation is an eEMOTIONAL thing. Not a logical thing.

You can't say,   You are dealing with this, this and that, which means your chances are a bit higher being motivated.

Not at all.

2 people in a bank, and a bunch of robbers break in and hold everyone hostage. Perosn 1 cowers on the floor in fetal position while pwrson 2 becomes the hero and beats them all up.

2 different people act completely differently in the exact same situation.

Why? Becuase they are different people. Different emotions. All have the same logic, they all think it is a bad situation, but they both act and decide differently.

Let me repeat.

Being in foreclosure has ABSOLUTELY ZERO impact being motivated or not.

The biggest mistake you make is this.

You still think that a motivated seller is someone that wants to, needs to or has to slel their house.

That is why you make this mistake in thinking.

This is not the case.

A motivated seller is anyone willing to sell their house below market value, and the reasons why don't matter.

Now with this new data, consider your message.

Being in foreclosure could make them motivated?

Sure!

But it also coul dNOT right?

take someone in flreclosure. Don;t they HAVE to sell? Yes, And if they don;t sell arn't bad things going to happen to them? Yes.. so according to YOU,  COULD be motivated.

But lets ask 1000 people in floreclosure to sell their house. Their response...

I rathe rpour concrete down the drain then sell to you. (at market value, let alone at discounted value).

Do you start to see your flaw?

Foreclosure has NOTHING to do with the fact that they are willing or not willing to slel below market value.

And that my firneds, is why people fail.

You need to think. Analyze be smart. 
Don't see what you want to see, Analyze.

No, again.

There is no room for opinions here. Don;t debate with me/this. If you have a differnet opinon , it simply means your opinionis wrong.

1=1 = 2 no matter what your opinion is. And if you think it is not 2, then grreat you have an opinion but it is wrong.

Same with this.

What I am telling you is correct and any othe ropinion simply is wrong. And this sounds realyy egotistical, but that is what you get when trying to bring opinoins to a battle of data!