All Forum Posts by: Ryan Mullin

I have found this to be a good article for a general explanation of wholesaling. 

https://www.biggerpockets.com/renewsblog/2015/01/3...

My advice would be to get your license first.  Complete some transactions and get a feel for how real estate works in general before you dive into wholesaling.  

I would be interested in hearing about / checking out the properties.  We definitely manage in Irvington  but Englewood would be a case by case basis.  Other groups to look into are Dorfman Property management, IPM Real estate, Barron Property services and Equity Management solutions.  

Property radar is only west coast :(   

Anyone know of something like this in the midwest?  

There is 2 types of wholesalers in my opinion.   Assigners and closers.   

The difference is obvious and we can sniff them out a mile away.   There has already been some really good responses so I won't go into it...   

But another thing you have to look out for as an agent is people that want to flip, have no liquid assets, and have been taught (by a guru) to make offers first and get hard money next. A few weeks ago I listed a fixer for 99k. I get an offer for 106k. cash offer. the POF is an IRA account that the the 'buyer" had no intention of using. My wife (the detail oriented one) looks the buyer up on Facebook and sure enough he's ON STAGE WITH A GURU in his photos. Strike 3. your done.

Thank you Jay and Ritch for the kind words!   If we can help any MI/op investors, we certainly will!  Currently working with a few that have salvageable properties and advised some just to dump and move on.  

@Joe Splitrock  I don't know but I don't think they paid any 55k markups...   I have no idea about this deal really, I couldn't find anything that matches up with the info here. but, If Brett did something wrong then the entire RE community is guilty of it too.  Including  the city of Indianapolis.  Not trying to argue, and I DO get your point, trust me.  (I will chime in on the next wholesaling thread I see). 

Brett and his company are great and bring a lot of value to investors.  I would even recommend to the original poster Jaron, to work with Brett to get a deal.  

 I never said that...  

1.  Yeah the history on the property is weird.  No argument there.   Frankly I see so much of this I'm 100% desensitized to it.  

2. Thats what wholesalers do... They are middle men. Agree with it or not thats what they do. I have my opinion on wholesaling in general and specific wholesalers here in town.. I could go on and on and on about that subject. But I won't. that would be a different thread. I was simply stating that there is no "hiding" going on. You Mention Brett who is a stand up guy and does a ton of good business and actually brings value to the RE community and I know this for a fact because I buy properties from him and the end result is rehabbed house. I could give you at least a dozen examples of deals that I have done with him. He is a broker and does everything by the book on the record majority on MLS. He also runs a podcast and had Clayton Morris on his show... not hiding or doing anything wrong legally or ethically IMO. You also mentioned Andy's entity and he came on the thread and straight up said it was him. Not hiding.

3.  I am that guy that rehabs properties and offers them to home owners and buy and hold investors.   and I don't really use wholesalers unless they close on the properties with there own money and disclose fees etc..  

4.  This isn't the first group that came to Indy and thought they were hot sh*t and could pull the wool over the eyes of us Indiana folk and get over on everyone from the municipal government all the way down the line to the out of state investors that line up to get these "deals" that magically get pumped out 20 - 50 a month in a town that barely has that many decent deals total.  Ive seen this happen over and over and over.  IMO you have to look the out of state investors roll in this too.  I can scroll back and start reading Jay Hinrichs comments warning people about this before OP even started.  

A lot of the locals that end up wholesaling these deals don't know or care what the end result is.  I agree a lot of the time it adds NO value to the city or the economy or society in general.  I know lots of brokers that fit under the same category.  I know lots of buy hold investors as well that couldn't give 2 craps about providing quality housing and improving communities. and all they care about is there bottom line (which is funny to me because they make way less money slum lording then doing it right).  Local and out of state.     Again...  I could go on a on about all of this.  This whole ocean point thing doesnt need to be a witch hunt.  Its waaaay to obvious who are the criminals here.  Like.. not slightly un-ethical.   Straight stealing.  Criminal.  I mean the guy left a death threat on a voice mail of a local PM for a post on BP!  

The original post was more about "should I buy from oceanpointe?"   and basically I said no.  or lowball them out of principle..   which I should add to that make sure you use a really thorough title company if you do.   

Honestly..   Inventory is at an all time low and people need deals.   If I buy a property from a bad person because I need a deal to keep my company going and keep my guys working does that make me a bad person too????    Im participating...   ?  

Every one that does even a little wholesaling in Indy sold houses to oceanpointe..  some more than others but no one is really hiding behind any curtain in that regard.  But as locals at THIS point in time I would say pretty much boycott them or lowball just on principle.  They made bad areas worse and even turned some decent blocks into areas where people are scared of the neighbors squatting in an ocean point house dealing drugs or stealing stuff.   total plague on the city.    Sad.  

If its really thick I would say more of a goof off or goo be gone (one in particular is a citrus formula works really well) to get rid of it..   if its not that thick than primer should be fine.   On a high end flip I would say new drywall...   middle of the road, just cover it up.   

My wife and I have a brokerage and a management business with about 200 units in the inner city of Indianapolis.  We started in 2014 but both had plenty of experience in the industry prior.  Our core business has always flipping and that is how we grow our net worth..    But the PM is what sets us apart from a lot of the local competition and brings us buyers and sellers that most don't have access to.  The bulk of our RE experience was during the 2008 recession and our attitude has been shaped by that almost entirely.  When the retail flips and all attractive deals dry up you will see investors and brokers just disappear.  But property managers will thrive.  And yes the steady income is really really nice.  Its not always fun and it does have its challenges but for me its kinda priceless.   As we grow our portfolio of our own personal rentals we can actually take on deals that most would pass up because we don't have to pay that 10% (or it goes back into our pool of cash flow regardless).  When we have maintenance or vacancy its not nearly as big of a problem for us because we have built a pretty darn good cash flow machine and our big picture looks really solid and not over leveraged at all.  Again...  not always fun.    Im personally driving around the inner city doing things that NO ONE in my income bracket would normally ever do...  (like checking to see if a non paying tenant has vacated a property...  or delivering a window AC unit to a pissed off tenant who's central air went out :)     but I'm also driving for dollars and building my knowledge of local areas and demographics and staying in tune with the "streets".    When I first got my start in RE pretty much everyone said NOT to get into PM...   but Im glad I did.    If your asking where to find PM clients you are literally looking right at it.  Almost every single one of our PM clients came from Biggerpockets.    

Its definitely not the zip codes fault.  46205 includes one of Indy's wealthiest neighborhoods.  Of course, on the other hand it also includes this property.   I was able to look up the property on tax records (using zip code, sq ft, and year built) and yeah...  its pretty hood right there.  

The question is...  who sold you the property and who quoted the rental rate..?  (rhetorical).  IE;  is the PM the turnkey company?   If not then it probably isn't their fault..  and possibly set up to fail by TK provider.    if it is the same company then its just a classic case of inflating the rent to sell the house for a bit more.   Which, unfortunately is the norm in TK.  Both scenarios have the same ending.   And this is it.  

In terms of leasing and property management its pretty 101 to rent to folks that have garnish-able wages, decent credit etc.  But if you're managing this property and the owner says rent it for 850...   and its only worth 750, then you either rent it to who ever will rent it, or let it sit vacant.  Either way, in that scenario,  the PM looks bad on the BP threads..  :)  

On a more positive note, I did see some addresses on the tax records that are in appreciating areas closer to the wealthy neighborhood I mentioned above..   "Meridian Kessler"   ..also Mapleton fall creek.  

Try to look at the positive in this and learn from it.  Get your portfolio performing!  Even if you have to accept a lesser rent amount on some of these properties.  If you do switch PM's be sure to give your new company a clean slate and don't bring existing problems (rental rates, sub par rehabs etc..)  into a new picture.  Start fresh and remember this was never a short term play...