Squatter Shot and Killed by Police

35 Replies

Another avoidable situation. This woman squatted for a year and it was NOT related to COVID in any way, yet they couldn't evict her. When they finally do, she's apparently gained a sense of established entitlement (why not?) and decides to fight back. Shot and killed.

This city has created a special team just to deal with evictions. I see more trouble coming.

https://www.local10.com/news/l...

Interesting.  

From the article, it seems like she was very unstable and since she opened fire on the police, who were legally evicting her, I hope there will not be much sympathy for this behavior.

The CDC has seriously overstepped its authority with this nightmare. They are creating dangerous situations for the police to now have to deal with. It's likely in this particular case, they would have needed to extract her anyway but there are many other cases that don't make the news where police need to clean up an eviction mess created by the CDC. 

Originally posted by @Julie Hartman :

The CDC has seriously overstepped its authority with this nightmare. They are creating dangerous situations for the police to now have to deal with. It's likely in this particular case, they would have needed to extract her anyway but there are many other cases that don't make the news where police need to clean up an eviction mess created by the CDC. 

Exactly. This woman clearly had some issues, but she was likely emboldened by the illegal CDC Eviction Moratorium and our legal system's refusal to execute justice. Even if the Eviction Moratorium were legal, this woman did not qualify as a renter, nor was her situation in any way related to COVID. With all other evictions halted, the court should have been wide open to deal with her swiftly. Instead, they refused to act. It endangered the lives of neighbors and law enforcement, and now the woman is dead. All 100% preventable.

 

Good thing it was the police who are trained to deal with these situations and are armed. It could easily have been a PM or LL who was shot. Unfortunate all the way around but could have been way worse. 

How sad. 

Now who has to pay to patch up all of those bullet holes in the walls and probably replace the door?

I wonder if Miami-Dade PD would cut a check if they were sent an invoice for that?

Do they have that in their budget, bullet hole repair to other peoples property?

The eviction stories should have a show on TV. This keeps getting worse. You pretty much have to forget about your property if they are not paying rent and their lease is not going to end soon. 

Originally posted by @Nathan G. :
Originally posted by @Julie Hartman:

The CDC has seriously overstepped its authority with this nightmare. They are creating dangerous situations for the police to now have to deal with. It's likely in this particular case, they would have needed to extract her anyway but there are many other cases that don't make the news where police need to clean up an eviction mess created by the CDC. 

Exactly. This woman clearly had some issues, but she was likely emboldened by the illegal CDC Eviction Moratorium and our legal system's refusal to execute justice. Even if the Eviction Moratorium were legal, this woman did not qualify as a renter, nor was her situation in any way related to COVID. With all other evictions halted, the court should have been wide open to deal with her swiftly. Instead, they refused to act. It endangered the lives of neighbors and law enforcement, and now the woman is dead. All 100% preventable.

 

Nathan if you recall during the GFC  you had all sorts of folks moving into homes that were vacant as the owners decamped many in CA and some were mansions.. and then they squatted or did cash for keys the professionals knew the investor who bought it at court house would have to go through a year long or longer process to remove the squatter so they would hold out for 5 to 10k..  Bruce Norris talked about this a lot with his court house activities in the Riverside CA market.  WE saw some of it in Portland and i remember one on the news the squatters were really indignant and nasty and mean .. 

 

I'm not sure what part is more messed up. The lady squatting in the unit for a year, the cops bashing down the door and shooting her for it, or the heartless comments in this thread. Definitely not the first one.

@Scott Mac the police department will compensate the owner or hire a contractor to repair.

At least, that’s what happened when my father had a situation where the police forcibly entered one of his rentals a decade or so ago to make an arrest in the Midwest.

Originally posted by @Nick Barlow :

@Merritt S. Did you read the article? The lady OPENED FIRE AT THE COPS.

I don’t want to sound snarky, but to answer your question, that’s the messed up part.

 Yes, I did read the article. The article says the lady opened fire at the cops after they "breached" the door. The news story is of course using the statement from the police only, as the lady was not available for comment, and the news person was not a witness themselves. So what really happened? What does "breach" mean? What other methods of removal were attempted? What methods were even considered? According to the article, the cops knew the lady was armed, suspected she was dangerous, and cleared out the entire floor of the building. Did they use a bullhorn to announce themselves? Did they ask her nicely to come out? Or did they do what everyone knows they love to do, which is announce themselves at the door saying, "Police. Search Warrant.", a second before they use a ram to smash the door to pieces and swarm the unit with weapons drawn and tensions high. Excessive force. That's what happened here. It lead to a death. Let's say maybe they waited for the lady to come out, starved her out maybe. Turned off the power, cut the water. Would the lady have come out with her gun and then opened fire? Perhaps. We'll never know. Or if they didn't have the patience to starve her out, they could have drilled a hole in the wall/door and gased her out. Again, maybe she would have opened fire once out and maybe not, we'll never know. What we do know, is a lady that was squatting, was in her home, and strangers came busting through the door. This lady was not wanted for murder, rape or armed robbery, her crime against humanity was essentially trespassing. I suppose some people think it's ok to shoot a trespasser dead on the spot. The thing is, in this case, in the mind of the lady, the cops were the trespassers. Everyone says how horrible it was that she opened fire on trespassers, but don't seem to have a problem with the police coming into the unit and shooting a trespasser. That aint consistent justice.

The only thing I really agree with within the body of comments I've read so far is this, it was 100% avoidable.

Originally posted by @Nick Barlow :

@Merritt S. Did you read the article? The lady OPENED FIRE AT THE COPS.

I don’t want to sound snarky, but to answer your question, that’s the messed up part.

Some people think that the mentally ill should be given a free pass for their behavior, no matter what it is or who they injure.   That treatment can not be forced or required, but acceptance of the mentally off behavior is expected by all of society is messed up too!   

That a mentally ill person can live in a place rent free, threaten neighbors, and everyone should dismiss the deviant behavior and allow her to stay until she may someday decide to leave is just messed up.  People think that social workers are the solution, but even they can not get the mentally ill to comply PRIOR to treatment and medication.

There are some police departments that have a trained person who deals with the mentally ill but the reality is, if there is a weapon drawn,  the police will shoot. It is a shame it came to that but I do think the moratorium and pandemic have had a profound impact on mental health and the thoughts and actions of the mentally ill.  The longer it went on the more this woman felt entitled. Sometimes I wonder why they can't find a method that locks this type of tenant out instead of approaching them when they are locked in and have access to a gun. 

To anyone that says the cops over reacted. If her first shot had killed a cop. Then would your main concern still be her being killed? If you say she was mentally insane then thank god it wasn’t a Girl Scout selling cookies she killed  


ps. I haven’t seen it brought up yet but it was mentioned during the tv coverage. She was NEVER a tennant. A tenant had a party and then moved out. She came to the party and just never left. She had also threatened several other tenants with her firearm for which she was never arrested. 

Originally posted by @Colleen F. :

There are some police departments that have a trained person who deals with the mentally ill but the reality is, if there is a weapon drawn,  the police will shoot. It is a shame it came to that but I do think the moratorium and pandemic have had a profound impact on mental health and the thoughts and actions of the mentally ill.  The longer it went on the more this woman felt entitled. Sometimes I wonder why they can't find a method that locks this type of tenant out instead of approaching them when they are locked in and have access to a gun. 

 I think in this type of case it is better to do it when they are 'home' because they get the message it is no longer their home.  Otherwise they will go back to the place and try to break in, leaving the other residents or landlord or property managers to deal with the person and their gun). 

And when they are locked out when they are home they can take their most desired things with them generally.  This also reduces the likeliness of them returning.

And she likely carries that gun everywhere, so with contact outside the apartment more of the general population would be at risk.

Also more reason to be more cautious, as a landlord, in potentially dangerous tenant interactions. If your state offers CCW laws, get trained and be prepared. 

Originally posted by @Lynnette E. :
Originally posted by @Nick Barlow:

@Merritt S. Did you read the article? The lady OPENED FIRE AT THE COPS.

I don’t want to sound snarky, but to answer your question, that’s the messed up part.

Some people think that the mentally ill should be given a free pass for their behavior, no matter what it is or who they injure.   That treatment can not be forced or required, but acceptance of the mentally off behavior is expected by all of society is messed up too!   

That a mentally ill person can live in a place rent free, threaten neighbors, and everyone should dismiss the deviant behavior and allow her to stay until she may someday decide to leave is just messed up.  People think that social workers are the solution, but even they can not get the mentally ill to comply PRIOR to treatment and medication.

 
no, we don’t think mentally ill people should just be given a pass but they also should not be shot and killed in cold blood either. 
this was absolutely ridiculous. For one, why was this much force and effort put into an eviction! And they have an entire unit that is dedicated specifically to throwing people from their homes into the street. Police with guns should not be the ones doing that. Personally I feel like if a landlord is going to throw someone into they street they should have to do it face to face. No hiding behind lawyers and eviction companies. You get a lawyer if the tenant is also provided one. And you and a social worker should be the ones to do the actual act of the evicting. You should have to witness what you’re doing to someone. Maybe it was justified because they were a criminal or did massive damage. But if it was a person who had a temporary financial set back who you’ve now thrust into years of debt, poverty, and housing insecurity then you should have to look them in the eye. 
this woman did not deserve to die to protect someone’s financial and property interests. Human life is worth more than that. Would it really have been so hard to try to de escalate things. If someone burst down my door I’d probably try to defend myself too. 

@Eric Weldon-Schilling The reason the police have a unit for evicting is because once the landlord has "faced" the tenant in court and the court issues an eviction verdict, the great majority of tenants leave. They obey the law. The tenants who do not comply are essentially breaking the law and our tax dollars pay for law enforcement to intercede. Sometimes it takes a badge to get people to face reality. If they resist they can be taken into custody, which happens time to time and would probably have been the expected result in this case. But anytime a gun is drawn or fired the expected result is for police to protect themselves and the public by shooting the gunman. So maybe vote for politicians who support gun control?


Let's recall that she:

entered the property illegally and then refused to leave for an entire year;

threatened and harassed her neighbors;

pulled a gun on a neighbor and threatened to shoot them;

fired a gun at the police who where trying to enforce the law.

And your first response is to question whether the police did enough? 

Despite what you hear on CNN, police do not just one day decide to smash someone's door down and shoot them. The reason she remained for an ENTIRE YEAR is because everyone tried to follow the legal process. She was given notice, didn't care. She was taken to court, didn't care. She was evicted, didn't care. So the police finally show up at her door. Even during a "no knock" warrant, the police will usually announce themselves. The lights were cut off. They evacuated the floor. She had plenty of time to know what's going on and respond accordingly. Instead, she chose to stay holed up and then shoot at the police when they tried to enter.

But you want them to take more steps? Maybe we should force everyone out of their homes, shut off the utilities, and take police officers off the streets so they can sit in a hallway and babysit this criminal for days or weeks until she runs out of food. Because we all know crazy people suddenly turn sane when you take away food, water, and freedom. 


 

Originally posted by @Eric Weldon-Schilling :
Originally posted by @Lynnette E.:
Originally posted by @Nick Barlow:

@Merritt S. Did you read the article? The lady OPENED FIRE AT THE COPS.

I don’t want to sound snarky, but to answer your question, that’s the messed up part.

Some people think that the mentally ill should be given a free pass for their behavior, no matter what it is or who they injure.   That treatment can not be forced or required, but acceptance of the mentally off behavior is expected by all of society is messed up too!   

That a mentally ill person can live in a place rent free, threaten neighbors, and everyone should dismiss the deviant behavior and allow her to stay until she may someday decide to leave is just messed up.  People think that social workers are the solution, but even they can not get the mentally ill to comply PRIOR to treatment and medication.

 
no, we don’t think mentally ill people should just be given a pass but they also should not be shot and killed in cold blood either. 
this was absolutely ridiculous. For one, why was this much force and effort put into an eviction! And they have an entire unit that is dedicated specifically to throwing people from their homes into the street. Police with guns should not be the ones doing that. Personally I feel like if a landlord is going to throw someone into they street they should have to do it face to face. No hiding behind lawyers and eviction companies. You get a lawyer if the tenant is also provided one. And you and a social worker should be the ones to do the actual act of the evicting. You should have to witness what you’re doing to someone. Maybe it was justified because they were a criminal or did massive damage. But if it was a person who had a temporary financial set back who you’ve now thrust into years of debt, poverty, and housing insecurity then you should have to look them in the eye. 
this woman did not deserve to die to protect someone’s financial and property interests. Human life is worth more than that. Would it really have been so hard to try to de escalate things. If someone burst down my door I’d probably try to defend myself too. 

Eric let me share an experience that I had personally.

I bought a home at a sheriffs auction ( actually it was a west coast trustee sale but same thing as sheriff's sale)

We win the bid and get our trustee's deed so now we own the home.. I go to the door and the prior owner is still there and like with many folks in deep denial.. He was a vet and not in a good place.. I worked with him to the point I let him live there for free for 9 months.. all the time trying to help him move on.. Talked to his parents etc etc.  Finally it was just evident he was not going to move unless forced to.. So we were left with no other choice but to do an eviction.

So we have to go through the whole mary ann he simply will not leave.. So the Sherriff shows up to remove him as is the law.. And no answer at the door.. And the door is open the police officer goes in and instructs me to wait outside he see a note and a wallet on the kitchen table he comes back out and tells me to now go sit in my car.

He walks around the house then goes into the back yard and there is our hold over tenant a Veitnam vet sitting in a chair and had shot himself in the head and committed suicide.. He could have gone the other way and did what this lady did and shot at me or the police..  He had made up his mind these are highly charged emotional situations that need trained and ARMED police officers to carry out. 

While this affected me deeply ( stopped buying occuppied foreclosures as i had 2 other suicide attempts that were thankfully not successful  ) .  I did everything possible to help this person but at the end of the day I could not let him just live out his years in the house we bought and paid for legally. 

now you have defund the police here in Portland and they have decided to replace them with PARK rangers that have no protection no Bullitt proof vests nothing but pepper spray and their negation skills.. I fear there will be a tragedy here 

 

Crazy for 1 year..

With all the fraud and scam activity going on with Facebook marketplace and Craigslist, someone is going to break a lockbox, move into a property, think they are legal tenant, and then come face to face with police ready to evict squatters. Likely not a scenario involving guns as most people and tenants are decent people and not willing to fire a gun at a police officer.

Squatting on the rise, with everyone moving into FL and a rental housing shortage.

@Lynnette E. there is no saying if she takes the gun everywhere but if someone had complained about the threats with a gun the police could have taken action specific to the gun  prior to eviction.  I guess no one but the landlord complained and the action had to take the form of an eviction. 

@Jay Hinrichs I wonder how many people will last in those park ranger positions. I think they will be hard to fill. I am all for some reform to policing but its more about setting the right standards and  teaching de-escalation techniques then taking away any weapons. 

 @Marian Smith not sure gun control is controlling the guns you want controlled. These kind of people for the most part don't get guns through legal channels.