All Forum Posts by: Matt Ruttenberg

@Ray Hull

To add to my other comment… ideally, it’s a longer term play. There are products that are better for short term with bigger cash on the front end. But it will surely lag long term.

Usually, it’s good to look at the Whole Life options next to a Universal Life option to compare the growth. There’s more versatility with Universal than WL.

Just need to run numbers with someone who knows the REI business.

It’s good to see how you can use it for down payments in the earlier years… then fully funding projects in the later years.

@Ray Hull

I design these for REI and business owners. Works well if designed properly. The idea to "squash" the death benefit down as much as possible to promote the cash value growth… not the other way around.

Need to work with the numbers to get it designed perfectly.

@Rhett Ruehle

I agree with that every situation is different.  If you need life insurance to for the death benefit, term life insurance is best.  Whether it's Whole Life or Universal Life, using it as a Cash Value play depends on how it's designed... which can be extremely advantageous.

I also own an administration company for 401ks and use LIRPs (Life Insurance Retirement Plans) or Deferred Compensation Plans quite a bit as an alternative. They're basically designed the same way, just different goals. Long term vs. short term goals (like REI) are two different goals that need to be designed slightly differently.

At the end of the day, running the numbers is the best place to start.  I am working on about 4 at the moment and can share a few ideas and point you in the right direction.

@Mike S.

Whole life is a more conservative approach.

I’ve designed them with both, and it’s hard to compete with the IUL. The concept with Whole Life is that you’ll invest in RE and get a higher ROR in the outside investments.

So Whole Life is basically a lending play.

 I agree with @John Perrings.  I own both an insurance agency and am a TPA for 401k plans, defined benefit plans, etc.

CV life insurance, if designed correctly, has many benefits outside of what the balance is at the end.  If designed properly for cash value growth, the commissions are lessened considerably than someone who doesn't understand how to design a policy.

I CV life insurance quite often for Deferred Compensation Plans for business owners as well due to the tax benefits for the employER.  

On another note, if you're using it for REI, than the real value is the RE on its own.

And if you're filing a Schedule E as a REI, then your income doesn't qualify for 401k contributions anyhow.

@Satish Lakhapatri

Check out my comments… delicate design to maintain the favorable tax status.

@Ernesto Barragan JR

In addition to my other comment… you need to be careful not “MECing” the policy, which basically loses the tax benefits.

It’s better to design a policy that put the funds in over time.

It can still be the same amount of money, just over several years. You’d need to run numbers to make sure it doesn’t do this. It’s a very individualized product.

@Ernesto Barragan JR

Good question! In order to move money from a 401k to WL, you’d have to pay all the taxes on it that you owe first, then it would go in after tax.

I’ve designed many of these and I wouldn’t suggest using your 401k money for this. Use non-qualified assets.

I’d be happy to run numbers if you like.

@Zachary Blomberg my brother is actually using Tardus. Is in his first round and so far so good.

@Troy Bailey no we moved on because we got outbid to n the property. We’re now in Hawaii! Lol. We move fast!