All Forum Posts by: Davido Davido

Hi Jade,  Good to hear from you.  You might not realize that this thread was started 11 years ago.  There are a couple of  Olympia Real Estate meetup groups in case you are interested.   I haven't been to either for a while.

https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/521/topics/781503-olympia-rei-happy-hour-hops-on-the-hill

https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/521/topics/778409-attention-olympia-rei-group

@Jonah Wilson, 
"My question is how to approach this new lender in California if its a possibility they are unaware of the mortgage? Would this be worth challenging for adverse possession through the court to identify the note holder?"

If you've received a (Warranty) deed, then you already own the property exclusively.  You would not be using adverse possession.  As a point of interest, just last year a new PA law was passed which requires only Ten years for AP (instead of the former 21 years) =if the property is less than a half acre.   See the affect of PA house Bill #352 lowering Quiet Title times via Adverse Possession to ten years for some PA residences.) 

https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/LI/consCheck.cfm?txtType=HTM&ttl=42&div=0&chpt=55&sctn=27&subsctn=1

Instead, you could file a Quiet Title Law Suit and argue that the loan is beyond the PA statute of limitations for mortgages.  It probably is not past the statute of limitations (20 years since last payment), but two things might happen that could enable you to succeed in getting the mortgage removed from the title by court order.  1. The new bank might not respond to your Quiet Title Lawsuit (happens more than you'd think).   2. The new bank might not be able to prove they have the original mortgage documents or the bank might not have proof of when the last payment was made.  (There is a good chance)   See section 5530 of the PA statute of limitations for mortgage debt.

https://www.legis.state.pa.us/WU01/LI/LI/CT/HTM/42/00.055..HTM

The cost of a Quiet Title suit is usually a few thousand -if the other party does not respond.  If they do respond costs will go up some, and if the bank can prove their mortgage and the last payment dates, you would gain nothing, and may have to pay the bank's reasonable attorney fees as well as your own.  Good luck. 

http://bankruptcylawyerpa.com/blog/pennylvania-statute-of-limitations-on-debt/

@James Mc Ree, "Any thoughts on the status of this contract?"    By the definitions you used for Void and Voidable, whether the contract is void depends on the Deed held by the parent and child.  That information is not posted.  However, if the Deed contained a right of Survivorship, then the child owns the property even without probate.  Without the Right of Survivorship in the Deed, it would seem that your contract is void as to the interest of the deceased parent (who never signed the contract) and voidable as to the child (who we presume can not perform).   But we haven't seen the contract so either.   It is possible the child only contracted to sell his/her interest.  None of that really matters.  The sale will proceed only if you want it too.   Under the circumstances that you described, there is almost no chance the seller will attempt to force your purchase.  That puts you in the driver's seat.  It is time to re-negotiate for better terms (price and/or payments).

I agree completely with the sage advice of Mr. @Daniel Smyth, 

"You may be in a better place than you think you are. However, If I was the estate manager, a grieving family member, and felt that you were disrespectful with your eagerness to capitalize on the death of my loved one, I may be wanting to sell to anyone OTHER than you!

Caution. Patience. Send a card, be polite. Emotions are strong enough to destroy nations!"

It is possible for you to take their mess and make it your profit.  You could go ahead and offer to rewrite your original purchase agreement, acknowledging the seller's need to complete probate and agreeing to $50/day until the seller can fulfill the sale.  You could also offer to take the property off their hands, as is, via Quit Claim Deed(s) from everyone with a legal interest in the property -for a substantial discount on the price (25%)?

Then you can immediately rent out the property and take your time completing the probate yourself, or your could just rent the property for the next ten years, then clear the title via a Quiet Title Suit.  (New PA law requires Ten years if the property is less than a half acre -see the affect of PA house Bill #352 lowering Quiet Title times via Adverse Possession to ten years for some PA residences.)   At that time you'd be claiming full title via, adverse possession against any unknown heirs, who may have retained legal interest in the property as a result of it not having gone through probate.

https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/LI/consCheck.cfm?txtType=HTM&ttl=42&div=0&chpt=55&sctn=27&subsctn=1

James, if you decided to accept a simple Quit Claim Deed now, the key info you should have is: a copy of the current Deed, a copy of the will, and knowledge of the PA law on intestate succession.   The current Deed specifies what interest the deceased parent had, and can control what happens to that parent's interest when he/she dies.   Otherwise, the will controls what happens to the deceased parents interest in the property.  If the deed does not provide for a right of survivorship, and there is no will, or if the will does not include the property, then the PA statute for intestate succession will control who inherits legal interest in the real property of the deceased.

Your are in the driver's seat.  Just decide what works best for you and for the surviving child.   There might be considerable profit in just taking the entire problem off the child's hands.

Mark you can sell the house on a multi year Real Estate Contract.  The buyer pays monthly, there can be a balloon payment in 3, 4, 5, or XX years.  The buyer does not get your quit claim deeds until after the lien expires.  The lien never gets paid off. 

To get exclusive rights to the house, you only need a simple quit claim deed from your sister to you.  That gives you all her interest.  However, if you don't complete probate, the house remains legally in your father's name.   Even without clear title, it is no problem for you to quit claim your interest to another person when ever you want.  

Your attorney probably has his own good reasons for suggesting an LLC. To me, there is not enough equity in the property to make creating an LLC worthwhile. You can transfer your interests in the house fine by yourselves with simple one page Quit Claim Deeds. If you do sell the house, just make it clear that you are the heir with the right to inherit the house but not (yet) the owner of record. The buyer would get a house still in your father's name unless you or the person who buys it from you puts it through probate or files a suit to quiet title.

You may want to check out Grant Shipman's "Beyond HouseHacking" at 
https://livingsmith.co/

@Kevin Reinell, comparing local listings is the way I do it.   I compare Craigslist, Facebook MarketPlace, and Offer Up.  Notice that rooms with private bath's (master suites) are in higher demand.  30 to 40% higher rent for private bath.

@Mark Gruetzmacher  Sounds as though you are leaning towards renting the house and waiting out the IRS lien.  That is a sensible choice.  If you don't want to do the work necessary to bring top rent, then consider offering a partial rebate of the rent to any tenant/handyman who will do the work.  (They only get the rebate if/when they complete the work).  That way you have rent money coming in for materials and you are paying nothing up front for the labor.  The rent money then is paying for both the materials and labor.

However since, "We kind of just want to get rid of the house and be done with it." you might as well advertise it as a house for sale with an IRS lien set to expire in 3 years.  If the house is worth $40,000 in its present condition, there may be experienced local investors who would pay $29,949 for a current quit claim deed from you and your sister.  Try it.  You have nothing to loose but the cost of advertising it.  

Frankly, the chances of the IRS doing anything with the lien are almost nill.  It will not be renewed against a deadman.

@Mark Gruetzmacher, you asked; 

"Can you sell it still obviously with the lien still there and then wait out the next 3 year until the lien ends then do quit title action?"

Yes.  A property with an IRS lien can certainly be sold, usually at a significant discount to normal market value.  And it would be a rare situation that would require a quiet title action when the lien expires.  Title companies know whether the lien has expired.

"Transfer the property to the kids and wait out the lien?"   

No reason you couldn't do that. However, from your post it isn't clear who, if anyone, has title to the property.  Was there a will?  If there was a will then it will control who gets the house, otherwise the relevant state statute for intestate succession controls inheritance of real property, but probate will likely be required to get clear title.

One strategy might be to obtain Quit Claim Deeds from the heir(s) and rent the property while waiting out the IRS lien.  Then sell it on a contract or lease option with the proviso that the title isn't clear, or rent until you can get it through probate or can acquire clear title through a quiet title action (typically your state's time period to effect adverse possession).

@Latoya Wright, you might consider Grant Shipman's "BeyoneHouseHacking" which can be done with 5% or less down.  

https://livingsmith.co/

@Brandon Wulff,  The more bathrooms the better.  Ideal would be a private bathroom for each bedroom plus a guest bathroom in the common area.   Also be sure to hire a cleaner to come in weekly.