All Forum Posts by: Christina Carey

Hi Jonathan. Welcome to BP. If you haven't already found it, my husband and I host a networking meetup in Fairborn on the second of Monday each month (so, 2 days from now). Lots of energy in the room with 70+ investors of all experience levels. No speakers, no agenda - just networking. It's posted on here in the local forum for Dayton, or PM me and I can shoot over the details.

@William Knights You mentioned off-market home buyer - I assume you are asking about using a broker for resale of the property.

For the best market exposure, your listing should include an offer of compensation (aka co-op commission) that is competitive with what others are offering in your market, so buyer's agents have incentive to show it and sell it. 

I'd start by Googling "flat fee MLS [your city, state]" and see what you come up with. Typically you'll pay the flat fee broker a small fee for the listing entry, but every broker is a little different in terms of what's included in the listing fee, so you should shop around.

Also beware of the sites who are offering super-low prices ($99 or whatever) - some of those are just lead services for the listing brokers, and you're just hiring whatever broker they send you to - who may or may not be local.

Hi Chris - not sure about AZ license law, but here in Ohio anyone can own a brokerage (with or without a license), as long as there is a licensed broker also associated with the company. A quick call to the AZ real estate commission (or whatever it's called there) might get you an answer a little faster.

@Jessica Sadusky - if you haven't already, be sure check with your broker also. Not all brokers allow their agents to practice property management.

@Judy Schutz it seems you created a practically anonymous BP profile just for this post, in a forum where there also happens to be the highest ratio of people who will utilize the service you not only loathe, but also do not fully understand.

As a broker who does both full-service and flat fee, I'll offer my two cents to help you understand the difference.

Maybe your MLS is different, but in Ohio, the seller is allowed to waive some fiduciary duties, but not all, for what is known as a limited service listing. The seller's contact information is not permitted in the public remarks of the listing, therefore the listing agent still gets calls from prospective buyers who find the listing in all the usual places, the same as they would any other listing.

Limited service listings are not FSBO listings, as there has to be an offer of compensation to be in the MLS. With a true FSBO, there is no guarantee of how much the seller will pay for bringing a buyer - if they'll pay anything at all. The seller is obligated to pay a commission if an agent brings a buyer, based upon their Exclusive Agency Agreement with the listing broker. In no way does that undermine the brokers and agents who pay for access to the system.

Just because the traditional model is the way you've always done it, doesn't mean that's the way it should always be done. The MLS is merely a tool (not a "privilege"). I can use that tool however I see fit, so long as I comply with the MLS rules. Not everyone wants or needs their hand held to sell a house, and if they're willing to do all the work to get it sold, then they should keep the portion of the commission that they would otherwise have paid to an agent.

To make it a little clearer for you: the seller is paying money to an MLS member broker in order to advertise their property to other agents, who they will gladly pay if they bring a buyer to the table. They're simply paying less on the listing side, in exchange for less service. 

The other comments hit the nail on the head: The listings you erroneously believe you've "lost" were never your clients to begin with. People who want to pay for more service will do so, and those who want less, pay less. It really is that simple. It's up to you to show sellers the difference in the value they are receiving for their money, and if you can't do that, then you should probably rethink your business model. I believe it was Charles Darwin who said something like, "adapt or die."

I'm sorry if you find any "hostility" in my comments, but you sort of set the tone in your original post. You're really in the wrong forum if you're looking for people to commiserate with you.

Has the property been vacated with keys turned over to you? I'm guessing not, given the circumstances. Can you reach the husband and/or his lawyer? You'll need to get a termination signed by the remaining living person(s) on the lease, otherwise you'll have to go through the eviction process to legally regain possession.

If there is a clause in your lease that covers criminal activity or abandonment? If so, you may be able to get the eviction ball rolling now. Otherwise, you'll likely be stuck waiting until next month when you can evict for nonpayment of rent.

Given the circumstances, I recommend consulting with a local attorney experienced in evictions. You want one who is familiar with the court in which the case will be heard. Some judges are more landlord-friendly than others.

Ohio does not require disclosure of a death in a property, no matter the cause.

@John King - excellent point. I belong to 4 different MLS systems, and each one of them has a different listing contract for their area. Some are worded better than others in laying out gross commission vs. co-op. One is worded so poorly that I sometimes have to correct my own agents on how they complete it. They'll have the same amount in both the total gross and the co-op. So I ask them - do you want to get paid when this sells?

So, @Jeff Moore it may be a total of 6%, with 4% to be buyer's agent, and your agent retaining 2%. Again that assumes you don't have a cheap property. Just ask him about it - I'm sure you won't be the first.

@Jeff Moore You did not mention a sale price. I'll echo what others have already said: I charge a minimum commission on cheap properties, and that can vary according to how time consuming I anticipate the deal (and sometimes the client) will be.

As a broker, even I will agree that a great many agents are grossly overpaid, and marginally competent at best. I encounter many whose clients I feel sorry for, and some who make me wonder how they find their way home at night.

Like any service-based business, a very small percentage of agents truly excel at what they do. It's a combination of knowledge and skill. Anyone with half a brain can find a house to buy and fill out the paperwork (see above), though most deals are not that simple. Those who really earn their commission do so through market knowledge, problem solving abilities, and negotiation skills - they can save a deal when things go south.

As an investor, commissions are simply a cost of doing business. If an agent brings a buyer at price and terms I'm happy with, they should get paid for it. The buyer wouldn't have been there otherwise. If I can sell without paying an agent, great.

@Brian Pfaehler not everyone is comfortable representing themselves. I'm sure there was a time when you weren't either. Also, you didn't mention a sale price when you're paying an agent 1.5 - 2%. On $300K, I'd say that's realistic. On $100K, not so much.

Even a halfway decent buyer's agent earns every penny they make. It's unlikely the buyer materialized 5 minutes before they walked through your front door. They've often shown that buyer multiple properties over several days (or weeks even), and once they have a contract, there are inspections, and so on. Factor in their costs of business: license fees, continuing ed, MLS and Board of Realtors dues, and E&O insurance. Also, gas and vehicle wear & tear, marketing expenses, never mind whatever their broker split is, or any other fees their broker is charging them. As @Mike Cumbie said, they aren't "collapsing under the weight of their moneystacks".

I know Jerry. He's been in the real estate business for quite a while. He's an active wholesaler and does retail fix/flips. He shows up at our meetups once in a while. We co-taught a rehab bus tour for the REIA, along with my husband and a couple other REIA leaders - that was probably 5 or 6 years ago, at least. From what I saw then, he definitely has the knowledge. I haven't attended the Dayton REIA in several years, so I don't know if he's still active there or not.

I'm not sure how long Jerry has been doing TK properties. I do the occasional flat-fee MLS listing for him (not turnkey though), and I have not seen any of his completed renovations, so I cannot speak to the quality of the work being done. As I always stress in these sort of posts, if you're considering an out-of-state purchase, visit the area, and always have inspections done.

Also, since Jerry isn't licensed, he's either working with someone else for property management after the sale, or he expects you to find your own.  Regardless, you should also vet the management company, whoever that may be.

@Darrin Carey should be able to assist you.